As I am sure you will agree, slaveowners were bad guys - as bad as it gets.
Majority of House GOP, including 3 Black Republican grifters voted to reinstate confederate monument at Arlington National Cemetary
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Not only a student of history, but an expert on the bible.
Do you agree it would have been helpful if Jesus had specifically condemned slavery? (Or did he and I missed it?)
Some people watch sports. Some listen to music. Others play golf or have another passion. You, clearly, spend your waking minutes looking for perceived RACIST wrongs to uncover. Most of us are too busy just getting through each day as good neighbors to have such worries.
Your statement is the epitome of white privilege. If anyone wants to know what the definition of white privilege should just read your post. Then when you say "perceive racist wrongs" you have no sympathy for those that have. Perhaps you are correct that you don't spend your waking, as you put it, minutes looking for racism. Well that's where the white privilege comes in. I don't spend my waking minutes looking for racism either. But sometimes racism just hits black folks in the face. Just like the GOP members of congress voting to re-instate confederate monuments in Arlington National Cemetery. That is racism my friend. You and other white people can just live life. Most of y'all has never had experienced racism. Never had any friends that have. Never, had any relatives that have. Never had any ancestors that have, let alone have been enslaved. Most black folks in the US have in one form or another. Not your fault. You wouldn't no the wiser. That's the way it is.
Some people listen to understand.
Some people hear and read to respond.
I believe that the people that listen to understand ... will find compelling reasons that the inclusion of Confederate monuments honoring secessionists Arlington National Cemetery is offensive to those whose ancestors were enslaved, and to all decent people who think that human enslavement was and is an extraordinary abomination. Who else should be offended? Ancestors of and citizens protected by the military that protects the American Union against those that fought to destroy it.
I believe that people that listen to understand will agree that those who support Confederate monuments in Arlington National Cemetery (instead of in history museums where context and the atrocities of slavery and the Confederacy can be explained) are dog-whistling to the lowest elements of society.
A large portion of Congress that approves of monuments honoring treasonous fighters for secession and the preservation of slavery? That is a clear sign from those people of who they are and who and what they stand for. It is incredibly sad.
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If Blue states don't create homelessness then why are the majority of the worst Blue states?
Maybe because the blue states round up unsuspecting victims, hog tie them and force them to inject heroin in there veins.
If Red States don't create obesity, sub-standard levels of education, and lower income, then why are the majority of the worst Red States?
If Red states don't create hurricanes then why are the majority of the worst ones in Red states? lol
Because correlation is not causation.
No matter which of the various user names you post under, JM, it is easy to spot your incredibly pompous style of writing.
Why don't you just stick with KatstenchJM, as it is the most incredibly descriptive? Or does that make you incredibly sad?
Boldface and italics earns you extra points for being incredibly pompous, katstenchJM.
Off-topic.
In addition, per the Terms of Service (TOS), forum moderators reserve the right to blocklist or ban users who are consistently disruptive to the overall community by trolling, flaming, or posting false information.
There were horrible slave owners and there were others that were not as bad. Slavery was quite common across the world for much of history and started getting viewed differently in the 1700s here. John Adams and his wife were opposed and Thomas Jefferson struggled with slavery in his writing of the Declaration. The view of a horrible slave owner is what led John Brown.
Slavery on its own has been wrong, but some were very cruel and others not very kind. Slaves have always been viewed as lesser people by slave holders.
War many times had financial influence and the civil war was no different although history has shown state rights to be in play as well. My point is that the view of slavery has changed over the centuries from being normal to being despised today from “most “ of the world. There were people that accepted it and did not accept in both the north and the south … and a few abolitionist in the north.
Lincoln never went to war to free slaves even though he was personally opposed. Many confederate and union officers were good friends and shared many thoughts but supported their state. I don’t see the war as good guys and bad guys on different sides, but different interests… a war cost a lot of lives that might have been avoided and actually freed slaves…it is hard to say. Most of country outside of financial interest were apathetic to slavery…to the dignity of a person back then… not all, but most
I’m setting pavers and just took a break in the shade. I’ve already spent too much time on the civil war, but will try to help you a bit with another understanding.
If a believer of Christ, then you are aware the common language in the first century was Greek. One could debate on whether the Greek Septuagint or the Hebrew is the appropriate view for the Old Testament and have valid reasons for each. However, the New Testament which ties into this discussion was 100% determined by Catholics (which means universal) as to what it would obtain. They determined what was considered heretical and left out.
This was based on many parchments in many countries for uniformity of content while leaving out the Asian heresy and gnostic gospels as examples. Implying the group that determined what would be in the NT had no idea what was included and yet known by those that had no influence into the content seems a stretch.
It makes no difference to me what if anything you believe, but did want to let you know the Bible never fell from the sky, but was composed during a time that people could have lived and vouched for its contents.
Great day in the morning! I want you to know you are an ignorant, racist jackass. What do you mean Thomas Jefferson struggled with slavery? The man owned hundreds of slaves and you are trying to say that he struggled with slavery? Struggled because he wrote that BS the man was created equal? Jefferson even impregnated some of these slaves he “struggled” with. Jefferson didn’t struggle with crap. He’s an evil person like the rest of the framers that owned slaves. It’s comments like yours is why we have African American studies in schools. It’s comments like yours is why we don’t need to ban African American studies courses in schools. You need to be ashamed of yourself.
I see the civil war as good guys fighting for a noble cause - to end slavery - and a combination of misled and evil guys fighting to uphold a horrible, unchristian institution. Slavery was ultimately what the civil war was about, whether cloaked in the rationalization of states' rights or not.
I do think that if Lincoln had foreseen the death and suffering to come, he might have pursued an economic blockade or some other strategy.
YOU'VE ADMITTED ON THESE HERE AIRWAVES, THAT YOU'VE NEVER PERSONALLY EXPERIENCED RACISM!!!
All you're 'racism' experience comes from the boys you talk to at the barber shop or urban radio.
I'm still trying to find the rules and laws, specifically targeted at black people, that prevent them from doing anything a white person can do in this country. If you find them, will you let us know.
And lets' not forget this little inconvenient truth about slavery.......African blacks captured and sold other black Africans to white Europeans.
Yes, owning other humans is evil. That’s a dumb question. But knowing who asked it is not surprising.
Agree vis a vis rules and laws, but the problem has been in the subjective application of those rules and laws.
An example? Senator Tim Scott, a strong-minded, smart guy, was already an elected official when he was routinely targeted by the police. His offense? Driving a nice car. As he tells it:
______________________________________________________
“While I thank God I have not endured bodily harm, I have however felt the pressure applied by the scales of justice when they are slanted,” Scott said. “I have felt the anger, the frustration, the sadness, and the humiliation that comes with feeling like you’re being targeted for nothing more than being just yourself.”
“Was I speeding sometimes? Sure,” he added of the times he was stopped by police. “But the vast majority of the time, I was pulled over for nothing more than driving a new car in the wrong neighborhood or some other reason just as trivial.”
In one instance, Scott said, an officer suggested the car he was driving might be stolen. In another, Scott said he was trailed by police across several traffic lights only to be pulled over and told he had forgotten to use his turn signal on the fourth turn he took.
“I do not know many African American men who do not have a very similar story to tell – no matter their profession, no matter their income, no matter their disposition in life,” Scott said.
____________________________________________________________
(Now) Senator Scott was able to navigate those situations, but for less confident, secure people those situations are a risk for disaster.
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I knew this recent round of slavery discussions would trigger your same ‘ol ignorant responses. I’ve told you over and over that racism is more than laws on the books. I’ve also told that I was blessed to not have been discriminated from any jobs, or getting into Purdue. However, like I also told over and over was that I, and other blacks at Purdue faved racism back on the 80s when they burned a cross in the tha lawn of the Black Cultural Center and at the black fraternity house of Alpha Phi Alpha on Waldron St.
Your hero promotes modern slavery.
As far as rules or whatever, blacks are still discriminated against when it comes to the justice system, housing, loans, black farmers etc. It’s well documented that black home seller’s homes are grossly undervalued by racist appraisers compared to similar homes owned by whites. I’ve told you about that over and over again.
Those are the only two times in your life you have faced racism?
Who are the 'they' who committed these heinous acts of which you speak?
Yep as far as something like cross burnings. Prior to that in high school, during baseball practice the school bus dropping off the local public school kids passes by our baseball field and yelled the n-word at me and the 2 blacks they saw on the field.
Who knows who did the cross burnings at Purdue. Could have been the KKK or some other racist jackass.
As a biblical scholar, you didn't answer my question about Jesus specifically condemning slavery.
Kamala Harris must be ashamed since her family were big time, prominent slave owners in Jamaica.
Great story....want to hear mine?
When I lived in Chicago and worked on the south and west sides, in the hoods of the hood, I was usually the only white guy you'd see most days until I went home to the northside.
I got pulled over twice for no reason....Know what my offense was: Driving while white in a black neighborhood. Know why? Because they thought I was there to buy drugs.
See, it goes both ways.
But, statistically, blacks, while only 13% of the population, commit 53+% of violent crimes. So, if the cops pulled over a black guy in a nice, car, maybe they had a hunch.
Dude, how many times do we have to talk about Kamala Harris’ 3rd great grandfather owning slaves. When your 3rd great grandfather is an Irish dude living in Jamaica during the trans Atlantic slave trade, I guess you better believe he owned slaves. Colin Powell is a light skinned black dude with Jamaican heritage. His ancestors most likely owned slaves also. I may have some ancestors that owned slaves. So what is your point. You do this all the time. I’m in the middle of having good discussions about race. Then here you come late to the party as usual and bring up old points about Harris’ ancestors owning slave. So, what is your point?
Not to speak for others, but one point could be that without slavery, you wouldn't exist.
And maybe since Jesus didn't condemn slavery (did he?), it is not so bad.
I’m no biblical scholar. I would like to be. My wife and I do study the Bible regularly. But off hand, I do not recall any scripture of Jesus condemning slavery. What’s your point?
The point is, you are condemning Jefferson and others for owning slaves, yet Jesus, surrounded by slavery, did not condemn slavery. I find that troubling about Christianity. Do you?
If you are going to address me personally know that I have already been assigned arrogant ass, but I welcome you to call me an arrogant, ignorant, racist jackass if you prefer. I know everything of which you write and have nothing to do with why there exist African American studies. I think most people know why....similar to why there are "women" studies.
Now, what I tried to tell you and what I'll try again is that Jefferson struggled writing what he did knowing slavery was in opposition to what he wrote. It was an internal conflict. He was not a rent a riot person we see today. I've been to Monticello and fully aware of everything you wrote. I just know a bit more and tried to make you aware of an internal conflict Jefferson had as he wrote what he did. Jefferson also didn't want the government involved with church. Many understand it backward today, but knowing his love for the French, hate for England and how Henry 8th made England have a "national church" so he could get a divorce since he blamed his wife for not giving him a son as he heard about this newer religion that would grant a divorce that the Catholic Church could find no wrong doing with his wife. Hugo Black (SCOTUS) reciprocated the view in the opposite direction. Jefferson himself took out the miracles in the bible and had it in four different languages, because he couldn't rationalize the miracles with what he knew.
Nope. There is nothing troubling about Christianity. What I do know for sure is that Jesus did not own any slaves.
Bible views on slavery..... certainly is more interesting than BNI saying the same race baiting crap over and over and over in this thread......
Slavery was a common practice in Biblical times. The Jews were slaves in Egypt. Rome also had slaves. The wealthy Jewish families had slaves.
Some treated them well, others treated them poorly. Some parents sold their children as slaves or even concubines. Many times slaves were taken by military force.
The Bible doesn't condemn slavery.....doesn't endorse it either.
It has instruction for slaves...... for example....
Ephesians 6:5–8, Paul states "Slaves, be obedient to your human masters with fear and trembling, in sincerity of heart, as to Christ".
The Bible has instructions for slave masters.....
Colossians 4:1 advises slave masters to "treat your slaves justly and fairly, realizing that you too have a Master in heaven".
The Bible's main concern though is about people. It's main concern is helping people not to be slaves to sin and to save themselves through repentance and calling on the redemptive blood of Jesus Christ. Simple as A, B,C....
A ....Admit you are a sinner & repent
B ....Believe in Christ
C.....Commit and call on Christ to save you & take him as a gift as your Lord & Savior & follow Him
Slavery was a common practice in Biblical times. The Jews were slaves in Egypt. Rome also had slaves. The wealthy Jewish families had slaves.
Some treated them well, others treated them poorly. Some parents sold their children as slaves or even concubines. Many times slaves were taken by military force.
The Bible doesn't condemn slavery.....doesn't endorse it either.
It has instruction for slaves...... for example....
Ephesians 6:5–8, Paul states "Slaves, be obedient to your human masters with fear and trembling, in sincerity of heart, as to Christ".
The Bible has instructions for slave masters.....
Colossians 4:1 advises slave masters to "treat your slaves justly and fairly, realizing that you too have a Master in heaven".
The Bible's main concern though is about people. It's main concern is helping people not to be slaves to sin and to save themselves through repentance and calling on the redemptive blood of Jesus Christ. Simple as A, B,C....
A ....Admit you are a sinner & repent
B ....Believe in Christ
C.....Commit and call on Christ to save you & take him as a gift as your Lord & Savior & follow Him
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Very fair and also see it more than state rights...financial as well Lincoln very easily could lose a reelection if he came out strongly against slavery. Much of the north had apathy on the situation. The south had been buying slaves...many from the north slave ships for agriculture (cotton). Tax money went heavily to the north as they built up the industry and much less tax money spent on the south. When ramblings about fleeing the slaves started to gain some momentum it marked financial ruin for the south and the few that had many slaves. Who knows if the north would have bought back slaves from the tax money how things would have turned out and freed them if desired. FWIW, I've had many rangers at Gettysburg and Antietam in particular express that the north went to war ONLY when the south fired on Ft Sumpter and why that happened (some believe Lincoln goaded the south into doing such so he could start a war to stop the secession???). Until firing on Sumpter, the north had no interest in war, but once that happened they saw it as an attack on them.
Lincoln wanted the country to remain one...THAT was his goal...not to free slaves. He was willing to not allow it in new territories, but was willing to let it die out (just not expand it) with the Cotton Gin around the corner. Only around 20% give or take a few points had slaves in the south and so many had no particular interest financially in slaves. Had the confederates not went down in the sunken road in Antietam in which they were flanked and massacred and came out a winner instead of suffering heavy losses, the French were in a position of possibly helping the south with another victory.
Slavery was and still is as it exists today, a horrible unchristian approach to humanity. There is no question about that, but I wonder...would we be the minority abolitionists that exist or would we fall into the masses as we see today by so many. Thankfully, mankind has became more human over the years...and not just the last 200 years...
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