Huge positives and Huge red flags

[IowaMuse]

MOST HATED Rivals to be precise.....

lol I haven’t picked up on any real rivalry between Iowa and Purdue though I’ve just been following both closely the last four years. Alli I know
Is that while tailgating at both Iowa City and West Lafayette for games against one another it’s been fun and cordial. But more of the longtime fans would know better. I also attended a Purdue v Iowa women’s bball game and it was very cordial.

 

[Chi-Boiler]

Yeah, I don't recall how it started that we jokingly refer to Iowa as Our Most Hated Rival, or OMHR. It causes visiting Iowa fans to scratch their heads and lurking Indinia fans to have conniptions.

It's because when the B1G had the Legends and Leaders divisions for football, each team had 1 protected rival in the other division. Purdue and Indinia were in the same division, so they had to create one. Purdue got linked with Iowa. Basically the 2 teams left standing at the end.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

I think the OP raised some good points. I thought we looked slow, especially to the ball.

That being said, MSU likes to grind it out against us and we can never pull away.

Did you not see the first half? We were flyin around on offense and defense. Best defensive half we have had for quite some time

 

[IowaMuse]

Except it's just not true. Purdue's last 6 games last year were all played at a pace of 65 possessions or lower with an average of 63.2. Purdue's last 6 games this year have all been played at 65 possessions or higher with an average of 66.8.

For those that follow advanced metrics, those differences are significant. For example, this season, 63.2 possessions would be 350th nationally. 66.8 possessions would be 221st.

On the season, we are at 67.5 possessions so we've slowed down a little but that has a lot to do with opponents. 3 of our last 5 games have been against MSU x 2 and Wisky. MSU is 304th in pace and Wisky is 307th.

Interesting. Thats a good breakdown.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

Except it's just not true. Purdue's last 6 games last year were all played at a pace of 65 possessions or lower with an average of 63.2. Purdue's last 6 games this year have all been played at 65 possessions or higher with an average of 66.8.

For those that follow advanced metrics, those differences are significant. For example, this season, 63.2 possessions would be 350th nationally. 66.8 possessions would be 221st.

On the season, we are at 67.5 possessions so we've slowed down a little but that has a lot to do with opponents. 3 of our last 5 games have been against MSU x 2 and Wisky. MSU is 304th in pace and Wisky is 307th.

What was our pace vs Illinois and Wisconsin? Is there somewhere i can check?

 

[BoilerAndy]

lol I haven’t picked up on any real rivalry between Iowa and Purdue though I’ve just been following both closely the last four years. Alli I know
Is that while tailgating at both Iowa City and West Lafayette for games against one another it’s been fun and cordial. But more of the longtime fans would know better. I also attended a Purdue v Iowa women’s bball game and it was very cordial.

A virtual rivalry. Not a real one, as boilerzz and Chi-Boiler pointed out. What makes it funny is what you pointed out -- both fanbases are very cordial to opponents. OMHR without the hate and without the rivalry.

 

[qazplm]

Did you not see the first half? We were flyin around on offense and defense. Best defensive half we have had for quite some time

Defensively I agree. Holding them to barely 60+ points and having their guards play well below their max was definitely impressive.

Offensively I thought our guards not named Jones and Colvin played subpar. Too much passing up decent perimeter shots for questionable forays and drives.

Edey was Edey, dominant and Jones was the MVP on both ends.

But a win is a win and MSU is pretty talented. Definitely going to need our guards to be more willing to take some of those threes though.

 

[BoilerDeac]

He’s an idiot and is now on ignore. I suggest everyone else do the same.

How unhinged are that you have to call another person an idiot instead of just refuting his point?

 

[06boiler]

I agree with the lack of tempo being a red flag. I am uncertain if it was by design or if the players went into a bit of a cautious shell. But it really made our team one dimensional and is not a formula for success moving forward. It's a stark difference from earlier in the year.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

It was when the B1G set up Leaders and Legends divisions. They set Iowa as our cross division rival and it was a big joke.

I think that original crossover list was:

Leaders - Legends

Purdue - Iowa
Ohio State - Michigan
Illinois - Northwestern
Wisconsin - Minnesota
Penn State - Nebraska
Indiana - Michigan State

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

Defensively I agree. Holding them to barely 60+ points and having their guards play well below their max was definitely impressive.

Offensively I thought our guards not named Jones and Colvin played subpar. Too much passing up decent perimeter shots for questionable forays and drives.

Edey was Edey, dominant and Jones was the MVP on both ends.

But a win is a win and MSU is pretty talented. Definitely going to need our guards to be more willing to take some of those threes though.

And I think they will. We adjusted to msus style of plays. I just want smith to be ok.

 

[Wolegib]

The most hated Purdue rivals are the Purdue fans who post on this board! How many times do Purdue fans call othe purdue fans names like idiots and trolls just because they have differing views? More Purdue fans hate me than Iowa and IU fans combined. I highly doubt any IU or Iowa fan has ever placed me on ignore!

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

I agree with the lack of tempo being a red flag. I am uncertain if it was by design or if the players went into a bit of a cautious shell. But it really made our team one dimensional and is not a formula for success moving forward. It's a stark difference from earlier in the year.

Not too worried there. Think we slowed it down cuz MSU decided to foul so much — per usual. What’d you think of pace vs Illinois or wisconsin?

 

[boilerzz]

What was our pace vs Illinois and Wisconsin? Is there somewhere i can check?

65 and 67 respectively. It’s on KenPom.

 

[Do Dah Day]

Tastes awful too.

A shot of bourbon and then a quick swallow!!!

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

Not too worried there. Think we slowed it down cuz MSU decided to foul so much — per usual. What’d you think of pace vs Illinois or wisconsin?

Yeah - the Spartans controlled the pace for the most part. They are in the 300's on tempo, and Purdue is 160's.....it's a tough balance because even with the slow pace, they can score extremely well in transition - even off opponent scores. Case in point......fast break points today? Michigan State 18, Purdue 0.

Credit Michigan State - Purdue didn't get a ton of open looks either....now, they had some chances to stretch the lead several times and couldn't convert - naturally, once Smitty went down, all bets were off. Hall caused some issues too.

They might actually be better off on the 10 line next week (guessing they're in the SOUTH or EAST but could go WEST too) - would avoid a top seed in the second round.

 

[Heads up BOILER]

I agree with the lack of tempo being a red flag. I am uncertain if it was by design or if the players went into a bit of a cautious shell. But it really made our team one dimensional and is not a formula for success moving forward. It's a stark difference from earlier in the year.

It was painter settling in to take advantage of 1 on 1 D against Zach. Normally a fairly high percentage game plan. This game was really an 8-10 point affair if we hit a few more free throws

 

[06boiler]

Not too worried there. Think we slowed it down cuz MSU decided to foul so much — per usual. What’d you think of pace vs Illinois or wisconsin?

You're probably right that MSU was partially responsible for the lack of tempo. I think our pace vs Illinois is the happy medium we world strive for. The Wisconsin game was a little slow for my liking as well, but once again probably had something to do with their style of play.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

Forget the Smith injury and physical play for a moment, there were some nice positives but also huge red flags from doay's game:

Positives:

1) JOnes - Imagine Purdue w/ him last year. Guy was a menace on both ends today and played well at PG w/ Smith out of the game. He's going to be a huge factor the rest of the way. He also can't be manhandled physically like Loyer and Smith can at times.

2) Better D - Played really good D for the most part today.

3? Colvin - In a game that typically wouldn't be ideal fo him (super physical) he showed up and played well. And played with aggressiveness and physicality I haven't seen much this year.

Red Flags:

1) Style of PLay -- A HUGE problem. All on Painter. Think about this team the 1st month against several top 10 teams. Pushed the tempo, got out in transition, shot 3s, took it to the rim, put a lot of pressure on opposing Ds. And it actually opened up things for Edey when they played outside in. Now Painter has reverted back to half-court, grind-it-out, dump it into Edey and hope for the best. IT's way too conservative and is a recipe for an early tourney exit again. Way too content w/ playing a methodical style which played into MSU's hands.

2) Loyer - Yes, he hit that big 3 late which was huge. But he was a non-factor for 38 minutes. ON both ends. Gotta get more from him.

3) FTs - I chalk it up to the physical play, but obviously have to improve here.

OK

 

[mediaexpert]

The most hated Purdue rivals are the Purdue fans who post on this board! How many times do Purdue fans call othe purdue fans names like idiots and trolls just because they have differing views? More Purdue fans hate me than Iowa and IU fans combined. I highly doubt any IU or Iowa fan has ever placed me on ignore!

Don't be so hard on yourself, Bigelow. It is just because they don't know you.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

The MSU Family

Travis Walton, Mateen Cleaves, Keith Appling, Adreian Payne, Brandin Dawson, Miles Bridges, Bryn Forbes, Alan Anderson, Shannon Brown…

 

[krazychicagod]

Except it's just not true. Purdue's last 6 games last year were all played at a pace of 65 possessions or lower with an average of 63.2. Purdue's last 6 games this year have all been played at 65 possessions or higher with an average of 66.8.

For those that follow advanced metrics, those differences are significant. For example, this season, 63.2 possessions would be 350th nationally. 66.8 possessions would be 221st.

On the season, we are at 67.5 possessions so we've slowed down a little but that has a lot to do with opponents. 3 of our last 5 games have been against MSU x 2 and Wisky. MSU is 304th in pace and Wisky is 307th.

Great data. What was our pace in the non conference if you have that by chance

 

[BoilerAndy]

The most hated Purdue rivals are the Purdue fans who post on this board! How many times do Purdue fans call othe purdue fans names like idiots and trolls just because they have differing views? More Purdue fans hate me than Iowa and IU fans combined. I highly doubt any IU or Iowa fan has ever placed me on ignore!

Did someone hear something? I think I must have hit the ignore button.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

Forget the Smith injury and physical play for a moment, there were some nice positives but also huge red flags from doay's game:

Positives:

1) JOnes - Imagine Purdue w/ him last year. Guy was a menace on both ends today and played well at PG w/ Smith out of the game. He's going to be a huge factor the rest of the way. He also can't be manhandled physically like Loyer and Smith can at times.

Jones might have helped some last year, but remember...Smith and Loyer were both first year players and the tourney was new to them. This is the year we need someone like Jones on the roster and we all are certainly glad he's here.

2) Better D - Played really good D for the most part today.

For the most part, PU has played pretty solid D all season. Not perfect, but much better, and at the right time. Credit Morton and Gillis a lot for that coming off the bench when needed.

3? Colvin - In a game that typically wouldn't be ideal fo him (super physical) he showed up and played well. And played with aggressiveness and physicality I haven't seen much this year.

Colvin "tried" to play defense today, but....5 points in 8 minutes but also 4 huge fouls in that time frame as well. Again, he tried harder, but he's not...and I hope he catches fire at some point...going to help us much if at all, in the tourney.

Red Flags:

1) Style of PLay -- A HUGE problem. All on Painter. Think about this team the 1st month against several top 10 teams. Pushed the tempo, got out in transition, shot 3s, took it to the rim, put a lot of pressure on opposing Ds. And it actually opened up things for Edey when they played outside in. Now Painter has reverted back to half-court, grind-it-out, dump it into Edey and hope for the best. IT's way too conservative and is a recipe for an early tourney exit again. Way too content w/ playing a methodical style which played into MSU's hands.

Painter has varied more this year than ever before. This team won the Conference again this year, has a great chance to win the tourney, and reach the FF. Part or that is Jones and the guards being older, but part of that is Painter changing it up.

2) Loyer - Yes, he hit that big 3 late which was huge. But he was a non-factor for 38 minutes. ON both ends. Gotta get more from him.

There's a reason it's called a team. Loyer is a part of that five that has played together last year and this. Just because he's not scoring, he's still passing out assists, he knows where his team mates are for that pass, or how to help on defense. It's a UNIT when all five are on the court. I'm fine with Loyer starting and playing, because right now, unless Morton starts shooting and hitting, we have no one else.

3) FTs - I chalk it up to the physical play, but obviously have to improve here.

I will agree with you that we need to concentrate on making every free throw, but PU has done much better at the line this season.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

Jones might have helped some last year, but remember...Smith and Loyer were both first year players and the tourney was new to them. This is the year we need someone like Jones on the roster and we all are certainly glad he's here.

For the most part, PU has played pretty solid D all season. Not perfect, but much better, and at the right time. Credit Morton and Gillis a lot for that coming off the bench when needed.

Colvin "tried" to play defense today, but....5 points in 8 minutes but also 4 huge fouls in that time frame as well. Again, he tried harder, but he's not...and I hope he catches fire at some point...going to help us much if at all, in the tourney.

Painter has varied more this year than ever before. This team won the Conference again this year, has a great chance to win the tourney, and reach the FF. Part or that is Jones and the guards being older, but part of that is Painter changing it up.

There's a reason it's called a team. Loyer is a part of that five that has played together last year and this. Just because he's not scoring, he's still passing out assists, he knows where his team mates are for that pass, or how to help on defense. It's a UNIT when all five are on the court. I'm fine with Loyer starting and playing, because right now, unless Morton starts shooting and hitting, we have no one else.

Damn you’re a Colvin hater 😂 he played great today. His foul when he met Booker at the rim was one of the most impressive fouls we have had all year. He skied higher than Booker. He played great for the limited mins he’s got all year. Hit two big buckets for us. His fourth foul was pretty ticky tack and don’t fault him for that. Loved that painter left him in after that for a few more plays. He’s going to be a difference maker and it’s great that he’s eating Morton’s minutes. Painter clearly sees Heide and Colvin as better than Morton.

Just don’t get why you think be only played “defense” today. He was not a liability whatsoever…he played great defense vs Wisconsin too. Where were you at to critique him then?

 

[Chi-Boiler]

Damn you’re a Colvin hater 😂 he played great today. His foul when he met Booker at the rim was one of the most impressive fouls we have had all year. He skied higher than Booker. He played great for the limited mins he’s got all year. Hit two big buckets for us. His fourth foul was pretty ticky tack and don’t fault him for that. Loved that painter left him in after that for a few more plays. He’s going to be a difference maker and it’s great that he’s eating Morton’s minutes. Painter clearly sees Heide and Colvin as better than Morton.

Just don’t get why you think be only played “defense” today. He was not a liability whatsoever…he played great defense vs Wisconsin too. Where were you at to critique him then?

His 3rd foul was a real doozy too. Whatever guard it was simply moved the ball from right to left and it bounced off Colvin's knee and went loose. Guess who, Green, called a foul on him.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

His 3rd foul was a real doozy too. Whatever guard it was simply moved the ball from right to left and it bounced off Colvin's knee and went loose. Guess who, Green, called a foul on him.

Yep no doubt. Really encouraged by Myles…I want to see him get double digit mins today. See what he can do and get that confidence and experience up even more!

 

[Old Gold n Black]

Except it's just not true. Purdue's last 6 games last year were all played at a pace of 65 possessions or lower with an average of 63.2. Purdue's last 6 games this year have all been played at 65 possessions or higher with an average of 66.8.

For those that follow advanced metrics, those differences are significant. For example, this season, 63.2 possessions would be 350th nationally. 66.8 possessions would be 221st.

On the season, we are at 67.5 possessions so we've slowed down a little but that has a lot to do with opponents. 3 of our last 5 games have been against MSU x 2 and Wisky. MSU is 304th in pace and Wisky is 307th.

Bingo. Two factors stick out regarding pace. The first, as you pointed out, is that the opponent matters. As for the second point, Braden Smith has a lot to do with it. He was hampered by foul trouble in the first half, and injury in the second. A fully healthy and available Smith is always looking to push the pace.

 

[tjreese]

Bingo. Two factors stick out regarding pace. The first, as you pointed out, is that the opponent matters. As for the second point, Braden Smith has a lot to do with it. He was hampered by foul trouble in the first half, and injury in the second. A fully healthy and available Smith is always looking to push the pace.

Pace without purpose can also lead to less efficient offense. Push it when it is there and probe, but stay in control because Purdue also has a factor other teams don't in their pace and it is Zach. As in any offensive approach for Matt and many others, it is take what the D gives you...assuming you can execute effectively...else there may be a reason you were given that. It is not a given that if you speed up, the other team will. It isn't as though Purdue's defense speeds teams up.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

Jones might have helped some last year, but remember...Smith and Loyer were both first year players and the tourney was new to them. This is the year we need someone like Jones on the roster and we all are certainly glad he's here.

For the most part, PU has played pretty solid D all season. Not perfect, but much better, and at the right time. Credit Morton and Gillis a lot for that coming off the bench when needed.

Colvin "tried" to play defense today, but....5 points in 8 minutes but also 4 huge fouls in that time frame as well. Again, he tried harder, but he's not...and I hope he catches fire at some point...going to help us much if at all, in the tourney.

Painter has varied more this year than ever before. This team won the Conference again this year, has a great chance to win the tourney, and reach the FF. Part or that is Jones and the guards being older, but part of that is Painter changing it up.

There's a reason it's called a team. Loyer is a part of that five that has played together last year and this. Just because he's not scoring, he's still passing out assists, he knows where his team mates are for that pass, or how to help on defense. It's a UNIT when all five are on the court. I'm fine with Loyer starting and playing, because right now, unless Morton starts shooting and hitting, we have no one else.

You still not liking Myles after today?

 

[Dryfly88]

You still not liking Myles after today?

He's a complete tool. He's really an IU fan and his knowledge of hoops shows it.

He's the one that thought IU would make the dance if they won 1 game in B1G tournament. Clueless.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

He's a complete tool. He's really an IU fan and his knowledge of hoops shows it.

He's the one that thought IU would make the dance if they won 1 game in B1G tournament. Clueless.

Yep no doubt. Really encouraged by Myles…I want to see him get double digit mins today. See what he can do and get that confidence and experience up even more!

Well, you got your wish. 12 minutes/3 points/2 turnovers. Nice young man I've heard, but hasn't been good enough for more playing time. I don't hate him...I don't hate anyone. I just see him for what he is..HS stud who hasn't figured out the college game yet. But maybe he'll come in figure it out someday. And Dry....If you had a brain, or even half a brain, you'd know I'm not an iU fan.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

Well, you got your wish. 12 minutes/3 points/2 turnovers. Nice young man I've heard, but hasn't been good enough for more playing time. I don't hate him...I don't hate anyone. I just see him for what he is..HS stud who hasn't figured out the college game yet. But maybe he'll come in figure it out someday. And Dry....If you had a brain, or even half a brain, you'd know I'm not an iU fan.

He literally figured it out the last two games. He’s playing better than Morton….hence why he’s taking his minutes. Great to see.

 

[Dryfly88]

Well, you got your wish. 12 minutes/3 points/2 turnovers. Nice young man I've heard, but hasn't been good enough for more playing time. I don't hate him...I don't hate anyone. I just see him for what he is..HS stud who hasn't figured out the college game yet. But maybe he'll come in figure it out someday. And Dry....If you had a brain, or even half a brain, you'd know I'm not an iU fan.

I know exactly who/what you are. An iU fan who longs for the RMK days. Read your crap for years on here about your love for ole Bobby.

Your comments on Myles have been over the top and you've been called on it by many on here, including me. Even this latest post shows how little you understand the game.

How did that prediction of IU winning one game and getting into the tournament work out? If you had half a brain you would have known that was stupid.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

Well, you got your wish. 12 minutes/3 points/2 turnovers. Nice young man I've heard, but hasn't been good enough for more playing time. I don't hate him...I don't hate anyone. I just see him for what he is..HS stud who hasn't figured out the college game yet. But maybe he'll come in figure it out someday. And Dry....If you had a brain, or even half a brain, you'd know I'm not an iU fan.

Also I’m really glad you’re not a coach/scout because you’d definitely not be good at evaluating talent and how to bring that talent along throughout the year.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

Also I’m really glad you’re not a coach/scout because you’d definitely not be good at evaluating talent and how to bring that talent along throughout the year.

Hmmm....maybe that's why 10 young men who played for me got to play at the next level. Maybe that's why I see things differently than you do. Because I've been there/done that.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

I know exactly who/what you are. An iU fan who longs for the RMK days. Read your crap for years on here about your love for ole Bobby.

Your comments on Myles have been over the top and you've been called on it by many on here, including me. Even this latest post shows how little you understand the game.

How did that prediction of IU winning one game and getting into the tournament work out? If you had half a brain you would have known that was stupid.

You actually know very little about much of anything. My comments about Myles have been very accurate...otherwise he'd be replacing someone on the court. He's NOT READY yet.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

He literally figured it out the last two games. He’s playing better than Morton….hence why he’s taking his minutes. Great to see.

Surely you're not trying to say he is playing better defense than Morton? And I know Painter is putting him in games to rest a starter, HOPING he gets it because down the stretch to make a FF he is going to need SOMEONE off the bench to step up. So far, he's not been the one.

 

[ghostoffatjack]

Forget the Smith injury and physical play for a moment, there were some nice positives but also huge red flags from doay's game:

Positives:

1) JOnes - Imagine Purdue w/ him last year. Guy was a menace on both ends today and played well at PG w/ Smith out of the game. He's going to be a huge factor the rest of the way. He also can't be manhandled physically like Loyer and Smith can at times.

2) Better D - Played really good D for the most part today.

3? Colvin - In a game that typically wouldn't be ideal fo him (super physical) he showed up and played well. And played with aggressiveness and physicality I haven't seen much this year.

Red Flags:

1) Style of PLay -- A HUGE problem. All on Painter. Think about this team the 1st month against several top 10 teams. Pushed the tempo, got out in transition, shot 3s, took it to the rim, put a lot of pressure on opposing Ds. And it actually opened up things for Edey when they played outside in. Now Painter has reverted back to half-court, grind-it-out, dump it into Edey and hope for the best. IT's way too conservative and is a recipe for an early tourney exit again. Way too content w/ playing a methodical style which played into MSU's hands.

2) Loyer - Yes, he hit that big 3 late which was huge. But he was a non-factor for 38 minutes. ON both ends. Gotta get more from him.

3) FTs - I chalk it up to the physical play, but obviously have to improve here.

Cannot agree on your 1st Red Flag, running with MSU takes Edey out of the scheme!

 

[Dryfly88]

You actually know very little about much of anything. My comments about Myles have been very accurate...otherwise he'd be replacing someone on the court. He's NOT READY yet.

Do you believe CMP when he says something? I'm asking because when asked about Myles playing, he actually said he is playing good on the defensive end. So if you don't want to believe me, then by all means listen to the B1G coach of the year.

So we can go back and forth some more if you'd like. I can keep this up as long as you want to go. But you have absolutely been over the top with your criticism and myself and others have called you on it. Hopefully now that CMP has disputed your view, you will let it go, up to you.