Purdue at Marquette Game Thread

[ZLaner]

Because he was supposedly working on his shot all summer and is much improved. I agree he needs to learn how to use his size to his advantage.

Yeah, I could work on my shot all summer too, but I wouldn't shoot over 10% in a Big Ten slate.

I'm a full-time basketball scout (not gloating, just providing a bit of background) and I know hundreds of kids who work all summer on their shot, and then once you get into a game it is totally different. Listening to a parent is the work thing you can do because they are tunnel-visioned. Until he is able to show in a game that he can shoot the ball, he can't shoot the ball.

 

[ZLaner]

Yeah, I could work on my shot all summer too, but I wouldn't shoot over 10% in a Big Ten slate.

I'm a full-time basketball scout (not gloating, just providing a bit of background) and I know hundreds of kids who work all summer on their shot, and then once you get into a game it is totally different. Listening to a parent is the work thing you can do because they are tunnel-visioned. Until he is able to show in a game that he can shoot the ball, he can't shoot the ball.

I really don't comment on the situation at all because I don't want to be shredded by the rest of the members on the boards for disagreeing with the mother of a kid.

 

[Boilerbub73]

Who coached offense last season?

Carsen Edwards

WTF dude? Root for someone else then. Jeez.

Why do you want me to go root for another team because I'm realistic and you don't like hearing it.

 

[cjf04]

Rough game to watch coming off what we were used to at the END of last year....this team makes mistakes, more than we all think they should...free throws were disgusting...no leader, out of control play for the most part...but to think we didn’t get better today is a mistake. Save judgement until Big10 play starts...

 

[IUhaterade]

Yeah, I could work on my shot all summer too, but I wouldn't shoot over 10% in a Big Ten slate.

I'm a full-time basketball scout (not gloating, just providing a bit of background) and I know hundreds of kids who work all summer on their shot, and then once you get into a game it is totally different. Listening to a parent is the work thing you can do because they are tunnel-visioned. Until he is able to show in a game that he can shoot the ball, he can't shoot the ball.

I actually agree with you. I just wanted to believe that he would be better.

 

[ZLaner]

I actually agree with you. I just wanted to believe that he would be better.

I did too, just from my background I knew it wasn't how it worked.

 

[FirstDownB]

Yeah, I could work on my shot all summer too, but I wouldn't shoot over 10% in a Big Ten slate.

I'm a full-time basketball scout (not gloating, just providing a bit of background) and I know hundreds of kids who work all summer on their shot, and then once you get into a game it is totally different. Listening to a parent is the work thing you can do because they are tunnel-visioned. Until he is able to show in a game that he can shoot the ball, he can't shoot the ball.

I'm not a professional scout, but I have seen plenty of guys develop an outside shot in the span of 1 or 2 years. Most recently Biggie Swanigan, Grady Eifert, even Matt Haarms.

That, and the marked improvement in FT shooting last year, earned a lot of belief.

 

[ChoiceBeef]

I'm not a professional scout, but I have seen plenty of guys develop an outside shot in the span of 1 or 2 years. Most recently Biggie Swanigan, Grady Eifert, even Matt Haarms.

That, and the marked improvement in FT shooting last year, earned a lot of belief.

Swanigan had a good mid range shot as a freshman and was a 72% from the line. He increased his range and became a consistent threat from 3pt range after his freshman year. Not sure he is a good example.

I will give you Haarms.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

Swanigan had a good mid range shot as a freshman and was a 72% from the line. He increased his range and became a consistent threat from 3pt range after his freshman year. Not sure he is a good example.

I will give you Haarms.

Zo is the best example.

 

[ZLaner]

I'm not a professional scout, but I have seen plenty of guys develop an outside shot in the span of 1 or 2 years. Most recently Biggie Swanigan, Grady Eifert, even Matt Haarms.

That, and the marked improvement in FT shooting last year, earned a lot of belief.

I wouldn't say I am a professional lol. Having said that though, all of the players you've mentioned had a resemblance of a jumper. Eastern can't hit a 10-foot jumper, let alone a 3-pointer. Eifert could shoot it, just didn't have the opportunity until last year. Haarms came over as a guy who could stretch the floor and just didn't look to shoot it a ton because he could just roll. Swanigan did improve yes, but even still he was close to 30% his freshman year.

Eastern just won't even think about taking wide-open jumpers and last night he had a bunch of opportunities to do so at the top of the key as they were playing off about five feet in the middle.

Do you have an example of a guard improving from a 44% FT shooter to a 65% FT shooter and becoming a guy who can knock down jumpers? I am just curious if you have any guard examples since Eastern is a guard.

 

[tjreese]

Yeah, I could work on my shot all summer too, but I wouldn't shoot over 10% in a Big Ten slate.

I'm a full-time basketball scout (not gloating, just providing a bit of background) and I know hundreds of kids who work all summer on their shot, and then once you get into a game it is totally different. Listening to a parent is the work thing you can do because they are tunnel-visioned. Until he is able to show in a game that he can shoot the ball, he can't shoot the ball.

Two things. First, a kid needs to believe he can make the shot and have confidence and that comes from game success, practice success which are somewhat a dependant variable on "working" on your shooting.
Second, many kids think they are working on their shot and they are not. They are not simulating game conditions after warming up and focusing on correct muscle memory during the off season. All that said...Purdue will get better shooting the ball as the season goes, but nothing like the last 5 or 6 years. Thompson might improve this year, but Purdue is pretty much what it is which doesn't have a lot of room for error, but enough it could be 3-0 easily...

 

[Rockman]

I wouldn't say I am a professional lol. Having said that though, all of the players you've mentioned had a resemblance of a jumper. Eastern can't hit a 10-foot jumper, let alone a 3-pointer. Eifert could shoot it, just didn't have the opportunity until last year. Haarms came over as a guy who could stretch the floor and just didn't look to shoot it a ton because he could just roll. Swanigan did improve yes, but even still he was close to 30% his freshman year.

Eastern just won't even think about taking wide-open jumpers and last night he had a bunch of opportunities to do so at the top of the key as they were playing off about five feet in the middle.

Do you have an example of a guard improving from a 44% FT shooter to a 65% FT shooter and becoming a guy who can knock down jumpers? I am just curious if you have any guard examples since Eastern is a guard.

Not very common, but since you asked, Ronald Nored from Butler a handful of years ago.

 

[FirstDownB]

I wouldn't say I am a professional lol. Having said that though, all of the players you've mentioned had a resemblance of a jumper. Eastern can't hit a 10-foot jumper, let alone a 3-pointer. Eifert could shoot it, just didn't have the opportunity until last year. Haarms came over as a guy who could stretch the floor and just didn't look to shoot it a ton because he could just roll. Swanigan did improve yes, but even still he was close to 30% his freshman year.

Eastern just won't even think about taking wide-open jumpers and last night he had a bunch of opportunities to do so at the top of the key as they were playing off about five feet in the middle.

Do you have an example of a guard improving from a 44% FT shooter to a 65% FT shooter and becoming a guy who can knock down jumpers? I am just curious if you have any guard examples since Eastern is a guard.

I don't have all the answers. It's hard enough to find an example of somebody who has improved their FT shooting as much as he did last season. But for that reason I can't dismiss the possibility of also developing an outside shot. The two skills are interrelated. Can you think of a player that became a good free throw shooter who couldn't hit a jump shot?

It was documented that he was working on his jump shot during the off season just like how he worked on FT's last year. Haven't seen it manifest yet 3 games in, so who knows. Might be a confidence issue, might be more.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

I don't have all the answers. It's hard enough to find an example of somebody who has improved their FT shooting as much as he did last season. But for that reason I can't dismiss the possibility of also developing an outside shot. The two skills are interrelated. Can you think of a player that became a good free throw shooter who couldn't hit a jump shot?

It was documented that he was working on his jump shot during the off season just like how he worked on FT's last year. Haven't seen it manifest yet 3 games in, so who knows. Might be a confidence issue, might be more.

Lewis Jackson, perhaps. He went from 50's% to nearly 75% at the line but never really developed a consistent outside shot. Defense, floor leader, and drive penetration remained his other strengths.

Ricky Hall improved to where he could at least make the defense account for him from the outside - that was before the 3pt shot. He went from 60's FT% to almost 80%. Disclaimer - Ricky Hall is one of my favorite all-time Boilers, among many worthy candidates.

 

[ZLaner]

I don't have all the answers. It's hard enough to find an example of somebody who has improved their FT shooting as much as he did last season. But for that reason I can't dismiss the possibility of also developing an outside shot. The two skills are interrelated. Can you think of a player that became a good free throw shooter who couldn't hit a jump shot?

It was documented that he was working on his jump shot during the off season just like how he worked on FT's last year. Haven't seen it manifest yet 3 games in, so who knows. Might be a confidence issue, might be more.

It could happen. I HOPE it happens. I just think that the repeated "he has confidence" "his shot looks great" and a video showing him nailing jumpers gave us a sense of false hope.

When in reality, as you say as well, it could be confidence or something else. In my opionion, I think there's 0 confidence because he just can't shoot the ball. With Edwards and Cline last year it was easy to mask, this year he is a liability on the offensive end in late-game situations.

The only example I can think of that you asked for is Shaun Livingston. A career 17% 3 point shooter and an 80% FT shooter as a guard. But that is the NBA where it is a little different but the only player I can think of to fit the mold.

 

[FirstDownB]

It could happen. I HOPE it happens. I just think that the repeated "he has confidence" "his shot looks great" and a video showing him nailing jumpers gave us a sense of false hope.

When in reality, as you say as well, it could be confidence or something else. In my opionion, I think there's 0 confidence because he just can't shoot the ball. With Edwards and Cline last year it was easy to mask, this year he is a liability on the offensive end in late-game situations.

The only example I can think of that you asked for is Shaun Livingston. A career 17% 3 point shooter and an 80% FT shooter as a guard. But that is the NBA where it is a little different but the only player I can think of to fit the mold.

I don’t think we’re too far apart. I actually stated in another thread today that at times it felt like we’re playing four on five on offense. But that’s as much about not driving the hoop as it is about shooting. And there might need to be some changes to the rotation. I’m just not ready to give up hope quite yet or say that it is impossible for a player to develop an outside shot.

 

[ZLaner]

I don’t think we’re too far apart. I actually stated in another thread today that at times it felt like we’re playing four on five on offense. But that’s as much about not driving the hoop as it is about shooting. And there might need to be some changes to the rotation. I’m just not ready to give up hope quite yet or say that it is impossible for a player to develop an outside shot.

Yeah, I'd say you are correct.

I'll agree with you that a player can potentially develop a jumper, but it hasn't happened in now 2+ years and the simple unwillingness to even try to shoot it makes me think there is little hope.

If I was a coach, I would literally put my defender in the paint and make him shoot it every time down the floor.

 

[IUhaterade]

Yeah, I'd say you are correct.

I'll agree with you that a player can potentially develop a jumper, but it hasn't happened in now 2+ years and the simple unwillingness to even try to shoot it makes me think there is little hope.

If I was a coach, I would literally put my defender in the paint and make him shoot it every time down the floor.

That would be a best case scenario for us I think. Maybe if he sees a few go in his confidence will soar.