When your best player is a post player, it doesnt work.
Say whatever you want, purdue has shown it to be the case over and over again
Say whatever you want, purdue has shown it to be the case over and over again
CMP reduces ex-Mr. Basketballers to company men (Spoiler: it doesn't work)
- Thread starter MetMyWifeAtHarrys
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Agree. There were a couple of awful calls today (out of bounds timeout and no call on Key at the end) but overall not worse than what I’d expect in a Big Ten road game. The combination of Loyer, Smith and Jones needs to be better if this team wants to make a deep run.
Except for UConn last year and a number of other examples. Agree that you need a backcourt/ wing player also playing at a high level. Smith has to be that guy and he needs help from Jones and Loyer and they all ranged from bad to just ok today.
Now that's an odd take. You do realize we are the number #7 total offensive & #3 most efficient team in the nation.
We were good, maybe great, early in the year when all our players played offense with purpose. Even Morton looked to score. You cannot play offense with a pass first mentality. This frightened, force-it-to-Edey every time down the court is just Painter’s typical late season shenanigans.
Uconns wings were way better than any we have had since carson edwards and their big was a defense first guy with athleticism and good feet like haarms was.
This isnt hard to figure out. You look foolish
Pretty sure someone on this board—it may have been you, but I’m not 100% sure—were singing Morton’s praises as a shooter before the season because he shot well from 3 as a Sophomore.
He did shoot well then, but I don’t know what’s happened. His confidence is gone. This seems to have happened before with players like Kendall Stephens and Brandon Newman.
So Sanogo didn’t lead them in scoring? Come on man, if you’re going to talk shit that’s cool but try to have some idea wtf you are talking about. He couldn’t have been any less like Haarms.
He had 1 outlier season on low volume , less than 1 attempt per game. Other than that, he’s been in the 20s, which is what he is. He wasn’t a shooter in AAU either.
At Western Kentucky, Brandon Newman is shooting…wait for it …in the low 30s, again. That’s just what he is.
to add...the problem wasn't forcing it to Zach. Fletch and someone made three soft passes that got tipped and Zach had trouble "after" he had the ball. Caleb was not recruited to Purdue due to his perimeter shooting and before Ethan entered Purdue many thought that in the AAU games prior to Purdue Ethan was not a perimeter shooter. There are soooo many things above and beyond a couple of players. Anyone that has had a group of players knows they can have that bad game. With all the bad things...a couple of better decisions under 4 or so and Purdue might have pulled it out
Funny because Newman was last years and the year before Colvin, put him in coach. Many folks thought he was the savior. He wasn't and isn't. Colvin is young so we will see. The problem today was Jones was not able to stop Thornton at all, he usually is better than that. Morton was a little better but not great. The other guard was too tall for our guards and had some easy looks.
With that being the case, we can’t have 2 non shooters out there together.
We need Fletch and Braden to hit their mid range shots on a consistent basis. Jones needs to hit his layups and 3's. Those things to me is our path to a NC.
understand, but at this point in the game Purdue wants to stop Thorton and Battle and believes the other two with Zach are able to score more than OSU if Thorton and Battle are held (Purdue's three can beat OSU's three?). That was the trade off decision I believe the coaches considered and with probably two time POY you would think you had enough offense "if" you stopped Thorton and Battle. Course neither were stopped in hindsight. I do think Zach could have got on his toes and contested some of those shots in close by Thorton and Battle and made a difference, but that didn't happen. Those two got 41 points!
I think that is applicable in a lot of threads in various forums after a loss. Once you realize it is about them and not yourself, the perspective can change. That said, I hope they reach the goals that are still in front of them
Well when stuff isn't working you turn somewhere and we don't have a ton of options off the bench.
Painter clearly doesn't think Waddell is an option at all so that leaves one of two guys
Well maybe the problem is we keep needing saviors because some of our main guys aren't performing
I don't disagree, I'm just not clear what the answer is. From what I've seen Cam is more of a spot up guy, he does an ok job at times putting the ball on the floor against aggressive close outs but isn't creating his own shot. Good rebounder and generally pretty solid on defense. Myles can get his own shot, which I think is why you've seen MP get him more meaningful minutes the last couple of games (although I didn't see him get the ball in position to score against OSU), but doesn't rebound particularly well and is still figuring things out on defense.
Based on the last two NCAAT losses I think Purdue has to assume that they're going to run into a team in the tournament that plays them very physical, as OSU did, IMO, and that they're not going to get calls. Braden, Lance, Fletcher and Mason didn't play well enough yesterday to overcome that. Can Cam or Myles step in when that happens or do we have to just hope that when we hit that game or games in the NCAAT that the core guys are better? I don't know.
I'm generally a pretty optimistic guy but yesterday's game was concerning to me. Having said that, I think Zach's turnovers are likely correctable and Braden and Fletch are still second year guys that can get better. The question is whether they will and whether this team can play it's best basketball over the next six weeks.
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There were a lot of issues with yesterday’s effort, but #1 in my view was that OSU was getting the 50/50 balls. The focus was lacking until late in the game at which time a talented OSU team was playing with confidence and nothing to lose.
You can’t play expecting to win. You have to earn it. For that reason, I am not so sure that the loss isn’t a good thing. Coach Painter will definitely use it to get the attention of his players. Let’s see what kind of team shows up against Rutgers.
You can’t play expecting to win. You have to earn it. For that reason, I am not so sure that the loss isn’t a good thing. Coach Painter will definitely use it to get the attention of his players. Let’s see what kind of team shows up against Rutgers.
I understand the sentiment and agree with what you wrote. The lack of focus can show up in a lot of ways as does the physical play inside. Merely pointing out what @northside100 wrote that it wasn’t just a single guy, but several people that played below average it too supports a general lack of focus of several. When several do not play well, it indicates something beyond Matt needs to do this or that and play this person. Still, give OSU credit for how well they played, because that too played a huge role in the result.
Now, there exists a question of whether Purdue is playing worse or not than a couple of weeks ago. The results support they are not playing as well, but is that the only thing in play…Purdue not playing well and all the fear that conjures up in some for the tourney? First, Purdue has a target on it’s back and as you say you don’t win by just starting the game or just getting a good start in a game, but by playing 40 minutes well. The scouting reports are honing in on being more affective in D against Purdue. That too led to the coverage of the perimeter by OSU as well as the physical play inside.
Now, are those things making it harder for Purdue to have the same success late in the Big as much a factor into the game results as Purdue not playing well on its’ own? Yes, there are definitely things, to tighten up as well as getting past the mental fatigue that might be in play to bringing 40 minutes of focus in a game, but give the other team some credit as well. People that look at the general play of a team overall and assume it will be that way when they play is human nature, but inaccurate as we just saw in OSU. Any team that puts it together well and follows their scouting report can beat a Purdue team that is not mentally sharp in details and execution of those details.
It is a hard lesson for people…youthful especially to fully understand that when the game is over there is no “do over” and to not put yourself in a position where you think you should have done this or that and reflect on the things you could have and should have done because it is too late…the results are in. When you walk off the court have no regrets that you are bringing into the locker what you should have left on the court. Yet, all the coaches at all levels experience this human frailty…especially when fatigue of some sort sets in.
I thought that OSU played a great game and definitely deserves a lot of credit, which is exactly why Purdue was not going to win this game without matching their intensity.
And you can’t turn the ball over on 23% of your possessions and beat anyone on their home court in the B1G.
turning the ball over is almost always a poor choice, but if the D has you scouted well then the D knows what to do with anticipation rather than many times reaction. If I recall correctly-one turnover was a mix up between Braden and Fletch in anticipation of where Fletch was going. Another Braden got deep and threw into a crowd on the blocks. I think Fletch may have had and another player had soft post feeds. Zach fumbled and got slapped on 5 or 6 turnovers. There was communication issues with Mason a couple of times on D. There were a lot of signs that point to Purdue not being ready mentally
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They hit all 20 free throws and still lost. I would have never thought that would have resulted in that result.
I believe there was a post game stat they showed Purdue had 53 FG attempts, 9 3 pt shots, Edey had 20 shots, so the rest was 24 FG attempts
That's the scariest part to me. We shoot at our season average, this loss goes from bad to a nightmare.
I've said this for years: A low post scorer is the easiest player to defend. You double, dig, don't let him get to his right shoulder and force him to pass it back out.
Yes, you have to gamble and be willing to leave others open for jumpers, but if guys are having an off shooting night, then that defensive game plan will work.
It's why I've never been a fan of Painter's offense almost always running through the low post as the number 1 option.
Don't have the data in front of me, but it seems Purdue was up 10 on FTs and down 12 on 3 pt shots and the offensive boards maybe a plus 7 for Purdue and a minus 6 or 8 in turnovers for Purdue leading me to believe that OSU scored more effectively off turnovers than Purdue did off offensive boards. Again, my memory could be off but I wouldn't be surprised if I wasn't close. Course I have not remembered things before.
With the whistles the way they are at this time that is true. However, do you think there is a team in college that wouldn't want Zach and play him as Purdue does which is not always down on the block? Zach is that good and now picking up early fouls for some reason...
that one foul in the first half was garbage where they are planting in front of Zach when he's running down the court, that's not even a basketball play, there were some others where they should be attending acting school
Don't have the data in front of me, but it seems Purdue was up 10 on FTs and down 12 on 3 pt shots and the offensive boards maybe a plus 7 for Purdue and a minus 6 or 8 in turnovers for Purdue leading me to believe that OSU scored more effectively off turnovers than Purdue did off offensive boards. Again, my memory could be off but I wouldn't be surprised if I wasn't close. Course I have not remembered things before.
Ohio State had 22 points off 14 Purdue turnovers.....that was more for the opponent than either of NW or Nebraska, if I heard correctly.
It's a double whammy as you know because you're prevented a possession (and some of those will lead to second chance opportunities, fouls, etc.) and give up a score on top of that. Painter talked about that a little with the post turnovers quite often leading to run-outs with the way they develop.
The Boilers have handled adversity, made come-backs, gritted/ground out wins before - yesterday, they did not handle it well when the opportunity presented itself. And I agree with some others, Purdue was outplayed and out-hustled. Much to our collective chagrin. JMHO
Final break-down:
Points off turnovers - Ohio State 22 (off of 14), Purdue 5 (off of 6)
Paint Points - Purdue 32, Ohio State 24
Second Chance Points - Purdue 13, Ohio State 7
Fast Break points - Ohio State 7, Purdue 5
Bench Points - Ohio State 26, Purdue 4
But Painter is infatuated with 7 foot low post scorers. Painter never let Zach develop his mid-range jumper game, which means the middle is usually clogged up and we're either relying on long jumpers or Edey.
Yes, every team, or most every team, would take Edey. But, maybe there's some coaches out there that value more dribble drive/kick outs than running the offense through the low post. It's hard to argue with Edey's production, but the problem is, if a team can defend him or he gets in foul trouble, Purdue becomes pretty limited offensively.
It's only happened a few times this year, but if Edey gets in early foul trouble in a tourney game, I can see the rest of the team becoming extremely tight under that pressure to win without him.
You can't rely on the refs to call a game a certain way. A foul is only a foul if the ref calls it.
This is a sad flaw in the Purdue mentality. You simply do not out defend a team to win. You out score a team to win. There is absolutely no consistent way to shut great players down, especially in man D. You do your best on defense to limit them and score more than their team. We had 3 and sometimes 4 players on the court who had no intention of scoring. This is a reason Lance has been such a breath of fresh air (despite having a poor game). He’s not looking for someone else to save him. Great teams have 5 guys on the floor capable of and looking to score. This is why we were so fun to watch early. I thought this was THE YEAR, but our coach has turtled as is his nature.
don't think Jacobson is exactly in that mold and we may see Berg go out on the floor some
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