Did Carsen get injured?
- Thread starter *4purdue*
- Start date
Northwestern was forcing him into some bad situations, so I'm guessing Painter felt better with Spike and PJ on the floor at the same time.
He is in a major slump took a bad shot or so, but was really lost on D. Twice McIntosh was completely open...Carsen was lost, but not scored on. Since he came out right after that I'm guessing the coaches saw 25 feet away what I saw 150 miles.
Purdue needs him..and he needs to get it going
Carsen is one of those players that is better when he starts. I think Cline was also better coming off the bench. I really wish CMP would switch them back.He is in a major slump took a bad shot or so, but was really lost on D. Twice McIntosh was completely open...Carsen was lost, but not scored on. Since he came out right after that I'm guessing the coaches saw 25 feet away what I saw 150 miles.
Purdue needs him..and he needs to get it going
Think that would send a bad message. Carsen needs to go out and earn the spot back. Not crap the bed and make the excuse that he needs to start to play well.
He was 0-5 in the game. Not sure why anyone would be pining for him to play more.
CMP has given him a long leash the entire season... Even when he struggled. I wasnt home and watching the game with the sound down. I was only wondering why he was MiA most the second half.
We don't see what happens at practice, which is where the starters should be decided. Starting anyone shouldn't be decided on a bad game, especially when Cline struggled also.
Do you think Carsen is playing well in practices and Painter just decides to start Cline instead?
The truth is that Carsen's aggressiveness makes him dangerous when he's not playing well. If you're passive and not playing well, you can fly under the radar and not screw it up for everyone else. When Carsen is aggressive and taking bad shots or driving into traffic and trying to force stuff (shots AND passes) then he's hurting the team. He'll learn and get better but today's game was kind of close. Have to play the best lineups. Not time for anyone to be learning lessons.
I don't disagree, but I do think that both Cline and CE play better when CE starts. I know CE looked much better when he started and I haven't seen any stats, but I'm guessing Cline's shooting percentage has gone down since he's been starting. Cline was only 1-4 with 2 points, CE was 0-5 with 2 points also in 7 less minutes. I don't think Cline is a better defender and I do think we were playing better as a team with CE starting.
he has wore that many times. I think he hurt it over a month ago when he tried to dunk on a break
you and TC4 are both correct in my mind. Matt lets freshmen play based upon performance. Carsen will be back...he is needed for more than scoring. Matt has great confidence in his abilities, but as a freshmen that did better on the ball D...he has got to focus ALL the time. HE in my opinion is one that can provide a missing ingredient for PUrdue when stuck. I was really impressed with how well Purdue played..except for a few bad rebound bounces and such. After running too much the first half, they remembered who they were the second and the grind set in. Againe, Vince and Biggie were really good...but the unexpected boost was Spike since he has played so little and the competitive spirit he brings. Spike knows his time is running out...his body is done after this year and he wants to win as bad as anyone.
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YES ... and, the comment that has not been made is the message that is sent to every other player - If you practice hard, you will be rewarded. The message is not just being sent to CE ... this is a team in every way and if you earn a promotion, you'll get one ... so EVERYone, work hard every minute of every day.
...and THAT is how you build a team and grow a culture of winning. I think Carsen is a good kid that will grow from this, but is probably a little confused at this time since he has only been asked to outscore the other team before
I think Carsen may have hit the freshman wall. I'm hoping he will come back strong next year and not decide to leave. But I get nervous when he is in the game. He made some poor decisions again today and Matt showed more patience than I would have.
He's worn that brace on his hand since he was in high school. It's not an injury thing. He's just not playing that well right now.
Offensively, he just needs to learn when he can and cannot make a play. When he cannot finish at the rim, he needs to pass it off quicker on a drive.
It also has to do with the way Painter wants the halfcourt offense to be but he needs to also understand that CE operates better in a more spread-out setup. You can't put a square-peg in a round hole. Does CE need to make better decisions and pass it instead of trying to finish a drive when there's not much there or abstain from launching up a deep three at times? Yes, he certainly does. However, CMP also needs to understand that, while we're glad to have a talent like CE, he has to admit to himself that the motion O is not the best offense for CE. CE needs to play more team ball in the motion O but I also think Painter would benefit from tailoring some sets and halfcourt O towards CE's strengths at times.
Basically, Carsen was taking early shot clock threes with everyone out of position and forcing drives into trafic resulting in bad shots or bad passes. All of these were converted into fast break opportunities for NW. The bench stopped that problem. It's not working for him of late because the big has the book on him now. Coaches have him scouted and defenses are taking away what he wants to do. He will adjust. It's just a question of when.
What a shocker you dump the issue on CMP. No one saw that coming, truly.
Sarcasm aside, it is the player that needs to adjust to what he is being asked to do and understand his role in a specific offense. Not the coach conforming to one player, plus CE is a freshman so he is going to make mistakes. I get it you hate Painter, but even you are reaching now.
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...and why the NCAA tourney may open a door
If sitting on the bench when you are not playing well or within the system is enough to chase him away then he should go. I don't see it happening but if that's the case he's no more than Ronnie Johnson and we don't ever need to see one of those again. I think he'll weather the storm and be a much better leader for it.
FWIW I thought CE was our best player at Michigan. Really the only guy that played well.
Just like senior managers in my company should listen to me and change company policies to fit my desires ....
CE was awful. He had three straight plays where he either turned the ball over or forced a bad shot. He has so much potential, but he is still very reckless. If he can develop a game like Yogi, he will be extremely dangerous. Painter has him on a freshman leash and Spike was just playing better. I actually thought Spike was unbelievable and outplayed all of the other guards not named Mathias. Spike looked healthy and brought poise and control that Purdue needed. He was able to settle them down. Getting big minutes from Spike in the tournament will be extremely important.
Spike happened......that's what happen.
Ride the hot hand and last night PJ and Spike did well.....
Ride the hot hand and last night PJ and Spike did well.....
Watch games carefully, not watching the ball, and you will see set plays and multiple sets peppered in throughout the game. They are usually not run specifically for Carsen but his day will come.
I think everyone is missing my point. I agree CE was awful today and has been since the game before he was replaced by Cline as a starter. Cline also seemed to hit a wall since he's been starting, aside from the two 3's he hit in the OT game against PSU. My question is, if he's going to play anyhow, and he's been better most of the season when he's started, why not start him (especially since Cline has been better this year coming off the bench)? This is the time of year to get players on track that have hit a wall, not send a message. I don't think anyone here thinks that CE is a selfish player that needs to be benched. If the kid has more confidence as a starter, why not do it.
I thought Cline started vs Michigan and that was one of Carsen's best games in my opinion. Am I wrong?
Sorry. I wasn't trying to address who should start. I was merely talking about the NW game. I'd have to know and work with the kids everyday before attempting to weigh in on the psychological aspects of rotation management. You may be right. I just don't know.
Because CE needs to settle down as his mistakes here recently at least have resulted in giving the opponent points.
Personally I don't get the infatuation with who starts. It is what you do with the time you are in is what makes the difference. Who cares if it is from the beginning, middle or end?
Complaining that your favorite player is not starting just sounds like that parent yelling at a coach at some middle school to put their kid in.
He was the better than everyone else we had, I wouldn't say it was one of his best games. He just looked good because everyone else was so bad
I actually like Cline starting.....
Has played well and can guard taller guards and rebound.
I like all the guards we have, they all compliment each other.....and with Spike feeling better, we can lean on his experience in tourney play.
PJ, Dakota, Cline with Spike and Edwards is a killer group to have at your disposal.
Quality depth there.....
Has played well and can guard taller guards and rebound.
I like all the guards we have, they all compliment each other.....and with Spike feeling better, we can lean on his experience in tourney play.
PJ, Dakota, Cline with Spike and Edwards is a killer group to have at your disposal.
Quality depth there.....
That's kind of my point. I don't think it matters who starts either. But I know from my coaching experience, some kids play better starting and some don't. Carsen seems to me to play better when he starts. If he plays bad, he's still only going to get 15 min, but if it jumpstarts him...
I was hoping someone would post his stats as a starter vs coming off the bench. His shooting seemed much better coming off the bench.
Well he did score 18 points (2nd highest total in Big Ten games) and shoot .500 from the field. Not sure how many conference games you've seen him play better but it can't be that many.
I don't hate Painter. Obviously, this team wouldn't be where it is without him. I just think there are things that he often fails to grasp (whether it be due to stubbornness or not having an abundance of natural instincts or creativity in tweaking or changing things up), in terms of playing to the strengths of certain players and schemes that could improve things even moreso than they typically are on both ends of the court(s).
Alright.
As a starter:
25 mpg
PER GAME 10 points, 2.7 boards, 2.2 assists, .9 steals, 2 fouls, 2 turnovers
37.7% from the field
36% from 3
76% from the line
From the bench:
20 mpg
PER GAME 10.6 points, 2.2 boards, 1.2 assists, 1.2 steals, 1.6 fouls 1.5 turnovers
38% from the field
32.6% from 3
64% from the line
Maybe there are some things you fail to grasp about why he does certain things?
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