Our guards will be in foul trouble no matter what in the Hall of Calls. We better work on our defensive help side anyways, because even with playing the defense that you want, Romeo is a simple screen away from getting in the lane. Our bigs will have to be there to take away the rim without fouling.
Sr All-Stars lose to Kentucky
- Thread starter Roeder
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IU doesn’t return a single player who has beat an NCAA tourney team in over a year.
I’ll just leave it at that. You can figure the rest out on your own.
Experience doesn’t equal experience winning
Remember this Indiana gotta play defense too The guards on Purdue not slow either. Both teams has many question marks 5 months from now many of the Questions will be answered about each player on not just Indiana team but many teams in college basketball bcuz so many teams lost a lot of very good players and to replace them that’s were the questions remains a lot of unknowns. Like many freshmen this level there are bigger faster stronger players that many freshmen hasn’t competed against in HS only time will tell which of those freshmen will adjust to the physically, speed and length with longer courts and 3 point line a foot longer and coaches who will scout all of the freshmen weaknesses and strengths of their games and adjust their game plans against them. In 5 months we’ll no a whole lot more for sure.
That's fine. I'll take the team full of returning production, and a lot of projected new production.
I agree, I don't buy the experience arguement. The only way it holds water is if you're talking about experience playing for a championship contending program, which Matt has shown the last couple of years and Archie is trying to re-build. Otherwise IU has more overall game experience.
Having said that, I would take Carsen over anyone on IU's roster by a fairly wide margin. I expect Romeo to be very good and Morgan is a nice player, but he's most efficient as an undersized post. This year he'll want to showcase what he can do on an NBA roster and I'm not sure he'll be able to duplicate the season he had last year playing more outside. After those two I'd take Eastern, Haarms, Cline and Boudreaux (who has a ton of D1 experience, albeit at a lower level) over anyone else on IU's roster.
IU looks to have some talented young players coming in (in addition to Romeo) who are generally ranked above most of Purdue's young players in recruiting ratings (what else is new?), but Purdue has a couple of guys coming off of redshirt and a freshman class that Painter is excited about. How those players contribute for both teams could make a big difference.
It's good that we both prefer our teams over each other's teams!
Should be two really good games this year.
This is a good point. But I think your mistake also falls under this point.
Returning experience isn't always a good thing. I wouldn't want Hartman, Newkirk or McSwain coming back to play a single minute ever again. And johnson's per was below avg considering his experience. Purdue lost some heavy hitters per-wise.
I didn't see much from cline, eastern and haarms to suggest they're ready to take a lead role in the offense. And they will potentially be three of your starters to begin the season. Their PER are substantially worse than the players that left a hole in front of them. To not have much of a drop this season, multiple players will have to take significant, unlikely jumps.
The flaw in your thinking is that your projected new production is all based on what players have done in high school and your assumption on returning production that more minutes last year = greater production this year.
Purdue graduated three players who were better than anyone on IU's roster last year and a fourth that was very solid. Haarms, Eastern and Cline have all shown that they are ready to play at a Big Ten level, there just weren't enough minutes and shots available last year at Purdue. That wouldn't have been a problem had they played at IU and that's not a flame, just two very different rosters.
It's good that we both prefer our teams over each other's teams!
Should be two really good games this year.
Agree, should be a pretty wide open conference race and the most competitive Purdue / IU matchups in a while. I would be surprised to see either team beat the other on the road.
Morgan is likely 1st team B1G, and could(key word) challenge carsen for poy honors. Davis had an elite offensive efficiency rating, similar to Haas before going down. If he plays, I'm not sure I'd take anyone other than Edwards in the starting five.
You're making dangerous assumptions. The math isn't there to back up your claim. If those players were capable they would have played. Their per numbers were not good enough. The stats are available.
There is no question Purdue will have a drop. I don’t think anyone here has ever said otherwise.
The question here seems to be will Purdue drop as much or more so than IU will improve and where each team will land at the end of the season.
I am not sure how losing players is a good thing. If IU had better players to play instead, they would have. That, along with McRoberts starting and playing 21 minutes per game tells me you had less to begin with and any major improvement being predicted will come from newcomers, ie. Romeo.
IU also has a new coach who has zero experience winning in Ann Arbor, East Lansing or for that matter, Madison or West Lafayette. There are factors that matter when predicting future results. When their is no history of an event happening, then it is less likely to happen.
I get it. Y’all are excited to have a OAD along with a new coach. The problem here is, the most veteran coach in the league didn’t seem to do as well as y’all are hoping and he had numerous highly rated players.
That is extremely simplistic thinking. Players at Purdue are asked to play a role. If understanding that playing a role is important to team success but may not support statistical metrics you should probably run simulations on games rather than watch them. I'm sure you could find metrics that would show that IU should have been better than Purdue the last two years but the reality is they weren't and it wasn't close.
Morgan won't sniff POY and if he gets pushed to the perimeter rather than playing in the post he won't match his 2nd team all conference results from last year.
What else would you base freshmen on other than what they did in high school?
Is it more realistic to assume that a guy like Eastern will take a major stride and become a big time player, or that Juwan Morgan will have a similar season to the season he had last year?
Again, I'm glad that you guys are happy with your team next year. I'm happy with the team we will be fielding as well.
Completely agree, you have to base it on high school production, but aside from a superstar like Romeo it's hard to predict how that translates to the Big Ten. My point was that I'd rather rely on guys like Haarms, Cline and Eastern who have played at the college level but haven't had a ton of minutes versus guys coming from high school. Not saying that's right, just my opinion.
I like Juwan Morgan a lot, he seems like a good, hard working young man and would not be surprised if he has a similar season to last, which may land him first team all conference. I think the temptation will be to move him out of the post to show more of a wing game to the NBA and to make room in the post for players like Davis and Thompson. Just my opionion, but it reminds me of Purdue playing Vince Edwards at the 3 rather than the 4 two years ago and I think that would lead to a regression in his productivity.
Regarding Eastern, and I'd put Haarms in the same category, you're completely correct in that assuming they'll make the type of jump that Morgan made last year is extremely risky. Worst case, both will be excellent defensive players who are limited offensively and will rely on dishes from Carsen and offensive rebounds for their offensive production. If that's the case I still see Purdue as an NCAA tournament team but not a conference championship contender. Having said that, both have shown glimpses and I'd expect at least one of the two to become a legitimate offensive threat, but that's why I'm a fan
So you are happy, we are happy, what’s the difference here?
Yep, we aren’t on your site trying to get your approval. Hope you feel better now.
I agree with almost all of this. The one small thing I disagree with is that IU will have to rely on guys coming out of high school (outside of Romeo). Hunter might be an immediate impact player, but I don't necessarily think IU needs him to have a huge impact.Completely agree, you have to base it on high school production, but aside from a superstar like Romeo it's hard to predict how that translates to the Big Ten. My point was that I'd rather rely on guys like Haarms, Cline and Eastern who have played at the college level but haven't had a ton of minutes versus guys coming from high school. Not saying that's right, just my opinion.
I like Juwan Morgan a lot, he seems like a good, hard working young man and would not be surprised if he has a similar season to last, which may land him first team all conference. I think the temptation will be to move him out of the post to show more of a wing game to the NBA and to make room in the post for players like Davis and Thompson. Just my opionion, but it reminds me of Purdue playing Vince Edwards at the 3 rather than the 4 two years ago and I think that would lead to a regression in his productivity.
Regarding Eastern, and I'd put Haarms in the same category, you're completely correct in that assuming they'll make the type of jump that Morgan made last year is extremely risky. Worst case, both will be excellent defensive players who are limited offensively and will rely on dishes from Carsen and offensive rebounds for their offensive production. If that's the case I still see Purdue as an NCAA tournament team but not a conference championship contender. Having said that, both have shown glimpses and I'd expect at least one of the two to become a legitimate offensive threat, but that's why I'm a fan
For example:
I'd put Smith, Durham, Davis, and Green in the same category you have Haarms, Cline, and Eastern.
I don't care about your approval. Our premium board is very boring at the moment, and I wont go near the free board over there. I like to talk about how the team will do next year, especially in comparison to Purdue, because they will be so similar. There is always a couple posters here willing to do so.
Limited offensively interestingCompletely agree, you have to base it on high school production, but aside from a superstar like Romeo it's hard to predict how that translates to the Big Ten. My point was that I'd rather rely on guys like Haarms, Cline and Eastern who have played at the college level but haven't had a ton of minutes versus guys coming from high school. Not saying that's right, just my opinion.
I like Juwan Morgan a lot, he seems like a good, hard working young man and would not be surprised if he has a similar season to last, which may land him first team all conference. I think the temptation will be to move him out of the post to show more of a wing game to the NBA and to make room in the post for players like Davis and Thompson. Just my opionion, but it reminds me of Purdue playing Vince Edwards at the 3 rather than the 4 two years ago and I think that would lead to a regression in his productivity.
Regarding Eastern, and I'd put Haarms in the same category, you're completely correct in that assuming they'll make the type of jump that Morgan made last year is extremely risky. Worst case, both will be excellent defensive players who are limited offensively and will rely on dishes from Carsen and offensive rebounds for their offensive production. If that's the case I still see Purdue as an NCAA tournament team but not a conference championship contender. Having said that, both have shown glimpses and I'd expect at least one of the two to become a legitimate offensive threat, but that's why I'm a fan
He does have experience winning in the 2nd weekend of THE tournament so I'm not sure I'm really worried about that. He can coach.
Also, where you seem to consider him as somewhat of a negative, I view it the exact opposite. Last year, not a single player had any exp with his system. This year, there are already several experienced players to build upon. Those players help the new players acclimate quicker, etc. The 2nd year in a new system should be noticeably better all around.
As for losing players and improving...it's all about the numbers. The players leaving had horrible per numbers. The chances of newkirk's replacement being worse than a 13.5 per are almost 0. And when you replace 25mpg with a 17-18 per, you get dramatic improvement. The opposite is also true which I think you understand. Replacing VE, IH and DM will be tough. Those three had very good numbers.
Don't know if you want to be basing your arguments strictly off PER...It's kind of a skewed stat towards scoring and doesn't seem as relevant in college as it does in the NBA
It is better than opinion or the eye test. I agree it's not perfect. But there's a reason they use it.
Mama bear, unlike most others, I love that you post here, but I won’t pull punches on what I saw last year. I’m also a great advocate that your son is primed for a breakthrough season and I hope after the season I’m posting that he’s so good that it’s a shame he didn’t get more minutes as a freshman.
So what's your question(s) about the upcoming season? I think this PU team will be as good as last year, and maybe even better. Scoring, defense, quickness, size...redshirts, and freshmen who have a year of experience.
Eastern struggled last year for sure...lack of minutes caused by some damned good Seniors. But...that being said we saw snippets of a brilliant defender who now has a year of experience and will most certainly defend Langford, the IU freshman. I'm taking Eastern in that match up....both times.
Yeah. 31+ wins and elite 8.
But I'm looking beyond this season to next. THAT is the real turning point. Should be at least 37 wins and final game.
Surely you can’t be serious? If that happens, I’ll happily become a Purdue fan for the rest of my life. So the next two years Painter will do better than he's ever done in his career with less talent than he had even just last season? Ok, good luck. And you people say IU fans have high expectations.....
Bruh... he's trolling... chill...
Mostly mocking TD. I don't troll another team's board.
My bad, if I had looked back a few posts I would have realized that. It just sounded so much like something I would expect an overzealous Purdue fan to say, you fooled me.
I think you on point with everything you said not sure about the red shirts though but I believe the team will be shockingly good and will surprise a lot of folks. Team as a whole is young but look like they will be tough but gritty defensively. 5 months from now we all gonna find out what they made of I see big things Coming from this talented young group. My son put iin some serious work when he was home major improvements confidence is there and he’s ready to help lead this team as far as it can go.
Ha ha! What the hell do you expect him to say? The truth?
Are you really that naive?
Can we just make a separate thread for all the IU trolls? Where they can have as many jerk off sessions they want about the upcoming season...….we could call it the CREAM and Crimson thread..
I agree. Can’t wait to see Nojel on Landford this year.
Landford should ask Tony Carr what that’s like.
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