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I am over the CMP era

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ARSmitty30

Jan 26, 2005
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How long has Chris Beard been at Tech? His team is now in the Elite 8.

CMP has never made it that far in how many years??

Don't give me the Haas excuse. We held their best scorer in check and still lost.
I respect Dakota but the dude couldn't even get a shot off.

I completely respect and appreciate the contributions that CMP has made to the program. That being said, how many coaches are out there that can accomplish what CMP has done?

More importantly....How many could do better?
 
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ARSmitty30 said:
How long has Chris Beard been at Tech? His team is now in the Elite 8.

CMP has never made it that far in how many years??

Don't give me the Haas excuse. We held their best scorer in check and still lost.
I respect Dakota but the dude couldn't even get a shot off.

I completely respect and appreciate the contributions that CMP has made to the program. That being said, how many coaches are out there that can accomplish what CMP has done?

More importantly....How many could do better?
Click to expand...


A fast, up-tempo offense
is the ‘style’ now. Has been for some time. Very effective for deep NCAA runs. And the beauty of it is that you dont have to recruit all 4 and 5 stars to get them (see TT roster) The irony is that Purdue is from a basketball state that still employs the 1970’s weave-motion offense and TT (from a football state) has progressed to the 2018 style that kids these days want to be a part of.
 
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typeviic said:
A fast, up-tempo offense
is the ‘style’ now. Has been for some time. Very effective for deep NCAA runs. And the beauty of it is that you dont have to recruit all 4 and 5 stars to get them (see TT roster) The irony is that Purdue is from a basketball state that still employs the 1970’s weave-motion offense and TT (from a football state) has progressed to the 2018 style that kids these days want to be a part of.
Click to expand...
...and yet, Purdue was one of the highest scoring teams in the country. Now that's an odd fact that doesn't quite fit your rant...
 
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I’m not over Painter, but I am over this building a team in your own image stuff. Slow barnyard shooters don’t work in the NCAA. It takes speed and athletes. We should be playing guys like Eastern, Taylor and Ewing all year instead of a slow, undersized legacy who the coach prefers because of practice work. That’s what I’m over … and why our season is over.
 
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Born Boiler said:
I’m not over Painter, but I am over this building a team in your own image stuff. Slow barnyard shooters don’t work in the NCAA. It takes speed and athletes. We should be playing guys like Eastern, Taylor and Ewing all year instead of a slow, undersized legacy who the coach prefers because of practice work. That’s what I’m over … and why our season is over.
Click to expand...
PJT completely outplayed Eastern last night on both ends of the floor, Taylor was lost on D and failed to protect the lane and rim on multiple occasions, and Ewing didn’t play last night...because he left the program months ago.

You’ll have all the speed you need next year.
 
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BoilerBulldog said:
PJT completely outplayed Eastern last night on both ends of the floor, Taylor was lost on D and failed to protect the lane and rim on multiple occasions, and Ewing didn’t play last night...because he left the program months ago.

You’ll have all the speed you need next year.
Click to expand...

This is about building quality depth, which is what Painter failed to do all year and exactly what blew us out of the Sweet Sixteen. Painter ran off his best athlete after failing to play him in front of a personal favorite, then he did not develop the deep bench, namely Taylor and Wheeler, which killed us as Vince and then Haas went down. Even so, Taylor was light years more effective inside than Eifert, who is lost even when in place. And Eastern should have been relieving all guards, not just Thompson, then he could have also spelled Mathias and Cline during their Tech follies.
 
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Born Boiler said:
This is about building quality depth, which is what Painter failed to do all year and exactly what blew us out of the Sweet Sixteen. Painter ran off his best athlete after failing to play him in front of a personal favorite, then he did not develop the deep bench, namely Taylor and Wheeler, which killed us as Vince and then Haas went down. Even so, Taylor was light years more effective inside than Eifert, who is lost even when in place. And Eastern should have been relieving all guards, not just Thompson, then he could have also spelled Mathias and Cline during their Tech follies.
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree more. Bench development and depth has been Painter's issue for quite some time. I love that Grady put in the work and got a scholarship. But at what cost to the team? That scholarship could have been used for an athletic wing player to back up Vince. Painter is just not a good roster manager.
 
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Born Boiler said:
This is about building quality depth, which is what Painter failed to do all year and exactly what blew us out of the Sweet Sixteen. Painter ran off his best athlete after failing to play him in front of a personal favorite, then he did not develop the deep bench, namely Taylor and Wheeler, which killed us as Vince and then Haas went down. Even so, Taylor was light years more effective inside than Eifert, who is lost even when in place. And Eastern should have been relieving all guards, not just Thompson, then he could have also spelled Mathias and Cline during their Tech follies.
Click to expand...
I totally disagree that Taylor was "light years" ahead of Eifert. Not the Taylor that played last night. But would I love an upgrade over either for the sake of depth? Of course. The debate that I think is legit is whether we shouldn't have redshirt Wheeler in hindsight.
 
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typeviic said:
A fast, up-tempo offense
is the ‘style’ now. Has been for some time. Very effective for deep NCAA runs. And the beauty of it is that you dont have to recruit all 4 and 5 stars to get them (see TT roster) The irony is that Purdue is from a basketball state that still employs the 1970’s weave-motion offense and TT (from a football state) has progressed to the 2018 style that kids these days want to be a part of.
Click to expand...
TT is in the Elite 8 because they play great defense......
 
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ARSmitty30 said:
I completely respect and appreciate the contributions that CMP has made to the program. That being said, how many coaches are out there that can accomplish what CMP has done?

More importantly....How many could do better?
Click to expand...
IU has been asking the same question since RMK was fired. How has that worked out? For a supposed 'blue blood' program, they can't get the coach they want.
 
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BoilerBulldog said:
I totally disagree that Taylor was "light years" ahead of Eifert. Not the Taylor that played last night. But would I love an upgrade over either for the sake of depth? Of course. The debate that I think is legit is whether we shouldn't have redshirt Wheeler in hindsight.
Click to expand...

Stature alone made Taylor better inside than Eifert. A 6-10 defender who can move and jump alters far more looks than a 6-6 goodfellow. Soon as Ewing was sent out the door, Wheeler should've been called up to the show. Vince could've had more relief, and that would've been huge in itself.

.
 
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Born Boiler said:
Stature alone made Taylor better inside than Eifert. A 6-10 defender who can move and jump alters far more looks than a 6-6 goodfellow. Soon as Ewing was sent out the door, Wheeler should've been called up to the show. Vince could've had more relief, and that would've been huge in itself.

.
Click to expand...
I'm curious. How many practices did you watch?
 
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BoilerAndy said:
I just wanted to know the source of your knowledge. So you didn't attend any practices, but you know better than the coaches?
Click to expand...

I started watching Purdue basketball before any of the coaches were born, and like most Purdue fans, I can tell the difference between an athlete and a stiff. Apparently you can’t, so go practice.
 
IU fans confuse me. They are here claiming that Painter is not a good coach because he has not advanced beyond the S16. However, both Crean and Davis advanced beyond the S16 and they claim that they are bad coaches.

This appears to me to be cognitively dissonant. Which is it? Logically it cannot be both.

I find it difficult keeping their argument straight.
 
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arcb102000 said:
IU fans confuse me. They are here claiming that Painter is not a good coach because he has not advanced beyond the S16. However, both Crean and Davis advanced beyond the S16 and they claim that they are bad coaches.

This appears to me to be cognitively dissonant. Which is it? Logically it cannot be both.

I find it difficult keeping their argument straight.
Click to expand...

Their big problem was trying to keep their players "straight."
 
Born Boiler said:
I started watching Purdue basketball before any of the coaches were born, and like most Purdue fans, I can tell the difference between an athlete and a stiff. Apparently you can’t, so go practice.
Click to expand...
LOL. OK. You are old, therefore you don't even need to see the players practice to know more about the team than the coaches. Got it.
 
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Born Boiler said:
I’m not over Painter, but I am over this building a team in your own image stuff. Slow barnyard shooters don’t work in the NCAA. It takes speed and athletes. We should be playing guys like Eastern, Taylor and Ewing all year instead of a slow, undersized legacy who the coach prefers because of practice work. That’s what I’m over … and why our season is over.
Click to expand...
It is what you want to be. We are good at beating bad teams. 28-6. Our record against NCAA tournament teams I believe was 4-4. The "great" conference record in a year four teams made the dance and we were 0-2 vs the top 2. It is a little bit of smoke and mirrors.
 
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Born Boiler said:
Stature alone made Taylor better inside than Eifert. A 6-10 defender who can move and jump alters far more looks than a 6-6 goodfellow. Soon as Ewing was sent out the door, Wheeler should've been called up to the show. Vince could've had more relief, and that would've been huge in itself.

BoilerAndy, post: I'm curious. How many practices did you watch?


I'm curious as well. I wonder how many practices Chris Beard has seen?
 
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purduepat1969 said:
I couldn't agree more. Bench development and depth has been Painter's issue for quite some time. I love that Grady put in the work and got a scholarship. But at what cost to the team? That scholarship could have been used for an athletic wing player to back up Vince. Painter is just not a good roster manager.
Click to expand...
There are some things relative to some players I might have preferred different, but if you go back about three year or so years ago you will notice that Matt was playing 10 deep within the first 5 minutes and he was getting criticized for playing too many...no chemistry...hard to get going...and then players not getting enough minutes and transfering and evenutally one quitting. Kendall, Bryson and Basil. It is important with AJ and Haas to have shooters that would compliment your players in place. Getting through the mess of budget, coaches leaving and quality of players Matt started trying to get skill to surround his hub. It worked pretty well this year until the hub had a throwdown that effected him more than that play..or that game adn effected the whole offense.

Compensating for that mass exodus, Matt gambled this year knowing Wheeler could use a year...as could Shasha...but didn't plan on a whole half of his offense getting a broken "ARM" of all things when there wasn't enough time to attempt to recover. I doubt he recruited Ewing with the idea he wouldn't blend into what was expected at Purdue. Going forward since this is nothing new to Matt he is trying to get a more athletic team. Now this too is nothing new as he was already down the road with the baby boilers before the previous mentioned fiasco when building off the Baby Boilers were important. History shows an ajustment to playing too many bit Matt this year. History shows why Matt wanted shooters with AJ in place and getting the best players you could at that time.

The only thing I wanted different that I harped on with few thinking similar thoughts was to develop as an option Haarms and Haas together and Haarms and Taylor together as a means to give some length inside and be able to pound it if needed. I wish it were different because I wanted all the guns available for the gun fight in advance of a potential problem but most preferred to not explore that option. Even with that, if teh refs treated Haas a bit better in calling fouls we might all be excited for to play Nova...the team Purdue wanted to play when they lost the first two in the tourney.

This is not directed towards you or anyone in particular, but understand anyone can post and there exists quite a range of basketball understandings and misunderstandings in these forums
 
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BoilerAndy said:
I'm curious. How many practices did you watch?
Click to expand...

I'm glad Eifert performed up to Painter's standards in practice. Tell me though, does that make him a good enough player to be getting big minutes in an NCAA tournament for a Top 10 team? Again, I'm sure Grady is a great kid and I mean him no personal disrespect. But he is NOT the caliber of player a Top 10 program should be happy to have as their #7 off the bench. Do you think he'd play at Michigan St? Duke? For that matter even Michigan? Texas Tech had 33 bench points against Purdue, a Top 10 team. Purdue had 6. Those are the facts that matter. Lack of bench depth.
 
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tjreese said:
There are some things relative to some players I might have preferred different, but if you go back about three year or so years ago you will notice that Matt was playing 10 deep within the first 5 minutes and he was getting criticized for playing too many...no chemistry...hard to get going...and then players not getting enough minutes and transfering and evenutally one quitting. Kendall, Bryson and Basil. It is important with AJ and Haas to have shooters that would compliment your players in place. Getting through the mess of budget, coaches leaving and quality of players Matt started trying to get skill to surround his hub. It worked pretty well this year until the hub had a throwdown that effected him more than that play..or that game adn effected the whole offense.

Compensating for that mass exodus, Matt gambled this year knowing Wheeler could use a year...as could Shasha...but didn't plan on a whole half of his offense getting a broken "ARM" of all things when there wasn't enough time to attempt to recover. I doubt he recruited Ewing with the idea he wouldn't blend into what was expected at Purdue. Going forward since this is nothing new to Matt he is trying to get a more athletic team. Now this too is nothing new as he was already down the road with the baby boilers before the previous mentioned fiasco when building off the Baby Boilers were important. History shows an ajustment to playing too many bit Matt this year. History shows why Matt wanted shooters with AJ in place and getting the best players you could at that time.

The only thing I wanted different that I harped on with few thinking similar thoughts was to develop as an option Haarms and Haas together and Haarms and Taylor together as a means to give some length inside and be able to pound it if needed. I wish it were different because I wanted all the guns available for the gun fight in advance of a potential problem but most preferred to not explore that option. Even with that, if teh refs treated Haas a bit better in calling fouls we might all be excited for to play Nova...the team Purdue wanted to play when they lost the first two in the tourney.

This is not directed towards you or anyone in particular, but understand anyone can post and there exists quite a range of basketball understandings and misunderstandings in these forums
Click to expand...

If you're suggesting I don't understand how "hard" it is, I'm sorry, I shouldn't have to hear the excuses. Painter's being paid millions of $ to build and maintain a winning program. It's "hard" for everyone at that level. It's hard for Chris Beard in Lubbock, TX where it's a football school. It's hard for John Beilein at Michigan where it's a football school. Spare me your condescension that you know any better than anyone else on this message board why it's so much harder for Painter.
 
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purduepat1969 said:
If you're suggesting I don't understand how "hard" it is, I'm sorry, I shouldn't have to hear the excuses. Painter's being paid millions of $ to build and maintain a winning program. It's "hard" for everyone at that level. It's hard for Chris Beard in Lubbock, TX where it's a football school. It's hard for John Beilein at Michigan where it's a football school. Spare me your condescension that you know any better than anyone else on this message board why it's so much harder for Painter.
Click to expand...

Actually, I "thought" you might be aware of the budget and coaches and the history, but apparently not or... I like those football budgets as well. Now, relative to "basketball" do you recall Matt playing that many players because you said he didn't try to develop a bench or was that history not important?

I also never said ...I think you can check this pretty easy...that is was sooooo much harder for Matt to build a "winning program" is what you referenced that Purdue apparently is not. I tried to give you some info that perhaps you had forgot. If that is not important to you I am fine with that. There are no requirements to post here.
 
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purduepat1969 said:
If you're suggesting I don't understand how "hard" it is, I'm sorry, I shouldn't have to hear the excuses. Painter's being paid millions of $ to build and maintain a winning program. It's "hard" for everyone at that level. It's hard for Chris Beard in Lubbock, TX where it's a football school. It's hard for John Beilein at Michigan where it's a football school. Spare me your condescension that you know any better than anyone else on this message board why it's so much harder for Painter.
Click to expand...
Who should we go after ...
 
Thad Matta?

Just to be clear: I don't think Bobinsky should fire a career .664 guy who made the NCAA Tournament in 10 of 13 seasons and finished in the top 4 of the B1G 9 times.

But I have wondered if Matta could take Purdue deeper in March.
 
purduepat1969 said:
I'm glad Eifert performed up to Painter's standards in practice. Tell me though, does that make him a good enough player to be getting big minutes in an NCAA tournament for a Top 10 team? Again, I'm sure Grady is a great kid and I mean him no personal disrespect. But he is NOT the caliber of player a Top 10 program should be happy to have as their #7 off the bench. Do you think he'd play at Michigan St? Duke? For that matter even Michigan? Texas Tech had 33 bench points against Purdue, a Top 10 team. Purdue had 6. Those are the facts that matter. Lack of bench depth.
Click to expand...
Not just the bench. The starters did not hold up their end. Losing Haas played a big role in that fact.

Whether Eifert would play for MSU or Duke wasn't a question anyone was asking or responding to. The question is, was he a better contributor than those behind him on the bench. Painter can only play the players on his roster.

If you want to ask who would play for MSU or Duke, the only Purdue players that might start are CE and the one Purdue player who was out with an injury.
 
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