Our nation's COVID-19 response is a disaster !

[Tony79]

As I’ve said on here a number of times, I am ambivalent about who ends up in charge. I’m just tired of the constant bitching and blaming about every single issue no matter how big or small.

I can’t wait for this election to be over. I wish it was tomorrow.

 

[PurdueFan1]

View embedded media

I literally just got done watching that video clip on another site. We are doomed.

 

[PurdueFan1]

As I’ve said on here a number of times, I am ambivalent about who ends up in charge. I’m just tired of the constant bitching and blaming about every single issue no matter how big or small.

I can’t wait for this election to be over. I wish it was tomorrow.

Oh the irony of your post. Seriously.

 

[Tony79]

Fan1, I’m probably more of a Republican than not although I’ve voted for many Dems particularly at the state and local level, but I highly doubt if many of the attack dogs on here are at some Mensa level compared to others. For instance, I happen to know who one of the main attack dogs is on here where he works and his major at Purdue. He’s no rocket scientist believe me.

 

[BuilderBob6]

Fan1, I’m probably more of a Republican than not although I’ve voted for many Dems particularly at the state and local level, but I highly doubt if many of the attack dogs on here are at some Mensa level compared to others. For instance, I happen to know who one of the main attack dogs is on here where he works and his major at Purdue. He’s no rocket scientist believe me.

Why do you regularly make associations between people's intelligence and what they post? Everybody that posts thinks they're right or they wouldn't post. Some of us are more forceful or direct about it, doesn't mean we think we're more intelligent. It usually means we've done our homework and the other party hasn't.

Would you rather see more posts that consist mostly of overused, partisan catchphrases like TDS and orange man bad?

 

[Tony79]

Because of the constant “all Republicans are stupid” mantra on here. Here’s a quick run down on a handful of my friends who are Republicans: PU engineer who started his own business employing around 40 people; board certified ED physician who started an ED group that covered 10 hospital in IN; quadruple boarded pulmonologist who used to run the critical care fellowship program at IU health; former president of one of the largest manufacturers in IN with 1.3 billion in sales that employed roughly 3,500 people in IN, Ohio and Alabama.

These are obviously not the stupid people the attack dogs on here stereotype.

 

[PurdueFan1]

Because of the constant “all Republicans are stupid” mantra on here. Here’s a quick run down on a handful of my friends who are Republicans: PU engineer who started his own business employing around 40 people; board certified ED physician who started an ED group that covered 10 hospital in IN; quadruple boarded pulmonologist who used to run the critical care fellowship program at IU health; former president of one of the largest manufacturers in IN with 1.3 billion in sales that employed roughly 3,500 people in IN, Ohio and Alabama.

These are obviously not the stupid people the attack dogs on here stereotype.

I could not give two shits what your Republican friends do for a living. If they support this administration, they’re garbage.

 

[70boiler]

View embedded media

Makes sense to me...why not? 35% of America is on board. Might as well throw in some alien escaped from Roswell is a Chinese operative hired by the libs to help Antifa by passing on Covid.

 

[MJ-79Boiler]

Dozens of secret service agents now quarantining after Tulsa - The carnage is just going to continue. He has clearly stopped trying to "control" it. - Doesn't know how and wont let experts handle it.

https://www.chron.com/news/article/Dozens-of-Secret-Service-officers-and-agents-told-15364507.php

PS Texas and Florida now have the 5th and 6th most cases in the nation and continuing to move up. (Both states look to be out of control now) Without wearing masks, it's just going to get worse.

 

[PA Boilermakers]

I could not give two shits what your Republican friends do for a living. If they support this administration, they’re garbage.

PurdueFan1: "I support paying as much tax to the government as possible since I trust the government to make better decisions on how to spend my money than I can!"

PurdueFan1: "I support trade agreements for our country that provide incentives for companies based here to move operations to foreign countries so I can buy more plastic crap at a cheaper price!"

PurdueFan1: "I support our military being the policeman of the world with bases all over the world since that is what we have done since WW2 and it has worked out so well for us! I support the taxpayers of our country paying for this so that other countries around the world can invest more of their taxes into social programs!"

PurdueFan1: "I support our country to provide a large percentage of the funds to global organizations such as the United Nations, NATO and the WHO!"

PurdueFan1: "Instead of helping poorer countries develop their economies, I support an unending stream of immigrants into our country since I place a high value on keeping the wages of those at the bottom of our economy as low as possible!"

Yep, you're correct. Anyone who wouldn't support viewpoints like yours are "garbage"

 

[PurdueFan1]

PurdueFan1: "I support paying as much tax to the government as possible since I trust the government to make better decisions on how to spend my money than I can!"

PurdueFan1: "I support trade agreements for our country that provide incentives for companies based here to move operations to foreign countries so I can buy more plastic crap at a cheaper price!"

PurdueFan1: "I support our military being the policeman of the world with bases all over the world since that is what we have done since WW2 and it has worked out so well for us! I support the taxpayers of our country paying for this so that other countries around the world can invest more of their taxes into social programs!"

PurdueFan1: "I support our country to provide a large percentage of the funds to global organizations such as the United Nations, NATO and the WHO!"

PurdueFan1: "Instead of helping poorer countries develop their economies, I support an unending stream of immigrants into our country since I place a high value on keeping the wages of those at the bottom of our economy as low as possible!"

Yep, you're correct. Anyone who wouldn't support viewpoints like yours are "garbage"

PABoilermaker: I support an administration that doesn’t give two shits about the citizens of its country and doesn’t care about a raging pandemic with 120k dead and counting. A chunk of the government reps are blatantly racist and pander to the racists that they represent.

Your other statements are fairly factually inaccurate so not worth my time responding.

But go ahead and keep on keeping on with your head up your ass dude.

 

[BuilderBob6]

 

[Boilermaker03]

2,000,000 cases, 115,000 dead, 44.2 Million filing for unemployment, hospitals in the south starting to fill up, people losing healthcare, red ink in businesses, the market dropping and a Harvard doctor is now predicting 200,000 deaths by Sept. This is just GREAT, huh ?

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/jun/11/dr-ashish-jha-harvard-health-expert-says-us-will-h/

I still think the estimates will be on the low side, but they are now starting to get realistic.

You're acting as if we wouldn't have the massive unemployment, or the covid outbreak/deaths if someone else was in charge. What do you want, to stop the spread or to have low unemployment? You can't have both. I think you forget that "experts" early on thought we'd have 2 million deaths from Covid. We are a LONG ways away from that.

Stop using every single bad number that came from something that wasn't created here and blame it on our leadership. Seriously. We have 330 million people in this country. At what point does personal responsibility kick in? Or would you rather always suckle at the tit of a single person?

 

[PurdueFan1]

You're acting as if we wouldn't have the massive unemployment, or the covid outbreak/deaths if someone else was in charge. What do you want, to stop the spread or to have low unemployment? You can't have both. I think you forget that "experts" early on thought we'd have 2 million deaths from Covid. We are a LONG ways away from that.

Stop using every single bad number that came from something that wasn't created here and blame it on our leadership. Seriously. We have 330 million people in this country. At what point does personal responsibility kick in? Or would you rather always suckle at the tit of a single person?

How much weight have you lost chasing after those always-moving goalposts dude? Mercy.

 

[Boilermaker03]

How much weight have you lost chasing after those always-moving goalposts dude? Mercy.

What? Moving goal posts? How are my goal posts the ones that are moving when people here are using numbers that would correlate negatively with one another and use them all as proof of someone being bad? Seriously. If you locked down completely, we'd have a lot more unemployment and a lot less covid spread. If we didn't lock down at all, we'd have a lot more covid spread and very little unemployment. You can't have no spread and no unemployment. How is that ME moving the goal posts?

 

[PurdueFan1]

What? Moving goal posts? How are my goal posts the ones that are moving when people here are using numbers that would correlate negatively with one another and use them all as proof of someone being bad? Seriously. If you locked down completely, we'd have a lot more unemployment and a lot less covid spread. If we didn't lock down at all, we'd have a lot more covid spread and very little unemployment. You can't have no spread and no unemployment. How is that ME moving the goal posts?

This isn’t even remotely true as evidenced by plenty of other countries who have navigated this without destroying their economy to boot. But keep on keeping on with the ignorance.

 

[Boilermaker03]

This isn’t even remotely true as evidenced by plenty of other countries who have navigated this without destroying their economy to boot. But keep on keeping on with the ignorance.

LOL, ok. Sorry I forgot, you can cross compare any country to any country. There aren't any differences. Good point.

 

[PurdueFan1]

LOL, ok. Sorry I forgot, you can cross compare any country to any country. There aren't any differences. Good point.

Of course there are differences. First one being those countries are run by competent people who listened to doctors, scientists and economists and put a comprehensive plan in place.

 

[Boilermaker03]

Of course there are differences. First one being those countries are run by competent people who listened to doctors, scientists and economists and put a comprehensive plan in place.

Which places are you specifically talking about?

 

[PurdueFan1]

Which places are you specifically talking about?

Sigh. Germany. South Korea. New Zealand. Japan. For starters. Not that difficult to do some basic research dude.

 

[MJ-79Boiler]

You're acting as if we wouldn't have the massive unemployment, or the covid outbreak/deaths if someone else was in charge. What do you want, to stop the spread or to have low unemployment? You can't have both. I think you forget that "experts" early on thought we'd have 2 million deaths from Covid. We are a LONG ways away from that.

Stop using every single bad number that came from something that wasn't created here and blame it on our leadership. Seriously. We have 330 million people in this country. At what point does personal responsibility kick in? Or would you rather always suckle at the tit of a single person?

Am I saying someone could have done better on ALL those issues? YOU BET I AM ! Hell, I could have done better and I am just a lowly 6 sigma process control person who did a lot of project management. You want me to make it simple: WEAR MASKS and have a LEADER who is willing to model that behavior !

IF . . you doubt that . . ask yourself a few questions

1.) How can South Korea have 30 or less cases a day while we have over 30,000 a day? &
2.) How can Italy go from apocalyptic to 200 cases a day, yet the GREAT United States, with all of our resources, is now out of control. The BIG difference between the U.S. and them is THEY are wear masks !

I am also sure you can appreciate, not all "experts" have the same qualifications. I have been saying sine APRIL that the 2 million will be way too low ! I said 5 million by Sept - we are now half way and the states which I thought would contribute to the next surge is happening before our eyes (ie The south) This will be tough to hear but . . Trump has NOT hired or used the best experts and certainly now any with any spine (until just recently, which was months too late !) Professionals should DO the RIGHT THING all the time, and let the chips fall where they will - ESPECIALLY when American lives are at stake ! !

When will people understand that IF you want people to participate in a major change (like wearing masks, socially distancing, etc.. it HAS to . . let me repeat . . it HAS TO start at the TOP. Our country has far too many uneducated people who will follow false prophets because they are desperate for a change in their lives. Trump is just leading them to the slaughter. (a pied piper if you will - It's a hoax, the flu is more deadly, drink bleach, you will be ok) Sadly, we do NOT have a leader in the white house, just a blowhard !

 

[Boilermaker03]

Sigh. Germany. South Korea. New Zealand. Japan. For starters. Not that difficult to do some basic research dude.

Well Germany for is having plenty of issues economically.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/08/german-economy-during-coronavirus-lockdown-saw-worst-month-ever.html

Basically, your opining for more government control. Their unemployment is low because their government is functioning in a quasi Fascist manner (the real definition of Fascism where the government tells business what to do). In America we are still relatively more free in our markets than any of those countries you listed. Personally, I think we need to loosen some of the control in our markets, but that's another discussion. When business opens back up, jobs will bounce back fast. We already saw some of that this last month when experts were expecting to see 8 million more lost jobs and instead we saw an increase in jobs by 2 million.

What we do is just another way of handling the problem. I wouldn't want to give up our economic freedom for the feeling of safety in the rare instance of a pandemic. I value freedom above all else. If you think we should have more control then I don't know what to tell you.

I'm sure the story isn't that different for those other countries.

 

[PurdueFan1]

Well Germany for is having plenty of issues economically.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/08/german-economy-during-coronavirus-lockdown-saw-worst-month-ever.html

Basically, your opining for more government control. Their unemployment is low because their government is functioning in a quasi Fascist manner (the real definition of Fascism where the government tells business what to do). In America we are still relatively more free in our markets than any of those countries you listed. Personally, I think we need to loosen some of the control in our markets, but that's another discussion. When business opens back up, jobs will bounce back fast. We already saw some of that this last month when experts were expecting to see 8 million more lost jobs and instead we saw an increase in jobs by 2 million.

What we do is just another way of handling the problem. I wouldn't want to give up our economic freedom for the feeling of safety in the rare instance of a pandemic. I value freedom above all else. If you think we should have more control then I don't know what to tell you.

I'm sure the story isn't that different for those other countries.

Psst, in case you haven’t noticed, especially because you always seem to be about two months behind, cases are skyrocketing. Some states are already shutting things down again. Kind of contradicts your kick the doors open mentality.

Also, wearing a mask isn’t impinging on anyone’s freedom. That’s the easiest way right now to stem
The tide but too many people, including many on here, act like wearing a mask is the equivalent of being a sissy. The problem is that people aren’t wearing masks and acting like everything is fine, when it’s not. The economy won’t recover until people smarten the hell up, and that starts at the top.

 

[Boilermaker03]

Am I saying someone could have done better on ALL those issues? YOU BET I AM ! Hell, I could have done better and I am just a lowly 6 sigma process control person who did a lot of project management. You want me to make it simple: WEAR MASKS and have a LEADER who is willing to model that behavior !

IF . . you doubt that . . ask yourself a few questions

1.) How can South Korea have 30 or less cases a day while we have over 30,000 a day? &
2.) How can Italy go from apocalyptic to 200 cases a day, yet the GREAT United States, with all of our resources, is now out of control. The BIG difference between the U.S. and them is THEY are wear masks !

I am also sure you can appreciate, not all "experts" have the same qualifications. I have been saying sine APRIL that the 2 million will be way too low ! I said 5 million by Sept - we are now half way and the states which I thought would contribute to the next surge is happening before our eyes (ie The south) This will be tough to hear but . . Trump has NOT hired or used the best experts and certainly now any with any spine (until just recently, which was months too late !) Professionals should DO the RIGHT THING all the time, and let the chips fall where they will - ESPECIALLY when American lives are at stake ! !

When will people understand that IF you want people to participate in a major change (like wearing masks, socially distancing, etc.. it HAS to . . let me repeat . . it HAS TO start at the TOP. Our country has far too many uneducated people who will follow false prophets because they are desperate for a change in their lives. Trump is just leading them to the slaughter. (a pied piper if you will - It's a hoax, the flu is more deadly, drink bleach, you will be ok) Sadly, we do NOT have a leader in the white house, just a blowhard !

There is a lot of nonsense in there that I won't be able to get to all of it because I have to run for a bit. You could have done better? Yeah I bet. If only you could be dictator for a day right? Bleach? Really? Nobody has recommended drinking bleach. At least nobody of importance.

We are a LOT bigger than South Korea for one. It's a lot easier to control something smaller. You'd be a lot better to compare a single state of similar size to them vs the entire USA.

As far as the number of cases. I have no doubt there will be more spread. In fact we knew there would be. The lockdown was always about slowing the spread, not stopping it. It was to prevent hospitals from being over run. Which we succeed in doing. Time will tell how things fare going forward.

If you're so worried about people dying then why don't I hear people getting mad at those states that put covid positive people into nursing homes? A lot of people died that didn't have to because of those idiotic policies.

 

[Boilermaker03]

Psst, in case you haven’t noticed, especially because you always seem to be about two months behind, cases are skyrocketing. Some states are already shutting things down again. Kind of contradicts your kick the doors open mentality.

Also, wearing a mask isn’t impinging on anyone’s freedom. That’s the easiest way right now to stem
The tide but too many people, including many on here, act like wearing a mask is the equivalent of being a sissy. The problem is that people aren’t wearing masks and acting like everything is fine, when it’s not. The economy won’t recover until people smarten the hell up, and that starts at the top.

I never made any comment about current rates. Way to ascertain what I really think before asking. I've never dissented over mask wearing. So again, why don't you ask before assuming.

 

[PurdueFan1]

I never made any comment about current rates. Way to ascertain what I really think before asking. I've never dissented over mask wearing. So again, why don't you ask before assuming.

I never said you were one of the folks not wearing a mask, so you can stop playing the victim game.

 

[MJ-79Boiler]

Well Germany for is having plenty of issues economically.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/08/german-economy-during-coronavirus-lockdown-saw-worst-month-ever.html

Basically, your opining for more government control. Their unemployment is low because their government is functioning in a quasi Fascist manner (the real definition of Fascism where the government tells business what to do). In America we are still relatively more free in our markets than any of those countries you listed. Personally, I think we need to loosen some of the control in our markets, but that's another discussion. When business opens back up, jobs will bounce back fast. .

Facism? Seriously. Why do people trying to defend Trump's action always resort to name calling like some 3rd grade bully. Should the opposition to his views start labeling all his supporters racists, nazis, facists or just evil?

When a country is in the middle of a pandemic, war, etc.. YES the government NEEDS to tell businesses what to do and hence the reason prior politicians saw the merit in creating laws which allow this to happen.

As for our economy bouncing back and loosening controls in the markets, we have been doing that since May. How is that working for you? Sure some jobs bounced back initially when we did that and NOW . . we are shutting a number of them back down.

Each time we do that, more and more people will NOT see their job come back any time soon (The Republicans no longer want to provide stimulus checks) Lost on many people is that we saw 1.5 Million NEW people filing for unemployment this week. Until people start wearing masks, what we are seeing in the economy is a "dead cat bounce"

 

[PurdueFan1]

Facism? Seriously. Why do people trying to defend Trump's action always resort to name calling like some 3rd grade bully. Should the opposition to his views start labeling all his supporters racists, nazis, facists or just evil?

When a country is in the middle of a pandemic, war, etc.. YES the government NEEDS to tell businesses what to do and hence the reason prior politicians saw the merit in creating laws which allow this to happen.

As for our economy bouncing back and loosening controls in the markets, we have been doing that since May. How is that working for you? Sure some jobs bounced back initially when we did that and NOW . . we are shutting a number of them back down.

Each time we do that, more and more people will NOT see their job come back any time soon (The Republicans no longer want to provide stimulus checks) Lost on many people is that we saw 1.5 Million NEW people filing for unemployment this week. Until people start wearing masks, what we are seeing in the economy is a "dead cat bounce"

Oh and let’s not forget that Trump is trying to totally kill Obamacare in the middle of a pandemic with zero replacement plan in sight. Another promise unfulfilled. But he’s golfing today so there’s that.

 

[TMan92]

There is a lot of nonsense in there that I won't be able to get to all of it because I have to run for a bit. You could have done better? Yeah I bet. If only you could be dictator for a day right? Bleach? Really? Nobody has recommended drinking bleach. At least nobody of importance.

We are a LOT bigger than South Korea for one. It's a lot easier to control something smaller. You'd be a lot better to compare a single state of similar size to them vs the entire USA.

As far as the number of cases. I have no doubt there will be more spread. In fact we knew there would be. The lockdown was always about slowing the spread, not stopping it. It was to prevent hospitals from being over run. Which we succeed in doing. Time will tell how things fare going forward.

If you're so worried about people dying then why don't I hear people getting mad at those states that put covid positive people into nursing homes? A lot of people died that didn't have to because of those idiotic policies.

Compare the response of the entire EU. A group of completely autonomous countries with a larger population. The funny thing, they have stated they followed the plans developed by our CDC

 

[Boilermaker03]

I never said you were one of the folks not wearing a mask, so you can stop playing the victim game.

I wasn't playing a victim game. I was just asking why you were bringing that up to me when I never said otherwise.

 

[Boilermaker03]

Facism? Seriously. Why do people trying to defend Trump's action always resort to name calling like some 3rd grade bully. Should the opposition to his views start labeling all his supporters racists, nazis, facists or just evil?

When a country is in the middle of a pandemic, war, etc.. YES the government NEEDS to tell businesses what to do and hence the reason prior politicians saw the merit in creating laws which allow this to happen.

As for our economy bouncing back and loosening controls in the markets, we have been doing that since May. How is that working for you? Sure some jobs bounced back initially when we did that and NOW . . we are shutting a number of them back down.

Each time we do that, more and more people will NOT see their job come back any time soon (The Republicans no longer want to provide stimulus checks) Lost on many people is that we saw 1.5 Million NEW people filing for unemployment this week. Until people start wearing masks, what we are seeing in the economy is a "dead cat bounce"

Not sure where you're going with the bold section above. I said they were using quasi Fascist policies. That's the reality. Fascism was a goverrnment ideology, just like Capitalism, Socialism, Communism. Not sure how you then jumped to what you wrote.

 

[Boilermaker03]

Oh and let’s not forget that Trump is trying to totally kill Obamacare in the middle of a pandemic with zero replacement plan in sight. Another promise unfulfilled. But he’s golfing today so there’s that.

See, this tells me all you care about is finding stuff to be pissed about. Show me any president that has fulfilled ALL of their campaign promises. Yes, he hasn't done many of his promises. He made a lot of them. He's completed a lot of them. Just as much if not more than any president before him.

 

[Boilermaker03]

Compare the response of the entire EU. A group of completely autonomous countries with a larger population. The funny thing, they have stated they followed the plans developed by our CDC

View embedded media

This is misleading. The US has a vast greater amount of testing that has been done. More tests are going to provide more positive results. This is also from Our World Data:

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-deaths-covid-19?time=2020-01-17..&country=European Union~USA

Then compare the deaths to confirmed cases:

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-cases-covid-19?country=European Union~USA

This shows that their total number of cases are probably close to ours, but they haven't tested enough. Unless you're going to argue their death rate is vastly higher than ours.

Then the other issue is how are they (the other countries) verifying their Covid deaths vs the way the US is confirming theirs. I've seen people make a pretty solid argument that our total deaths are probably over stated by nearly 25% as is shown in the below article.

https://justthenews.com/politics-po...nting-guidelines-colorados-confirmed-covid-19

 

[PurdueFan1]

See, this tells me all you care about is finding stuff to be pissed about. Show me any president that has fulfilled ALL of their campaign promises. Yes, he hasn't done many of his promises. He made a lot of them. He's completed a lot of them. Just as much if not more than any president before him.

Everyone should be pissed about this. Trump just tweeted again about Obamacare in the last day or so, in the middle of a pandemic, and has offered zero in terms of a replacement. He’s made a huge goddamned deal about it, promised a beautiful plan, and has given us two things: jack and shit.

Look, I get it, you’re in denial and more than willing to go down with the ship. But is this the hill you really wanna die on?

 

[Boilermaker03]

Everyone should be pissed about this. Trump just tweeted again about Obamacare in the last day or so, in the middle of a pandemic, and has offered zero in terms of a replacement. He’s made a huge goddamned deal about it, promised a beautiful plan, and has given us two things: jack and shit.

Look, I get it, you’re in denial and more than willing to go down with the ship. But is this the hill you really wanna die on?

I didn't realize that we should do nothing else. Nothing else matters right now. You can't because of the rona.

 

[PurdueFan1]

I figured as much.

 

[70boiler]

These are hospitalization rates through June 20 and I am quite certain that they have increased in the interim, and they are certainly not simply related to increased testing. It's really time for the Administration to stop with the nonsense and actually address this.

 

[PurdueFan1]

I didn't realize that we should do nothing else. Nothing else matters right now. You can't because of the rona.

WTF are you even talking about. Your orange boy is the one going mad about Obamacare right now, so it’s fitting to discuss it, is it not?

 

[Bethboilerfan]

The sad thing is that Trump is insistent on great protection against COVID for himself not that I disagree with great protection for the President but that is proof that he knows how bad this pandemic is. One of his friends died of COVID plus he has said he is a “germaphobe” He won’t wear a mask because he doesn’t care about or have sympathy or empathy with the rest of us.

 

[BoilerBF]

View embedded media

Definitely remember "Florida will be the next New York" predictions from March.

New York Covid 19 Deaths per Capita 150
Florida Covid 19 Deaths per Capita 16