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Mathis at the point

He IS our best passer (Painter said that last pre-season before he even played a game), he can help advance the ball and has some already last season. That being said he can't be our "PG" because he won't be able to guard that position IMO. Hopefully we get a 5th year PG, if not the point duties will fall to PJ and Weatherford most likely, the latter being the best defensive option.
 
No way he is a heck of a player but that isn't his position. I'd hate to see that vs a full court press
 
Somebody who is an intruiging PG to me is Basil. Has the size and athletic enough. If he works on his handles he could be a lot like Barlow.
 
Originally posted by BoilerFan#35:
Somebody who is an intruiging PG to me is Basil. Has the size and athletic enough. If he works on his handles he could be a lot like Barlow.
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Agree. I think that Mathias doesn't handle the ball well enough to bring it up under any kind of pressure. The best thing about the motion offense is that you don't necessarily need a PG to get the offense going. That said, I think Painter will bring somebody in who is decently equipped to help us at that spot.

If we somehow strike out, I feel confident that the offense will be just fine without a true PG type player. We have the luxury of having a 3 (Raphel) and a 4 (Edwards) who are GREAT ball handlers for their positions. We'll no doubt miss Octeus but I think we will be fine as far as offense goes, no matter if its feeding the post, getting to the rim or generating outside shots.
 
maybe boiler fans are underestimating the kids at pg already.

good players who make shots make a pg look good. example rajon rondo (did i spell that right?) is just another guy these days and jeremy lin (i think that's his name) was the rage a couple of seasons ago.

we shall see
 
I don't recall who posted in another thread on this point, but there's just as much the critical need for defense. Yes, it's great to have other ball-handlers, especially guys like VE or Basil Smotherman and even Ray Davis....but you need someone who can handle the main responsibility for guarding players like Koenig, Ferrell, and Walton, just to name a few. That won't work by committee IMO....you can switch off or use the bench for flexibility or foul trouble but not as the main strategy for defending the opposing point.

Again, JMHO.

In any event, I like where D Mathias is headed with his game and expect him to have a solid year next year.
 
"Purdue coach Matt Painter has mentioned Mathias among internal options to help at point guard next season. When asked if he can handle point guard duties, Mathias barely waited a heartbeat before answering: "Absolutely."
Mathias believes his skills, intelligence and lower-level experience would translate to what Purdue needs from a point guard. The bigger adjustment comes on defense.
He also feels stamina would be even more important at the point - another reason Mathias hopes the health woes are behind him.
"The big thing for me, if I'm going to do that, is get in the best shape possible," Mathias said. "Especially at this level, being a point guard, you've got to run and go the entire game and go full court with those guys. I look forward to that, though."

Mathias at the point
 
Re: No, he's not quick enough


I re-iterate from a couple of months ago ... what rule says that the point guard bringing the ball up has to guard the opposing point guard?
 
Originally posted by Purdue Grad in Texas:
I don't recall who posted in another thread on this point, but there's just as much the critical need for defense. Yes, it's great to have other ball-handlers, especially guys like VE or Basil Smotherman and even Ray Davis....but you need someone who can handle the main responsibility for guarding players like Koenig, Ferrell, and Walton, just to name a few. That won't work by committee IMO....you can switch off or use the bench for flexibility or foul trouble but not as the main strategy for defending the opposing point.

Again, JMHO.

In any event, I like where D Mathias is headed with his game and expect him to have a solid year next year.
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This. It may have been me. I've shared this opinion since Bryson decided to leave.I'm not worried about offense or who brings the ball up. As many have said, we can do that by committee. The problem is on the defensive end. As the roster stands now, there are only two players who can hope to check B1G caliber PGs. PJ and Weatherford. Ray may be able to guard some but do you really want him to leave the oppositions best wing scorer? I think not. So, we must have PJ or Weatherford in the game at all times regardless of who brings the ball up or runs the offense. To me this makes it clear that it is imperative that Painter land another quality PG (5th yr. or Juco). I like PJ as a back up PG and Weatherford as depth to guard the 1 or 2 but we need a primary PG that can guard but also be a threat on offense.
 
Originally posted by BoilerFan#35:
Somebody who is an intruiging PG to me is Basil. Has the size and athletic enough. If he works on his handles he could be a lot like Barlow.
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Correct me if I am wrong,but wasn't he in the ESPN top 25 when he was a freshman as a PG? Then he grew and switched schools a couple times.
 
Anybody who says Mathias isn't a good enough ball handler to be a PG didn't watch him closely last year. He brought the ball up several times against Sam Thompson when Octeus was denied the ball and with Thompson all over him he handled the ball more confidently and skillfully than any other player we had last year...dribbling with his head up and not looking scared.

I think he is easily the teams best ball handler/passer. Offensively Purdue doesn't run a PG driven offense, so as long as we have guys capable of getting it across half court in 10 seconds, that is all that is needed offensively.

Defensively Painter will always match guys up and design his defense based on who the other teams has, so Mathias wouldn't necessarily be guarding other teams PG's. The luxury of having Hammons or Haas protecting the rim also helps negate a lot of perimeter defensive mistakes. It also appeared by the end of the year Mathias had figured out defensive angles and became a much better defender anyway.

I would prefer a lineup full of skilled guys/shooters over a lineup of drivers and slashers when we have a 7 footer clogging up the lane down low. Cline, Mathias, Stephens, Vince should be a pretty good core group of players the next few years, even if they aren't the quickest players in the world.
 
He is a good passer, but his handles aren't close to what we need at that position. If the opposition puts anyone relatively quick on him he will get picked clean A LOT.

If Purdue decides to use him at PG, Purdue is going to see full-court pressing from just about everyone.
 
Re: No, he's not quick enough

Legit question, but my response had nothing to do with him as a defender. I don't think he's quick enough to escape pressure when he's on offense.
 
Mathias could play point I think. Everyone keeps saying he can't guard the point, but does he have to? Maybe Davis could guard the point and Mathias play on a shooting guard.
 
Just out of curiosity, how many of the sweet 16 teams from this past, or almost any past NCAA tourney did not have a PG or big two guard who could create their own shot and shots for others on the team, regardless of style of offense. Pretty sure the answer is Zero, so why would we be different?
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Re: No, he's not quick enough


Originally posted by BoilerTom90:
Legit question, but my response had nothing to do with him as a defender. I don't think he's quick enough to escape pressure when he's on offense.
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I can't remember teh game, but late in the season I remember seeing Mathias bringing the ball up and was about to get trapped but made a long pass up the court. Or something like that, anyone else remember that?

Personally I love this idea as I think it could wreak havoc on teams when you have a shooter like Mathias with the ball already, that might open other things up.
 
I think it's a very real possibility and it can work, but it will be somewhat a committee approach if it happens. I am hoping that Purdue gets Ennis or another solid, eligible point guard and I am sure that PJ will get significant minutes, but it appears very likely that Mathias will log a lot of minutes at point guard.

Mathias has quite a bit going for him. He is a very good ball handler, passer, and decision maker. He might even turn out better against the press than Octeus, because I think that he has better vision and anticipation, not to mention free throw shooting.

To another point that was made, he may not be great at creating his own shot, but I think that Purdue has a chance to have a unique offensive attack with really good spacing, I see a Stephens and Mathias backcourt creating a lot of space and Edwards and Davis attacking from all over the half court with their versatility, making it very hard to double the bigs.

Defensively, I think that Mathias can be similar to Josh Gosser(sic), who spent a year at point guard a few years ago for Wisconsin. Point is not his ideal defensive position, but it can be managed if he plays smart and stays on the same page as his teammates. I'm glad that his breathing issues are being addressed proactively now, so that he should have better endurance.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by BoilerDaddy:
I think it's a very real possibility and it can work, but it will be somewhat a committee approach if it happens. I am hoping that Purdue gets Ennis or another solid, eligible point guard and I am sure that PJ will get significant minutes, but it appears very likely that Mathias will log a lot of minutes at point guard.

Mathias has quite a bit going for him. He is a very good ball handler, passer, and decision maker. He might even turn out better against the press than Octeus, because I think that he has better vision and anticipation, not to mention free throw shooting.

To another point that was made, he may not be great at creating his own shot, but I think that Purdue has a chance to have a unique offensive attack with really good spacing, I see a Stephens and Mathias backcourt creating a lot of space and Edwards and Davis attacking from all over the half court with their versatility, making it very hard to double the bigs.

Defensively, I think that Mathias can be similar to Josh Gosser(sic), who spent a year at point guard a few years ago for Wisconsin. Point is not his ideal defensive position, but it can be managed if he plays smart and stays on the same page as his teammates. I'm glad that his breathing issues are being addressed proactively now, so that he should have better endurance.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
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BD, I always enjoy your insight and consider you one of the more substantive posters on this board. But you lost me with the Gasser comparison. Gasser has been one of the best defensive guards in the B1G over his career. His lateral quickness is light years ahead of Dakota.IMO, it is imperative that Painter bring in a 5th year PG for next year and a solid 2016 recruit for the future.
 
I guess I'd have to see them side by side. I thought that by the end of the year, Mathias was moving very well laterally. I never thought that Gasser had point guard quickness either, but had really good anticipation and knew when to take chances vs. when to play it safe. In any case, iirc, he only played point guard for one season when Wisconsin had limited options, before moving back to the 2 or 3 after his injury.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
As long as Dakota stays healthy, I think he will put in the work this off season to be able to play pg if we need him to. And while he won't be the quickest pg in the league, I think he will be better than many folks are anticipating. That said, I would like to see us pick up a good natural pg if possible.
 
He said he wants to be in better shape next year. After a healthy off season of workouts he may prove to be quicker than last season. Leaner. Stronger. He already improved enough to start those last 15 games. He's gonna be a good one whatever slot you put him in. Btfu!
 
Mathias played excellent defense later in the year. I couldn't believe how well he did against Rice for IL. He stayed in front of Rice and stripped him a couple of times. Again, with the switching that we will be able to do on the perimeter, people are making way too much out of 1 on 1 defensive matchups at the point.
 
PG in today's game is a speed position. Painter was also known as a very good passer, but would never have had the speed to defend quickness for 25+ minutes, dribble through a press, or penetrate like many PG's do on almost every team to set up perimeter shots.

Dakota is a nice player, but I think you diminish his passing as an asset unless he is simply giving only a few minutes to spell a person who is much more conditioned for the position.
 
Originally posted by koopmeister:
PG in today's game is a speed position. Painter was also known as a very good passer, but would never have had the speed to defend quickness for 25+ minutes, dribble through a press, or penetrate like many PG's do on almost every team to set up perimeter shots.

Dakota is a nice player, but I think you diminish his passing as an asset unless he is simply giving only a few minutes to spell a person who is much more conditioned for the position.
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Aaron Craft was a decent athlete and a very smart player, but no one would describe him as fleet of foot. Quick hands, yes.
 
4sure - I was always very impressed with Craft's lateral quickness. He's one of the very few players that I ever recall being able to stay in front of Lewis Jackson.

But I do agree that Craft is a good example of a player who maximized his effectiveness on the defensive side of the ball by playing smart, anticipating well, giving maximum effort, always staying low, and playing as physically as he could get away with.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Purdue Alumnus said:
Anybody think he could handle the position ? He may be our best passer.
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While it would be great if RD could successfully play PG, snow in Miami would be great as well. I believe our best chance [barring injury] for continued smooth success throughout the season, where victories abound, & troubles are fewest, is this list below:

PG: DM/Hill

SG: RD/Stephens

SF: VE/Smotherman

PF: CS/Taylor

C: AJH/IH


DM is one of, if not our best passer, as has been mentioned previously, his ball handling would have to improve now, & throughout the season. RD seems to be a natural SG, this level, & probably at the next level. I like this bigger line up, as long as turnovers are managed better than last season, we don't get fast breaked too often, & the players listed are comfortable [as can be expected] with their responsibilities.



Go Boilers!!!
 
Purdue Alumnus said:
Anybody think he could handle the position ? He may be our best passer.
Click to expand...




Some think DM isn't quick/fast enough to play the/our point guard. No secret, he's not the quickest/fastest player [by any means] on this team, nor does he have to be to play the PG position on THIS team. Many people forget that the PG isn't alone on an island. Even the best point guards will have real trouble, frontcourt, backcourt-anywhere on the floor, bringing the ball up, getting the offense into motion/a set play, or even keeping the ball, if his teammates aren't properly spaced on the floor, paying full attention, and making the proper adjustments/movements, as the defense adjusts/moves. If the player with the ball doesn't get the proper help [including spacing] from his teammates, at the proper time, [especially during a press/clocks ticking] even the greatest of point guards will have real troubles/turnovers, when a good defense presses or finds a weakness in the offense.

Mathias can play the point, provided he gets the proper help, not just from the other guard, but from every other teammate on the floor. If this Purdue team can limit the turnovers this season, the sky is the limit. Anouther advantage to a bigger, stronger line up [if all players can get back on defense in time, while limiting turnovers] is the post up problems it can create for the opponents. If Mathis is going to play the point, & Davis the SG, I'd be telling them now, so they can more easily be properly prepaired for those increased responsibilities as soon as possible. It's never too early to win.
 
If I was coach... ;)

This is my breakdown...

PG
Hill / PJ = 30+ minutes combined... RD / DM / VE combine for remaining 10min in spot duty
SG
DM / KS = 35+ minutes combined... RD filling in for the remainder based on matchups
SF
RD / VE = 35+ minutes combined... BS getting the remaining 2-5min based on matchups
PF
CS / VE = 35+ minutes combined... BS / JT getting the remaining 2-5min based on matchups
C
AJH / IH = 40 minutes combined... CS / JT could get a few min per game due to fouls/matchups

I can see one redshirt... either Cline or Weatherford. Which one depends on which 2 deep position is the most solid (PG or SG). I also envision Basil only getting about 5+ minutes per game, and Taylor getting even fewer. My opinion is our team is 8-9 deep for the majority of the season, and the 9th player is either Basil or Taylor based on opposing team matchups. The 9th player will only get 5min per game.

my 2cents.
Go Boilers!!!
 
SDBoiler1 said:
He is a good passer, but his handles aren't close to what we need at that position. If the opposition puts anyone relatively quick on him he will get picked clean A LOT.

If Purdue decides to use him at PG, Purdue is going to see full-court pressing from just about everyone.
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This is exactly correct.
 
SDBoiler1 said:
He is a good passer, but his handles aren't close to what we need at that position. If the opposition puts anyone relatively quick on him he will get picked clean A LOT.

If Purdue decides to use him at PG, Purdue is going to see full-court pressing from just about everyone.
Click to expand...



The opposition full court presure was interesting last season. As Octeus grew more comfortable throughout the season, naturally, our & his play showed it in wins & better play. We lost a couple of games early because of turnovers, by several players. Hammons started playing great/better & better, we still had turnovers though, but some teams gave up after the first half or part way through the second half of several games on their extended presure/full court presure, even as the games were close, either way. Now, we did a very bad job dealing with that ball presure [although better in second half of season]. I thought, especially in the second half of the season, & in the 2nd half of many games, [even though we didn't necessairly burn them offensively, because of their presure on us/the ball] they gave up on their extended/full court presure of us prematurely. I thought several teams, throughout the season [especially first half of season] could & should have beaten us, if only they had full court pressed us more, in more games, & more throughout the game. No matter who the guards for Purdue are this season, if I were the opposition, I'd be sure to press them as much as possible, especially early on. Like former Iowa Coach Tom Davis teams did, run several players [sometimes in waves] at Purdue's guards, with intense presure, especially on the PG/guard with the ball, until they broke/turned the ball over. I'd do that to them until either Purdue proved, not only can Purdue beat the opposition press, but make the opposition sorry they tried it in the first place. Make no mistake about it, the opposition will test our guards this season, early & often. We must be prepaired.
 
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