CBI (early loss)
No tourney
First round loss
First round loss
Either B1G is getting a lot worse or Fainter can't coach in the tourney!
7/9 NCAA Tournament's Painter has coached in Purdue we haven't lost in the first round.
CBI (early loss)
No tourney
First round loss
First round loss
Either B1G is getting a lot worse or Fainter can't coach in the tourney!
And I don't think anyone was complaining about Purdue's season 2 days ago. We went from everyone is happy to suddenly it's unacceptable? One game doesn't change that much other than overreactions.
I posted elsewhere - the NCAA Tournament is a cruel thing. How many schools have their season end in this tournament and the fans are just happy and excited? Very few. 80% or so I'd say end in disappointment.
It sucks, but at the end of the day, it's one game. As I said before too, it'd be one thing if there was some actual trend going on - like we never beat ranked teams in general - or we lose to bad teams routinely - or we could never win on the road - etc. There's absolutely flaws from this team. Every team has flaws. It's why there are upsets in this tournament year after year.
But at the end of the day, we have a lot of young, promising guys on this team. They had a great overall year this year and I look forward to them next year. And I certainly do not see how firing a coach after a 26 win season will result in positive things (and bless your heart for thinking Purdue is going to hire a Tom Izzo).
7/9 NCAA Tournament's Painter has coached in Purdue we haven't lost in the first round.
So you don't think we won any important games in the past 2 years?
Purdue where we made gene keady a legend for above average! Do you think Purdue would have fired Bruce like Illinois did? I don't we hang onto our Tourney coaches, even if we never see improvements! A tourney appearance is a good thing at purdue who cares if we win a game! /s
Sure and what has Bruce done for KSU? Keeping them respectable. That type of coach is a good fit for a KSU a team that just wants to compete. He was never going to make UoI win like they wanted. Purdue wants to be elite, we can't do that with just a average to good coach and a poor recruiter!I'd be careful about that, banshee90. The goal is to make the program better, not just put coaches on the chopping block. Illinois fired a decent coach in Bruce Weber (a coach probably comparable to Painter), but...
John Groce is 67-61 (29-43) in four years at Illinois. He's never finished above 7th in the B1G and has made the NCAA tournament only once.
I remember the uproar over Weber at Illinois. I remember Illinois fans screaming "we can do better." I also seem to recall at least one high profile coach turning the Illini down (can't remember who -- maybe Shaka Smart?). And I remember the Illinois athletic department scrambling to get Groce.
The grass is not always greener on the other side of the coach chopping block.
Since we don't really want to watch other tourney games now, I really, really suggest each one of us goes to yesterday's tape and watches it ONLY WATCHING AJ at all times. I think it is worth your time, if you don't, fine, but there are a lot of answers to a lot of the questions/comments that will be provided if you only watch AJ at all times.Have you watched Hammons over 4 years? It's no secret that he is as good as he wants to be. It's been a frustrating thing for 4 years. Hammons was not dialed in and a coach can only do so much. There's things to point at Painter at if that's the route you want to go, but AJ is his own beast. I certainly do not believe that Painter was telling them "don't let AJ get the ball!"...
Your point is we are at an impasse, we can accept mediocrity and just expect early round losses and just RAH RAH WE ARE DOING IT THE PURDUE WAY (poorly)! or we stop accepting mediocre to average.Ya, I get what you're saying about Weber. But, my point isn't really about Weber.
Four years ago, Illinois fans and athletic administrators thought they could only make the jump to elite status by dumping a respectable coach for a great one. That back-fired in a big way. There's no guarantee it would work out for Purdue.
I'm not really trying to defend Painter here. He has his limitations. His recruiting has been hit-and-miss. His game plans have sometimes been wooden. I'm just acknowledging that the Illinois case illustrates the risks involved with cutting him loose.
If there is a trend, it is that we are not getting super athletes. Maybe they don't want to play our style, maybe CMP isn't pushing for one, I'm not sure. For years, we were weak at getting a big man, then we got several. Many complained that we didn't have an outside shooter, and we got the guy that won the national 3-poiint shooting contest. We have gotten some athletes, and I'm sure many will point out the ones we have had, but I challenge you to define us as an athletic team. And I challenge anyone to dispute that today's basketball is not your Dad's basketball ... finesses and skill is gone ... athleticism and playground style is what is winning and is what the rules are now allowing.As I said before too, it'd be one thing if there was some actual trend going on - like we never beat ranked teams in general - or we lose to bad teams routinely - or we could never win on the road - etc. There's absolutely flaws from this team. Every team has flaws. It's why there are upsets in this tournament year after year.
But at the end of the day, we have a lot of young, promising guys on this team. They had a great overall year this year and I look forward to them next year. And I certainly do not see how firing a coach after a 26 win season will result in positive things (and bless your heart for thinking Purdue is going to hire a Tom Izzo).
I don't think I'm accepting mediocrity. The season ended with a kick in the stomach to be sure, but 26-9 and a top-15 national ranking isn't mediocrity.
I'm just trying to discuss the situation without emotional hyperbole. When you call for a coach to be fired, you can draw any conclusion you want about what will happen next. Maybe Purdue would land a rising star; maybe we'd land the next John Groce and then be stuck with him for 4 or 5 years. Plus, as others have pointed out, there'll very likely be a Hazell buyout in the next year or two, so that has to be factored in as well.
FWIW: I'm intrigued by Cuonzo Martin as well, though I think we should first see what's what at Cal.
I don't think I'm accepting mediocrity. The season ended with a kick in the stomach to be sure, but 26-9 and a top-15 national ranking isn't mediocrity.
I'm just trying to discuss the situation without emotional hyperbole. When you call for a coach to be fired, you can draw any conclusion you want about what will happen next. Maybe Purdue would land a rising star; maybe we'd land the next John Groce and then be stuck with him for 4 or 5 years. Plus, as others have pointed out, there'll very likely be a Hazell buyout in the next year or two, so that has to be factored in as well.
FWIW: I'm intrigued by Cuonzo Martin as well, though I think we should first see what's what at Cal.
I looked up Bruce Weber when his name was mentioned and the similarities to he and Painter are interesting.
Bruce Weber HC Illinois from 2003 - 2012
Overall: 210-101 (89-65)
2 Big Ten Regular Season Titles
1 BTT Title
1 National Runner-Up
37-2 single season record
Early success but began to falter later in his tenure which led to his firing. His final 5 years at Illinois:
Missed the NCAA Tourney twice
98 - 73
2 NCAA Appearances (1 Sweet 16 & 1 First Round loss)
1 NIT Appearance
Painter's last 5 years at Purdue:
100 - 70
Missed NCAA Tourney twice
3 NCAA Appearances (1 Second Round loss, 2 First Round losses)
1 CBI Appearance (First Round loss)
I looked up Bruce Weber when his name was mentioned and the similarities to he and Painter are interesting.
Bruce Weber HC Illinois from 2003 - 2012
Overall: 210-101 (89-65)
2 Big Ten Regular Season Titles
1 BTT Title
1 National Runner-Up
37-2 single season record
Early success but began to falter later in his tenure which led to his firing. His final 5 years at Illinois:
Missed the NCAA Tourney twice
98 - 73
2 NCAA Appearances (1 Sweet 16 & 1 First Round loss)
1 NIT Appearance
Painter's last 5 years at Purdue:
100 - 70
Missed NCAA Tourney twice
3 NCAA Appearances (1 Second Round loss, 2 First Round losses)
1 CBI Appearance (First Round loss)
OK?Our last 4 years:
7
12
3
3
That's not downward...
2016 wins I would classify as important games:
@ Pitt
#8 MSU
#10 Maryland
2015 wins I would classify as important games:
#22 IU
@ IU
Purdue has not won an away game against a top 25 teams since they beat #7 Wisconsin in 2012-2013.
Overall in Painter's tenure Purdue is 27 - 65 in games against ranked opponents. That is a 29% winning percentage. I wouldn't classify that as being able to win important games.
Arizona will fire their coach this year after making the tourament!