ADVERTISEMENT

This years team

guidelinesa2

All-American
Sep 3, 2018
6,039
4,869
113
Is everything last years team wasn't. You can really feel how much having JI gummed up the ball movement last year.

Having an elite PG and a team full of guys who pass the ball is not just a breath of fresh air, its an entire alpine meadow.
 
Is everything last years team wasn't. You can really feel how much having JI gummed up the ball movement last year.

Having an elite PG and a team full of guys who pass the ball is not just a breath of fresh air, its an entire alpine meadow.
I posted on GBI pre-season I was looking forward to getting back to team ball and Purdue type BB and was told in many ways , your saying that because there is white guys gonna be playing....I just quit writing comments given the somewhat challenged IQ there at times. More peaceful here, testosterone is not so jacked up.
 
I posted on GBI pre-season I was looking forward to getting back to team ball and Purdue type BB and was told in many ways , your saying that because there is white guys gonna be playing....I just quit writing comments given the somewhat challenged IQ there at times. More peaceful here, testosterone is not so jacked up.

This board is much better. People should just post what they want to say without getting attacked like on the playground. The other board is all about enforcing group think
 
Last year's team was good. This year's team is good. Both fun to watch and frustrating to watch at times.

Hopefully, this year's team becomes a great team & improves to be dominant.....we will see in March & April.
 
Wait, I thought Ivey was the key to winning? After all, he can “get his own shot” when no one else could. I was told by experts on here that this years team just couldn’t get it done without a lottery pick like Jaden. Just say’en…
Let me clarify. My initial comment was not a knock on Jaden Ivey. My perspective is that team ball always trumps individual stars trying to win games by themselves. Jaden didn’t have enough players around him to avoid a couple bad losses. When Jaden got the ball, all four other players almost froze watching him drive.
 
Jaden Ivey did not have a point guard as good as Smith to play with so the onus to create and bail out fell on him. I will never understand the amount of crap Ivey gets for being one of the best players and ambassadors that Purdue has ever had. Completely different teams and schemes based on personnel.

His show boating and me first attitude, his lack of defense, his meltdown that cost us the game against St Peters, his inability to dominate games. He is the most overrated Purdue player I can ever remember.
 
Jaden Ivey did not have a point guard as good as Smith to play with so the onus to create and bail out fell on him. I will never understand the amount of crap Ivey gets for being one of the best players and ambassadors that Purdue has ever had. Completely different teams and schemes based on personnel.
Wasn't' about Ivey, was about the fan bois that thought he could do no wrong because he was an NBA talent.
Those that thought/think that 'getting your own shot' is key to winning.
And that the "star" should have the ball in his hands all the time and always take the last shot.
Was very annoying and very wrong.
 
Wasn't' about Ivey, was about the fan bois that thought he could do no wrong because he was an NBA talent.
Those that thought/think that 'getting your own shot' is key to winning.
And that the "star" should have the ball in his hands all the time and always take the last shot.
Was very annoying and very wrong.
Unless you were Glenn Robinson!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: PurdueDave
His show boating and me first attitude, his lack of defense, his meltdown that cost us the game against St Peters, his inability to dominate games. He is the most overrated Purdue player I can ever remember.
Overrated? He came to Purdue as a 3 star/borderline 4 star recruit and left a top 5 draft pick. Sure, there were times he struggled, however, that wasn’t all on him. When Jaden came to Purdue he sort of was an afterthought, he left Purdue a top 5 NBA draft pick after 2 seasons, overrated sure isn’t the term I’d use.
 
Wasn't' about Ivey, was about the fan bois that thought he could do no wrong because he was an NBA talent.
Those that thought/think that 'getting your own shot' is key to winning.
And that the "star" should have the ball in his hands all the time and always take the last shot.
Was very annoying and very wrong.

I think JI had that attitude tho
 
All of the comments I’ve made on this board were about how we utilized Ivey (particularly in the second half of last season) to the detriment of good team basketball, which I do believe cost us in the end. Ivey himself is great— really talented player and humble person. But too much of our offense was dependent on him as a single player, and that really hurt our overall play when he had a bad night.
 
All of the comments I’ve made on this board were about how we utilized Ivey (particularly in the second half of last season) to the detriment of good team basketball, which I do believe cost us in the end. Ivey himself is great— really talented player and humble person. But too much of our offense was dependent on him as a single player, and that really hurt our overall play when he had a bad night.
Ivey’s game and physical abilities didn’t mesh well with our low post centric offense. He’s better with the floor spread.

And as stated by others, would have been awesome if we would have had a point guard to pair with him.
 
His show boating and me first attitude, his lack of defense, his meltdown that cost us the game against St Peters, his inability to dominate games. He is the most overrated Purdue player I can ever remember.
His excitement and love for the game is not showboating, the game has changed, you must be one of those "just shut up and play" types. I never felt like Ivey was me above everyone else again complete over exaggeration. His lack of defense was frustrating at times, but lets be honest, last years team as a whole was bad defensively, don't see you calling out anyone else. I agree he had a poor game against St. Peters, but even Zach had 5 turnovers in half the time, again selectively choosing what you complain about.

Jaden carried and won us plenty of games, if he is overrated, he was still better than 99% of any player that has come through our program. Jaden's contribution to this basketball program will be net positive for years to come, from recruiting, NBA mentions, and NIL money. Sad some people have a negative view of him because he didn't fit the "Purdue mold" like you envision every player should.
 
His excitement and love for the game is not showboating, the game has changed, you must be one of those "just shut up and play" types. I never felt like Ivey was me above everyone else again complete over exaggeration. His lack of defense was frustrating at times, but lets be honest, last years team as a whole was bad defensively, don't see you calling out anyone else. I agree he had a poor game against St. Peters, but even Zach had 5 turnovers in half the time, again selectively choosing what you complain about.

Jaden carried and won us plenty of games, if he is overrated, he was still better than 99% of any player that has come through our program. Jaden's contribution to this basketball program will be net positive for years to come, from recruiting, NBA mentions, and NIL money. Sad some people have a negative view of him because he didn't fit the "Purdue mold" like you envision every player should.

The game hasn't changed. Its just being played poorly.

I am going to to do an analysis of his game vs others and see where we end up
 
All of the comments I’ve made on this board were about how we utilized Ivey (particularly in the second half of last season) to the detriment of good team basketball, which I do believe cost us in the end. Ivey himself is great— really talented player and humble person. But too much of our offense was dependent on him as a single player, and that really hurt our overall play when he had a bad night.
Can we blame the player or scheme at that point? I agree, you have to mix it up but that wasn't all on Ivey.
 
The game hasn't changed. Its just being played poorly.

I am going to to do an analysis of his game vs others and see where we end up
The game has changed, basketball has transitioned to position-less. Its all about versatility and ISO opportunities. Analysis of one game or all? Comparison against only teammates or full college basketball population? I have a feeling you didn't major in statistics, so I will probably take your analysis with a grain of salt.

Jaden Ivey 21-22 (per EvanMiya)
28th Best player in CBB (BPR)
7th Best Offensive Player in CBB (OBPR)
+269 While on the floor (Best on Purdue's team)

That being said JI was not perfect, but again the hate he gets is a little odd at this point. He was a great college player with a game the translates significantly better in the NBA.
 
Can we blame the player or scheme at that point? I agree, you have to mix it up but that wasn't all on Ivey.
Honestly I don’t really know what changed. There were some games where we struggled and Painter gave Ivey the freedom to make something happen and it worked! But it felt like we then threw the baby out with the bath water, and completely went away from what was working most of the time.

It’s interesting to compare to Carsen— different player, but was given the same freedom. When Carsen had a bad shooting night and kept throwing them up, it was hard to watch. But it somehow felt like relying on him didn’t detract from the overall team, whereas the way we relied on Ivey seems like it did. The other thing is that Carsen did really well in his last big game and Ivey did poorly, so maybe part of it is just remembering a player based on their last game to some extent.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Boiler_HD
Honestly I don’t really know what changed. There were some games where we struggled and Painter gave Ivey the freedom to make something happen and it worked! But it felt like we then threw the baby out with the bath water, and completely went away from what was working most of the time.

It’s interesting to compare to Carsen— different player, but was given the same freedom. When Carsen had a bad shooting night and kept throwing them up, it was hard to watch. But it somehow felt like relying on him didn’t detract from the overall team, whereas the way we relied on Ivey seems like it did. The other thing is that Carsen did really well in his last big game and Ivey did poorly, so maybe part of it is just remembering a player based on their last game to some extent.

Edwards and Ivey are not on the same tier in terms of performance. JI had no where near the firepower.
 
His show boating and me first attitude, his lack of defense, his meltdown that cost us the game against St Peters, his inability to dominate games. He is the most overrated Purdue player I can ever remember.
Ivey came to Purdue as what, the 80th ranked player in his class? Had a very solid freshman year, improved over the off-season, and then had a great soph year in which he was hands down the best player on a top 5-10 basketball team.

No one was expecting Ivey to be a 2 and done (easily could have been a 1 and done).

Not sure how he was ever overrated when he essentially exceeded all expectations coming into Purdue.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Poprudy and mathboy
Ivey came to Purdue as what, the 80th ranked player in his class? Had a very solid freshman year, improved over the off-season, and then had a great soph year in which he was hands down the best player on a top 5-10 basketball team.

No one was expecting Ivey to be a 2 and done (easily could have been a 1 and done).

Not sure how he was ever overrated when he essentially exceeded all expectations coming into Purdue.

JI was overrated in his potential, his impact on games, and his value on the team last year. There were a lot of fans who thought he would be able to carry us to a FF and the truth is he barely even carried Purdue to victory once in his career. A lot if fans were overawed by his athletic ability and his speed, but they never realized that his highlight reel plays did not make up for his deficiencies, which were significant. He was a human highlight reel, but not a play maker, in that he made his team mates better.

I am going to post an analysis of his numbers
 
Ivey more suited to the NBA. He is averaging 15.0 points 4 assists and 4 rebounds. He can be the second Painter player in his 20 year Purdue coaching career to have a long NBA career. But he won't be a star.
 
Ivey more suited to the NBA. He is averaging 15.0 points 4 assists and 4 rebounds. He can be the second Painter player in his 20 year Purdue coaching career to have a long NBA career. But he won't be a star.

You need to score like 120 to win in the NBA, averaging 15 in the NBA is like averaging 9 in college. Didnt someone put up like 71 the other night? No defense.
 
JI was overrated in his potential, his impact on games, and his value on the team last year. There were a lot of fans who thought he would be able to carry us to a FF and the truth is he barely even carried Purdue to victory once in his career. A lot if fans were overawed by his athletic ability and his speed, but they never realized that his highlight reel plays did not make up for his deficiencies, which were significant. He was a human highlight reel, but not a play maker, in that he made his team mates better.

I am going to post an analysis of his numbers
Boy, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you on all this.
 
Is everything last years team wasn't. You can really feel how much having JI gummed up the ball movement last year.

Having an elite PG and a team full of guys who pass the ball is not just a breath of fresh air, its an entire alpine meadow.
The most fun guys to play with can pass teh ball. The most fun teams to watch can pass the ball. Most of the best teams pass the ball well...and yet passing may be the most underappreciated skill in the game by some
 
Wait, I thought Ivey was the key to winning? After all, he can “get his own shot” when no one else could. I was told by experts on here that this years team just couldn’t get it done without a lottery pick like Jaden. Just say’en…
And there were many on here who said the motion offense didn't need a true point guard. We're seeing how smart they were as well...

And to be fair, Smith has been able to get his own shot on numerous occasions this year...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Poprudy and mathboy
And there were many on here who said the motion offense didn't need a true point guard. We're seeing how smart they were as well...

And to be fair, Smith has been able to get his own shot on numerous occasions this year...
I think there are different versions of what a PG is. Many think that person makes everything happen through his ball dominance. Some think Yogi was a pure PG. Braden sees everything and rarely dribbles just to dribble while others are watching waiting for him to do something so the others can score. Purdue does a lot of off ball screening as well as feeding the bigs. Last game Braden got it going with his change of pace working ball screen and getting deep, but for most of the season he just sees things a few frames ahead of them happening. His vision, his passing and his control of the game set him apart from many that play the same position.

Certainly in a motion type offense or "read" offense the success is the versatility of those to counter the D based upon a read. Purdue runs a lot of sets, but not as much so far this year due to more versatility and a couple of freshman with high basketball IQs. What Braden brings realtive to IQ and passing Matt was already sold on Ethan to provide in that area a couple of years before.

In a way I hate saying this, but Braden and Fletcher are not only really good players skill wise, but both pretty mature in their approach and that is not to denigrate any other players. The play between is similar to Braden's dad playing with Austin Parkinson where they knew each others game well and where they would be at all times on the court. Few players considered PGs are a pass first player "today" that sees the floor so well. Many are scorers that create off the dribble which Braden did with Zach last game. If Braden were 5 or 6 inches taller and somehow played a 3 we would be talking about how good of a 3 he was in that he could pass, shoot and put the ball on the floor with good court savvy. Essentially, he is just a really good ball player that is playing the 1. Had he played a 2 with the same skills we would just call him a really good ball player.

Braden can get his shot and most importantly make it, ;) and although many wanted him to look a bit more to shoot, he isn't wired the same way as Carsen. Thankfully, his maturity understands that when he has the ball, 4 others don't and recognizes there is today and in the future talent around him to help carry the load. FWIW, for a team that had no true PG over Matt's years (by many), a particular person as a talent evaluator thought Braden was a good fit for Purdue...that Braden fit the needs of Purdue and no doubt some of that were those leaving.

Some people would think Willie Deane is the PG they want...others Carsen Cunningham...two scorers that were very different. Lewis Jackson another...all three very different. Two scorers on poorer teams and Lewis another game controller on the better team...but not a scorer although he did well in the Kansas game driving the ball ...until he missed... ;)

Braden has the skill set Purdue and every team needs. It will be interesting to see how his game goes if Zach stays another year (and that is possible) and when he pairs up with others in a couple of years and it won't surprise me either way in that he still defers to others and yet I can see him maturing physically and shooting a bit more behind the arc as well. Years ago a reporter asked Knight and his coaches who would be a PG and Knight laughed and asked what was a PG? He wanted basketball players. Still we know what we generally mean in discussing many PGs, but we understand a bit more in agreement when we discuss really good players. He is still a freshman, but he has been a pleasant addition to Purdue.

edited below
I guess what I'm trying to say it this talented team allows Braden's talent shine. I believe that if lewis Jackson was running the point and Braden was a 2, we would be talking about Braden being a very good 2 for all the same reasons...and if Braden were on a poorer team his skill set would not shine as much and so he makes Purdue better and when Purdue is better so is he...
 
Last edited:
Ivey more suited to the NBA. He is averaging 15.0 points 4 assists and 4 rebounds. He can be the second Painter player in his 20 year Purdue coaching career to have a long NBA career. But he won't be a star.

15/4/4 as a rookie often becomes a star. He has a very good chance of makig a few all star games. We will see, I am not sure playing with Cade will help him next year, but we will see.
 
Ivey more suited to the NBA. He is averaging 15.0 points 4 assists and 4 rebounds. He can be the second Painter player in his 20 year Purdue coaching career to have a long NBA career. But he won't be a star.
Who’s the first, Landry? E’twaun had a 10 year career in the NBA, though not as consistent.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Poprudy
JI was overrated in his potential, his impact on games, and his value on the team last year. There were a lot of fans who thought he would be able to carry us to a FF and the truth is he barely even carried Purdue to victory once in his career. A lot if fans were overawed by his athletic ability and his speed, but they never realized that his highlight reel plays did not make up for his deficiencies, which were significant. He was a human highlight reel, but not a play maker, in that he made his team mates better.

I am going to post an analysis of his numbers

You coach who you have. Given his team, CMP ran it the best way he could. Sure JI's game had holes and was at times frustrating. Being centric on this negativity at this point is kind of pointless imo.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Boiler_HD
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT