Its a Titanic reference.
You know how the Titanic sunk after Catchings an ice Berg
Most dominant center is not Edey?
- Thread starter Spinn
- Start date
Its a Titanic reference.
You know how the Titanic sunk after Catchings an ice Berg
I wish for him, that he’d go in the lottery, but he needs to get quicker, which I think he still can…especially how he has progressed over the years. Plus develop this type of shot and 3 pt shot to get to the NBA (I’m sure he’s well aware).
While I agree it would open up down low for other players and the lane, it’s not the same as shooting FTs (as you know). It’s a whole lot tougher with a hand in your fave, or being a bit rushed or having to square your body up to shoot well. Zach damn near stares so hard at that rim, it seems like he’s trying to make it explode when he shoots FTs.
But again, I think his really big advantage, and what makes him so good and absolutely so tough to guard, is that no one can stop him (at a high %) on the block. If he shoots out by the FT line, it’s a hell of lot easier to stop. I’d let him shoot all day out there if I were a coach, especially if that meant he wasn’t down rebounding or shooting 2-4 footers.
I don’t disagree he 100% needs to develop that for the next level, but for the college game and what he does in this offense, it makes him more normal and not as effective…IMO (even if it’s boring to non Purdue fans haha).
I agree with you, and just to add to that, his shooting 2-4 footers draws a crap load of fouls on opponents bigs, and allows him to shoot many free throws of which he makes at a high clip. Give him the green like on occasion when they have a big lead I guess, but for this college season, don’t mess with his current advantage and method of success.
Very good point. I completely forgot that haha. He wouldn’t have nearly the FTs if he shot out there.
Because defense is half the game and he couldn't hold post position against my sister at this point.
I do think it is safe to say that he has improved substantially from when he stepped on campus and will only get better with more minutes. I can see him carving out some minutes next year and if he does, we all will get a better feel for him.
To be fair, your sister is 325 lbs though
So Edey averages around 18 shots per game. He shoots 70+% FT, and I think he will shoot 60+% on no hand in his face 15-foot shots and dribble drives, including layups. This means if he takes three extra shots, he makes two, but let's use your % and let's say he takes 4 to make 2. He still picks up the fouls down below. And on the two shots he misses, he won't be boxed out as much, and he has a pretty good idea where the missed shots are going.
The two centers who play inside and out are Dickinson and Jackson-Davis. And we did not just let them shoot. Jackson-Davis is now playing regular backup minutes in the NBA.
I like the optimism! I think 60% is a high number, but maybe the big maple could do it! I do think Hunter and TJD are a lot more mobile than Zach (although Hunter is NOT interested in playing any type of Defense). TJD went to the right team and situation and I think the same could be for Zach…who knows maybe Zach could the the answer for Wemby (I think Zach would have to get a lot quicker laterally). Hunter got 3s off vs us and TJD didn’t really look to shoot outside of 4-6 ft like Zach.
But back to the shot, I think it would definitely help if he was able to do shoot it in a game.
I was thinking who was the last 5 man in the offense to consistently shoot a 15 footer in this offense? I thought maybe Tre, but I think he was mostly around the basket, Haarms didn’t shoot much, Haas was how Edey is now…did hammons ever shoot those? I can’t remember if he did. But I’m wondering if Paint just doesn’t really have that in the offense for the 5? I could be completely forgetting something obvious so please remind me haha
I think AJ or biggie would be the last 2 “5’s” that could hit a shot consistently.
I always liked Haas. I don't think he had the mean streak like Edey, and that kept him from getting more boards. However, I used to argue the same thing offensively with him. He should have taken more outside shots and driven more.
Another bunny trail, but I always thought the best I ever saw Hass play defense was when he teamed with Haarms, and Haas ventured out to scare ten-foot shots.
And to your point, Purdue is much better when Haas or Edey play rim protectors, but I think there are times when they both should charge out when the opponent seems to be dead set on taking a ten-footer; Haas could do that with Haarms and Edey can with Furst.
Another bunny trail, but I always thought the best I ever saw Hass play defense was when he teamed with Haarms, and Haas ventured out to scare ten-foot shots.
And to your point, Purdue is much better when Haas or Edey play rim protectors, but I think there are times when they both should charge out when the opponent seems to be dead set on taking a ten-footer; Haas could do that with Haarms and Edey can with Furst.
ESPN worthy........
He's 7'.
An uncontested dunk does not an impressive player make. ;0)
I just don’t see the logic in him taking 15 footers when he is so good close to the basket. I’d be ok with an occasional 3 pointer, but only if he’s unguarded and can hit at a rate of around 38% or better. Any lower and I would much rather force defenses to contend with him inside.
Why should any 4 or 5 take a 15 footer when they are so much more effective close to the basket?
As stated, the opp center is hedging the Purdue guards as they cut off Edey. There are at least twice a game when the opp center is five feet away from him. Edey can square to the basket and take a wide open shot. IMO, he makes it 60% of the time, but let's say he makes it 50%. I would take that, wouldn't you?
Let's view it from a different angle. The majority of the games we lost were when the D did everything possible to stop the inside game to Edey and we did not make our outside shots. If we have Edey practice and play to score from 15 feet out, the guard will be more open when the D tries to counter Edey. The forwards will be more open on back cuts to the basket, and they can post down low, too. This gives us an added dimension if our threes aren't falling.
Finally, there are two skinny 7-footers who are ROY contestants who are doing what I suggest Edey practices. What do you think will happen in the draft if Edey becomes fair at doing this?
not just logic, it's straight math. You will seldom to never see a man anywhere on the court as sure to score as Zach in the paint. To take him out of that is just silly "nba" stuff.
If there was a way for Matt to reduce the game to nothing but Braden and Fletcher shooting free throws, that would be the game plan.
Because that would the simplest and surest way to accumulate points.
Add in that he's the best rebounder and even more so offensive rebounder in the nation.
And WANTING him anywhere other than the paint would make Spocks (star trec) head explode.
You aren’t pulling him out of the paint as much as showing him that sometimes he has a wide open at the free throw line (where he shoots75% from.) If you watched the Arizona game, you saw that one pass he threw got Smith trapped in the corner near half court, and the 2nd time he threw a bad pass and turned it over. Both times she got the ball at the free throw line, Arizona double down under the basket, and their guards kept Smith and Jones from getting the ball.
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You’re not wrong but you’re also picking times when it didn’t work. There are multiple times a game in the offense where he dribbles up by the 3 line or above the elbow and hands off to a guard and sets a pick and then (a lot of the past 2 games) smith is able to get a shot off because teams are dropping on him.
FT% does not equal FG% from the same spot while catching the ball, getting set, squaring your body and then shooting it in a much sped up motion. I get that it’d give a different look, and as I’ve said before, if I were a coach, I’d let edey shoot all day from there if that meant more of a chance he is going to miss from out there than he will from 2-6 ft. It also takes him away from the offensive glass, where he gets a lot of those plus put backs and if he’s out there shooting he won’t get fouled as much by the bigs on the other team.
He definitely needs to develop that for the next level, but his competitive advantage over everyone else in the college game is to be down low since he’s 7’4 and is pretty damn skilled for that size. If he shoots from 15 at this point, he becomes a regular player and hits 35-(MAYBE)50%.
Agree. Very few players hit over 45% on 15 foot jump shots.
If It came down to him taking the shot, or making a questionable pass from that position, I would like to see him attempt the shot. We know we will have people crashing the boards..
Depending on who we are playing, we don’t really. Vs AZ, a majority of the game we had the 1-3 heading back immediately when a shot was taken. Maybe they’d get the long rebound off a 3, but if zach is taking a 15 footer, the only other person crashing would be the 4.
Zach is like Derrick Henry (prior to this year haha) where he just wears the defense down and they slowly pick up fouls and then by the home stretch, he either has the other bigs in foul trouble or he fouls them out. Then he makes the other team have to put someone else out of position on him and then he is unstoppable even more than he was with their actual bigs on him (as long as the game is close).
On the play that you are mentioning, Zach made a really bad pass, but he didn’t know that he was making a pass that would be deflected. In retrospect, that specific pass was a bad decision, but that doesn’t mean that forcing up a wild shot would have been a good decision. I would have been fine with him protecting the ball for 3 seconds and calling a timeout if no teammates got open. He likely would have gotten fouled. More to the point, nobody planned for Zach to receive the ball in that position. Zach had run down a loose ball. I think that we are primarily talking about shots within the offense with the assumption that Zach would be relatively unguarded.
There are centers for which the 15 foot jump shot makes sense. JaJuan Johnson was one. The Marquette center this season is another (especially going up against Edey). But, for Edey it doesn’t make sense. The advanced stats on Edey in the post are ridiculously good. He even draws several fouls a game from defenders trying to deny him position before a pass is even made. The goal is to get him shots at the rim and free throws.
I watched part of the Milwaukee Bucks game recently, and Brooks Lopez came out and hedged but did not go out and waited for the defender to catch up to the ball handler as he dropped back to protect the rim. Pretty much like Purdue taught Edey and Haas.
I look at Haas' senior stats of 62% FG and 76% FT, and I wonder why teams didn't draft Haas to play about 3 minutes a half for when the team goes cold and they just dump it down low. The knock on Haas is that he has white man's disease when it comes to rebounding and has never developed the intensity to grab everyone like Edey or Biggie. However, back to the topic, I see the Bucks having Lopez take 3-pointers. Why?
Let's look at another example. Haas' opponent, Wagner, had senior stats of 53% FG, 70% FT, and 39% 3Pt. Wagner was drafted in the first round. My conclusion is the NBA wants players who can shoot from the outside.
Now, for the present time, I agree with all of you. Our offense should be to drop it low to Edey for the shot, and if they bring the kitchen sink, throw it out for the uncontested three. In theory, we should be undefeated, and Edey will surely be drafted.
My wish is that three or four times a game, Edey creates his own shot. I think the worst case scenario is that it costs us six points per game, maybe once or twice, which may cost us two games. And this could mean winning the Big 10 by only four games. Moreover, it gives the other teams something to think about come March, and IMO, it will make Edey a first-rounder. What do you think?
I look at Haas' senior stats of 62% FG and 76% FT, and I wonder why teams didn't draft Haas to play about 3 minutes a half for when the team goes cold and they just dump it down low. The knock on Haas is that he has white man's disease when it comes to rebounding and has never developed the intensity to grab everyone like Edey or Biggie. However, back to the topic, I see the Bucks having Lopez take 3-pointers. Why?
Let's look at another example. Haas' opponent, Wagner, had senior stats of 53% FG, 70% FT, and 39% 3Pt. Wagner was drafted in the first round. My conclusion is the NBA wants players who can shoot from the outside.
Now, for the present time, I agree with all of you. Our offense should be to drop it low to Edey for the shot, and if they bring the kitchen sink, throw it out for the uncontested three. In theory, we should be undefeated, and Edey will surely be drafted.
My wish is that three or four times a game, Edey creates his own shot. I think the worst case scenario is that it costs us six points per game, maybe once or twice, which may cost us two games. And this could mean winning the Big 10 by only four games. Moreover, it gives the other teams something to think about come March, and IMO, it will make Edey a first-rounder. What do you think?
I am not sure how a wide open shot from the free throw line would be considered a wild shot
I’m specifically talking about the play where he turned it over. If I am recalling the play correctly, he was facing a lot of pressure. Maybe the difference here is that you believe that he is going to be left wide open if he receives a pass near the free throw line. I think that, best case, he’ll have someone closing on him quickly. It’s a shot that he can make, but I just don’t see it as an efficient option. Keep in mind that both KenPom and Torvik rate Purdue’s adjusted offensive efficiency as second in the nation in the 123 range, which is very good. A large part of that efficiency comes from the way that Edey is used now. Edey is arguably the best offensive weapon in all of college basketball. I just can’t see how adding midrange jump shots to his repertoire helps that.
Edey needs the inside passing game , halfway up the 3 second Zone he needs to pass over the top or around the defender and hit the cutting three point shooter for an easy layup since he is double teamed there is always a open player to score baskets, you have to have this especially when you're not hitting from three
Edey gets doubled on the block or about 2-(maybe)6 feet. He doesn’t get double out past that since he doesn’t look to shoot because the offense is not designed for him to shoot out there. It also depends on where the double comes from. Doesn’t always come from opposite side guard. NW brought their other big, other teams bring opposite post defender and sometimes teams do bring the opposite weak side guard and then rotate around when ball is passed around. Another issue could be WHEN the double comes. It may come right away or it may be delayed.
The open man isn’t always easily accessible with a pass straight from edey. It is sometimes there and we need to take advantage, but the open man could be on opposite side in the corner near baseline or up top or if they cut, they may run into TKR land etc. Not as easy as just having someone cut to the basket every time he’s doubled.
a 15' shot is a free throw, so I'd figure most decent shooters shoot over 45% from there.
You are correct sir. The people that want to see Zach further out are either worrying about his NBA future or just clueless as to the higher probability of Zach scoring in the paint. It's not going to "open up his game" or create new (better) opportunities for anyone else. They just want to see it. Like adding a skill to a NBA2K player.
You would think, but unless you shoot like Shaq, somebody is going to be closing on you quickly if you catch the ball at 15’. I’ve seen Braden produce some nice pull up jumpers from 15 feet, but few players can do that. Analytics say that percentages on 15’ jump shots aren’t much different than 3 point shots which reward more points. There is a time to take midrange jump shots in the college game, but it isn’t some that I would be looking for Zach to add.
