Health of our society

[TheGunner]

A ruling that the majority of the public approves was just overturned by justices who were mostly appointed by presidents that lost the popular vote and we’re mostly confirmed by a senate that represents a minority of the country. Does anybody think that this is healthy for our society? What can we do to fix this?

Get Congress to pass a law that can pass instead of the far left trying to pass laws beyond where a majority of Americans want abortion rights to go. The polls are pretty clear what society wants to accept, but the Democrat proposed bills tend to reflect the Democrat majority versus that of the US.

Aka, work to pass laws that allows abortion at 12-14 weeks (with accommodations for rape, incest and risk to mothers health) versus the last trimester, then let the states decide the gray area.

But a compromise rarely exists in Congress these days.

 

[Joetboiler]

Didn’t you read the part about the senate not representing a majority of the country?

Also, did you forget our recent conversations about the filibuster?

Did you have similar angst during the last administration when Chucky S utilized the filibuster a record number of times?

 

[mdthornb]

Did you have similar angst during the last administration when Chucky S utilized the filibuster a record number of times?

Yep. The system is broken.

 

[Joetboiler]

Yep. The system is broken.

So you started several threads about it? IIRC Obama had a super majority in the senate and had the house yet he and Democratic leadership did not codify abortion as the law of the land. My bet is that they didn’t want to because it’s great to use as a fundraising item. Again if it is widely popular why didn’t he do it? Sounds broken. Please start a thread on this.

 

[Joetboiler]

Get Congress to pass a law that can pass instead of the far left trying to pass laws beyond where a majority of Americans want abortion rights to go. The polls are pretty clear what society wants to accept, but the Democrat proposed bills tend to reflect the Democrat majority versus that of the US.

Aka, work to pass laws that allows abortion at 12-14 weeks (with accommodations for rape, incest and risk to mothers health) versus the last trimester, then let the states decide the gray area.

But a compromise rarely exists in Congress these days.

Correct. IIRC the legislation Dems put forward was basically abortion up to crowning and did other things like strip away parental notification. That is way beyond popular opinion which is limited to first trimester and other special circumstance. The other trick is that Dems define “health of mother” to include mental health which is nebulous.

 

[tearsforfears]

Correct. IIRC the legislation Dems put forward was basically abortion up to crowning and did other things like strip away parental notification. That is way beyond popular opinion which is limited to first trimester and other special circumstance. The other trick is that Dems define “health of mother” to include mental health which is nebulous.

Thank you for sharing. Did not know this.

 

[BoilerJS]

A ruling that the majority of the public approves was just overturned by justices who were mostly appointed by presidents that lost the popular vote and we’re mostly confirmed by a senate that represents a minority of the country. Does anybody think that this is healthy for our society? What can we do to fix this?

I don’t see the problem you suggest. The popular voters you reference live in States that have legal abortion. The Supreme Court Decision will have no effect on them.

 

[SIBoiler2]

It becomes increasingly more obvious that our schools are doing a poor job of instructing Americans regarding the roles of the branches of government. The Judicial branch rules on cases based on the rule of law as set forth in the Constitution or enacted by Congress. Laws enacted by Congress can be reviewed if they are contrary to the writing of the Constitution. While it has become popular for judges to rewrite the law according to their own beliefs and such actions have led to shopping for a favorable court to file a suit judges are not entitled to make law. Only Congress has that function. In overturning Roe v Wade the Supreme Court did not remove a Constitutionally guaranteed right. Abortion has never been included in the Constitution. What the court did simply returned the control of abortion to state legislatures until such time that the US Congress chooses to pass legislation of its own to standardize access nationally. The Supreme Court did its job. It is not supposed to make its decisions based on popular opinion. There is a reason why Justices are not elected. If you want to point fingers and assess blame start with the legislators that have never been willing to pass a law to address abortion. The Democrats appear to be the most pro-choice but have never made a serious attempt at putting an end to using abortion as a campaign tool by enacting legislation to end the conflict.

 

[BSIT]

Is that a healthy way to run a society?

The irony of healthy society mentioned in the same sentence defending abortion

 

[mdthornb]

It becomes increasingly more obvious that our schools are doing a poor job of instructing Americans regarding the roles of the branches of government. The Judicial branch rules on cases based on the rule of law as set forth in the Constitution or enacted by Congress. Laws enacted by Congress can be reviewed if they are contrary to the writing of the Constitution. While it has become popular for judges to rewrite the law according to their own beliefs and such actions have led to shopping for a favorable court to file a suit judges are not entitled to make law. Only Congress has that function. In overturning Roe v Wade the Supreme Court did not remove a Constitutionally guaranteed right. Abortion has never been included in the Constitution. What the court did simply returned the control of abortion to state legislatures until such time that the US Congress chooses to pass legislation of its own to standardize access nationally. The Supreme Court did its job. It is not supposed to make its decisions based on popular opinion. There is a reason why Justices are not elected. If you want to point fingers and assess blame start with the legislators that have never been willing to pass a law to address abortion. The Democrats appear to be the most pro-choice but have never made a serious attempt at putting an end to using abortion as a campaign tool by enacting legislation to end the conflict.

With legislation essentially impossible all we have now are executive orders and judicial rulings. System absolutely needs to be fixed so our government can reflect the will of the people.

 

[mdthornb]

The irony of healthy society mentioned in the same sentence defending abortion

Why is that?

 

[hunkgolden]

With legislation essentially impossible all we have now are executive orders and judicial rulings. System absolutely needs to be fixed so our government can reflect the will of the people.

So majority rule is the way to govern on everything? Or just the policies that you’re in favor of?

 

[mdthornb]

So majority rule is the way to govern on everything? Or just the policies that you’re in favor of?

Nope. Just saying that if the government continuously refuses to respond to the wishes of the populace, bad things are bound to happen. Happens over and over in history. Fully understand that I won’t agree with everything that is done.

 

[SIBoiler2]

With legislation essentially impossible all we have now are executive orders and judicial rulings. System absolutely needs to be fixed so our government can reflect the will of the people.

The system will never be fixed as long as politicians use conflict to raise funding and ensure reelection instead of actually working to pass meaningful legislation.

 

[hunkgolden]

Yep. The system is broken.

Lol! Your party has control of the presidency, house, and senate. The one body you don’t control is the SC and you’re sobbing like a child because you want Dems to control that too. Your party screwed over Bernie and put up quite possibly the most unlikable presidential candidate ever. This allowed Trump to win, which resulted in 3 conservative justices on the SC. Your issue is with the democratic national party and Hillary Clinton. Go whine to them.

 

[BSIT]

Lol! Your party has control of the presidency, house, and senate. The one body you don’t control is the SC and you’re sobbing like a child because you want Dems to control that too. Your party screwed over Bernie and put up quite possibly the most unlikable presidential candidate ever. This allowed Trump to win, which resulted in 3 conservative justices on the SC. Your issue is with the democratic national party and Hillary Clinton. Go whine to them.

And to make it even more clear, HRC could have possibly won if she even showed up and campaigned in Wisconsin and Michigan. Elections have consequences

 

[hunkgolden]

Nope. Just saying that if the government continuously refuses to respond to the wishes of the populace, bad things are bound to happen. Happens over and over in history. Fully understand that I won’t agree with everything that is done.

You realize the SC only ruled that abortions are not constitutionally protected, right? A position that RBG herself agreed with.

 

[mdthornb]

The system will never be fixed as long as politicians use conflict to raise funding and ensure reelection instead of actually working to pass meaningful legislation.

The system will never be fixed as long as politicians use conflict to raise funding and ensure reelection instead of actually working to pass meaningful legislation.

Can anything be passed these days without a supermajority in the senate? I think the last time that happened was briefly in 2010.

 

[mdthornb]

Lol! Your party has control of the presidency, house, and senate. The one body you don’t control is the SC and you’re sobbing like a child because you want Dems to control that too. Your party screwed over Bernie and put up quite possibly the most unlikable presidential candidate ever. This allowed Trump to win, which resulted in 3 conservative justices on the SC. Your issue is with the democratic national party and Hillary Clinton. Go whine to them.

As I’ve said numerous times, is it possible to get anything done without a supermajority in the senate? That happened the last time 12 years ago for a couple months.

A majority supported decision was overturned by justices appointed and confirmed by candidates that a minority of people voted for. People voted and their votes didn’t mean anything. My life is fine. None of this effects me all that much but I’m wondering How long will this continue with people remaining civil?

 

[TheGunner]

Topics important to Americans


1. Inflation or increasing costs
2. Crime or gun violence
3. Political extremism or polarization
4. Climate change
5. Race and racism
6. Healthcare
7. Immigration
8. Government budget and debt
9. Abortion.
10. Economic inequality

Poll was conducted AFTER the leaked SC opinion. 🤔. Abortion importance did double from May to June, but still way down the list.

https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/news/documents/2022-06/FiveThirtyEight%20Election%20Tracker%202022%20Wave%202%2006.09.2022%20Release_0.pdf

 

[SDBoiler1]

And to make it even more clear, HRC could have possibly won if she even showed up and campaigned in Wisconsin and Michigan. Elections have consequences

That, and not making comments like "basket of deplorables" and "racist, sexist, misogynist...." and basically telling people in "flyover country" to go screw themselves - they don't count.

 

[bonefish1]

I love it when lefty/libs/dems always go to the max extreme if you don't agree with them on something. Everything is automatically labled as "Hate"
Pro-life?: You hate woman
Tired of Pride virtue signaling? you hate gays
Anti-trans playing sports? You hate children
Pro-legal immigration? You hate Hispanics
Pro-voter ID? You hate blacks.

It's pretty entertaining actually.

 

[Chris P Bacon]

I love it when lefty/libs/dems always go to the max extreme if you don't agree with them on something. Everything is automatically labled as "Hate"
Pro-life?: You hate woman
Tired of Pride virtue signaling? you hate gays
Anti-trans playing sports? You hate children
Pro-legal immigration? You hate Hispanics
Pro-voter ID? You hate blacks.

It's pretty entertaining actually.

The thing that is very telling when comparing right vs left... when something doesn't go the left's way, the entire country is told to "brace for violence" while cities burn, people are violently assaulted (like a Preacher being beaten up and his Bible torn to shreds) "celebrities" yelling death chants to the country, the Flag burned, federal buildings attacked and federal officials doxxed and their lives threatened.

And what is the worse thing the "right" does? They trespass on the capital and put their feet up on Pelosi's desk.

The hypocrisy by the left would be hilarious if it wasn't literally costing lives of innocent people.

 

[SIBoiler2]

As I’ve said numerous times, is it possible to get anything done without a supermajority in the senate? That happened the last time 12 years ago for a couple months.

A majority supported decision was overturned by justices appointed and confirmed by candidates that a minority of people voted for. People voted and their votes didn’t mean anything. My life is fine. None of this effects me all that much but I’m wondering How long will this continue with people remaining civil?

What you and many others do not understand in today's world of instant gratification is that the designers of our country had the foresight to build a system where two branches are compliant to the wishes of the voters while one is independent and has a lifetime appointment to remove the effect of popular opinion whose job is to interpret law to assure the country does not wander far from ints base in the Constitution. I'm guessing you know all of this but prefer to continue to whine because you feel you've been not awarded a trophy this time. When I see all the loud whiny people in the streets my only regret is that all of the believers did not have mothers that believed so vehemently years ago.

 

[TopSecretBoiler]

But is it healthy?

Define healthy. Is mudering fetuses healthy?

 

[TheGunner]

To fix this we offer all those unhappy with this country a free ticket out of this country with the promise to revoke their citizenship.
🤣

Actually, those who don’t like the change in abortion laws just need to change states, which, the Democrats must advocate for since they are chasing Republicans out of their states with their new drug laws (read Oregon) and laxed prosecutors (too many to list, but SF and LA have been recalled or soon could be).

i find it odd that no liberal seemed to care about the current political environment over the past 18 months as blue states enacted their own far left polices as noted above. But they care now and are really focused on 2023 with their failing administration.

 

[Boiler Buck]

Actually, those who don’t like the change in abortion laws just need to change states, which, the Democrats must advocate for since they are chasing Republicans out of their states with their new drug laws (read Oregon) and laxed prosecutors (too many to list, but SF and LA have been recalled or soon could be).

True, but out of our nation gives me a more warm & fuzzy feeling. 😎

 

[BuilderBob6]

To fix this we offer all those unhappy with this country a free ticket out of this country with the promise to revoke their citizenship.
🤣

Why haven't you left?

 

[Chris P Bacon]

Why haven't you left?

You first.

 

[BSIT]

Why haven't you left?

Maybe it’s because we see a HUGE Red wave coming in November and in 2024 as America is Made Great Again from all the lawless liberals

 

[BuilderBob6]

Maybe it’s because we see a HUGE Red wave coming in November and in 2024 as America is Made Great Again from all the lawless liberals

Yeah, this will be like November of '18 when all you said if the Dems won Congress it would because history said the off party always wins the midterms. Different this time though eh?

And this red wave will be like the one in '16.......that resulted in losing Congress and the WH in 4 years.

Both parties do the same thing. Get power, move to the extremes, then give it all back. Another 180.

But each time, idiots like you on both sides talk smack and strut around like the next election is some defining moment in history........then it all goes to hell and those in the middle have to listen to you whine for another 2 years while your leaders fack things up. Can't wait.

 

[BSIT]

Yeah, this will be like November of '18 when all you said if the Dems won Congress it would because history said the off party always wins the midterms. Different this time though eh?

And this red wave will be like the one in '16.......that resulted in losing Congress and the WH in 4 years.

Both parties do the same thing. Get power, move to the extremes, then give it all back. Another 180.

But each time, idiots like you on both sides talk smack and strut around like the next election is some defining moment in history........then it all goes to hell and those in the middle have to listen to you whine for another 2 years while your leaders fack things up. Can't wait.

Well 2016 was a defining moment in history. Otherwise, we wouldn't have 3 new great Supreme Court Justices. Elections have consequences. I bet you are upset HRC didn't campaign in MI and WI. By the way when is your Jan 6 kangaroo court going to get Trump? I hope your guys do their job so Desantis gets 8 years to truly Make America Great Again.

 

[jddpt06]

A ruling that the majority of the public approves was just overturned by justices who were mostly appointed by presidents that lost the popular vote and we’re mostly confirmed by a senate that represents a minority of the country. Does anybody think that this is healthy for our society? What can we do to fix this?

As we sit here during “pride month”, I think it’s safe to say we threw out “healthy for our society” a long time ago.
IMHO, it’s crazy how many people are losing their sh*t over the possibility of not being able to kill babies.

 

[BuilderBob6]

Well 2016 was a defining moment in history. Otherwise, we wouldn't have 3 new great Supreme Court Justices. Elections have consequences. I bet you are upset HRC didn't campaign in MI and WI. By the way when is your Jan 6 kangaroo court going to get Trump? I hope your guys do their job so Desantis gets 8 years to truly Make America Great Again.

Lol. You're all changing teams......but I've been wrong about trump for 5 years.

Watch tomorrow at 1pm if you're so interested. But you're not, you'd rather stay deaf and dumb than admit what trump did.

 

[BSIT]

Lol. You're all changing teams......but I've been wrong about trump for 5 years.

Watch tomorrow at 1pm if you're so interested. But you're not, you'd rather stay deaf and dumb than admit what trump did.

Actually I’m not changing teams. I didn’t vote for Trump in the primary but did in the general elections and I’ll do the same in 2024. Trump’s policies were very good for the US but his personality was not.. So I take it you’re proud of your votes for HRC and Biden?

 

[EdwardElric]

Maybe it’s because we see a HUGE Red wave coming in November and in 2024 as America is Made Great Again from all the lawless liberals

I thought a huge red wave was coming in 2022 and 2024 but the Supreme Court recently is making me reconsider my predictions

the great news is, in 80 years, my great-great-grandkids (or their generation) will be reading about all of this in a history book and find all of it incredibly boring lol

 

[SDBoiler1]

I thought a huge red wave was coming in 2022 and 2024 but the Supreme Court recently is making me reconsider my predictions

the great news is, in 80 years, my great-great-grandkids (or their generation) will be reading about all of this in a history book and find all of it incredibly boring lol

Sorry, but the great majority of registered and likely voters are not 1-issue voters. Not that I put great credence in standard polling, but recent polls I’ve seen show abortion as being the 6th to 8th most important issue right now. As the illustrious James Carville quipped “It’s the economy, stupid”.

 

[Chris P Bacon]

Sorry, but the great majority of registered and likely voters are not 1-issue voters. Not that I put great credence in standard polling, but recent polls I’ve seen show abortion as being the 6th to 8th most important issue right now. As the illustrious James Carville quipped “It’s the economy, stupid”.

Plus as we pay more and more at the pump and for rising grocery prices and interest rates, this all is going to be forgotten anyway. One thing is always consistent, the left has the memory of a goldfish and are easily distracted.

 

[bonefish1]

Nope. Just saying that if the government continuously refuses to respond to the wishes of the populace, bad things are bound to happen. Happens over and over in history. Fully understand that I won’t agree with everything that is done.

You're essentially saying the most votes wins? This is why there's something called "the electoral college" in the POTUS elections.

 

[bonefish1]

Actually I’m not changing teams. I didn’t vote for Trump in the primary but did in the general elections and I’ll do the same in 2024. Trump’s policies were very good for the US but his personality was not.. So I take it you’re proud of your votes for HRC and Biden?

Bob doesn't like Turmp because of mean tweets. They hurt his feelings. He thinks Biden is a swell guy and therefore, voted for him.