Should we have expected more?

[SCBoiler1]

Last summer many had high expectations for this team based primarily on the fact that we had our entire "young" overachieving team back (13-6, 4th in B10) and we had two top 50 freshmen coming in.

Fast forward to today. We finished slightly better than last year at 14-6 and 3rd in the B10. Should this have been a surprise?

A few red flags early on for me:

1. Painter came out this summer and said that Williams and Edey couldn't play together. Obviously not good that two of our best three players can't be on the floor more than 40 minutes.
2. TKR redshirt. Obviously we weren't getting a boost here.
3. IT starting at the beginning of the year. Had IT improved that much? Turns out, not really.
4. Furst unable to hold on to starting job and actually lost minutes to Morton at the 4.. Gillis is good but his per 40's are only slightly better than last year so we didn't end up with a significant upgrade at the 4 which was perceived to be one of Purdue's weaknesses last year.
5. Newman not able to challenge Sasha for starting position. This didn't just develop the second half of the season. Newman only played 10 and 12 minutes vs UNC and Villanova.
6. Morton is Morton. He plays good defense and doesn't make a lot of mistakes but his lack of offensive productivity wasn't solely the result of mono.

Anything can happen in the tournament and I do believe Purdue is a top 10-15 type team, but the reality is this team is only a slightly better version of last years team.

 

[BoilerMaker P]

Here’s the thing with #5 though. Sasha was making 3s at the beginning of the season. He had 23 against Carolina so I don’t blame Painter sticking with the hot hand. The problem is that Newman has been still benched while Sasha has been struggling down the stretch until finally we saw him this weekend.

 

[TopSecretBoiler]

No. This team has a much higher winning percentage, better balance and higher ceiling. Most did not expect us to realistically be number 1 at any time. Playing in the B1G with covid exemption year players is a nightmare even moreso that we don't have any superduper seniors. Purdue would win the conference by a mile in a normal year. Like not even close. I think the team is actually in great shape for March. Personnel is not really the problem. Valuing the ball is.

 

[PumpkinShuckers07]

Did you see that wide open layup IT had against Iowa yesterday and he didn’t take it? wth.

 

[ImRonBurgandy?]

With you on #5.

I thought for Purdue to be the best version it could be was Newman being an X factor.

Outside of a handful of games early in the season and against PSU in the BTT it hasn't happened.

 

[Gman544]

Regular season, yes should have expected more. Big tourney , no. Two wins is exceptional for Painter.

 

[SKYDOG]

Last summer many had high expectations for this team based primarily on the fact that we had our entire "young" overachieving team back (13-6, 4th in B10) and we had two top 50 freshmen coming in.

Fast forward to today. We finished slightly better than last year at 14-6 and 3rd in the B10. Should this have been a surprise?

A few red flags early on for me:

1. Painter came out this summer and said that Williams and Edey couldn't play together. Obviously not good that two of our best three players can't be on the floor more than 40 minutes.
2. TKR redshirt. Obviously we weren't getting a boost here.
3. IT starting at the beginning of the year. Had IT improved that much? Turns out, not really.
4. Furst unable to hold on to starting job and actually lost minutes to Morton at the 4.. Gillis is good but his per 40's are only slightly better than last year so we didn't end up with a significant upgrade at the 4 which was perceived to be one of Purdue's weaknesses last year.
5. Newman not able to challenge Sasha for starting position. This didn't just develop the second half of the season. Newman only played 10 and 12 minutes vs UNC and Villanova.
6. Morton is Morton. He plays good defense and doesn't make a lot of mistakes but his lack of offensive productivity wasn't solely the result of mono.

Anything can happen in the tournament and I do believe Purdue is a top 10-15 type team, but the reality is this team is only a slightly better version of last years team.

Disappointed they didn’t win the tournament. With Illinois, Wisconsin, and Ohio State losing and the favorable games they had it might be a long time for Purdue to win it again.

 

[z_one]

How does allowing your bigs to be pulled out to the top of the key help our defense? The biggest player being at the top of the key is ridiculous. I saw Sasha trying to stop Keegan Murray at the basket while Edey was out front. I don't see what we gain other than wearing out our bigs. Overall our defense has been better lately, however, with Painter's current scheme we are constantly placed into mismatches on defense.

 

[EdBoiler]

No. This team has a much higher winning percentage, better balance and higher ceiling. Most did not expect us to realistically be number 1 at any time. Playing in the B1G with covid exemption year players is a nightmare even moreso that we don't have any superduper seniors. Purdue would win the conference by a mile in a normal year. Like not even close. I think the team is actually in great shape for March. Personnel is not really the problem. Valuing the ball is.

I believe the personnel have something to do with valuing the ball.

 

[MilwaukeeBoilerFan]

With the talent Purdue has this year, we should have either a B1G champion outright or B1G Tournament championship is disappointing. I think Painter is a good coach to very good coach.
When Purdue gets turnover Happy for multiple possessions in a row, I expect more of Painter to call a timeout, settle the team down and pull players to stop bleeding. That isn't happening and playing thru it burns us time and again. Maybe old school coaching with both bench time and chewing them out will get it between their ears!

He better coach his ass off or we are done at Sweet 16 at best. Beginning to think that Micah Shrewsberry was the coach that helped overachieve more than what we are seeing.
Do we fire Painter? Hell no! At the same time, he can't keep allowing the team to be turnover prone & darn it shoot better FT's %'s as a team (64.7% yesterday). There is a proven method that works. Virgil Sweet process. Do it or else get someone else who will use it! It is time to John Wooden Purdue to a standard process for all players. We've lost several games at the free throw line & turnovers. Yesterday was 17 turnovers to Iowa's 6. That is totally unacceptable! More than 10 and losing goes up exponentially. We saw that result.

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If Purdue can shoot 75-80% as a team at the FT line, there are enough points 3-5 or more than can either put games away or keep games close. To let Ivey and others spin the ball, not look at the basket, that is B.S. Coach that crap out of him and others. This year is too far gone to expect the much more than Sweet 16. My $.02


Sidenote: Ivey with a sore back is so Purdue. Have great player and right at Big Dance, one gets hurt that affects their performance or they are out altogether. Haas comes to mind. I know there is no way to get around those situations. It is just Purdue luck that we have that happen and it affects the play.
One question did come to mind: When Gillis fell on his butt and the ball was turned over, did the court wipers do their job or let the sweat stay on the court and then Ivey went down hard the next time down the court? WTH!? Too coincidental that it happens without wiping it down.

 

[chrobertson02]

Last summer many had high expectations for this team based primarily on the fact that we had our entire "young" overachieving team back (13-6, 4th in B10) and we had two top 50 freshmen coming in.

Fast forward to today. We finished slightly better than last year at 14-6 and 3rd in the B10. Should this have been a surprise?

A few red flags early on for me:

1. Painter came out this summer and said that Williams and Edey couldn't play together. Obviously not good that two of our best three players can't be on the floor more than 40 minutes.
2. TKR redshirt. Obviously we weren't getting a boost here.
3. IT starting at the beginning of the year. Had IT improved that much? Turns out, not really.
4. Furst unable to hold on to starting job and actually lost minutes to Morton at the 4.. Gillis is good but his per 40's are only slightly better than last year so we didn't end up with a significant upgrade at the 4 which was perceived to be one of Purdue's weaknesses last year.
5. Newman not able to challenge Sasha for starting position. This didn't just develop the second half of the season. Newman only played 10 and 12 minutes vs UNC and Villanova.
6. Morton is Morton. He plays good defense and doesn't make a lot of mistakes but his lack of offensive productivity wasn't solely the result of mono.

Anything can happen in the tournament and I do believe Purdue is a top 10-15 type team, but the reality is this team is only a slightly better version of last years tea

Last summer many had high expectations for this team based primarily on the fact that we had our entire "young" overachieving team back (13-6, 4th in B10) and we had two top 50 freshmen coming in.

Fast forward to today. We finished slightly better than last year at 14-6 and 3rd in the B10. Should this have been a surprise?

A few red flags early on for me:

1. Painter came out this summer and said that Williams and Edey couldn't play together. Obviously not good that two of our best three players can't be on the floor more than 40 minutes.
2. TKR redshirt. Obviously we weren't getting a boost here.
3. IT starting at the beginning of the year. Had IT improved that much? Turns out, not really.
4. Furst unable to hold on to starting job and actually lost minutes to Morton at the 4.. Gillis is good but his per 40's are only slightly better than last year so we didn't end up with a significant upgrade at the 4 which was perceived to be one of Purdue's weaknesses last year.
5. Newman not able to challenge Sasha for starting position. This didn't just develop the second half of the season. Newman only played 10 and 12 minutes vs UNC and Villanova.
6. Morton is Morton. He plays good defense and doesn't make a lot of mistakes but his lack of offensive productivity wasn't solely the result of mono.

Anything can happen in the tournament and I do believe Purdue is a top 10-15 type team, but the reality is this team is only a slightly better version of last years team.

Yes, we appropriately expected more. Last year we went 13-6 in the Big Ten. This year with a more experienced version of the same players, an addition of an Indiana Mr. Basketball recruit, and attrition at other schools (e.g., Washington leaving OSU) we went 14-6 in the Big Ten. So, yes, we appropriately expected more.

 

[bonefish1]

I think the issue is more that we had really good players in Ivey and Tre/Edey, but we struggled at the other 3 positions with nobody that could get their own shot, create for others or make it hard on the defense. We essentially had all spot up 3 point shooters (including an undersized 4 in Gillis) and if a defense took that away, we were relying on great post play or Ivey taking over.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

I think the issue is more that we had really good players in Ivey and Tre/Edey, but we struggled at the other 3 positions with nobody that could get their own shot, create for others or make it hard on the defense. We essentially had all spot up 3 point shooters (including an undersized 4 in Gillis) and if a defense took that away, we were relying on great post play or Ivey taking over.

I would love to see us have a shot creator at the 4 again, like Vince or Rob. Maybe TKR can develop into that.

 

[BoilerMaker P]

A lot of Purdue fans got excited about Furst being a beast for Team USA over the summer and he looked really solid in November and December but his role/performance was really diminished in B1G season. Understandable as a freshman playing his first year in a physical conference that had a lot of grown men bigs. Still think he’ll be great for Purdue when his time here is up.

 

[boiler-deuce]

No. This team has a much higher winning percentage, better balance and higher ceiling. Most did not expect us to realistically be number 1 at any time. Playing in the B1G with covid exemption year players is a nightmare even moreso that we don't have any superduper seniors. Purdue would win the conference by a mile in a normal year. Like not even close. I think the team is actually in great shape for March. Personnel is not really the problem. Valuing the ball is.

Many possessions we absolutely do not value the ball.

 

[FirstDownB]

To some extent, it is the same team as last year, so we shouldn't be too surprised that they did not make the jump from 4 seed to 1 seed, even though things were trending that direction early in the season.

I went back yesterday and watched the North Texas game highlights. It is eerie how similar Purdue March '21 is to Purdue March '22.

 

[PaBoiler78]

I believe the personnel have something to do with valuing the ball.

and w/ the mismatches.

 

[Dryfly88]

To some extent, it is the same team as last year, so we shouldn't be too surprised that they did not make the jump from 4 seed to 1 seed, even though things were trending that direction early in the season.

I went back yesterday and watched the North Texas game highlights. It is eerie how similar Purdue March '21 is to Purdue March '22.

You have a stronger stomach than I do!!

 

[PaBoiler78]

With the talent Purdue has this year, we should have either a B1G champion outright or B1G Tournament championship is disappointing. I think Painter is a good coach to very good coach.
When Purdue gets turnover Happy for multiple possessions in a row, I expect more of Painter to call a timeout, settle the team down and pull players to stop bleeding. That isn't happening and playing thru it burns us time and again. Maybe old school coaching with both bench time and chewing them out will get it between their ears!

He better coach his ass off or we are done at Sweet 16 at best. Beginning to think that Micah Shrewsberry was the coach that helped overachieve more than what we are seeing.
Do we fire Painter? Hell no! At the same time, he can't keep allowing the team to be turnover prone & darn it shoot better FT's %'s as a team (64.7% yesterday). There is a proven method that works. Virgil Sweet process. Do it or else get someone else who will use it! It is time to John Wooden Purdue to a standard process for all players. We've lost several games at the free throw line & turnovers. Yesterday was 17 turnovers to Iowa's 6. That is totally unacceptable! More than 10 and losing goes up exponentially. We saw that result.

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If Purdue can shoot 75-80% as a team at the FT line, there are enough points 3-5 or more than can either put games away or keep games close. To let Ivey and others spin the ball, not look at the basket, that is B.S. Coach that crap out of him and others. This year is too far gone to expect the much more than Sweet 16. My $.02


Sidenote: Ivey with a sore back is so Purdue. Have great player and right at Big Dance, one gets hurt that affects their performance or they are out altogether. Haas comes to mind. I know there is no way to get around those situations. It is just Purdue luck that we have that happen and it affects the play.
One question did come to mind: When Gillis fell on his butt and the ball was turned over, did the court wipers do their job or let the sweat stay on the court and then Ivey went down hard the next time down the court? WTH!? Too coincidental that it happens without wiping it down.

I saw that too, don't know if they came out but he slid right where Gillis went down.

 

[Tommaker]

No. This team has a much higher winning percentage, better balance and higher ceiling. Most did not expect us to realistically be number 1 at any time. Playing in the B1G with covid exemption year players is a nightmare even moreso that we don't have any superduper seniors. Purdue would win the conference by a mile in a normal year. Like not even close. I think the team is actually in great shape for March. Personnel is not really the problem. Valuing the ball is.

Agreed. And the thing that everyone seems to constantly over look is this league doesn't sit still year-to-year hoping it gets better. All of our competition stepped up their game (with the possible exception of Nebraska...and maybe Michigan) and brought in talent, coaching and game calling that made the road tougher than last year. I'll also add we had that top 5-10 target on our back EVERY GAME and we got the best game from a lot of players (Rob Phinesee, anyone?).

 

[MilwaukeeBoilerFan]

I saw that too, don't know if they came out but he slid right where Gillis went down.

My conspiracy mind thinks it had to be an IU fan manning that broom for two reasons:
1) Why wouldn't he have done his job? Spitefulness and hoping something would happen.
2) All his I.U. degree allows him to do. Janitorial work.

 

[Purdue0023]

Luckily the season isn't yet over so we still have a shot at redemption. I did not like how things went yesterday especially at the end after we got to within 1 point with Hunter Jr.'s three pointer. We looked gassed and I thought despite our momentum that we should have called a time out! (We had 3 remaining). I hope Painter goes back and not only assesses film but also looks back at in-game coaching decisions and how to adjust for the future. Why do you run a play that is the most important possession of the game for the player that is the coldest shooting player in the game and the whole tournament for that matter? Sure, you want to break him out of his slump and give him confidence but with Hunter Jr, Ivey, Gillis, (Newman or Morton on the bench) being much better options, why??? These are the kind of in-game decisions (not looking at in-game evidence) that are going to send a team home early in the NCAA tournament!

 

[Bethboilerfan]

A lot of Purdue fans got excited about Furst being a beast for Team USA over the summer and he looked really solid in November and December but his role/performance was really diminished in B1G season. Understandable as a freshman playing his first year in a physical conference that had a lot of grown men bigs. Still think he’ll be great for Purdue when his time here is up.

Furst having Covid may have had an effect. Losing Shrewsberry was big. And last but not least, allowing players a Covid year hurt! I don’t think anyone should be allowed to play 6 years of college ball.

 

[BoilerAlumni12]

This season was another painter waste. No big ten regular season or tournament championship. Top tier talent.

But we were #1 for 1 day.

 

[COBoiler1]

Amazing with 27 wins and a couple miracle shots leading to losses (and hence no regular season title) and you call the coach a “waste”. Seems like that’s the sad part.

 

[rjmpu82]

Turnovers, missed FTs and some very timely shots by the opposition is the difference right now. The only game we were ever out of was at Michigan. If we keep TOs to 10 or less and make 75% from the line in the tournament, we can make a run.

 

[Roeder]

Yes.

However the season isn't over yet. Make a run the next few weeks and no one will care what happened the past 2 weeks.

Something else to consider about expectations is that the year Purdue returned it's entire roster, Covid years and 1 time transfers went into effect. If that doesn't happen Purdue is likely the B1G regular season and BTT tourney champs if you take Frazier off ILL, Davison off Wisconsin, Bohannon off Iowa, etc. Sure Purdue could have added a transfer, but the high level guys are going to schools with spots open, not to loaded rosters. It was very bad timing for this to happen unfortunately.

That excuse aside, this team can still play with anyone if they don't beat themselves first.

 

[SCBoiler1]

No. This team has a much higher winning percentage, better balance and higher ceiling. Most did not expect us to realistically be number 1 at any time. Playing in the B1G with covid exemption year players is a nightmare even moreso that we don't have any superduper seniors. Purdue would win the conference by a mile in a normal year. Like not even close. I think the team is actually in great shape for March. Personnel is not really the problem. Valuing the ball is.

Would of, should of, could of..... But we didn't.

It's not like Purdue doesn't have its share of older players, and after three or four years in college, a players growth kind of levels off. Sasha and Hunter are both older than Davison.

I'm not sold on the idea the B10 is any better than last year. The B10 was thought very highly of until it bombed in the Tournament last year. We'll see what happen this year but I'm not optimistic.

 

[BBG]

Furst having Covid may have had an effect. Losing Shrewsberry was big. And last but not least, allowing players a Covid year hurt! I don’t think anyone should be allowed to play 6 years of college ball.

I'm not in terrible shape and amd a good 3 months since I had COVID and I STILL have lingering symptoms like a cough and fatigue. So I don't think it's any real coincidence that Furst dropped off after her got it.

Also I think that month of no time off really impacted this team more than we may know. Yeah we were sliding a bit but still winning and beat a very good Illinois team.

It's all tin foil hat stuff and maybe the right answer is it wasn't any ONE thing, but a lot of different things snowballing in to one big one.

Still though, we take care of the ball and we win some of those games we lost.

 

[PaBoiler78]

Did you see that wide open layup IT had against Iowa yesterday and he didn’t take it? wth.

I remember it, also remember the sequence where Morton's 3 put us up 47-46 then Kegan air balls a corner shot then IT lets a no talent Tousaint knock the ball out his hands to lead to a PMac layup.