Now that the cat is out of the bag, how will this play out? NCAA ruling

[Purdue85]

Who said the school will have any control? An athlete can merchandise his NIL directly with a business that is interested.

Wha....????!

You think schools aren't going to be ... "assisting" ... with this sh*t show? That they will have ZERO influence??

LOL!

They're going to be the primary brokers!

They have the data on the donors, bubba! They know who has money and who doesn't. It'll be like a dating app, matching one with another.

This sh*t's just getting started, and it's going to get filthy dirty... like pigs wallowing in the pigpen.

Wish I could park my cynical side on this topic, but it's going to get really sleazy.

 

[bumpstock]

It destroys Title 9.

Pretty much. I think what you'll see in five years is:
Men: Football, Basketball, Track
Women: Volleyball, Basketball, Track
Three sports; equal for both genders. All other sports (men & women) gone to club sports unless the university is so well endowed they're willing to pick up the tab for a few other sports.

 

[Purdue85]

Pretty much. I think what you'll see in five years is:
Men: Football, Basketball, Track
Women: Volleyball, Basketball, Track
Three sports; equal for both genders. All other sports (men & women) gone to club sports unless the university is so well endowed they're willing to pick up the tab for a few other sports.

if they continue to allow dudes to "compete" with girls, those sports you listed for "women" will become a thing of the past, as well.

This is truly a bizarre world in which we live.

 

[bumpstock]

Will players be taxed? If scholarships are considered compensation will they be taxed on it.

Players will most certainly be taxed for NIL earnings.

However, if the university takes the deduction, and reports the value of fringe benefits, and scholarships on their 1099 on Jan. 1, 2022, then the IRS wo/man will either come knocking on the school's front door, or the athlete's front door.

That's when we'll have the answer to your question.

 

[PrintersRowBoiler]

Players will most certainly be taxed for NIL earnings.

However, if the university takes the deduction, and reports the value of fringe benefits, and scholarships on their 1099 on Jan. 1, 2022, then the IRS wo/man will either come knocking on the school's front door, or the athlete's front door.

That's when we'll have the answer to your question.

not playing politics but if renting an apartment for someone and paying for tuition is considered fringe benefits that should have been taxed for their services, how is college athletes free tuition and room and board not?

 

[BCfanatic2020]

Wha....????!

You think schools aren't going to be ... "assisting" ... with this sh*t show? That they will have ZERO influence??

LOL!

They're going to be the primary brokers!

They have the data on the donors, bubba! They know who has money and who doesn't. It'll be like a dating app, matching one with another.

This sh*t's just getting started, and it's going to get filthy dirty... like pigs wallowing in the pigpen.

Wish I could park my cynical side on this topic, but it's going to get really sleazy.

Agree 1000% and any Purdue fan who thinks it’s a good thing just isn’t thinking

I think the kids should get paid but the way they’ve chosen to do it is gonna ruin the product …

and unlike the nba there isn’t gonna be a foreign market to save them

 

[bumpstock]

not playing politics but if renting an apartment for someone and paying for tuition is considered fringe benefits that should have been taxed for their services, how is college athletes free tuition and room and board not?

It's not politics; it's tax law.

It's all up to the IRS (well, at the Federal level; state Dept. of Revenue at the State level).

Somebody's gonna get hammered ~ (1) the University for taking a deduction they're not entitled to take; or, (2) the athlete who should have, but didn't, report the compensation.

You might be right, or, you might be wrong ~ I tend to agree with you, but let's wait for the ruling.

 

[BCfanatic2020]

It's not politics; it's tax law.

It's all up to the IRS (well, at the Federal level; state Dept. of Revenue at the State level).

Somebody's gonna get hammered ~ (1) the University for taking a deduction they're not entitled to take; or, (2) the athlete who should have, but didn't, report the compensation.

You might be right, or, you might be wrong ~ I tend to agree with you, but let's wait for the ruling.

Are they getting paid this year

 

[bumpstock]

Are they getting paid this year

We'll see...ask the school if they're taking the deduction on their 1099 in January.

 

[Purdue85]

This entire conversation (and issue) has the feeling of the old adage, "be careful what you wish for..."

 

[bumpstock]

This entire conversation (and issue) has the feeling of the old adage, "be careful what you wish for..."

No worries...10,00 lawyers, and 50 judges will sort this all out in a few years, and return what's left to the fans. Besides, we haven't even discussed player unionization, and Workman's Comp' claims.

 

[BCfanatic2020]

This entire conversation (and issue) has the feeling of the old adage, "be careful what you wish for..."

true .. cause I used to be in the camp of saying somehow they should be paid

 

[HoosierTim]

Wha....????!

You think schools aren't going to be ... "assisting" ... with this sh*t show? That they will have ZERO influence??

LOL!

They're going to be the primary brokers!

They have the data on the donors, bubba! They know who has money and who doesn't. It'll be like a dating app, matching one with another.

This sh*t's just getting started, and it's going to get filthy dirty... like pigs wallowing in the pigpen.

Wish I could park my cynical side on this topic, but it's going to get really sleazy.

Might hurt the schools (namely athletic departments) more than you think.

Say Big John, who owns Roll Tide Motors; Tuscaloosa's largest car dealership, customarily gives the Alabama athletic department a million dollar donation a year as a booster, what is to stop him from giving that money to prospective athletes directly going forward?

I think you have the potential to see less and less donations to current athletic departments and more direct payments to athletes.

 

[asby]

A S. Florida gym owner announced that he is giving every U of Miami football player on scholarship 500 bucks a month to advertise his gyms on social media

 

[Purdue85]

Might hurt the schools (namely athletic departments) more than you think.

Say Big John, who owns Roll Tide Motors; Tuscaloosa's largest car dealership, customarily gives the Alabama athletic department a million dollar donation a year as a booster, what is to stop him from giving that money to prospective athletes directly going forward?

I think you have the potential to see less and less donations to current athletic departments and more direct payments to athletes.

There's no doubt. Over the weekend I read an article on NIL and got to thinking the same thing.

But, what do athletic departments want? Successful programs. There will be some who are willing to forego the money directly from the big booster, for that money to flow directly into the pocket of the stud recruit.

Programs (like Purdue) who are straight up, have independent athletics programs funded privately (John Purdue Club) will find it challenging to navigate these waters, no doubt. Other programs likely won't care as much.

Now, with that said, one of the NCAA guidelines reads like this:

Individuals can use a professional services provider for NIL activities.​

🤣

Folks, they're not even hiding it.

The aggressive schools (think: $EC) will have them on retainer.

EDIT: If I was younger and had more time/energy, I'd be putting together a business model right now, to broker that service for certain schools.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

Might hurt the schools (namely athletic departments) more than you think.

Say Big John, who owns Roll Tide Motors; Tuscaloosa's largest car dealership, customarily gives the Alabama athletic department a million dollar donation a year as a booster, what is to stop him from giving that money to prospective athletes directly going forward?

I think you have the potential to see less and less donations to current athletic departments and more direct payments to athletes.

Agreed. And the first thing to go will be the non-profit sports, combined with extreme cost-cutting in the non profit sports that they have to keep due to Title IX.

 

[Purdue85]

Agreed. And the first thing to go will be the non-profit sports, combined with extreme cost-cutting in the non profit sports that they have to keep due to Title IX.

I don't disagree, at all.

What will need to be reconciled is the minimum number of sports each school needs to field to be a conference member.

Wisconsin trashed their baseball team years ago as a result of Title IX.

There will very possibly be fewer and fewer opportunities for the true student athlete as a result of the greedy few. (no doubt, I'll need to explain and clarify that further)

 

[TopSecretBoiler]

So they can start making the NCAA football video games again now right? This is the burning question here folks...

 

[BoilerBiker]

maybe 2 years away

 

[HoosierTim]

Agreed. And the first thing to go will be the non-profit sports, combined with extreme cost-cutting in the non profit sports that they have to keep due to Title IX.

I think NCAA athletics as we know it will be done once current TV contracts expire.

Power 5 schools who negotiate their own TV contracts via the conferences will continue to thrive and I don't think you'll see much of a change as we know it today (college football Saturdays on all the networks will remain the same), but it's the mid-major/non-football D1 schools that are going to get crushed. Schools like IUPUI/IPFW/etc who rely on revenue share from the NCAAT will have no choice but to shut down varsity programs and go the club route.

The NCAA exists (or existed) solely to regulate amateur collegiate athletics. Now that they've been told they basically can't do this, what is stopping the major conferences from colluding, forcing the NCAA out, and then re-negotiating their own TV deals to broadcast a new basketball and football tournament? It's a bigger pie that isn't going around to all the other D1 schools, money needed to fun their athletic scholarship programs. Due to Title IX, P5 schools still have to offer equal representation between sexes, but I think it's a very real possibility that most P5 schools will only field Football and Basketball programs, Baseball in some instances in men's sports, and then a few women's sports to keep within Title IX compliance.

 

[PurdueDave]

I think NCAA athletics as we know it will be done once current TV contracts expire.

Power 5 schools who negotiate their own TV contracts via the conferences will continue to thrive and I don't think you'll see much of a change as we know it today (college football Saturdays on all the networks will remain the same), but it's the mid-major/non-football D1 schools that are going to get crushed. Schools like IUPUI/IPFW/etc who rely on revenue share from the NCAAT will have no choice but to shut down varsity programs and go the club route.

The NCAA exists (or existed) solely to regulate amateur collegiate athletics. Now that they've been told they basically can't do this, what is stopping the major conferences from colluding, forcing the NCAA out, and then re-negotiating their own TV deals to broadcast a new basketball and football tournament? It's a bigger pie that isn't going around to all the other D1 schools, money needed to fun their athletic scholarship programs. Due to Title IX, P5 schools still have to offer equal representation between sexes, but I think it's a very real possibility that most P5 schools will only field Football and Basketball programs, Baseball in some instances in men's sports, and then a few women's sports keep within Title IX compliance.

Nailed it! What that leaves is 65 D1 progams. What happens to all the other kids looking for a scholarship? I guess they're out of luck. Do you think maybe all the support for paying kids will dry up when most kids are left with paying their own way and playing club sports?

 

[FirstDownB]

I think NCAA athletics as we know it will be done once current TV contracts expire.

Power 5 schools who negotiate their own TV contracts via the conferences will continue to thrive and I don't think you'll see much of a change as we know it today (college football Saturdays on all the networks will remain the same), but it's the mid-major/non-football D1 schools that are going to get crushed. Schools like IUPUI/IPFW/etc who rely on revenue share from the NCAAT will have no choice but to shut down varsity programs and go the club route.

The NCAA exists (or existed) solely to regulate amateur collegiate athletics. Now that they've been told they basically can't do this, what is stopping the major conferences from colluding, forcing the NCAA out, and then re-negotiating their own TV deals to broadcast a new basketball and football tournament? It's a bigger pie that isn't going around to all the other D1 schools, money needed to fun their athletic scholarship programs. Due to Title IX, P5 schools still have to offer equal representation between sexes, but I think it's a very real possibility that most P5 schools will only field Football and Basketball programs, Baseball in some instances in men's sports, and then a few women's sports to keep within Title IX compliance.

Wondering how this impacts Title IX and the equity practices that legislation led to. Seems like a big can of worms. Assuming the NIL compensation will be heavily steered toward male athletes won't this all be headed down the same gender equity/pay gap trap as other recent news headlines, i.e., USWNT soccer?

 

[HoosierTim]

Nailed it! What that leaves is 65 D1 progams. What happens to all the other kids looking for a scholarship? I guess they're out of luck. Do you think maybe all the support for paying kids will dry up when most kids are left with paying their own way and playing club sports?

Honestly not sure, but this is the unintended consequences of NIL. There are many scholarship athletes in the non-revenue sports who truly don't know how good they have it (free education, free housing, free training/meals/etc) that have been the leading advocates for NIL change. Most will soon find out they aren't worth a lick on the open market in comparison to the monetary value of a full-ride scholarship and will have no one else to blame but themselves for continuing to push NIL.

 

[HoosierTim]

Wondering how this impacts Title IX and the quity practices that legislation led to. Seems like a big can of worms. Assuming the NIL compensation will be heavily steered toward male athletes won't this all be headed down the same gender equity/pay gap trap as other recent news headlines, i.e., USWNT soccer?

Who knows really and to be honest I'm not that versed in Title IX. I know that if a school offers 150 male scholarships then it must offer 150 female scholarships. There's a reason why some of the P5 schools have 55 female rowers on scholarship and why that sport continuously hemorrages money, as does nearly every other sports sans men's basketball and football.

I do think Title IX will be avoided in NIL complaints as it will be individual boosters and donors facilitating payments, not individual universities. But I could be wrong.

 

[FirstDownB]

Honestly not sure, but this is the unintended consequences of NIL. There are many scholarship athletes in the non-revenue sports who truly don't know how good they have it (free education, free housing, free training/meals/etc) that have been the leading advocates for NIL change. Most will soon find out they aren't worth a lick on the open market in comparison to the monetary value of a full-ride scholarship and will have no one else to blame but themselves for continuing to push NIL.

That's the double speak of the whole issue. People promoting NIL on basis of "free market" concepts, which allow a select few to scratch out some extra dollars, meanwhile taking no objection to millions of dollars the institutions are spending on college athletics "welfare".

 

[HoosierTim]

That's the double speak of the whole issue. People promoting NIL on basis of "free market" concepts, which allow a select few to scratch out some extra dollars, meanwhile taking no objection to millions of dollars the institutions are spending on college athletics "welfare".

I agree, and to be fair, it's not really the NCAA's problem that the NBA and NFL have age requirements. Nobody is forced to sign a LOI and play collegiately for no "monetary" value. There's plenty of other avenues to make real dollars out of high school, but everyone knows that playing under the NCAA's platform with free high dollar exposure beats the hell out of playing in a hidden European league or in the G-League without any kind of structure or coaching.

 

[bumpstock]

I think NCAA athletics as we know it will be done once current TV contracts expire.

Power 5 schools who negotiate their own TV contracts via the conferences will continue to thrive and I don't think you'll see much of a change as we know it today (college football Saturdays on all the networks will remain the same), but it's the mid-major/non-football D1 schools that are going to get crushed. Schools like IUPUI/IPFW/etc who rely on revenue share from the NCAAT will have no choice but to shut down varsity programs and go the club route.

The NCAA exists (or existed) solely to regulate amateur collegiate athletics. Now that they've been told they basically can't do this, what is stopping the major conferences from colluding, forcing the NCAA out, and then re-negotiating their own TV deals to broadcast a new basketball and football tournament? It's a bigger pie that isn't going around to all the other D1 schools, money needed to fun their athletic scholarship programs. Due to Title IX, P5 schools still have to offer equal representation between sexes, but I think it's a very real possibility that most P5 schools will only field Football and Basketball programs, Baseball in some instances in men's sports, and then a few women's sports to keep within Title IX compliance.

Mercy! Whatever will we do without the NCAA to guide us through life's obstacles?

 

[HoosierTim]

Mercy! Whatever will we do without the NCAA to guide us through life's obstacles?

People like you and I will be fine, I'm not worried about myself. But there will be thousands of high school student athletes each year who will no longer be afforded the opportunity to pursue an educational and athletic career at the collegiate level because their sport no longer exists in the current climate. That's a damn shame if you ask me.

 

[bumpstock]

People like you and I will be fine, I'm not worried about myself. But there will be thousands of high school student athletes each year who will no longer be afforded the opportunity to pursue an educational and athletic career at the collegiate level because their sport no longer exists in the current climate. That's a damn shame if you ask me.

Oh, you mean like Intramural, and/or club sports? Or like, D-II, D-III, NAIA? Or AIA U-19? Nike Club?

It's no different than a Charter H.S. that doesn't have sports, and the public H.S. that offers sports. The Charter H.S. kids still play sports if they want to ~ they just have to pay to play. They're not denied anything! Somebody (usually taxpayers) always pays.

 

[HoosierTim]

Oh, you mean like Intramural, and/or club sports? Or like, D-II, D-III, NAIA? Or AIA U-19? Nike Club?

It's no different than a Charter H.S. that doesn't have sports, and the public H.S. that offers sports. The Charter H.S. kids still play sports if they want to ~ they just have to pay to play. They're not denied anything! Somebody (usually taxpayers) always pays.

How many kids on Purdue's club basketball or lacrosee teams are getting their entire school paid for? It's not remotely comparable. The cutdown of varsity programs eliminates a ton of scholarships and educational opportunities for thousands of prospective student athletes each year. A little common sense here.

 

[Purdue85]

How many kids on Purdue's club basketball or lacrosee teams are getting their entire school paid for? It's not remotely comparable. The cutdown of varsity programs eliminates a ton of scholarships and educational opportunities for thousands of prospective student athletes each year. A little common sense here.

I'm not necessarily solely responding to this post/response, but in general, I appreciate you being a breath of fresh air (and a voice of common sense) on this topic.

These students are offered a scholarship, and an opportunity to continue their passion of playing a sport as an amateur athlete.

It's not about a "job", and has nothing to do with "wages" or payment.

Some students are offered an academic scholarship. With most, there are stipulations and expectations attached. What makes the scholarship of a student athlete unique is the maintenance of the amateur status, and navigating those waters.

Therein lies the rub, as they say.

 

[bumpstock]

How many kids on Purdue's club basketball or lacrosee teams are getting their entire school paid for? It's not remotely comparable. The cutdown of varsity programs eliminates a ton of scholarships and educational opportunities for thousands of prospective student athletes each year. A little common sense here.

Darwinism ~ some will survive; some won't.

 

[HoosierTim]

I'm not necessarily solely responding to this post/response, but in general, I appreciate you being a breath of fresh air (and a voice of common sense) on this topic.

These students are offered a scholarship, and an opportunity to continue their passion of playing a sport as an amateur athlete.

It's not about a "job", and has nothing to do with "wages" or payment.

Some students are offered an academic scholarship. With most, there are stipulations and expectations attached. What makes the scholarship of a student athlete unique is the maintenance of the amateur status, and navigating those waters.

Therein lies the rub, as they say.

Well said.

 

[purduepat1969]

Darwinism ~ some will survive; some won't.

Funny. That's not how California, who started this mess, views things. The current leadership and majority population would have you believe "democratic socialism", like that even exists, is the way of the future.

 

[bumpstock]

Funny. That's not how California, who started this mess, views things. The current leadership and majority population would have you believe "democratic socialism", like that even exists, is the way of the future.

The evolution of sports has been taking place for decades.

From Title IX, to the Transfer Portal, to the NCAA vs. Alston, it's been a path of evolution.

Old farts pining for "the good ole days" will never end ~ they got over the 3-point shot, and the designated hitter.

Some will get over this issue; others won't; but, in the end, it won't matter what they do.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

The evolution of sports has been taking place for decades.

From Title IX, to the Transfer Portal, to the NCAA vs. Alston, it's been a path of evolution.

Old farts pining for "the good ole days" will never end ~ they got over the 3-point shot, and the designated hitter.

Some will get over this issue; others won't; but, in the end, it won't matter what they do.

Is this where I chime in and complain about class basketball and the IRL/CART split?

 

[Purdue85]

The evolution of sports has been taking place for decades.

From Title IX, to the Transfer Portal, to the NCAA vs. Alston, it's been a path of evolution.

Old farts pining for "the good ole days" will never end ~ they got over the 3-point shot, and the designated hitter.

Some will get over this issue; others won't; but, in the end, it won't matter what they do.

This is not an issue of "(o)ld farts pining for 'the good ole days'," nor is some adjustment to a game like a three point line. (WTH?) It's an issue of people recognizing what's right and what's wrong.

You have a long road ahead of you if wish to take decades and decades of policy ... policy that categorized and characterized a certain level of conduct as insidious, poisonous, and corrupt... and expect people with ethics, morals, and a sense of fair play, to suddenly smile, put on a happy face, and call it the new norm.

You can "get over it" if you choose. Many others will continue to call it what it is. Will it matter? Clearly, not to you. But, it does.

 

[Purdue85]

Is this where I chime in and complain about class basketball and the IRL/CART split?

LOL! Class basketball. Yeah... that's worked out well. All change is GOOD, dontcha know?!

Just shut the h*ll up, you old fart, pining for the good ol' days.

 

[purduepat1969]

Is this where I chime in and complain about class basketball and the IRL/CART split?

We had a guy in my hometown who put a sign up in his yard that said "Class Basketball is Wrong". Pretty much went viral around the area. It's now in the Indiana Basketball Hall of Fame.

Sign condemning class basketball heads to HOF

By HENDRIX MAGLEY

duboiscountyherald.com

 

[SIBoiler2]

Is Title IX invalidated if the entire "woman's" track team consists of transgendered "females"?