OT: OSU URBAN MEYER - fans and morality

[Do Dah Day]

Quotes from OSU students are below. For those old enough, recall the IU fans reaction at a similar time with RMK.
“It’s kind of a mess,” said Christian Rivers, a junior from Pickerington, Ohio, as he walked through the Ohio State Student Union on Friday. “I don’t really know what to believe. If Urban knew [about Smith’s alleged abuse of his ex-wife, Courtney], he should be gone. I love Urban as a coach, but if he did wrong, he did wrong. Some people think this is about football, but it’s really about decent human morality.”

Although every student interviewed by Yahoo Sports acknowledged not having a full command of the case and all the facts, many of them were viewing the situation through more than just a football prism. They adored Meyer as a coach and enjoyed the benefits of his winning, but they don’t want him back if he enabled Smith.

“I think everyone is confused by what to think,” said Justin Levine, who’d just returned from his home outside New York City to what he called a “weird vibe” on campus. “You hope that he did nothing wrong, and you hope that he’s back on the field week one against Oregon State. But at the same time, if he was hiding something like that it’s inexcusable.”

https://sports.yahoo.com/confused-ohio-state-community-braces-urban-meyer-decision-015019896.html

 

[Mandeville LA]

Quotes from OSU students are below. For those old enough, recall the IU fans reaction at a similar time with RMK.
“It’s kind of a mess,” said Christian Rivers, a junior from Pickerington, Ohio, as he walked through the Ohio State Student Union on Friday. “I don’t really know what to believe. If Urban knew [about Smith’s alleged abuse of his ex-wife, Courtney], he should be gone. I love Urban as a coach, but if he did wrong, he did wrong. Some people think this is about football, but it’s really about decent human morality.”

Although every student interviewed by Yahoo Sports acknowledged not having a full command of the case and all the facts, many of them were viewing the situation through more than just a football prism. They adored Meyer as a coach and enjoyed the benefits of his winning, but they don’t want him back if he enabled Smith.

“I think everyone is confused by what to think,” said Justin Levine, who’d just returned from his home outside New York City to what he called a “weird vibe” on campus. “You hope that he did nothing wrong, and you hope that he’s back on the field week one against Oregon State. But at the same time, if he was hiding something like that it’s inexcusable.”

https://sports.yahoo.com/confused-ohio-state-community-braces-urban-meyer-decision-015019896.html

I don't know what to think about this. I don't know the story other than very limited stuff I have seen published. What I do know is that the days of high profile coaches, executives, etc.. getting away with what ever they like is getting harder and harder. Can't hide from the way word travels these days. Something I am trying to teach my kids at the moment.

 

[Heller]

Once again I remind people that the one factor is Urban was asked directly by a reporter at Big Ten media day if he knew anything about it prior to Smith being fired. He said no and it's pretty obvious he did know and he lied.

 

[Do Dah Day]

I don't know what to think about this. I don't know the story other than very limited stuff I have seen published. What I do know is that the days of high profile coaches, executives, etc.. getting away with what ever they like is getting harder and harder. Can't hide from the way word travels these days. Something I am trying to teach my kids at the moment.

Essentially, one of his assistants was physically abusing his wife, who then talked with Urban's wife, who is clearly Urban's best friend, so he had to know ... and urban didn't take action.

Otherwise, yes, those who choose to make the bucks choose the papparazzi (the best way II have to describe all that is encompassed within living under the microscope).

 

[reswat]

...who then talked with Urban's wife, who is clearly Urban's best friend, so he had to know ... .

Not to pick on your post there, that just isn't necessarily true - that "he had to know". I can imagine a wife of my friend telling my own wife something in confidence, and my own wife being compelled to keep it a secret.

If it can be proved he lied, then he should be held accountable. But you can't reach a conclusion in these matters just based upon someone's assessment that "he had to know".

 

[TwinDegrees2]

Quotes from OSU students are below. For those old enough, recall the IU fans reaction at a similar time with RMK.
“It’s kind of a mess,” said Christian Rivers, a junior from Pickerington, Ohio, as he walked through the Ohio State Student Union on Friday. “I don’t really know what to believe. If Urban knew [about Smith’s alleged abuse of his ex-wife, Courtney], he should be gone. I love Urban as a coach, but if he did wrong, he did wrong. Some people think this is about football, but it’s really about decent human morality.”

Although every student interviewed by Yahoo Sports acknowledged not having a full command of the case and all the facts, many of them were viewing the situation through more than just a football prism. They adored Meyer as a coach and enjoyed the benefits of his winning, but they don’t want him back if he enabled Smith.

“I think everyone is confused by what to think,” said Justin Levine, who’d just returned from his home outside New York City to what he called a “weird vibe” on campus. “You hope that he did nothing wrong, and you hope that he’s back on the field week one against Oregon State. But at the same time, if he was hiding something like that it’s inexcusable.”

https://sports.yahoo.com/confused-ohio-state-community-braces-urban-meyer-decision-015019896.html

If any of us here has never sinned, by all means please....cast that first stone. Urban is innocent until proven, or he admits, guilt. My guess is that he's still the OSU coach opening day, and that he will be at OSU as long as he wants. Of course there's always the caveat that Saban wants to leave 'Bama and this is the only way the BOT at OSU can make it happen without a huge buyout.

 

[IndianapolisHoops]

Not to pick on your post there, that just isn't necessarily true - that "he had to know". I can imagine a wife of my friend telling my own wife something in confidence, and my own wife being compelled to keep it a secret.

If it can be proved he lied, then he should be held accountable. But you can't reach a conclusion in these matters just based upon someone's assessment that "he had to know".

Not trying to be a jerk, but it's not exactly a crime to lie to a reporter. If it were, you could clear out the vast majority of college and professional coaches. A press conference isn't a witness stand.

 

[boilernuke]

Not to pick on your post there, that just isn't necessarily true - that "he had to know". I can imagine a wife of my friend telling my own wife something in confidence, and my own wife being compelled to keep it a secret.

If it can be proved he lied, then he should be held accountable. But you can't reach a conclusion in these matters just based upon someone's assessment that "he had to know".

Everyone is a little different, but my wife has a difficult time keeping secrets, especially this big, and especially with me.

 

[Esox54547]

Not to pick on your post there, that just isn't necessarily true - that "he had to know". I can imagine a wife of my friend telling my own wife something in confidence, and my own wife being compelled to keep it a secret.

If it can be proved he lied, then he should be held accountable. But you can't reach a conclusion in these matters just based upon someone's assessment that "he had to know".

He did lie, as he later said he know about the allegations and passed them up the chain.

To those that say it's no crime to lie at a presser, I agree, but this isn't about who is going to start at QB. That lie appeared to be a blatant attempt to hide the fact he was protecting an abuser or himself for not following protocol. I'm not sure if either is true or if any of the allegations are true, but that lie sure makes it look it.

 

[hoosierdog1]

If any of us here has never sinned, by all means please....cast that first stone. Urban is innocent until proven, or he admits, guilt. My guess is that he's still the OSU coach opening day, and that he will be at OSU as long as he wants. Of course there's always the caveat that Saban wants to leave 'Bama and this is the only way the BOT at OSU can make it happen without a huge buyout.

Ha ha admit guilt!! Yeah right!

 

[SIBoiler2]

Not to pick on your post there, that just isn't necessarily true - that "he had to know". I can imagine a wife of my friend telling my own wife something in confidence, and my own wife being compelled to keep it a secret.

If it can be proved he lied, then he should be held accountable. But you can't reach a conclusion in these matters just based upon someone's assessment that "he had to know".[/QUOTE
Urban's wife isn't stupid. In this case she would tell him. The repercussions could sink her armored truck so she'd want to get out in front of it. Looks like hubby was to ego driven to heed the info.

 

[Do Dah Day]

Not to pick on your post there, that just isn't necessarily true - that "he had to know". I can imagine a wife of my friend telling my own wife something in confidence, and my own wife being compelled to keep it a secret.

If it can be proved he lied, then he should be held accountable. But you can't reach a conclusion in these matters just based upon someone's assessment that "he had to know".

He admitted he knew. There are other things involved, but admission pretty-well trumps all of them.

 

[Wolegib]

when a Gm says his team is going to be competitive and a world series contender is he ever accused of lying? Morgan said hazel l would take our football team to new heights that hope was not able to do. Was that a lie? Should football coaches be held to the same standards as our governmental leaders?

 

[TwinDegrees2]

Ha ha admit guilt!! Yeah right!

Yeah, I know....Sampson never admitted he cheated.

 

[Purdue85]

If any of us here has never sinned, by all means please....cast that first stone. Urban is innocent until proven, or he admits, guilt. My guess is that he's still the OSU coach opening day, and that he will be at OSU as long as he wants. Of course there's always the caveat that Saban wants to leave 'Bama and this is the only way the BOT at OSU can make it happen without a huge buyout.

TD, you make somewhat of a valid point, but nobody here is about to stone Urban to death. There's simply a discussion about his status, whether or not he should be employed, etc. The verse you cite is irrelevant.

In numerous passages the bible instructs us to gently counsel each other. So far most of what's occurred on these forums (fora?) could not be considered the "torch and pitchfork" crowd. I'm okay with the ongoing discussion. It's actually pretty innocuous.

 

[TwinDegrees2]

TD, you make somewhat of a valid point, but nobody here is about to stone Urban to death. There's simply a discussion about his status, whether or not he should be employed, etc. The verse you cite is irrelevant.

In numerous passages the bible instructs us to gently counsel each other. So far most of what's occurred on these forums (fora?) could not be considered the "torch and pitchfork" crowd. I'm okay with the ongoing discussion. It's actually pretty innocuous.

I've always been about justice being served, but I'm also about letting the accused have their day in court. I'm also against all of the political correctness being used to gore the other guys oxen. This jump to a conclusion bull shit is just that...bull shit...and it needs to end. And yes, I blame 400 cable channels all fighting for their one snippet on the nightly news (in this case ESPN) for most of it.

Let's let the man be convicted or proved innocent by the facts.

 

[snowsquirrel11]

when a Gm says his team is going to be competitive and a world series contender is he ever accused of lying? Morgan said hazel l would take our football team to new heights that hope was not able to do. Was that a lie? Should football coaches be held to the same standards as our governmental leaders?

Definition of a lie: an intentionally false statement. If Burke knew how bad Hazell would end up do you think he would have hired him? That means he didn't know or expect to be in the dumpster, therefore it isn't a lie.

 

[Wolegib]

Definition of a lie: an intentionally false statement. If Burke knew how bad Hazell would end up do you think he would have hired him? That means he didn't know or expect to be in the dumpster, therefore it isn't a lie.

I listened to Burke's introductory speech of Hazell several times. and after several years, it seemed like all Burke was doing was to praise Hazell and increase ticket sales. Burke made a lot of promises based on nothing, and promised a higher standard would be achieved - also based on no data. He didn't want purdue alumni to believe we would be in a rebuilding mold, or that hope had left and empty cupboard. In my mind, that's lying to the public.

it's the same thing baseball GMs do to generate season ticket sales. They sign a couple of free agents, and then proclaim these are the final pieces of the puzzle. and the people, like sheep, believe them and buy tickets, only to see the product is just as mediocre as the year before. The brewers badly needed an ace starting pitcher, so they picked up a mediocre one from San Diego , and said hey, he's an ace. They still needed an ace starting pitcher and catcher , so they traded for a 3rd baseman and a 2nd baseman, and a reliever, and said we're ready for the stretch drive. They were in first place before they made the trades. As a life long brewers fan, I feel like I was lied to once more.

so what's the difference if a football coach lies to the press? Why was Smotherman released from the team? Why was Ewing released? I found out the truth from this forum, and not from anything Painter said. Painter lied about both to the press. But I guess that's different because Painter is our coach and not at OSU. To me there is no difference between being not forthcoming and lying.

 

[Purdue85]

I've always been about justice being served, but I'm also about letting the accused have their day in court. I'm also against all of the political correctness being used to gore the other guys oxen. This jump to a conclusion bull shit is just that...bull shit...and it needs to end. And yes, I blame 400 cable channels all fighting for their one snippet on the nightly news (in this case ESPN) for most of it.

Let's let the man be convicted or proved innocent by the facts.

There's the legal court, then there's the court of public opinion. There's absolutely nothing wrong with having a general discussion about what's happened. Nothing. Unless I'm missing it, that's essentially what's happening here. No "bullsh*t", no gored oxen. And I have my (many issues with ESPN!)

He will have his 'day in court.' Until then, there's going to be an ongoing "drip" of information, and ensuing discussion in the public forum. Unfortunately, he lied publicly. That's what's stirring up a lot of public discussion. And that's perfectly reasonable.

 

[TopSecretBoiler]

nothing at schools like alabama, north carolina, o$u, etc...is on the up and up. Is there really an expectation of honesty from the head coach? These places give out fake degrees, buy cars, houses and create jobs for their stars families and who knows what else (strippers!). Hell ya he lies. ALL THE TIME. The game is not getting caught for these guys.

 

[lbodel]

I listened to Burke's introductory speech of Hazell several times. and after several years, it seemed like all Burke was doing was to praise Hazell and increase ticket sales. Burke made a lot of promises based on nothing, and promised a higher standard would be achieved - also based on no data. He didn't want purdue alumni to believe we would be in a rebuilding mold, or that hope had left and empty cupboard. In my mind, that's lying to the public.

it's the same thing baseball GMs do to generate season ticket sales. They sign a couple of free agents, and then proclaim these are the final pieces of the puzzle. and the people, like sheep, believe them and buy tickets, only to see the product is just as mediocre as the year before. The brewers badly needed an ace starting pitcher, so they picked up a mediocre one from San Diego , and said hey, he's an ace. They still needed an ace starting pitcher and catcher , so they traded for a 3rd baseman and a 2nd baseman, and a reliever, and said we're ready for the stretch drive. They were in first place before they made the trades. As a life long brewers fan, I feel like I was lied to once more.

so what's the difference if a football coach lies to the press? Why was Smotherman released from the team? Why was Ewing released? I found out the truth from this forum, and not from anything Painter said. Painter lied about both to the press. But I guess that's different because Painter is our coach and not at OSU. To me there is no difference between being not forthcoming and lying.

You're taking very different situations and molding them into one.

First off, what Burke did with a newly hired coach is literally no different than what any athletic director in the nation would do. Who hires someone and immediately says "they may not be that great, but we'll see". In this case, you also can't predict what will happen. You insinuate that he was hiding stuff by saying we are going to rebuild and have better standards. This forum was for the most part very happy with the Hazell hire.

Secondly, there are issues that coaches can't speak of publicly - relating to medical, academic, etc. issues.

Third, I think there's very much an "intent" factor. If a kid flunks a few drug tests and gets kicked off the team - do we need to know the nitty gritty details? He didn't follow the rules and was kicked off. However, if there were 5 players flunking drug tests and you were saying they were injured and that's why they didn't play, and it then happened again, etc. - well you're covering up an institutional problem where you are making excuses for players. I think those are two different situations.


As for fan reactions, people get blinders on - it doesn't exactly take a whole lot of explanation - truth isn't truth!

Going way back when Stuart Schweigert was arrested for DUI and didn't miss any playing time - there were some people upset, but for the most part people were defending him and saying the "behind the scenes" punishment was suffice (which they didn't know what it was). We've seen this a few times with football players getting in trouble....most recently Gelen Robinson.

 

[Wolegib]

to me a lie is a lie. and you shouldn't get all over Meyer's case of lying to the press, when every other coach and person does it. Sure, players did drugs, and the coach lied to protect them. so what's the difference? one of Meyer's coaches abused his wife and he knew about it and lied about it, and hid it from the press. how many people knew about Haas's exploits until it went to court? I have to believe many people within the Purdue basketball circles knew, and were not forthcoming. And I have to believe if asked by the press about it before it became public knowledge, painter probably would have lied about it or declared because of title 9, he couldn't comment on it. Painter did as much as he possibly could t o cover up Haas's issues from the press and the public..

Ethically and morally, what's the difference?

 

[BoilerIron]

I would be shocked to see Meyer fired for this. If Meyer was the abuser, that's one thing, however since he committed no crime there is no way they are going to get rid of one of the top 3 best coaches in college football.

 

[mathboy]

to me a lie is a lie. and you shouldn't get all over Meyer's case of lying to the press, when every other coach and person does it. Sure, players did drugs, and the coach lied to protect them. so what's the difference? one of Meyer's coaches abused his wife and he knew about it and lied about it, and hid it from the press. how many people knew about Haas's exploits until it went to court? I have to believe many people within the Purdue basketball circles knew, and were not forthcoming. And I have to believe if asked by the press about it before it became public knowledge, painter probably would have lied about it or declared because of title 9, he couldn't comment on it. Painter did as much as he possibly could t o cover up Haas's issues from the press and the public..

Ethically and morally, what's the difference?

So you equate violating the HIPA law (to disclose Haas' medical issues) to Meyer reporting a wife beater? You have some really screwed up morals. The difference is huge.

 

[Wolegib]

So you equate violating the HIPA law (to disclose Haas' medical issues) to Meyer reporting a wife beater? You have some really screwed up morals. The difference is huge.

to me, they both should be reported as well as all those other offenses students and people commit. I don't believe in protecting people. and most of all, I don't believe in calling out a different team's coach, when we have our own dirty laundry that we have tried our best to cover up.

and according to the law, the OSU coach was never convicted of being a wife beater. you are accusing somebody of being guilty of a crime he was never charged with. if the woman doesn't file charges, no legal crime has been committed. And if no legal crime was committed, how can a person be accused of trying to cover up that crime? And you talk about my morals?

a verbal and emotional attack can be just as powerful and lethal as any physical attack. And I've seen many on this board. and I've seen posters comment not to say negative things about a player, because the y might be reading this board. So obviously, verbal assaults are equally as bad and they usually have longer lasting power. fear is a very powerful force as is depression.

Go ahead - defame Smith. But by our court system, he's not guilty of any crime. and yet, you still attack him and others who defend him . yet you are more than willing to give Purdue related offenses the benefit of a doubt and a second chance. Cline could have easily killed somebody, however we don't gossip about his actions. if he were from MSU, there would be a 200 post thread about him and the MSU program with claims Izzo must go.

 

[Do Dah Day]

to me a lie is a lie. and you shouldn't get all over Meyer's case of lying to the press, when every other coach and person does it. Sure, players did drugs, and the coach lied to protect them. so what's the difference? one of Meyer's coaches abused his wife and he knew about it and lied about it, and hid it from the press. how many people knew about Haas's exploits until it went to court? I have to believe many people within the Purdue basketball circles knew, and were not forthcoming. And I have to believe if asked by the press about it before it became public knowledge, painter probably would have lied about it or declared because of title 9, he couldn't comment on it. Painter did as much as he possibly could t o cover up Haas's issues from the press and the public..

Ethically and morally, what's the difference?

Doing drugs doesn't hurt anyone but you ... abusing your wife ... I put that as #2 below abusing your kids. Doing drugs ... Meh ... abusing your wife ... try to defend that!!!!!!! I admit, I have sensitivities. My daughter was with a sociopath for a while. .... I am sensitive to domestic abuse .... and hope everyone is.

 

[TopSecretBoiler]

to me, they both should be reported as well as all those other offenses students and people commit. I don't believe in protecting people. and most of all, I don't believe in calling out a different team's coach, when we have our own dirty laundry that we have tried our best to cover up.

and according to the law, the OSU coach was never convicted of being a wife beater. you are accusing somebody of being guilty of a crime he was never charged with. if the woman doesn't file charges, no legal crime has been committed. And if no legal crime was committed, how can a person be accused of trying to cover up that crime? And you talk about my morals?

a verbal and emotional attack can be just as powerful and lethal as any physical attack. And I've seen many on this board. and I've seen posters comment not to say negative things about a player, because the y might be reading this board. So obviously, verbal assaults are equally as bad and they usually have longer lasting power. fear is a very powerful force as is depression.

Go ahead - defame Smith. But by our court system, he's not guilty of any crime. and yet, you still attack him and others who defend him . yet you are more than willing to give Purdue related offenses the benefit of a doubt and a second chance. Cline could have easily killed somebody, however we don't gossip about his actions. if he were from MSU, there would be a 200 post thread about him and the MSU program with claims Izzo must go.

uh...i don't remember anyone covering for Cline. He was arrested and charged.

 

[proudopete]

to me, they both should be reported as well as all those other offenses students and people commit. I don't believe in protecting people. and most of all, I don't believe in calling out a different team's coach, when we have our own dirty laundry that we have tried our best to cover up.

and according to the law, the OSU coach was never convicted of being a wife beater. you are accusing somebody of being guilty of a crime he was never charged with. if the woman doesn't file charges, no legal crime has been committed. And if no legal crime was committed, how can a person be accused of trying to cover up that crime? And you talk about my morals?

a verbal and emotional attack can be just as powerful and lethal as any physical attack. And I've seen many on this board. and I've seen posters comment not to say negative things about a player, because the y might be reading this board. So obviously, verbal assaults are equally as bad and they usually have longer lasting power. fear is a very powerful force as is depression.

Go ahead - defame Smith. But by our court system, he's not guilty of any crime. and yet, you still attack him and others who defend him . yet you are more than willing to give Purdue related offenses the benefit of a doubt and a second chance. Cline could have easily killed somebody, however we don't gossip about his actions. if he were from MSU, there would be a 200 post thread about him and the MSU program with claims Izzo must go.

Building a lot of straw men ITT.

 

[TDisch]

Definition of a lie: an intentionally false statement. If Burke knew how bad Hazell would end up do you think he would have hired him? That means he didn't know or expect to be in the dumpster, therefore it isn't a lie.

Or as George told Seinfeld, "Remember Jerry, if you believe it, it isn't a lie."

 

[mathboy]

to me, they both should be reported as well as all those other offenses students and people commit. I don't believe in protecting people. and most of all, I don't believe in calling out a different team's coach, when we have our own dirty laundry that we have tried our best to cover up.

and according to the law, the OSU coach was never convicted of being a wife beater. you are accusing somebody of being guilty of a crime he was never charged with. if the woman doesn't file charges, no legal crime has been committed. And if no legal crime was committed, how can a person be accused of trying to cover up that crime? And you talk about my morals?

a verbal and emotional attack can be just as powerful and lethal as any physical attack. And I've seen many on this board. and I've seen posters comment not to say negative things about a player, because the y might be reading this board. So obviously, verbal assaults are equally as bad and they usually have longer lasting power. fear is a very powerful force as is depression.

Go ahead - defame Smith. But by our court system, he's not guilty of any crime. and yet, you still attack him and others who defend him . yet you are more than willing to give Purdue related offenses the benefit of a doubt and a second chance. Cline could have easily killed somebody, however we don't gossip about his actions. if he were from MSU, there would be a 200 post thread about him and the MSU program with claims Izzo must go.

You seem vey confused about this. Let me try to help.

1. Catching an STD is not a crime. Painter may have been aware of this medical condition, but because of the way the federal HIPA law can look at this situation, it might be a crime to disclose it. Painter may be seen as an extended part of the Purdue medical staff because he is the head coach. Besides, that issue is Haas' to disclose or not. You and I have no business knowing about it.

2. Cline was punished for the crime he committed. There was no hiding of the reports and no denial by Painter. We played this straight up. Not sure why you drag him into this argument at all.

3. Physical abuse of your spouse IS a crime. This time it might not have been prosecuted, but it is a crime none-the-less. If Urban was aware of this crime, and did not report it, he could be considered an accessary after the fact. (Help me out here you legal guys!).

I hope you now see the big difference between Painter never randomly announcing Haas has an STD, and Meyer hiding a spousal abuser.

 

[BoilerIron]

You seem vey confused about this. Let me try to help.

1. Catching an STD is not a crime. Painter may have been aware of this medical condition, but because of the way the federal HIPA law can look at this situation, it might be a crime to disclose it. Painter may be seen as an extended part of the Purdue medical staff because he is the head coach. Besides, that issue is Haas' to disclose or not. You and I have no business knowing about it.

2. Cline was punished for the crime he committed. There was no hiding of the reports and no denial by Painter. We played this straight up. Not sure why you drag him into this argument at all.

3. Physical abuse of your spouse IS a crime. This time it might not have been prosecuted, but it is a crime none-the-less. If Urban was aware of this crime, and did not report it, he could be considered an accessary after the fact. (Help me out here you legal guys!).

I hope you now see the big difference between Painter never randomly announcing Haas has an STD, and Meyer hiding a spousal abuser.

The issue with Haas was not that he had an STD. It was that he knowingly spread the STD without informing his partner(s). This is still not a crime though. It just makes most people lose all respect for him.

It certainly isn't as bad as domestic violence.

 

[Wolegib]

Show me where Smith was ever convicted of abusing his wife. If not convicted, he should not be accused of doing so! Anybody can start a rumor. Our country was based on the premise that all men are innocent until proven guilty.

As for Cline and Haas, the facts were made public long after the events occurred .

As for driving and drugs, please don't try to tell me that's ok. I have too many close friends and family killed by drunk drivers.

I didn't say I approve of spousal abuse. I said smith was never convicted of that crime.

We'll have to agree to disagree

 

[mathboy]

Show me where Smith was ever convicted of abusing his wife. If not convicted, he should not be accused of doing so! Anybody can start a rumor. Our country was based on the premise that all men are innocent until proven guilty.

As for Cline and Haas, the facts were made public long after the events occurred .

As for driving and drugs, please don't try to tell me that's ok. I have too many close friends and family killed by drunk drivers.

I didn't say I approve of spousal abuse. I said smith was never convicted of that crime.

We'll have to agree to disagree

Umm, I think you accuse first, then convict. Not the other way around. You have that a bit confused.

Now if the wife refuses to press charges, the legal system can take no action. However, that does not clean the slate for either the wife beater or Urban Meyer. Perhaps by a show of popular support the wife might get the courage to do what's right.

 

[Wolegib]

Umm, I think you accuse first, then convict. Not the other way around. You have that a bit confused.

Now if the wife refuses to press charges, the legal system can take no action. However, that does not clean the slate for either the wife beater or Urban Meyer. Perhaps by a show of popular support the wife might get the courage to do what's right.

She had the opportunity on more than one occasion. In my world, the public has no business accusing somebody of a crime if the police and court of law refuse to do so. I've spent some time in the court room testifying for both sides. I could accuse you of slander and verbal assault, but unless I actually filed charges, you are completely innocent.

and yes my morals are different than most. my morals were formed living I n a different environment where males were sexually and emotionally abused, and women were strong enough to lift 50+ pound hay bails and smart enough to take care of themselves and not need any protection from some strong male figure. I entered the Air force with the firs t graduating class of female Air Force cadets, and they took nothing from nobody! They were Equals in every shape and form and willing to prove it. my wife also wore combat boots and she'd kick your ass and do other things to you if you ever attempted to touch her. She broke a high school football player's nose in the classroom because he was annoying her. he learned not to mess with her.

That's why I don't really care for forums saying a person is a wife beater. if the wife doesn't say it, and the police don't say it, and the courts don't say it, then neither should you. and I'm sure she has been provided plenty of guidance on this issue outside this forum both legal and emotional to make up her mind if any abuse occurred. and I believe rather than accusing her ex- husband of anything, you should abide by her wishes. if she doesn't want to file charges, then neither should the public social media.

and if no charges were ever filed , what is Meyer guilty of? Concealing a non-crime? lying to the media?

 

[Do Dah Day]

and I'm sure she has been provided plenty of guidance on this issue outside this forum both legal and emotional to make up her mind if any abuse occurred. and I believe rather than accusing her ex- husband of anything, you should abide by her wishes. if she doesn't want to file charges, then neither should the public social media.

and if no charges were ever filed , what is Meyer guilty of? Concealing a non-crime? lying to the media?

Having had a daughter go through a year of abuse, from a guy I and my family thought was wonderful. And talking with her and therapists and attorneys and police for over a year. You can go to hell ... she chose not to file charges ... but let me ASSURE YOU... she suffered extreme emotional abuse. There are reasons not to file... mostly based on "I'm out now, I don't want to testify, I don't want him having a reason to come after me as he isn't now, and he still has two dogs that were mine and he has threatened to torture them if I do anything.

 

[Do Dah Day]

That's why I don't really care for forums saying a person is a wife beater. if the wife doesn't say it, and the police don't say it, and the courts don't say it, then neither should you. and I'm sure she has been provided plenty of guidance on this issue outside this forum both legal and emotional to make up her mind if any abuse occurred. and I believe rather than accusing her ex- husband of anything, you should abide by her wishes. if she doesn't want to file charges, then neither should the public social media.

and if no charges were ever filed , what is Meyer guilty of? Concealing a non-crime? lying to the media?

You've hit a really raw spot for me ... and I don't apologize for posting what I will post regarding this, whether it is basketball or not. 70% OF ALL DOMESTIC ABUSE CASES GO UNREPORTED --- does that ****ing mean they didin't happen???
Domestic violence against women has been considered a very serious public health problem. But probably few public health problems share this feature of domestic violence against women: a condition affecting about 25% of the population but only a few of those affected, between 2.5% and 15%, report that they are suffering from that condition. Again, the image of the iceberg tells us that although we can estimate how many women are victims of domestic violence, we are not reaching them because most cases are unreported.

The reasons so many cases go unreported are both personal (embarrassment, fear of retaliation, economic dependency) and societal (imbalanced power relations for men and women in society, privacy of the family, victim blaming attitudes). But we also need to know whether or not all those unreported cases are really invisible for the social environment surrounding the victims (friends, family, neighbours, social services, public health sector…). And if they are socially visible, but not reported, we need to respond accordingly.

 

[Do Dah Day]

Unreported Domestic Violence
The only real form of domestic violence that is regularly reported is stalking. About 50% of stalking victims will say something is happening to them or report the incident to police. As for other forms of abuse, it is believed that only 25% of physical assaults are ever reported and only 1 out of every 5 rapes is ever reported to police. In order to put a stop to this problem, we as a society must find a way for the victims of domestic violence to not only feel safe, but be protected from the abusers whom they love.

• For every woman who does report a domestic violence incident to police, it is estimated that she will have been assaulted by her partner a minimum of 35 previous times.

 

[Do Dah Day]

WOLEGIB --- get a clue --
Why Does Domestic Violence Go Unreported?

• According to BJS research, the most common reason [34% of cases] that victims of domestic violence gave for not reporting an incident was that it was a private or personal matter.
• 12% of domestic violence victims who don’t report what has happened to them do so because they wish to protect their abuser.
• In the period between 1998-2002, only 36% of the cases that were reported to police resulted in an arrest.
• In May 2000, there were about 1,500 defendants who had been charged with a felony assault. 33% of them were charged because of a domestic violence incident.
• The risks of a domestic violence incident increase dramatically when a partner has just one arrest for a misdemeanor or felony assault in the past, whether it is family related or not.
• For offenders convicted in Federal court of a domestic violence incident, 79% of them came from a guilty plea being entered.
• Only 45% of offenders who are sent to prison for a domestic violence incident receive a sentence that is greater than 24 months. In comparison, 77% of convicted defendants who assault a non-family member receive a 24+ month sentence.

Although we take domestic violence seriously on paper, the reality is that we don’t take it very seriously at all. We might even think that the victim has somehow caused this event to occur and place some blame on them rather than blame the abuser in the situation.

 

[Esox54547]

+1. I would give you a like triple D, but that seems inappropriate .

 

[mathboy]

WOLEGIB --- get a clue --
Why Does Domestic Violence Go Unreported?
Although we take domestic violence seriously on paper, the reality is that we don’t take it very seriously at all. We might even think that the victim has somehow caused this event to occur and place some blame on them rather than blame the abuser in the situation.

It might be possible that had Meyer spoken up, recognizing what was happening, the woman might have had enough courage and will to get out of the relationship, and maybe even prosecute. Of course, we will never know because he didn't say anything. For that silence, Meyer will carry a part of the blame for the situation continuing for the rest of his career. Not all the blame, but certainly part.

Wolegib, I think you have stubbornly gotten on the wrong side of this situation. Maybe you should quit while you can and preserve some credibility.