Chorus of boos rained down on the Patriots who were kneeling from their own fans. Free market will reign the day. Not sure how/why the owners didn’t see this coming - as was the point of my original post. Now they have a giant shit storm on their hands from the silent majority who pay to keep their businesses thriving. Once it starts hitting their bottom line they’ll put a quick end to their employees right to protest.
OT - NFL/Kneeling
- Thread starter 32zone
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Now when those same people stop buying tickets it will have an impact. If not then no big deal then they are supporting the protesting players.
Players have the right to kneel so long as their employers allow it. If people don't agree with them doing so, they should quit watching. Owners seem to be mostly backing players after Trump's speech but I wonder what their views would be if NFL ratings continue to decline and their franchise values drop by tens of millions of dollars as a result. They might change their policy to keep politics out of the workplace just like every business I've ever worked at.
In the meantime, I'm not "losing my mind". I'm simply finding better things to do than spend most of my Sunday watching football. I got many things done around the house today.
In the meantime, I'm not "losing my mind". I'm simply finding better things to do than spend most of my Sunday watching football. I got many things done around the house today.
The President has plenty of problems on his hands - it's utterly baffling to me why he randomly chose this. Of course, we know the answer - he likes to stoke these racial issues as we've seen time and time again. Likely to cloud the news cycle. I have no respect for that.
I don't think Kaepernick was cut because of it. However, I think he's fully capable of getting a roster spot - hell, a training camp/free agent spot - which would lead to a pretty obvious 'black balling' going on. While it's not my favorite form of protest, I wouldn't exactly get angry, not watch NFL games, etc. because of it. It's pretty simple to ignore. I watch plenty of athletes that I don't agree with politically, socially, etc.
Let me remind you that the internet company, Firefox, fired their CEO for making a private contribution to an organization opposing gay marriage in the state referendum when people complained.
NFL contracts have language that allows for suspension and fines for conduct considered detrimental to the league. Ray Rice was never convicted of a crime, yet banned. His behavior was considered improper even though it never got to court. This is true of other players as well. Elliottt of Dallas has been suspended, now appealing, because of an unadjudicated allegation.
TV ratings are down which translates into lower revenue. The league could take action if it wanted to do so as could individual owners.
There are also morals clauses in endorsement contracts that could also be invoked.
NFL contracts have language that allows for suspension and fines for conduct considered detrimental to the league. Ray Rice was never convicted of a crime, yet banned. His behavior was considered improper even though it never got to court. This is true of other players as well. Elliottt of Dallas has been suspended, now appealing, because of an unadjudicated allegation.
TV ratings are down which translates into lower revenue. The league could take action if it wanted to do so as could individual owners.
There are also morals clauses in endorsement contracts that could also be invoked.
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I think this is a pretty ignorant statement, which I'm not terribly surprised by. Most of these NFL players had no money prior to making the NFL - most of whom have been there less than 5 years. They didn't grow up rich or inherit millions of dollars. Many of them are the first people in their families to graduate college.
Are there some assholes in the NFL? Absolutely. But why is it ok for Trump and Mnuchin - both billionaires - to tell private companies to fire employees based on something they don't like - yet these players can't peacefully protest something? I don't think Trump's ever faced what they are protesting either. In fact, he's been held accountable for discriminating against people himself. Not sure he's the discrimination police.
He did, but I think they basically gave him a heads up. It was not some bad blood situation, they did what they needed to do. And Kaepernick opting out was a better situation for him.
Explain how. I find you unconvincing and someone who really just doesn't like opposing viewpoints.
Oh Jesus... spare me the dick Cheney george bush post Iraq propaganda that really just stands for "I love enriching military contractors."
I appreciate the military. One can acknowledge their service and not need to be military to think critically.
My issue is this. Does a country need to be perfect before you can appreciate it? This country has never been perfect. No country has ever been perfect. Although they have the right to kneel, it's my opinion that it's inappropriate to use the national anthem as a platform to air these types of grievances and it will be my choice to refuse to support organizations who support such displays. That's me exercising my rights just like anyone who kneels is exercising theirs and nobody has to agree with either one of us.
I think you're making a massive jump to say this protest means they don't appreciate anything about this country. They aren't burning the flag here.
I don't think it's a stretch at all. Can't count the number of times I've heard, "Please STAND and remove your hats as we HONOR America with the playing of our national anthem" or some such phrase at sporting events. To me it seems if you intentionally refuse to stand when you are able to do so then you are not showing full respect.
Kinda like how everyone hated Kobe Bryant when he was caught cheating? And everyone still loves Tiger Woods. And Ray Lewis is beloved and on TV. People don't give a crap about this stuff in the long run. They may boo but I doubt massive amounts of people are going to suddenly never watch NFL games because of something you don't even see when you watch TV.
What's lost in all of this is that SPORTS ratings and/or attendance is down across the board. Is NASCAR in the toilet because liberal Americans are boycotting the conservative-tilt of NASCAR? No. Sports ratings across the board are down for a variety of reasons - the NFL's drop has actually been less than other leagues/sports.
Also, to call this a "shit storm" is a bit much. Ok, Donald.
So we're judged on how much we love America based on our behavior during a sporting event's national anthem?
I talked to someone during a game back in 2012, oh gosh. Am I not a patriot?
My response was to your post implying they don't like anything about the country.
Is it my favorite form of protest? Not really. Is it really earth shattering stuff that boggles the mind? Not really.
I'm certainly not into dividing the country, calling people sons of bitches and inflaming race wars whenever I have the chance to on Twitter though, so maybe I'm in the minority.
If you choose to not show respect to the country during a ceremony designed to show respect to the country then clearly you have issues with the country that prevent you from even respecting it, let alone appreciate it.
And that's fine. It's your right. Just own it and don't pretend that it means something else.
Again, I said it's not my favorite form of protest. I have no problem saying that. And I never said they didn't have issues - but you implied that they don't like ANYTHING about this country. That's a very big difference.
I also find it disrespectful to our country if you call Neo-Nazis very fine people, but again, I'm just in the minority I guess.
Hey, Boris, I AM a veteran - USAF February 1971 thru April 1974. I was discharged ten months early because of an Article 15 which turned into a Courts Martial when I demanded one. It was because of an article I wrote in the Fuji Flyer (Yokota AB newspaper) which called Air Police procedures "arbitrary."
Seems airmen leaving Yokota and arriving at Osan or Kunsan two hours later suffered from rapid hair growth. Their mustaches and sideburns were legal when they left but did not meet regs when they landed. Really????? Sounded arbitrary to me. Anyway the Courts Martial was never prosecuted, I received a letter of reprimand and deselection from re-enlistmentand an Honorable Discharge ten months early. Possibly did not hurt that Senator Birch Bayh made an inquiry on my behalf. Broke my heart to get out early to back to Purdue to begin work on a PhD.
In high school i was a Barry Goldwater republican, joined the YAF my freshman year at Purdue. Then reality set in and by the time I was stationed at Lowry AFB, i was going to VVAW meetings. Working in the summer of 1974, listening to Nixon's impeachment proceedings I thought "worst president ever." For those of you parodying Kaepernick's name, I can only say i would prefer Nixon over Trumplethinskin.
I don't attend NFL games or NBA games. If i were to now I would do the same thing I do at professional tennis matches and MSL/USNMT soccer matches: sit during the national anthem. So far, no one has commented - positively or negatively (of course, I have not attended very many since Kaepernick began his kneeling).If that occurs and i am accused of disrespecting whatever it is they think i disrespect, I would tell them I am a veteran who "supported and defended" the Constitution - think First Amendment. Then I would ask if they were veterans. If so, they would be hypocrites. One last comment, I assume you, Boris, jump from your recliner when the National Anthem is played, your hand over your heart, staring intently, reverently at the flag on your television screen.
Incorrect. I never once said that kneeling means they don't like "anything" about this country. That's you trying to go off on a tangent.
I get it. You don't like Trump and try to make everything a referendum on him. I personally think it's absolutely idiotic from a political perspective for him to pick up this issue right now but that doesn't change a thing about how I feel about those who show disrespect during the national anthem.
You need me to spell it out for you?
OK-
1. Who said we don't need regulation? (Answer: no one, but feel free to keep arguing! by the way, the mortgage crisis was created by both democrats and republicans.)
2. Who said no one was watching the NFL? (Answer: again, no one)
actually many do not take their hats off until being told since they are used to wearing them in a building. We have experienced a coarsing of society in many aspects the last several years. I think when I retire I'm going to create a site and post people abusing their handicap parking when I show them running into a store and such..and then I see older people with the handicap parking NOT parking there and using a cane because someone "worse" might need it. I just visited a school a few hours ago...quickly noticed they were using "go math" and saw a teacher (proudly display) on a desk the inventor of the ball point pin...and yet I know they are missing out on history. FWIW, relative to another post...there are times I carry. Indiana law allows me to now keep a gun in my car at work, but rules of the company do not allow me to have full use of my second. I'm not sure how things would shake out if a terrorist shot me and others that were prevented from having a gun?
The owners actions will reflect their character "lean" or if not that...the bottom line. People need to advocate their right to attend or not attend instead of wanting someone else to do it for them...which is much of the problem in this country not doing what you can. I'm not at all optimistic of the future ...economically, morally or teh willingness for many to assume there is no difference between an informed opinion and an uninformed opinion. Compliments to Do Dah Day on the quote I stole from him that is now one of my favorites.
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...pRtCRqFJcJpSdEZtj5gAsvZopIRIbm-nDwxMA38zJKzUy
I think what we're finding is that most people disagree with the premise that blacks are being routinely rounded up and shot by police. I think people just kind of rolled their eyes at the few who were kneeling. Now that we are seeing more and more athletes kneeling and now entire teams not coming out of the locker room...I think people are saying enough is enough. I think they're saying we don't buy the premise that blacks are being arbitrarily shot. I think they're saying a big chunk of the responsibility (if not all of the responsibility) falls on the people who have committed a crime or are suspected of committing a crime and are not following police commands. What they seem to be saying is that White/black/yellow/...if you do not follow the commands of a police officer, you run the risk of being arrested, tackled, tazed, and even shot. These protests don't seem to factor in the responsibility on the part of the suspects for their behavior during their interactions with police.
I tend to think this is how most people feel who have issues with these protests.
I tend to think this is how most people feel who have issues with these protests.
The feds stuck their nose in the housing market and bailed out the home owners who over borrowed and the banks that lent the money. All on the premise that home prices would continue to increase in value. The feds should have let the banks and home owners go bust. Fiscally responsible people could than buy a home for what its worth, not what it was artificially inflated to. I was there in 1995 on business and saw this bust coming.
Reminiscent of the farm bust of the late 70s and early 80s. The feds bailed out the family farms. Ha, they bailed out the banks and again artificially inflated farm ground. I fear with increases in in put costs and declining commodity prices, farmers are again borrowing on inflated ground prices, history will repeat itself..
This whole situation is the bad guys trying to make the good guys look bad. That's what bad guys do.
I think you believe what you wrote because you, like most of us, live in a rural Indiana echo chamber of nonsense. It doesnt put you in any type of majority. The exponential increase in protests today shows that. And even if there was a majoroty of people who thought the protests were bad, that doesn't mean those people are right. The protesters are serving their purpose. They are opening a dialogue about policing murdering people in our country - predominantly black males. I suggest you make a genuine attempt to understand the view point of the players kneeling. It doesn't mean you hate police, or America, or anything other than trying to understand why these people will put their career on the line to do this. As this goes on, there will be fewer and fewer people standing with you on this.
Yup. If Kaepernick was a difference-maker, he'd be playing. He's just not worth the headaches that signing him would entail.
Cheap shot. Luck has had the hell beat out of him because he had the misfortune of getting drafted by a clown organization.
If Whoopi said what Trump said all would be good in the neighborhood.
In all the years Jim has owned the franchise they have only had three losing season. There are only a handful of teams who can say the same.
NFL is headed on a downward spiral. Will be like NASCAR in the very near future. No one will care anymore.
Well I guess you are right about one thing. I don't give a shit about what whoppi or trump say equally.
Then you understand the rights of veterans to peaceably assemble at the entrances of NFL stadiums to picket before kickoff.
I disagree. I think it's more along the lines of this:
Most Americans either served, or had family members and/or friends serve in WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Persian Gulf, Iraq, etc, and many did not return home the same person they left as, and some did not return at all. When they see Kaepernick kneeling, they see a selfish, pampered, multimillionaire prima Donna who doesn't understand, or care about, the sacrifice that made their livelihood and freedoms possible.
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