For the liberals and Democrats on here

[atmafola]

So exactly what is he doing to help the non whites of the country. Do tell......

Dont quotw black unemployment numbers to me. The low numbers reflect the overall low unemployment numbers and says nothing at all about Trump. It has nada to do with him. It still doesn't change the fact that should the economy turn south tomorrow, blacks and minorities will disproportionately lose their jobs first and be the last to be hired when things turn around. If you want to address that issue, I'd listen. But attempting to give Trump credit for a trend he has nada to do with is insulting people's intelligence

 

[gr8indoorsman]

I'll ask you this. Why are thousands of Mexicans and Central Americans flooding our borders every month? Most of the time, it's economic opportunity. Hispanic and AA unemployment rates are their lowest in recorded history of the nation.

They've been doing this for years...

And employment numbers are historically cyclical. Giving Trump credit for this is about the same as blaming Bush for Hurricane Katrina happening.

 

[SDBoiler1]

They've been doing this for years...

And employment numbers are historically cyclical. Giving Trump credit for this is about the same as blaming Bush for Hurricane Katrina happening.

Bush did get blamed for Hurricane Katrina and for his Administration’s poor response to it.

I just think it’s disingenuous to state that Trump’s policies aren’t helping the economy, unemployment, spending plant and equipment by companies, GDP growth, etc.

Yes, unemployment numbers can fluctuate, but they have been improving ever since he took office, because of his policies.

 

[ComradeRedBoilermaker]

Sorry, but this is an insane rant.

Well, ok

 

[SDBoiler1]

Well, ok

All Power to the Bolsheviks!

 

[atmafola]

Bush did get blamed for Hurricane Katrina and for his Administration’s poor response to it.

I just think it’s disingenuous to state that Trump’s policies aren’t helping the economy, unemployment, spending plant and equipment by companies, GDP growth, etc.

Yes, unemployment numbers can fluctuate, but they have been improving ever since he took office, because of his policies.

he got blamed for his response to it. and rightly so too. He didn't get blamed for the hurricane happening.

 

[ComradeRedBoilermaker]

All Power to the Bolsheviks!

This, but unironically

 

[atmafola]

Why is it about "black kids" in your response. White kids matter too.

because the idiot who shot him cared about his blackness. and get at me the day white kids start getting bugged for just going about their day the way black kids are.

 

[gr8indoorsman]

Bush did get blamed for Hurricane Katrina and for his Administration’s poor response to it.

I just think it’s disingenuous to state that Trump’s policies aren’t helping the economy, unemployment, spending plant and equipment by companies, GDP growth, etc.

Yes, unemployment numbers can fluctuate, but they have been improving ever since he took office, because of his policies.

Right, Bush got blamed for Katrina happening... no he didn’t. He rightly got blamed for slow response, but that’s not what I said, now is it? Unemployment numbers were improving before Trump, too.

Trump’s policies helped, but there can be too much of a good thing. Economic recovery was happening with or without Trump. I don’t think our economy will sustain long term growth much higher than 2-3%. A recession is coming, and that won’t be Trump’s fault. The president has damn near nothing to do with any of this.

 

[atmafola]

Actually he DID NOT live in the neighborhood. He was there VISITING his parents.

what stupid argument is this. how does a kid even visit his parents? do you have kids under 18? are they visiting your household too?

 

[SDBoiler1]

he got blamed for his response to it. and rightly so too. He didn't get blamed for the hurricane happening.

I was half-joking about Katrina itself. He was rightly blamed for the poor response.

 

[SDBoiler1]

This, but unironically

To do what you are advocating would require another civil war - one I don’t think the leftists can or would win.

 

[SDBoiler1]

Right, Bush got blamed for Katrina happening... no he didn’t. He rightly got blamed for slow response, but that’s not what I said, now is it? Unemployment numbers were improving before Trump, too.

Trump’s policies helped, but there can be too much of a good thing. Economic recovery was happening with or without Trump. I don’t think our economy will sustain long term growth much higher than 2-3%. A recession is coming, and that won’t be Trump’s fault. The president has damn near nothing to do with any of this.

There will be another recession someday, sure. I do think his policy changes (tax overhaul, regulation reduction) will postpone a recession for some years, UNLESS Trump ends up causing a global trade war, then all bets are off.

 

[gr8indoorsman]

To do what you are advocating would require another civil war - one I don’t think the leftists can or would win.

Yeah, if someone ran on a platform of destroying the constitution and starting over they would rightly lose in a landslide, and then likely have a fight on their hands if they tried.

Young socialists need to study history, not political theory.

 

[gr8indoorsman]

There will be another recession someday, sure. I do think his policy changes (tax overhaul, regulation reduction) will postpone a recession for some years, UNLESS Trump ends up causing a global trade war, then all bets are off.

Yes. Agree. But a delayed recession is artificial either way. As I said, it’s cyclical. Presidential policies can impact the timing, but not the event itself. The longer we go without one, the more likely the next one is worse.

 

[SDBoiler1]

Yeah, if someone ran on a platform of destroying the constitution and starting over they would rightly lose in a landslide, and then likely have a fight on their hands if they tried.

Young socialists need to study history, not political theory.

The hardcore Antifa and far-left Bernie Sanders crowd just don’t seem to understand the majority of this nation’s people. They don’t understand the Constitution, the Electoral College, the separation of powers, or our republican form of government and why it was set up the way it was. The Founding Fathers wanted to avoid the “tyranny of the masses” and the ability of a couple of large states to determine the outcome of every national election. They wanted to give smaller states a voice in the federal government. The didn’t want a federal government that dictated all policies from the top down. States are given the ability to decide how they want to operate on many things outside of the Common Defense, etc.

 

[SDBoiler1]

Yes. Agree. But a delayed recession is artificial either way. As I said, it’s cyclical. Presidential policies can impact the timing, but not the event itself. The longer we go without one, the more likely the next one is worse.

The last one was very, very bad, as we both know.

 

[BuilderBob6]

Right, Bush got blamed for Katrina happening... no he didn’t. He rightly got blamed for slow response, but that’s not what I said, now is it? Unemployment numbers were improving before Trump, too.

Trump’s policies helped, but there can be too much of a good thing. Economic recovery was happening with or without Trump. I don’t think our economy will sustain long term growth much higher than 2-3%. A recession is coming, and that won’t be Trump’s fault. The president has damn near nothing to do with any of this.

I think you're old enough to remember when 4+ % growth for too long was something to be avoided. Infkation and interest rates. It's one of the reasons the Fed became more involved in manipulating interest rates. They were actually trying to slow down the economy and avoid a recession.

It is coming and it will be someone else's fault.

 

[SDBoiler1]

I think you're old enough to remember when 4+ % growth for too long was something to be avoided. Infkation and interest rates. It's one of the reasons the Fed became more involved in manipulating interest rates. They were actually trying to slow down the economy and avoid a recession.

It is coming and it will be someone else's fault.

If we see sustained real inflation (which I highly doubt because our interest rates are still low due to Fed manipulation), then I will agree with you. I don’t think you will.

 

[gr8indoorsman]

I think you're old enough to remember when 4+ % growth for too long was something to be avoided. Infkation and interest rates. It's one of the reasons the Fed became more involved in manipulating interest rates. They were actually trying to slow down the economy and avoid a recession.

It is coming and it will be someone else's fault.

Yep, but any manipulation by government entities is, in the end, artificial. Recessions happen and are unavoidable. Expansion and contraction of economies is healthy and natural as they evolve. Personally, I think we're barking up the wrong tree trying to hold on to the 50s right now with respect to manufacturing, reliance on fossil fuels, etc.

 

[BuilderBob6]

Yep, but any manipulation by government entities is, in the end, artificial. Recessions happen and are unavoidable. Expansion and contraction of economies is healthy and natural as they evolve. Personally, I think we're barking up the wrong tree trying to hold on to the 50s right now with respect to manufacturing, reliance on fossil fuels, etc.

Agreed and I think the Fed figured that out.....at least that a recession can't be put off forever. And I agree that can make them worse later. But they are doing it right now, trying to slow things down. Lots of stimulous going on.

 

[SDBoiler1]

Agreed and I think the Fed figured that out.....at least that a recession can't be put off forever. And I agree that can make them worse later. But they are doing it right now, trying to slow things down. Lots of stimulous going on.

Not to the level seen under Bush or Obama. Are we doing Quantitative Easing now? Interest rates are still kept low by the Fed, but not close to as much as seen back in 2007-2010.

 

[BuilderBob6]

Not to the level seen under Bush or Obama. Are we doing Quantitative Easing now? Interest rates are still kept low by the Fed, but not close to as much as seen back in 2007-2010.

Uh, recession? The economy is growing faster than under Obama, in part thanks to Trump's actions. The Fed will continue to raise rates if necessary to keep growth from getting too strong.

You're the guys touting all the stimulous actions by Trump, when the economy was already growing. You wanted more. Tax cuts and easing regulations are stimulating the economy. You want fight about who had more rate hikes too?
The recession needed lower rates and more stimulous. Trump didn't need as much but had to do it anyway. You reap what you sow.

 

[SDBoiler1]

Uh, recession? The economy is growing faster than under Obama, in part thanks to Trump's actions. The Fed will continue to raise rates if necessary to keep growth from getting too strong.

You're the guys touting all the stimulous actions by Trump, when the economy was already growing. You wanted more. Tax cuts and easing regulations are stimulating the economy. You want fight about who had more rate hikes too?
The recession needed lower rates and more stimulous. Trump didn't need as much but had to do it anyway. You reap what you sow.

Tax cuts and easing regulations are not the same thing as Quantitative Easing. Not even close. Quantitative Easing keeps interest rates artificially low.

 

[BuilderBob6]

Tax cuts and easing regulations are not the same thing as Quantitative Easing. Not even close. Quantitative Easing keeps interest rates artificially low.

I said nothing about QE. Not sure how that applies. It's just a BS way of getting more money into circulation when stimulus or interest rate cuts don't do enough or have already been tried.

Tax cuts and easing regulations are not the same thing as Quantitative Easing. Not even close. Quantitative Easing keeps interest rates artificially low.

Didn't say it was the same thing. I don't think QE was a good idea but really wasn't going to complain much when I lost my business and nearly my house because Wall street and my government blew shut up.

Dragging you back to the point, too much of a good thing can be bad. Trump added fuel to a growing economy. It looks like he's stepping on his d!ck again with the tariffs, might slow things down.

Meanwhile, the world is making deals with each other, China is filling the void.......including the Pacific Rim, while Trump moves toward bilateral agreements. Like the South Korea deal you tout.....which does almost nothing, and the Brazil deal that actually never happened. Could you link that one please?

 

[JohnnyDoeBoiler]

Sorry you have so much trouble with the facts regarding GDP. These are some of the things that Trump has done with his policies:

Tax cuts for businesses and consumers. Increased Investment in new plants, capital, and equipment due to tax law changes. Substantial reductions in burdensome regulations.

These things have helped drive:
More jobs available than job seekers. Unemployment at 40+ year lows for blacks, Hispanics, and women. Unemployment at overall low since late 1960s. Substantial consumer confidence increases. First wage growth in over 20 years.

Haven’t gotten through the entire thread but it appears most of those new jobs are in the service sector where minimum wage is the standard. The jobs being created are not ones people can make a living with unless the minimum wage returns to the idea it was meant to represent: the minimum wage that working 40 hours per week can allow an individual to afford the basic standard of living without assistance. This is why people are clamoring for $15/hour. It appears to me that businesses can afford this but the CEO’s, Boards, and other executives aren’t willing to take a hit in to their personal intakes...and that goes for traditional conservative and liberal CEO’s alike (Walton’s vs Bezos).

 

[JohnnyDoeBoiler]

Sorry, but this is an insane rant.

It is actually accurate...especially when you take in to context what Europeans did to Africa and India/SE Asia.

 

[SDBoiler1]

Haven’t gotten through the entire thread but it appears most of those new jobs are in the service sector where minimum wage is the standard. The jobs being created are not ones people can make a living with unless the minimum wage returns to the idea it was meant to represent: the minimum wage that working 40 hours per week can allow an individual to afford the basic standard of living without assistance. This is why people are clamoring for $15/hour. It appears to me that businesses can afford this but the CEO’s, Boards, and other executives aren’t willing to take a hit in to their personal intakes...and that goes for traditional conservative and liberal CEO’s alike (Walton’s vs Bezos).

No one is clamoring for $15/hr except hardcore lefties. Businesses are leaving Seattle after they adopted $15/hr. This has been reported extensively.

 

[JohnnyDoeBoiler]

Right, Bush got blamed for Katrina happening... no he didn’t. He rightly got blamed for slow response, but that’s not what I said, now is it? Unemployment numbers were improving before Trump, too.

Trump’s policies helped, but there can be too much of a good thing. Economic recovery was happening with or without Trump. I don’t think our economy will sustain long term growth much higher than 2-3%. A recession is coming, and that won’t be Trump’s fault. The president has damn near nothing to do with any of this.

This assertion that growth at 2-3% is bad is false. This growth should be the standard and healthy growth of a post-industrial economy. You can not compare the US to growth that is occurring in China, India, South America, and parts of the Middle East...different expectations need to be had.

 

[JohnnyDoeBoiler]

No one is clamoring for $15/hr except hardcore lefties. Businesses are leaving Seattle after they adopted $15/hr. This has been reported extensively.

But why are the businesses leaving? Is their profit margin not met with the standards of other stores or are they actually losing money?

I agree that $15/hr likely isn’t feasible for fast food and other entry level jobs...but $11-$12 is a middle ground that should be feasible.

Jobs like McDonald’s (outside of management) shouldn’t be seen as a job to crutch on for the better portion of your life. This is why a high school education and some times going to trade schools, technical schools, Ivy Tech, and for some 4 year colleges should be the standard. We shouldn’t be in the business of rewarding poor effort in school so someone can work at Burger King and end up making more than a teacher.

 

[SDBoiler1]

But why are the businesses leaving? Is their profit margin not met with the standards of other stores or are they actually losing money?

I agree that $15/hr likely isn’t feasible for fast food and other entry level jobs...but $11-$12 is a middle ground that should be feasible.

Jobs like McDonald’s (outside of management) shouldn’t be seen as a job to crutch on for the better portion of your life. This is why a high school education and some times going to trade schools, technical schools, Ivy Tech, and for some 4 year colleges should be the standard. We shouldn’t be in the business of rewarding poor effort in school so someone can work at Burger King and end up making more than a teacher.

What do you think the $15/hr rate is targeting? It's the low-skill jobs, like at McDonalds and Starbucks.

 

[SKYDOG]

But why are the businesses leaving? Is their profit margin not met with the standards of other stores or are they actually losing money?

I agree that $15/hr likely isn’t feasible for fast food and other entry level jobs...but $11-$12 is a middle ground that should be feasible.

Jobs like McDonald’s (outside of management) shouldn’t be seen as a job to crutch on for the better portion of your life. This is why a high school education and some times going to trade schools, technical schools, Ivy Tech, and for some 4 year colleges should be the standard. We shouldn’t be in the business of rewarding poor effort in school so someone can work at Burger King and end up making more than a teacher.

If someone at Burger King is making more than a teacher, they are probably working 60 or more hours a week versus the 179 days of a first year or two teacher. And the teacher has health care benefits and a defined retirement pension.

 

[BoilerJS]

If someone at Burger King is making more than a teacher, they are probably working 60 or more hours a week versus the 179 days of a first year or two teacher. And the teacher has health care benefits and a defined retirement pension.

$15/hr puts you at $25,000 per year. Add $15,000 in subsidized health insurance and your at $40,000. A first year teacher in Indiana will make $35,000. If they have a $4,000 student loan payment annually, why go to college.

 

[SKYDOG]

$15/hr puts you at $25,000 per year. Add $15,000 in subsidized health insurance and your at $40,000. A first year teacher in Indiana will make $35,000. If they have a $4,000 student loan payment annually, why go to college.

I guess for the defined pension and the 179 work days. The rule of 85 is pretty sweet too. Probably not going to ever retire from a fast food job.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

Dont quotw black unemployment numbers to me. The low numbers reflect the overall low unemployment numbers and says nothing at all about Trump. It has nada to do with him. It still doesn't change the fact that should the economy turn south tomorrow, blacks and minorities will disproportionately lose their jobs first and be the last to be hired when things turn around. If you want to address that issue, I'd listen. But attempting to give Trump credit for a trend he has nada to do with is insulting people's intelligence

Really.....And who's policies reflect that low unemployment numbers? I've said this before, but Trump could find a cure for cancer and folks like you would bitch that he didn't cure all STD's at the same time. You're pure Demolib, and any GOP/conservative will always be your enemy. Just my opinion.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

he got blamed for his response to it. and rightly so too. He didn't get blamed for the hurricane happening.

The actual problem with Katrina wasn't Bush....it was the mayor of the day who is now deservedly in prison. He failed to take actions even though FEMA warned him and his city director that this was going to be the storm of a lifetime. He had days to utilize all those school and city buses to evacuate his citizens, yet he sat on his corrupt ass and let many suffer injury, lose their homes, and die. In 2014, Nagin was convicted on twenty of twenty-one charges of wire fraud, bribery, and money laundering related to bribes from city contractors before and after Katrina and was sentenced to ten years in federal prison......He was warned, he did nothing, and yet you want to put the blame on Bush.

 

[JohnnyDoeBoiler]

I guess for the defined pension and the 179 work days. The rule of 85 is pretty sweet too. Probably not going to ever retire from a fast food job.

179 work days? Funny...I’d love if my work days were only 179 per year. For example, I’m creating a new course from scratch because the state has provided zero guidance beyond a single paragraph, zero recommended textbooks, and yet it is mandated to be offered. I have spent more than 5 months putting resources together and haven’t even come close to finalizing everything. I also continually change my course content and look for ways to alter my teaching approach. I either take work home for the weekends or stay after school is over for 2-3 hours (btw, that isn’t paid bc overtime isn’t offered). Also, not paid for any of this extra time I’ve taken to create this course.

Now correct me if I am wrong but most jobs offer healthcare outside of entry level jobs like fast food...not really a ‘perk’ of the job when my co-pays are still $30/$50/$200. I also handle kids with depression, anxiety, adhd/add (most of which aren’t medicated), suicidal (I notified CPS and law enforcement 7 times this past school year), and battle phones and outside influences of social media.

I’d like to be spared the sarcasm in your words that denigrate my profession.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

what stupid argument is this. how does a kid even visit his parents? do you have kids under 18? are they visiting your household too?

Wow, you reach for anything don't you. Let me 'splain it to you...he did not live with the parents who lived in the area. He came for a visit....to spend some time with them. And no, I don't have kids under 18 and I'm glad I don't. I do however have grand-kids who come visit me and stay at my house in my neighborhood. Is it a bit clearer for you now?

 

[hunkgolden]

$15/hr puts you at $25,000 per year. Add $15,000 in subsidized health insurance and your at $40,000. A first year teacher in Indiana will make $35,000. If they have a $4,000 student loan payment annually, why go to college.

First year teachers at my wife's school corporation make 40K. They also get health insurance for themselves and dependents for $1 per year and free doctor visits with no copay. Teachers also get 12 weeks off per year plus a ridiculous amount of sick/personal days. The pension is pretty good too.

What I don't understand are the people going to expensive colleges to get a teaching degree.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

Haven’t gotten through the entire thread but it appears most of those new jobs are in the service sector where minimum wage is the standard. The jobs being created are not ones people can make a living with unless the minimum wage returns to the idea it was meant to represent: the minimum wage that working 40 hours per week can allow an individual to afford the basic standard of living without assistance. This is why people are clamoring for $15/hour. It appears to me that businesses can afford this but the CEO’s, Boards, and other executives aren’t willing to take a hit in to their personal intakes...and that goes for traditional conservative and liberal CEO’s alike (Walton’s vs Bezos).

I disagree that most are in the service sector. Because of my business, I see manufacturer's offering $15 to $20 per hour with jobs unfilled....begging for employees to run manufacturing equipment. But that would take getting hands dirty, and maybe relocating out of Mom's basement. There are way too many sitting on their behind drawing a government check who need to have those funds ended (if they can work) and then they'd look for work...maybe.