We have a couple of players that fade for big games, Enlighten me.

[RFSNES]

I am disappointed in DM and VE. DM can't play defense, looses his 3 pt shot and can't drive, he must be a hell of a good practice player because he rarely shows up for game day for 40 Min.

VE Disappears, with his ability he should be able to get to the basket and score at will, is he afraid to mix it up inside

They are our team leaders, they must show up

And last of all, why was Spike not in to take the final 3.

Painter could not win a big game if he had the Gold medal team.

 

[mathboy]

i really dislike arm chair coaches who call out specific players. I think they are mostly frustrated at the loss, but we all need to keep it together.

Why wasn't Spike in? Well he did hit a long 3-pt at the end of the first half.... wait.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

VE struggled a bit, no question. He did play 38 minutes. Fatigue is probably some of it.

 

[SunnyFL24]

Gets frustrating that we never seem to pull out the Big One's............we're going to be fine.......But it does get old year after year Painter can't find a way to beat any of the higher ranked teams......especially at HOME!!!!!!!!

 

[Dryfly88]

Way over the top there OP.

Vince and Dakota both had off nights. Their perimeter defense needs to improve. I would prefer to see them give a little ground and just stay in front. If the player makes a pull-up shot I'll take that over a lay-up or drawing a foul on one of bigs trying to help. All things that can be worked on and improved. Let's don't lose our minds over a game in November.

 

[Chuchumutha]

Overall, I thought it was a good performance by the Boilers. We had to play uphill the whole game because of the fouls to our bigs. Got down double digits a couple of times and fought our way back. Too many TOs but most were us being too aggressive. I can live with that. We miss three and they hit four FTs down the stretch. Any one of those goes the other way, it's probably a different game. I love Biggie playing primarily down low, he's so effective down there. And Basil really sparked us.

 

[DG10]

Way over the top there OP.

Vince and Dakota both had off nights. Their perimeter defense needs to improve. I would prefer to see them give a little ground and just stay in front. If the player makes a pull-up shot I'll take that over a lay-up or drawing a foul on one of bigs trying to help. All things that can be worked on and improved. Let's don't lose our minds over a game in November.

If it were just an off night as you suggest, I think I and others would be more agreeable with your post...but in each guy's case, it happens far too often, and far too often in big games...they have had far more off nights than on in those situations.

Mathias has clearly improved his defense...to the point that he actually switched off with Edwards tonight due the fact that Edwards was beat repeatedly on the defensive end...which probably speaks volumes about both of those guys in that regard.

 

[tjreese]

VE struggled a bit, no question. He did play 38 minutes. Fatigue is probably some of it.

Taylor loss hurts and will hurt this year. Not enough bigs now

 

[DG10]

Taylor loss hurts and will hurt this year. Not enough bigs now

I am not even sure that it hurts from a production standpoint (although maybe it would), but it hurts tremendously from a depth standpoint and it is going to be an issue in any of the big games that Purdue plays the rest of the way unfortunately.

 

[BoilerFan#35]

Vince doesn't disappear he is our clutchest player. Dakota seems to know how to knock down big buckets too. Can't fault guys for being a little rusty in their second games of the season.

 

[septimusharding]

Gets frustrating that we never seem to pull out the Big One's............we're going to be fine.......But it does get old year after year Painter can't find a way to beat any of the higher ranked teams......especially at HOME!!!!!!!!

Maybe it feels like that, but we did beat MSU and Maryland at home just last year. At the time of those games they were ranked 8th and 10th, respectively. Or, to put it another way, 3 of our last 6 home games have been against Top 10 teams, and we've won 2 of those 3.

 

[tjreese]

I am not even sure that it hurts from a production standpoint (although maybe it would), but it hurts tremendously from a depth standpoint and it is going to be an issue in any of the big games that Purdue plays the rest of the way unfortunately.

It definitely hurts depth...with him Purdue has a big that has decent lateral movement and can always have two bigs in the game. he needed to improve his high to low post passing and get some rough edges off...but he gave Purdue a little size with quickness in games and great practice against...going to bed...

 

[BoilerBiker]

Re: VE
Someone mentioned last season about him shuffling his feet on the perimeter,
Hopefully he can continue to limit that as the season goes on

 

[bonefish1]

My frustration is that DM misses a ton of wide open 3's. Those are shots he was recruited to make.
I'm sure he's going to have games where he hits 5 or 6, but we don't need those against South East College of the Arts. We need them in big games in big moments where every possession is important.

 

[BBG]

My frustration is that DM misses a ton of wide open 3's. Those are shots he was recruited to make.
I'm sure he's going to have games where he hits 5 or 6, but we don't need those against South East College of the Arts. We need them in big games in big moments where every possession is important.

I would have to go back and look, but I think last season his overall percentage was rather good. People have bad games, it happens.

Plus lets not forget the fatigue factor. I think the lack of Cline was more detrimental than at least I thought it would be.

 

[DG10]

I would have to go back and look, but I think last season his overall percentage was rather good. People have bad games, it happens.

Plus lets not forget the fatigue factor. I think the lack of Cline was more detrimental than at least I thought it would be.

The point that was made, and a valid one at that, is that he was recruited to hit shots...that is why he is there and why he is on the floor, and he missed multiple wide open good looks...and the fact that his overall percentage was ultimately good is irrelevant if he hits shots in games where there is no pressure to perform but not in those that there is.

Villanova shooters all knocked down big and clutch shots at key moments, and Purdue desperately needed (and needs) Mathias to do the same...for them to be as good as they can be, and for them to win games like the one that they had last night...and, with the lack of depth inside for Purdue this year, it is even more important that he do it.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

So just to be clear:

- Matthias was terrible
- Vince disappeared
- Spike didn't play enough
- Biggie and Haas had too many fouls
- CE took terrible shots
- Taylor was injured
- Cline was suspended

And we took the national champ to the wire. Seems like Painter did something right last night, no?

 

[Kesselschmiede]

And we took the national champ to the wire. Seems like Painter did something right last night, no?

Sorry, Painter only gets grief and no credit for anything ever. Not allowed by the negatwitts.

 

[JohnnyDoeBoiler]

So just to be clear:

- Matthias was terrible
- Vince disappeared
- Spike didn't play enough
- Biggie and Haas had too many fouls
- CE took terrible shots
- Taylor was injured
- Cline was suspended

And we took the national champ to the wire. Seems like Painter did something right last night, no?

The announcers said, at the completion of the game, Nova' looks every bit worthy of being a title contender this year again....and that Purdue is far better than the #15 ranking they have right now. Other than a ND game in mid-December, Nova will probably run the table in their non-conference. With that being said, they were favored to win the Big East this season...a conference that seems to send 5-6 teams to the NCAA's every season. Nova' will be #1 ranked at some point this season and Purdue gave them a run for their money and lost a one possession game. In years past, the match-up of ultra athletic teams with length, like Nova', gave Purdue severe problems. It was nice seeing the strength of the team being used as a positive throughout the game and the reason the team fought back rather than a hindrance at times.

 

[tjreese]

Re: VE
Someone mentioned last season about him shuffling his feet on the perimeter,
Hopefully he can continue to limit that as the season goes on

He always has...

 

[PaBoiler78]

Sorry, Painter only gets grief and no credit for anything ever. Not allowed by the negatwitts.

I'm pretty solid on Painter, he can't make the FT's this team continues to miss. again we shoot a mid 60's % vs nova's high mid 80's . That's were close games are lost imo.

 

[Boiler Buck]

VE 10 points 8 assists & 4 R So his stats say he was responsible for @ least 26 of our points (do not know how many 3 ptrs the assists were for).....not to mention points where he might not have got the assist but his offensive pressure led someone else to the assist or points his 4 rebounds might have produced. Just looking @ the 26 points.... is 34.2% of our team points from one position......now I will admit it wasn't a dominant game by him and he could have forced the action where he gets more FTs, but his 32% of team points.....It will be great when he actually shows up then

 

[02Boilermaker]

.but in each guy's case, it happens far too often, and far too often in big games...they have had far more off nights than on in those situations.

the fact that his overall percentage was ultimately good is irrelevant if he hits shots in games where there is no pressure to perform but not in those that there is.

Just wanted to put some numbers to those statements. Dakota shot over 45% from 3pt last year in games vs ranked teams or in tournaments (vs 34% in the other games on the schedule). Dakota's 3pt shooting came through in those games more often than not:

vs ODU: 2-3 (HOF tourney semis)
vs Florida: 2-3 (HOF tourney finals)
#17 Butler: 0-3
#9 Iowa: 0-3
#4 Maryland: 2-5
#8 MSU: 1-1
#22 IU: 2-2
#10 Maryland: 3-6
Illinois: 3-4 (BTT)
Michigan: 1-4 (BTT)
#2 MSU: 1-2 (BTT)
Little Rock: 3-8

Dakota didn't have it last night in a game where hitting 1 or 2 of those misses would have been huge, but I think he's shown he has the ability to perform well and knock down shots in big games.

 

[TopSecretBoiler]

VE 10 points 8 assists & 4 R So his stats say he was responsible for @ least 26 of our points (do not know how many 3 ptrs the assists were for).....not to mention points where he might not have got the assist but his offensive pressure led someone else to the assist or points his 4 rebounds might have produced. Just looking @ the 26 points.... is 34.2% of our team points from one position......now I will admit it wasn't a dominant game by him and he could have forced the action where he gets more FTs, but his 32% of team points.....It will be great when he actually shows up then

almost all of that was in the first half. He disappeared in the 2nd half and got crushed on D. Unusual. Maybe he was sick. He doesn't usually fade. It was a good game. We missed some open shots and had too many TOs. There was one sequence we were down 1 and turned it over 3 straight times. oof. I thought CMP was brilliant, actually, and I'm usually pretty hard on him. We got into a bad situation early and he managed it perfectly to give us a chance at the end. When we had our bigs out there, we outperformed them. We didn't crumble down the stretch either.

 

[dwhitebash11]

The announcers said, at the completion of the game, Nova' looks every bit worthy of being a title contender this year again....and that Purdue is far better than the #15 ranking they have right now. Other than a ND game in mid-December, Nova will probably run the table in their non-conference. With that being said, they were favored to win the Big East this season...a conference that seems to send 5-6 teams to the NCAA's every season. Nova' will be #1 ranked at some point this season and Purdue gave them a run for their money and lost a one possession game. In years past, the match-up of ultra athletic teams with length, like Nova', gave Purdue severe problems. It was nice seeing the strength of the team being used as a positive throughout the game and the reason the team fought back rather than a hindrance at times.

People seem to forget about stuff like this. At least twice Nova got on big runs, and were up double digits... Painter called a timeout, and Purdue came out with energy and poise, coming up with their own run to either take the lead, tie it up, or make it a one possession game... How many times in the past has this Purdue team done that? Usually when we get down big against smaller, athletic perimeter teams, ESPECIALLY with our bigs in deep foul trouble, the game is over. But this team fought back, made HUGE momentum plays, and made it a game. Give credit to the champs, Nova, for making HUGE shots in crucial times. Like I said, every time we cut the lead to 1 or tied it up, Nova would hit a 3 and silence the crowd... Those are HUGE shots on the road.

I'm proud of how resilient this PU team is early on in the season. They seem focused and ready to take on ANY challenge... They were just rusty, period. A handful of missed 3s, as noted above, numerous botched free throws whether it was 1 and 1 situations or just missing them late in the game, by Haas (not his fault as he kept us in the game late) which I think was due to fatigue as he played a lot in the 2nd half. Some questionable foul calls on our bigs, just because they're BIG human beings and it's frowned upon in the NCAA to have BIG human beings now playing ball it seems. But as I mentioned in another thread, the refs DID NOT cost us this game.


Lets learn from this, we faced the reigning Nat Champs who returned most of their lineup, took them to the last possession of the game. I like our chances from here on out against ANYONE we face. We did good against the press minus 2-3 possessions in the 2nd half. I think we have a lot to be excited for this year, folks. A loss hurts, but playing a top 3 team in the nation to the wire will ONLY improve this team.

 

[Statey]

VE 10 points 8 assists & 4 R So his stats say he was responsible for @ least 26 of our points (do not know how many 3 ptrs the assists were for).....not to mention points where he might not have got the assist but his offensive pressure led someone else to the assist or points his 4 rebounds might have produced. Just looking @ the 26 points.... is 34.2% of our team points from one position......now I will admit it wasn't a dominant game by him and he could have forced the action where he gets more FTs, but his 32% of team points.....It will be great when he actually shows up then

In fairness, if you did this for every position, you're going to have cumulative % of 200%, because you're counting every made basket for 2 different people.

I was surprised to see the box score afterwards and see he had 10/8/4. What I "saw" watching last night was him being a virtual non-factor throughout most of the game. And I like him as a player, so that's not a bias I have against him. However, others may have seen something different when they watched, and that's fine too.

 

[dwhitebash11]

In fairness, if you did this for every position, you're going to have cumulative % of 200%, because you're counting every made basket for 2 different people.

I was surprised to see the box score afterwards and see he had 10/8/4. What I "saw" watching last night was him being a virtual non-factor throughout most of the game. And I like him as a player, so that's not a bias I have against him. However, others may have seen something different when they watched, and that's fine too.

I agree VE had a bad game last night, no question. Still is probably our best all around player, but he has to play better to win games against teams like Nova. I have no doubt that no one is harder on VE right now than VE. He'll watch the tape and fix his mistakes. There's no doubt about it that he'll right the ship.

 

[since1980]

Enlightening you:

Our offense is still very much geared to play inside out. We are very much a pound it in to the bigs or shoot 3's type of offense. There isn't much in between because usually Haas or Swanigan are camped in the lane on the ball side. We do a lot more passing than we do dribbling because our guys up top are just switching positions...and our 2 bigs are usually just playing high-low with each other. There is very, very little dribbling into the lane.

We don't set pick and rolls very often with our bigs like Nova and other teams do creating driving lanes, therefore guys like Vince/Basil/ Spike or Carsen who could do really well putting it on the floor with a driving lane, don't get that chance much. Therefore our guards are inconsistent and because it generally comes down to how well they shoot the 3.

This really shows at the end of games when we need a perimeter playmaker making a play, and yet the ball tends to end up in Swanigan's hand because we don't have a playmaking guard yet....combined with Painter not adjusting his system to allow for something other than playing an inside out type of game. Teams are happy to have Swanigan with the ball in his hands on the perimeter at the end of a game.

Nobody played bad last night. We played within ourselves and will always be a competitive team because we have good players and an extreme size advantage. However, our sky is very limited because of our offensive system and it doesn't cater towards our guards being able to make plays like you see teams like Nova's guards being able to do. If we aren't hitting 3's, our offense struggles.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

Agree about a play-maker who can either create his own shot or force the defense to react with dribble penetration/slash. Right now, I'd guess the best candidates are VE and CE. It's more difficult for Purdue when they need a three to tie.

 

[Dryfly88]

Agree about a play-maker who can either create his own shot or force the defense to react with dribble penetration/slash. Right now, I'd guess the best candidates are VE and CE. It's more difficult for Purdue when they need a three to tie.

VE needs to really tighten up that handle if he is going to be an effective slasher consistently. I love his all-around game, but to take it to the next level he needs to handle the ball better (and quit shuffling his feet).

 

[Born Boiler]

Sorry, Painter only gets grief and no credit for anything ever. Not allowed by the negatwitts.

Yes, give Painter credit. With the loss to Villanova, he’s 30-65 against ranked teams. That’s .316, which ain’t bad for someone short of Stan Musial or Ted Williams. It would top the 2016 Cubs.

Taylor hasn’t stayed healthy since 10th grade, so counting on him as the one-and-only big man on the bench this year was absurd, especially given how often Haas and Swanigan foul. Painter, however, settled for a one-guard recruiting class while losing his best big man plus his best swing defender. We needed to add somebody, anybody, over 6-8 who could defend and rebound for a few minutes. The lack of backup size cost a win over Villanova. Basil was sweet, but we needed an Oregano, too.

Mathias has shot under 37 percent for his career -- below 36 so far this year -- and he’s too slow to play help defense, so he logs more empty minutes than Justin Bieber. An ooh-baby pass every 15 minutes.

Vincent has had three years to get to step one, but he still can’t get past that without a whistle. At times, he looks like our best player, then he suddenly takes a hike.

Swanigan and Haas have been the most consistent players on court … until they get to the stripe. Standing and looking seems to hurt this team, whether on free throws or open threes.

Villanova was 18 for 22 on free throws. Purdue was 12 for 19 -- seven-plus lost points leading to a six-point deficit in a three-point loss. Can’t throw away gifts.

Can’t be content with a close loss at home against a defending champ No. 4 on BTN just days after eye-ewe gets a close neutral-court win against a forever-over-hyped No. 3 on ESPN. We’re better and should show it.

 

[dwhitebash11]

Yes, give Painter credit. With the loss to Villanova, he’s 30-65 against ranked teams. That’s .316, which ain’t bad for someone short of Stan Musial or Ted Williams. It would top the 2016 Cubs.

Taylor hasn’t stayed healthy since 10th grade, so counting on him as the one-and-only big man on the bench this year was absurd, especially given how often Haas and Swanigan foul. Painter, however, settled for a one-guard recruiting class while losing his best big man plus his best swing defender. We needed to add somebody, anybody, over 6-8 who could defend and rebound for a few minutes. The lack of backup size cost a win over Villanova. Basil was sweet, but we needed an Oregano, too.

Mathias has shot under 37 percent for his career -- below 36 so far this year -- and he’s too slow to play help defense, so he logs more empty minutes than Justin Bieber. An ooh-baby pass every 15 minutes.

Vincent has had three years to get to step one, but he still can’t get past that without a whistle. At times, he looks like our best player, then he suddenly takes a hike.

Swanigan and Haas have been the most consistent players on court … until they get to the stripe. Standing and looking seems to hurt this team, whether on free throws or open threes.

Villanova was 18 for 22 on free throws. Purdue was 12 for 19 -- seven-plus lost points leading to a six-point deficit in a three-point loss. Can’t throw away gifts.

Can’t be content with a close loss at home against a defending champ No. 4 on BTN just days after eye-ewe gets a close neutral-court win against a forever-over-hyped No. 3 on ESPN. We’re better and should show it.

Fact of the matter is, we're not going to win EVERY game this year, or next, or most likely ever. There's a reason its only happened to 3 universities. It's unfortunate we lost @ home, yes, as I, along with everyone else, would love for their team to win a marquee matchup like this. It didn't happen.


Do we have weaknesses? Sure do, if you get our bigs in foul trouble and force us to dribble-drive penetrate to the rim, you have a good chance to keep it close and pull off a win, like Nova did. But it's not easy to do that against us when we make you pay with our inside-outside game. You can double Haas/Swanigan, but as they proved last night, they're not afraid to kick it out for an open 3. It's just that we didn't knock them down as often as we should of last night. The gameplan worked for us minus the foul trouble. We beat the press. Our bigs dominated the paint, and when they were doubled-tripled, they kicked it out to our shooters, Mathias/Spike/VE/CE/PJ. We hit some early shots in the game, but towards the end they just weren't falling.


We shot 36% from 3, and all but maybe 3-4 were open threes. We shot 63% from the FT line, missing 4-5 of them in the final minutes. We turned the ball over 15 times. Our dominant front line was in foul trouble 2 minutes into the game. Twice, Nova got on big runs and went up double digits, only to have Purdue come roaring back and take the lead or tie it up. And we STILL pushed the reigning NCs who returned a lot of their lineup, the #3 ranked team, to the final possession of the game. All we have to do is clean up ONE of those 4 crucial stats I mentioned, and we most likely win this game. If we clean 2 of them up, we win by double digits possibly.


What is there NOT to be excited about with this team?! We're going to be in every game this year, and we're already a nightmare matchup for every team we face.

 

[boilerzz]

I am disappointed in DM and VE. DM can't play defense, looses his 3 pt shot and can't drive, he must be a hell of a good practice player because he rarely shows up for game day for 40 Min.

VE Disappears, with his ability he should be able to get to the basket and score at will, is he afraid to mix it up inside

They are our team leaders, they must show up

And last of all, why was Spike not in to take the final 3.

Painter could not win a big game if he had the Gold medal team.

Vince Edwards became the second player in NCAA tournament history to score as many as 14 points with 8 rebounds and 7 assists in his first NCAA tournament game.

In his second NCAA tournament game, Vince Edwards had 24 points and 13 rebounds

But yes, he fades in big games.

You sir, are clueless.