Think Jim Chaney next year
- Thread starter pb1941
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The man drove me nuts sometimes, but nobody is perfect and I could get on board with him coming back.
Bob Stitt....Head Coach at Montana and known as an innovator on offense!
I am with you that he drove me nuts, too. But, in the big picture he was the BEST OC we have had in the last 20 years. Tiller's offense took a dip when Chaney left. He did have the advantage of excellent position coaches on the offensive side, but that can be repeated.
Chaney was blamed for Purdue failing to get over the hump. I think he did a great job while here. Every coach will make decisions you disagree with. Tiller baffled me by asking for trick plays at big moments.
I know Nord became terrible, but I really enjoyed his offense in year 1. It was when Hope freaked out after the QB injuries that we switched to the read option. Year 1 with Elliott I thought we had a nice balanced attack that used the whole field.
Later Nord and now Shoop - EVERYTHING is schemed for the outside. The defense can nearly ignore the middle 3rd of the field and never have to pay for it.
I know Nord became terrible, but I really enjoyed his offense in year 1. It was when Hope freaked out after the QB injuries that we switched to the read option. Year 1 with Elliott I thought we had a nice balanced attack that used the whole field.
Later Nord and now Shoop - EVERYTHING is schemed for the outside. The defense can nearly ignore the middle 3rd of the field and never have to pay for it.
The OC is always the least liked member of the football team. I don't care who it is, we will have countless posts every game day on here by folks complaining that we are "too predictable", "playing to not lose", running "too much" or "not enough", etc.
Do you think that is true at all schools or just here with our recent lack of success with OCs?
That everyone hated (too bad we can't go back and look at the posts on this board about him).
I guess time must heal all wounds. People used to eviscerate that guy on these forums. Although, I think even Mike Martz or Don Coryell would be "the devil" if they were our offensive coordinator.
The line isn't opening holes between the tackles. And that is without the linebackers supporting the D-line inside. I don't know if it is the spacing or the O-linemen just can't get it done. I don't believe we have had a tackle in type runner since Alstott. So the running game to me is one-dimensional to the outside. So they give the QB the choice of how to complete the play. Therefore, this is what we have. My belief is that if they could get our O-line into blocking schemes that are more well rounded and well executed, our offense would become a handful for even the very good defenses. Good coaches like Paterno and Daryl Royal aren't available anymore so we are stuck with this staff. I don't believe at the end of the year and CDH is either kept or let go, Purdue will end up with an offensive line geneus that can get this done. Those guys are already employed and unavailable. Our only chance is for an unknown young energetic coach to come in or develop from our current staff that gets a good chance to excel. That is where Urban Meyer came from. I respect him a lot. This also reminds me of Ron Myer doing this job for Mollenchoff. Sorry for misspellings.
Yes, Yes and Hell Yes. Idk why we'd settle for an "above average OC" when we could have an innovator as a HC. Stitt is my absolute favorite to take over here, behind him I'd take a guy like Scott Frost (OC Oregon) or an unknown like Willie Fritz (HC Georgia Southern).
About Fritz:
"Willie played defensive back at Pittsburg State and coached there and at Coffeyville College as an assistant. As a head coach, Fritz turned a Blinn College program that had gone 5-24-1 in the previous season into a national powerhouse. In four seasons (1993-1996) under Fritz, Blinn, a Texas juco, went 39-5-1 and won two national titles.
Fritz then spent 13 seasons at Div. II Central Missouri, where he went 97-47 and took the Mules to heights it never had accomplished. Fritz then went 40-15 in four seasons at Sam Houston State and made it to the Football Championship Subdivision national-title game in 2011 and 2012.
Georgia Southern is in its first season in the Football Bowl Subdivision. Fritz’s Eagles (7-2) lead the Sun Belt Conference and their only nonconference losses were by one point at North Carolina State and by four points at Georgia Tech.
Schools normally suffer in the transition year, but Georgia Southern has improved and ranks No. 1 in the nation in rushing yards (3,624), yards per carry (7.32) and rushing touchdowns (46).
Fritz had the guts to veer away from the “Ham Bone,” triple-option attack Georgia Tech coach Paul Johnson brought to Georgia Southern 30 years ago when he was the offensive coordinator. Fritz uses a run-based spread offense, which shares some elements of his Georgia Southern predecessors’ offenses. Fritz's final Sam Houston State team ranked fourth in the FCS in scoring (41.1 points per game) and sixth in rushing."
But Stitt is absolutely the first call we should make. He's said he wants to see how his offense does in D-1 football. I'd give him a call and tell me to name his price if I were Burke. He's the definition of an innovator. Guys like Sumlin, Dana Holgorsen, Sonny Dukes, Kliff Kingsbury, Mike Leach are all big admirers of Stitt.
whomever is coaching up at E. Wash isn't doing a bad job.
I see your point, but the problem with our current OC is that has been the mantra for him since he got here I do believe.
Jerod Void was a damn good between the tackle runner. The backfield with him and Brandon Jones was a great tandem.
How I long for us approach a hump....much less get over one....
Joey Harris was the most talented RB I've seen at Purdue since Alstott. He had track speed and I think people forget that he was pretty powerful, 6'1" 210-215 lbs. He wasn't easy to take down.
I still wonder what the 2003 team (Tiller's most talented from top to bottom imo) would have done if he hadn't been ruled academically ineligible that summer. Void was decent in all facets but wasn't dynamic like Harris (he was also pretty inexperienced that year). I could easily see the BG and OSU games going Purdue's way and finishing 11-1 but that's just another one of Purdue's 'what if' situations from the past.
I still wonder what the 2003 team (Tiller's most talented from top to bottom imo) would have done if he hadn't been ruled academically ineligible that summer. Void was decent in all facets but wasn't dynamic like Harris (he was also pretty inexperienced that year). I could easily see the BG and OSU games going Purdue's way and finishing 11-1 but that's just another one of Purdue's 'what if' situations from the past.
I really liked the offensive product Purdue put on the field while Jim Chaney was OC. The trick plays may not always have seemed to be the best choice at the time, especially when they didn't work, but they paid dividends in other ways - defenses always had to be on the look-out for them which may have been one reason why Purdue had such stellar offenses in those years. But mostly, Purdue did a great job of spreading out the ball and always distributing it to someone who could take it 5-10+ yards on every play. Our WRs and TEs ran tight routes and were in sync with the QBs of that era. Whatever was going on just plain worked, and without us having to rely on brute force (power running game) against some of the most physical defenses in the country. If I recall, Purdue was in the top 5 offenses in the country by several measures many or most of the years JC was OC, which is even more impressive considering the strength of our conference. So yes, I'd like more of that please.
Who cares who our offensive coordinator is? The football "experts" on here will blame them for our shortcomings like they always do no matter how good he is.
Seriously though...not to defend Shoop as I think he has made some very questionable play calls at times (especially 3rd and short against Marshall)...but Chaney had just a bit more talent to work with at the QB position than what Shoop has been working with the first few years at Purdue so far. QB's make all the difference in the world in College Football. Some will argue that it's Shoop's job to create the talent by coaching them up...but there is only so much you can do with young QB's unless they are future NFL'ers like Brees and Orton.
Brees is one of the best QB's to ever play, and his accuracy was ridiculous. Orton was a top 10 QB recruit that when healthy was front runner for the Heisman his senior year. Both guys had pretty decent offensive lines to work with. I remember being very upset with Chaney and most of the fan base wanting to run him out of town back in the day.
Shoop has had Rob Henry, a true Freshman Etling who was thrown into the wolves behind a terrible offensive line, and now Appleby who seems to not be able to find a 2nd receiver when the first one is not open. Considering how young and QB deficient we've been under Shoop, I'd say it would be difficult for Chaney to have done any better the past few years. We have scored over 30 both games this year and have left a lot of points on the board because of bad QB play.
I'm willing to see how the rest of this year goes now that Appleby seems to actually know the offense, especially once we put in a few more wrinkles against the better teams to judge Shoop.
Brees is one of the best QB's to ever play, and his accuracy was ridiculous. Orton was a top 10 QB recruit that when healthy was front runner for the Heisman his senior year. Both guys had pretty decent offensive lines to work with. I remember being very upset with Chaney and most of the fan base wanting to run him out of town back in the day.
Shoop has had Rob Henry, a true Freshman Etling who was thrown into the wolves behind a terrible offensive line, and now Appleby who seems to not be able to find a 2nd receiver when the first one is not open. Considering how young and QB deficient we've been under Shoop, I'd say it would be difficult for Chaney to have done any better the past few years. We have scored over 30 both games this year and have left a lot of points on the board because of bad QB play.
I'm willing to see how the rest of this year goes now that Appleby seems to actually know the offense, especially once we put in a few more wrinkles against the better teams to judge Shoop.
OK, I get what you're saying, but inTiller/Chaney's first year the QB was Billy Dicken. A guy who was pretty so-so under the previous coach but elevated his game tremendously once Tiller/Chaney took over. Brees wasn't that highly regarded out of HS - he was good but questionable enough that we were about his best offer. I often wonder whether a big part of the reason he developed into the NFL player he is, is because of throwing the ball 30-50 times per game in a really effective, QB-centric college system. It's the coaching and system that developed Dicken, allowed Brees to achieve his college potential, and brought in Orton as a recruit. None of that could have happened under the previous or any later coaching staff we've had.
Then look at the long list of record-setting receivers and tight-ends during that time period. Daniels, Stubblefield, Stratton, etc. etc. etc. - those guys were among the most effective in college - much more high-performing than their rankings coming out of HS (I don't recall any of the really effective receivers being top 3 or 4 at their position in HS). And as was said before - the OL was very strong but it's not like Purdue built that line from 5* O-linemen out of HS either.
This is the only kind of system I've ever seen Purdue have any success with. Even when we had all-world running back Mike Alstott, Purdue sucked. There is one way and one way only that I've seen (in my 3.5-decade lifetime) Purdue can compete with the physicality and talent level of the Big Ten - through precision timing and passing routes. Nearly all the strong historic Purdue teams that come to mind were pass-centric. Hence, the moniker "Cradle of Quarterbacks".
That's not to say all we have to do is have Appleby put the ball in the air 40+ times a game - we must have a coaching staff with an identity based on proven success in the passing game. You could tell that was at least on Burke's mind during the last hiring process, because most of the other candidates were known for passing offenses. For whatever reason we didn't get one of them.
I'd be all about having Chaney as next HC, with Tiller as a Gene Keady-like advisor.
Then look at the long list of record-setting receivers and tight-ends during that time period. Daniels, Stubblefield, Stratton, etc. etc. etc. - those guys were among the most effective in college - much more high-performing than their rankings coming out of HS (I don't recall any of the really effective receivers being top 3 or 4 at their position in HS). And as was said before - the OL was very strong but it's not like Purdue built that line from 5* O-linemen out of HS either.
This is the only kind of system I've ever seen Purdue have any success with. Even when we had all-world running back Mike Alstott, Purdue sucked. There is one way and one way only that I've seen (in my 3.5-decade lifetime) Purdue can compete with the physicality and talent level of the Big Ten - through precision timing and passing routes. Nearly all the strong historic Purdue teams that come to mind were pass-centric. Hence, the moniker "Cradle of Quarterbacks".
That's not to say all we have to do is have Appleby put the ball in the air 40+ times a game - we must have a coaching staff with an identity based on proven success in the passing game. You could tell that was at least on Burke's mind during the last hiring process, because most of the other candidates were known for passing offenses. For whatever reason we didn't get one of them.
I'd be all about having Chaney as next HC, with Tiller as a Gene Keady-like advisor.
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I may be wrong on this, but wasn't Drew hurt in High School and therefore not highly considered by many?
Drew was hurt while in high school and a lot of programs pulled offers and potential offers because of it. Tiller stuck with him and that's why he came to Purdue along with the history.
I've always thought that Dicken had had shoulder problems his first couple years at Purdue and wasn't able to really be effective and stay healthy and even switched positions at one time. When Tiller got to Purdue, Dicken was healthy enough and smart enough to pick up the offense and run it effectively.
We also had very good defense a couple of years while Chaney was the r/c and Spack was the d/c. He knew talent and Tiller knew how to coach.
izakman, johniedoeboiler, and pb1941 - yes. All true. Still, our offense over-performed during those years. It was awesome. Spack put a lot of guys in the NFL and I don't think we've had defenses since him that performed as well overall. But defense wasn't as consistent - the passing offense was our strength and identity. That's what put 70k butts in Ross Ade, got us on Sports Center regularly, and made the difference that took Purdue to the Rose Bowl. I think it's no coincidence that the only other Purdue team to make a Rose Bowl was also headed by a great Purdue QB in 1967: All-American Bob Griese.
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If Jim Chaney was so amazing in the current era of football, Arkansas and Tennessee would of been gangbusters the past several years. Shoop doesn't have the luxury of surprising teams with a new spread offense that now every single team runs in college football.
People forget Purdue was only 8-4 the Rose Bowl year and we were in a 3 way tie for first. We weren't exactly the typical 11-1 or 10-2 BIG10 championship team that dominated. Danny Hope won 7 games in a season.
We can't win with Austin Appleby throwing 50 times a game like Brees did. Put Appleby in Brees' place on that 2000 team and we would have been lucky to win 5 games at most that year. Not to rag on Appleby, but Brees was a top 3 college QB at the time (now a top 10 of all time NFL).
Stratton, Stubblefield and Daniels were successful because of who was throwing them the ball.
You also conveniently forget that that 2000 team could easily have been 10-2 were it not for some horrendous special teams gaffes against Notre Dame and Penn State that year. We lost both games by less than a FG. Doug Downing was a horrible ST coach.
You are missing Five Weights point- in the last half century, purdue has only been really good with an NFL QB under center, the only exception being dicken in 1997, because we just cannot consistently run the ball against the better defenses, like the one we face today.
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