Weird how a Purdue fan is trying to say it's bad that TJD is a senior... Isn't that what Purdue fans strive for? Having upperclassmen? Conference numbers, Edey has points per game... Rebounds, steals, blocks, assists(by a large margin) are all TJD. Assist to turnover margin widely to TJD. That's why the race is so close. TJD is a more complete player and he's showing it by being a playmaker. I can guarantee, Edey isn't ever going to bring the ball up the court and drop a dime or cross anyone over for a reverse dunk. They are very different players and both have been dominant. That's why the race is close. And if Indiana stays within 2 games of Purdue in the B1G standings, TJD will without a doubt have a case to win.
Big Ten Player of the Year- 2 Man Race
- Thread starter IMSKRONG
- Start date
Oooohhh...bring the ball up the court? POY everybody!
Lol - that would be quite a sight. Would prefer he not do that to any friends of mine.
If he smashes Mulcahy or Izzo like Godzilla in Tokyo? That'd be cool.
No, really.
Trayce is one of the dominant bigs in the conference, and as of this year has the ability to grab a defensive rebound and start the break. With Xavier Johnson out it prevents backcourt presses, gets IU transition buckets, and gets IU into the offense earlier in the shot clock. It's not a deal maker, but it's a really good thing to be able to do.
JM, if the idea that Edey doesn't get calls is just among Purdue fans and Bardo then please explain why Jon Crispin, not a Purdue homer - I believe that he is a NW grad and broadcasting a game that Purdue was not in, and Sonny Dykes, on an SEC broadcast that I watched, made the observation that: "Zach Edey gets fouled on every trip down the court." That would seem to argue against your position a bit. It is clear to many, not just Purdue fans, that this is a real issue.
Also, teams that have strong winning records tend to have a significant foul shot disparity versus their opponents. They win most of their games and the losing teams often foul intentionally in an effort to catch up in score with them. So that is expected and hardly unique to Purdue.
Teams that focus their scoring by shooting primarily inside the arc will also have an advantage in free throws by nature of their offense. You get fouled around the basket. Again, this is not unique to Purdue.
In Purdue's case, both of these factors come into play which easily explains the disparity that you cited.
If you look at IU's stats for this season you will see that TJD takes 31% of IU's foul shots. Why? Because he scores in close and gets rebounds, both of which will get you fouled. Edey takes 33% for the same reason.
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Do these guys realize they are talking to a wall over here trying to persuade us on this? Take it to the national forum maybe, but no Purdue fan is taking TJD over Zach Edey. Ever.
If I was a mod I would lock this thing up. It's going nowhere.
I don't understand living on another teams forum either. It's fun to do a quick skim every once in awhile, but wow it points to so many insecurities...
If I was a mod I would lock this thing up. It's going nowhere.
I don't understand living on another teams forum either. It's fun to do a quick skim every once in awhile, but wow it points to so many insecurities...
1) Completely agree with the second, third, and fourth paragraphs of your post.
As for a quote from Crispin? While hyperbole, Crispin makes the point that people are pushing on Edey every time he tries to get post position. Yes that is true, but the pushing goes both ways. This isn't like a shooter that gets hit on the elbow. Watching Edey and Nicholson go at it was like watching a nose tackle and offensive lineman wrestle around. So Edey is in a 'full-contact situation' more than anyone else? Yes... true. But as you said that's largely a product of what Edey is doing. And it takes two for that tango.
They did in early January. TJD was amazing in that game himself, the team just wasn't there early in the season.
You don’t even believe what you are saying. POY has been over for quite a while. TJD should have worked on a jump shot for all the time he’s been there. Too bad - he will make a good pro though 😂
You think B1G POY is already over? Lol. The amount of denial from some Purdue fans is wild.
Statements like this create a straw man that is not measurable. In your opinion, what do TJD and IU have to do in order for him to win the award?
I think IU needs to win out and at least tie Purdue for the conference title and TJD needs to clearly outperform Zach head to head at Mackey for TJD to win CPOY.
NPOY is not a lock but TJD has no shot at it, even if IU wins out. Fair or not, he needed to do more in the non conference than beat Xaver and a bad UNC team to have a real chance at it. For all intents and purposes he fell too far out of the race to recover when IU got rolled by Arizona and Kansas.
He's absolutely still in it. IU just has to keep winning and he has to keep dominating. About all he can do. Edey, TJD are probably #1 and #2 right now. Followed by a group of Jalen Wilson, Marcus Carr, Marcus Sasser, Brandon Miller, Azoulos Tubelis and probably a few others.
So tell me in your opinion, what does he have to do to win it. Are you saying if IU wins out the regular season and TJD plays well that he wins NPOY? If not, what do TJD and IU need to do?
If they win out the year and keeps going as he is, I'd say he definitely win NPOY and B1G POY. I think a tie with Purdue or maybe even 1 game back and there is a discussion about one of them or both of them winning. I think a 2 games back there is a Convo for co-POY.
That depends. I don't remember if the NPOY is named before or after March Madness. If before? Completely agree with you - at least tie for conference title and outplay Edey on Feb 25th. If after? The tourney exposure would matter a lot.
Either way, both Edey and Jackson Davis are having special, special seasons.
I'm just trying to understand what you think will happen. I understand you saying that if they win out TJD wins NPOY and CPOY.
Are you saying that YOU are predicting that if IU finishes one game back TJD still wins NPOY and CPOY and if IU finishes two games back they share both awards? I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, just trying to understand your prediction of what will happen (not what the discussion might be).
I gave you my prediction and I'll gladly come admit it here if I'm wrong (I often am).
Im not predicting it. Indiana could just as easily lose our with how tough their remaining schedule is. But there is still plenty of basketball to be playing. So saying anything is a lock is pretty silly because you have no clue how the next 3 weeks are going to play out. Nationally and in the conference.
Good call on NPOY date, I believe the winner is announced after the NCAAT. Yes, both are having fantastic seasons.
I'm not asking for a lock, just a clear prediction of what needs to happen in order for TJD to win NPOY and CPOY. Obviously you can do what you want, but not making a prediction because there's 'a lot of basketball left to be played' doesn't make sense to me. By that logic one would never 'predict' anything.
My prediction is Edey winning. That's the most likely. But you asked for a prediction of what NEEDS to happen. And I gave you that.
It might honestly just be me not following but I was unclear on your prediction of what NEEDS to happen. Are you saying that if IU finishes within two games of Purdue that TJD and Edey share CPOY and NPOY? Again, not trying to put words in your mouth, just trying to understand your previous post.
I think there is a Convo. I wouldn't say it's a 100% thing. Anywhere within that 2 game spread there will be a Convo for Co-POY IMO. Both have been that good. That's just for B1G POY, not for NPOY. To win NPOY, TJD would have to keep dominating and Indiana would HAVE to. Win out. And winning out right now gives them a win at Northwestern, Illinois, at Michigan State, at Purdue, Iowa and Michigan. Indiana is probably sitting somewhere near #5 in the nation and possibly ahead of Purdue in the polls. And that alone would be one hell of a feat. But that likelihood of that happening is probably 10%. There is a bigger likelihood of Indiana finishing 2nd in the B1G and two games behind Purdue. This Wednesday and Thursday are huge for both teams and Edey/TJD. At Northwestern and at Maryland. I think Edey still wins it, but the conversation is closer now than it has been the rest of the year. An Indiana win tomorrow night and a Purdue loss on Thursday, you're going to see those convos really ramp up.
The chances of IU "winning out" with six straight in the B1G, all against teams that are above .500 in conference is way way lower than 10%. I'm no Purdue statistician, but if those games were each (or averaged out to) coin flips the probability would be about 1.5% (1/64).
I disagree. While it is true that Edey pushes back, it is the other player that initiates the body contact. That is the foul right then and there. If called immediately, there is no need to push back. It doesn't take two to tango if one is not asked to dance as then there is no tango.
I note that in your post you cite Crispin as hyperbolic but ignore Dykes' comment affirming Crispin's view. Why? I will suggest that these people, like me, watch other games and have an educated eye for play. (Note: I am not claiming that I have an educated eye but rather that they do. I do not wish to be falsely accused.) Again, there is consistent commentary that refs need to treat Edey differently. Why? I was not aware that there are different rules for different players, except in the NBA.
My favorite picture from Sunday's game is the shot of Edey getting ready for a potential rebound of a foul shot by a Purdue player and the two NW players literally locking arms together in front of him. At that point, there are three refs supposedly watching play with little/no motion on the court and no call. To me, that says it all. That picture is published on this board so you can see it should you care to do so.
I can definitely believe that. I just know it is very low. ESPN has us finishing 5-1 and I'd consider that to be amazing.
Agree on the post position. If you’ve played or coached post players it’s clear the the offensive player is not trying to push his way into position before he receives the ball, he’s moving and then sealing while the defensive player tries to prevent him from establishing that position. There are legal ways to prevent the offensive player from establishing position and illegal ways (two hands in the back, knee up the butt, arms wrapped around, etc). Zach is consistently defended illegally as he establishes post position and that is absolutely not a ‘two way’ thing.
I though Painter said it well on his radio show last night and saying that ‘we know we are not going to get all the calls when Zach is fouled or even close to it, but we need them to get the egregious ones.’ When they fail to do that, it causes a lot of trouble for Purdue and is bad for the sport.
Which gives him 7 for his career. Edey has one less, all earned this season. It is not close for this year, which is what the award is about.
Did it ever occur to you that perhaps the B1G wants to develop controversy and thus generate media interest? Having a foregone conclusion can get a bit boring.
"It isn't close." That's a pretty ridiculous statement with 3 weeks left in the season.
6 to 4 with 3 weeks left is not close in my opinion. You would have to run the table to beat the front-runner. I will note that Sensabaugh was FoW with 4 awards and has not gotten another despite no significant drop in production since the 4th. I believe that has occurred for the same reason.
As James Bond observed in GOLDFINGER: "The first time an event occurs, it is happenstance. The second time it occurs, it is co-incidence. The third time it occurs, it is enemy action." Or as Renee Russo states in the remake of THE THOMAS CROWN AFFAIR: "I hate to be thought of as a sure thing."
Edey has taken Purdue to places well above pre-season expectations. TJD has not. That is why I view Edey's primary competition for NPoY as Wilson of Kansas.
If things become a foregone conclusion it gets boring.
Right now POY is about bas close to 1A and 1B as you can get. TJDs B1G numbers are better. Barely, but better. And it helps Indiana has been the best team in the B1G over the past month.
Nope - Purdue will win the Big Ten Regular Season - game over - it matters who has been better the entire season! Don’t become a lawyer.
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