Jacobsen to announce friday
- Thread starter PaBoiler78
- Start date
Furst & TKR need to produce at higher levels than last year. As both have aspects to their games that will allow other players to take their minutes if they don't improve.
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I trust him as much as possible until March. That's where it sadly ends for me.
Do you think this is how the MSU staff and administration approaches the tourney: Just get there and eventually you’ll advance deep?
There’s absolutely zero evidence, none, from Painter coached teams, to support this argument. In fact, you could justifiably argue the opposite: the more frequently Painter coached teams get to the tourney that the worse they perform. There’s actually quantifiable data to support this.
The guards just flat out weren't good enough in those games. Reason for optimism with Smith, Loyer and Jones this season. Myles is playing at the wing but if he can figure things out on defense he can create for himself and score.
Haha absolutely not. Their staff has a formula that works and gets top recruits that fit their program. That’s why they’ve been the most successful program in the conference since Izzos been coaching. I don’t think the admin really cares, as long as the team wins games.
But what’s the alternative? Get rid of painter and then make 3 S16s over a 20 year span, make the tournament half the time where you miss 5 years in a row, maybe be in top 10 every now and then? Is that better?
Why you so doom and gloom all the time? I mean I know that’s your whole “shtick” but was there ever a point you enjoyed anything Purdue?
I would agree, the basketball program post CMP, has a greater chance of being worse -- than better.
Well that’s a possibility, but I don’t think either of those things happen. I believe Berg might be a bit underrated by our fan base because he was injured and is behind Edey (30+) and the 4 logjam. Not a lot of film on him either. I don’t think he leaves before seeing what life without Edey holds for him at Purdue. Scrimmaging day in day out against Edey and TKR has almost certainly helped him. I also think Burgess and/or Jacobsen redshirt next year. Cox will not unless Harris commits and then someone will have to leave or give up a scholarship. Cox will probably be needed for backup guard duties. I could see a combination of these three redshirting Benter, Jacobsen, Burgess and possibly all three. That would leave 10 players active for the season.
Who knows, the new guys still have another year to develop before they even get to Purdue. Boiler Up!! 💛🖤🏀
I like a lot about Purdue. What I don’t like is a 40+ year FF drought and a coach who doesn’t want to change his philosophies when they haven’t proven to deliver in March.
I don’t like giving scholarships to guards that no other program thinks is worth one.
A lot of logical fallacies going on there. Of course there's no evidence to support something that hasn't yet happened. You're also quoting 'quantifiable data' but you're not looking at it in the way that any qualified data analyst would, which is looking for correlations to hopefully determine causality.
I agree with your overall assessment that Purdue's guards have not been good enough. I also agree that despite the four sweet sixteens or better (one EE) in seven years, the overall results have been disappointing. In the seven tournaments since 2016 Purdue has had the distribution of seeds listed below.. Guess which season was the only one in which Purdue had an upperclassman who was all conference or better at guard?
5 seed - once (2016) - first round loss
4 seed - twice (2017, 2021) - SS, first round loss
3 seed - twice (2019, 2022) - EE, SS
2 seed - once (2018) - SS
1 seed - once (2023) - first rounds loss
Despite your hyperbole, I understand that if you're not bullish on Smith and Loyer you're unlikely to feel good about the NCAAT chances this spring. I think we need one or both of those guys (or someone else at the 1 to 3, though that seems unlikely) to play at an all conference level for this team to have a legitimate EE or better aspirations.
I don't understand how you come to the conclusion that MP's 'philosophy' is to have mediocre and / or immature guard play. IMO that falls under poor execution in recruiting and development.
I 'borrowed' this scholarship chart from a poster on another site. Someone has to leave or go to prep school or leave to make the numbers work. Redshirting doesn't help the situation. I'd be shocked if it were Burgess and tend to agree with you that Berg is unlikely to go anywhere before the end of next season.
Maybe Cox or Benter go to prep school for a year? I know Painter doesn't play in grey areas but maybe he does start thinking about the route where preferred walk ons get an NIL package that covers cost of attendance.
Painter will have the 2025 scholarship and a loaded roster. Harelson and Sisley at play. We have what we have if we don't win it won't be that we didn't have talented players.I 'borrowed' this scholarship chart from a poster on another site. Someone has to leave or go to prep school or leave to make the numbers work. Redshirting doesn't help the situation. I'd be shocked if it were Burgess and tend to agree with you that Berg is unlikely to go anywhere before the end of next season.
Maybe Cox or Benter go to prep school for a year? I know Painter doesn't play in grey areas but maybe he does start thinking about the route where preferred walk ons get an NIL package that covers cost of attendance.
Only have to have someone leave If Harris commits, otherwise you are at 13. I’m not holding my breath on Harris at this point. Would love to have him but the longer time goes the less confident I am that he’s coming here. Not sure why, just gut feeling. I know red shirting players doesn’t effect scholarship numbers. Out of the 13 listed I wouldn’t be surprised if 1-3 people could possibly red shirt.I 'borrowed' this scholarship chart from a poster on another site. Someone has to leave or go to prep school or leave to make the numbers work. Redshirting doesn't help the situation. I'd be shocked if it were Burgess and tend to agree with you that Berg is unlikely to go anywhere before the end of next season.
Maybe Cox or Benter go to prep school for a year? I know Painter doesn't play in grey areas but maybe he does start thinking about the route where preferred walk ons get an NIL package that covers cost of attendance.
Haralson would be a great get and if seems we have the best relationship with him due to the family connection. However, I don’t think he will be playing ball in the state of Indiana once he’s done playin high school ball. I really hope we can get him, but I don’t have much confidence in that one.
Sisley will be tough since he’s in IUs backyard…would be huge if he commits.
Hope we can somehow get 1 of em
Given you are talking about Smith, can you name a B10 team that would NOT take Smith as a transfer given they had the room??
Perhaps a more interesting question is how many of those teams would be getting him 30+ minutes a game…
I’m not a huge fan of redshirting. If they are not contributing something as freshmen, it’s very doubtful they will stick around for that 5th year or contribute very much as a 5th year player. They would most likely be recruited over or transfer before that 5th year happens. Basically if they have to redshirt at Purdue, we are giving them an extra year to play somewhere else after they transfer.
Do you think Painter is the best possible option Purdue could get? You don’t think we could improve recruiting? Tourney performances?
I’d be interested to see, over the last 5 years, the recruit rankings/stars of the 20 PGs on those FF teams.
I'm as frustrated as you are with March performance. But I have to agree with Boiler buck, When CMP leaves there is a better chance that the overall program will go down, not up. That doesn't mean that isn't possible it could be better, but if I were betting, I would bet it gets worse.
While March is very important, it isn't the only measure of the overall program. When you take regular season and post season into account, it's more likely to get worse, not better.
His philosophy isn’t to have mediocre guard play. He has mediocre guard play because he’s not good at recruiting guards.
Why is that? I think it partially has to do with guards seeing that the offense is supposed to run through the low post which limits the freedom for a dynamic guard to do their thing.
I’d like to see some examples in the last 10 years of a Purdue player who really excelled in his 5th year at Purdue after playing at Purdue his entire college career. I’m not talking about players who transferred to Purdue or transferred from Purdue to play elsewhere. I’m Also not interested in players who redshirted 20 plus years ago like cardinal. Prove me wrong. What player who played for Purdue really excelled in that 5th year at Purdue? Are people expecting Gillis to be a star this year or a role player? To me by redshirting a player, you are just using up a scholarship for that 5th year that could be used to attract and sign someone else. Like Harris or someone else! I would hate to lose out on a 5 star recruit because we redshirted a player who turned out to be nothing more than a role player his 5th year
UM, MSU, OSU, MD, IL, iu,
I’m sure a lot of teams would take him, I’m not sure how many he’d start for.
Actually, from a National perspective, only March matters. That’s how teams are measured. Nobody outside the Midwest cares who won the conference championship.
Really? Do you honestly think that is true? Why then were we ranked in the top ten most of last year? Given a 1 seed? Ranked 3rd this year preseason? Is that all based on recent March tournament results? The regular season performance didn’t weigh in to this much?
lol what are you on about? I feel you’re just arguing with yourself about this whole RS thing. It’s not that complicated or a big deal. Not many players go a full 5 years with a RS these days…usually if they’re good enough, they go to the NBA or overseas. If they do go a full 5, yeah they can transfer…that’s what the transfer rules allow them to do nowadays, especially with NIL.
Gillis will be a role player, just like he has his whole career.
IF and that’s a big IF we can secure a 5 star, we would make it work.
Yeah Purdue is a terrible program and has had just no success over the last 20 years. You probably should go root for Duke or UConn. That’d probably make more sense for you.
Yes and recruiting is improving and yes we can improve tourney performances.
Going to ask you who we should get? (Yeah everyone asks that but seriously answer the question). And do you think that new coach would have Purdue in the top 5 within 3-5 years, have a top 10 recruiting class with top guards and also get to the F4?
Actually, that isn't true at all. The regular season matters not only for the conference title, but it also has a huge impact on what seed you get in the tournament. I know you have a hard on for CMP and I don't normally get involved in these back and forths with you. But in this case, I think you are wrong. If you want to argue that CMP has underperformed in the Dance, you have plenty of ammo for that and I wouldn't really argue with you. But when you say the regular season means nothing, you are flat wrong. Without the regular season, there is no Dance. If you have a poor regular season, you are either out of the Dance completely or you have such a poor seed that the odds are greatly against you going anywhere.
Again, March is very important, but it isn't the only thing that matters. If I were to bet, I would bet the overall performance of PU goes down after CMP, not up. We're not going to find out for a long time, so it's an argument that won't be proven for many years, but that is my opinion.
Agree, that would be interesting. I'd also be interested to see how many of those teams had a first team all conference and / or all American at the 1 and / or the 2.
When has Purdue ever come close to losing out on a five star player because they didn't have a scholarship for him? In what world would you realistically expect that to happen?
Your argument that redshirting has no value has been disproved because Sasha played a key role as a RS Senior and Mason will be a key contributor this year so now you've shifted the bar to be someone who 'really excelled'.
He was arguing four years ago that redshirting has no value and shouldn't be done. That's clearly been disproved so now he's taking a different approach.
What is Purdue’s basketball program reputation nationally: Good, solid program, but can’t get it done in March.
Why is Purdue always a popular upset pick in the tourney?
Never said that. Purdue is a good, solid program. What I’ve said is that Painter isn’t a good tourney coach and his teams struggle in March.
We’ve already gone through this exercise.
And yes, I think the right coach would recruit better and have better tourney success.
You missed my point. Which wasn’t that it literally doesn’t matter, obviously it does. The point is that some people are happy that the team wins 25 games and think the tourney is gracmvy.. But from a national reputation and perception perspective, what you do in March is what matters.
