We are going to run through the post way less frequently next year, and when we do it will mostly be TKR. He's finally going to have several athletes to work with. Sticking with a pound it inside strategy makes little sense.
Colvin and Heide
- Thread starter BoilerDeac
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My concerns are we are going to have the same arguments next year only the names will be changed! Posters will be saying Catchings and Harris are too good to sit on the bench and should be starting over players like Heide and Myles. And if that happens, people will speculate Myles and Heide will transfer out.
It looks like TKR may be our starting 4 next year. Maybe Burgess or Jacobson will start at center. Maybe Catchings will slide down and start at the three.
What happens to all those fans who currently love Myles if Catchings starts at the 3 next year? Or if Harris proves he is better than Myles? Will you stand by your current favorite player? Or will you jump on the catchings and Harris bandwagon next year?
It looks like TKR may be our starting 4 next year. Maybe Burgess or Jacobson will start at center. Maybe Catchings will slide down and start at the three.
What happens to all those fans who currently love Myles if Catchings starts at the 3 next year? Or if Harris proves he is better than Myles? Will you stand by your current favorite player? Or will you jump on the catchings and Harris bandwagon next year?
Great question. One could argue that Purdue is currently a top 15 program based on results the last ten years and significantly better than that based on regular season results the last three years (with one first rounds loss, one SS and one tbd in the NCAAT over that period).
The question is, how much of that is the job and how much of that is Matt Painter. Most basketball people would consider the job to be somewhere in the 5 to 8 range in the conference in terms of places where you can come in and win at a high level, behind MSU, OSU, UM, IU and in a group with MD, WI and IL.
I don't know whether that's right at this point or not. Certainly Purdue's attractiveness to recruits seems to have improved and the program has significant momentum overall. My sense is that the program needs a FF or NC to make that jump and be considered a tier 1 BT and national program outside of MP, but who knows.
Great post. These are the issues you see as you grow and improve as a program. Very difficult to come in and start as a freshman at a top program unless there's a big gap (Jaden enters the draft, IT and EHJ transfer out) or you're a superstar.
I would argue that Cam hadn't played in a long time due to injury and Myles had a very steep learning curve due to his high school experience. It may be easier for Kanon to come in and play a big role from day one, particularly if he can play alongside Trey.
I'd add that Edey didn't receive early playing time to develop him, he played early because he was too good not to. We've already moved away from the full 'pound it inside' strategy, using a lot more pick and roll, even with Zach.
I think you'll see the offense next year look a lot like it does this year when Zach is out with a lot of stuff running through Braden and Trey and whoever steps up to become the third option between Fletch, Kanon, Myles, Cam, etc.
It’s HeidE…how are we still spelling names wrong?
But it’ll change because every single one our players is capable of shooting the 3 and we will be more mobile and athletic than we have ever been from top to bottom on the team.
1. Smith/Harris
2. Loyer/Colvin/Harris
3. Heide/Colvin/Catchings/Harris
4. Furst/Catchings (I suspect this changes midway through)/Burgess or Jacobsen
5. TKR/Berg/ Burgess of Jacobsen
RS: Cox, Benter and one of Burgess or Jacobsen
Not sure where he fits in: Waddell
Hot take: Gillis somehow comes back even with scholarship issues/sign a transfer portal guy even though painter said he isn’t going to
The qualifier is "realistic shot of that happening". Purdue has put that on the chalkboard literally for a few decades I'm aware. Without a lot of luck it was not going to happen with a "lot" of the Purdue teams. The 87-88 team had a legitimate shot. Big Dog had a shot had he not hurt his back. Robbie prior to the knee injury had a shot. Certainly losing Haas hurt and allowed Texas Tech to play the way they did which with Haas "may" have got there...with probably some breaks. We know how close (Purdue definitely got some breaks and was hot) with Carsen and Ryan got and so that was five teams in 36 years that legitimately had a shot and one of the teams...was not as good as the other four, but got hot at the right time.
Being legitimately good enough with four plus one hot team or less than two classes full playing time is not the experience or near the experience of the teams you mention, but outside of those 5 programs Purdue has been not too far behind as far as "quality" of team put on the court.
I haven't looked at other teams similar to who we will be next year - but KY ... Yikes - what the hell????.
So - we have
~ a 3 year point guard = a LOT of GOOD!
~ a 3-year scoring guard with a 2-year unconscious scorer behind him
~ a 3-year underneath guy who has paid his dues against a 2x NPOY
~ a 2-year incredible athlete who played awesome at the end of this year
~ a 7" athlete who can flat out shoot the 3!!!
~ a 6' 8" guy who can flat out play ANYwhere
~ a 6' 4' and a 6' 5" who are incredibly skilled.
~ a 7' 3" who is damned skilled and can play away from the basket.
Yep - that's whut we got next year
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Shhhhh Purdue wants to surprise them. Yes, Purdue will be good next year at some point. With NIL it is possible that another team that we don't think will be as good next year might, but too your point there are some proven points with the existing players that are good players today. That 6'8" player as you said can do his thing anywhere on the court and at a different speed as he glides on skates. "IF" he plays to his capability he will turn some heads.
I love the mix of seasoned players at key positions and GREAT new comers or 2nd year guys!!! and NO seniors. Yes, The NIL/Portal will be "interesting" ... I hate that word and tend to dislike the portal as it is this year.
Wait don’t you know Purdue won’t be any good without edey?
Without swanigan (rip)?
Without Carsen?
Without Ivey?
Without …”insert player here”?
I agree that Matt Painter is doing a nice job of raising the profile of the program.
Knowing some things that took place when my brother-in-law played, reading Dave Schellhase's book and knowing what all Tony Hinkle did at Butler there is quite the illumination in the changes in the game we love, some in rules, but in the players and fans as well. I like freedom of choice for almost all things. I like Sowell's quote on islands of knowledge dwarfed by the sea of ignorance and so I typically lean to an evolutionary process over a revolutionary process with the anticipation that substance prevails over fluff. You prefer the evolutionary process in that bad things get canceled early or later rather than a mandate that stipulates such and such. The desire to help some kids financially that contribute to a Universities finances is fine with me. However, we can see this being used in recruiting in creating a semi professional league under the disguise of a college or university.
It is here, I don't like it and erodes the foundation of the mission of a university. Hopefully, there is an adjustment where players get a stipend or something to provide for them some spending money, but when is too much too much? It is a game we love with a team put together with players NOT wondering how much you are going to pay them for the face of the university. Oh well, off the soap box. I prefer watching college kids more than semi pros and the NIL as it is a disaster IMO.
Folks dense enough to call for recruits to decommit or cry for Painter to be fired when the team loses a game, may need things spelled out for them occasionally.
Alright, but it's been more than "occasionally." Why feed it more energy? Let it go.
Making 5 out of the last 7 sweet sixteens is successful, no matter what happens Friday night. Which seeds you used to get there matters exactly ZERO.
I also felt like the 98 team had a shot before Cornell’s high ankle sprain.
yeah if Booker would be there. Forgot that one...good catch!!!!
Then why is the knock on Painter and Purdue that they can't go deep in March? Statistically, if you're a top 15 team all year, you should make the S16.
Thats your “knock”.
Making 5 out of 7 sweet sixteens is a great accomplishment, proven by the fact that there is only other coach who did it.
Most folks think Painter is a very successful college basketball coach.
The same knowledgeable folks who would rather have Braden Smith than Marcus Carr, and who understand how important basketball IQ is.
What is? That making 5 of the last 7 sweet sixteens qualifies as tournament success?
When only 2 guys accomplish that, out of hundreds, that would seem to be pretty solid evidence. Unless you are pushing an agenda.
If you’re going to respond that way at least say, ‘Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, uh, your opinion, man.’ 😂
He's not good, he's just tall. But Purdue is not good without him. Have I got that right?
Yes. Also have seen he is being protected by refs, has no skill, is slow, has not improved and will not make it to NBA
Waddell is going to be getting more minutes I'd guess. He's now 6'8" and came in with a lot of skills. And we can only hope that Gillis returns. He's been very valuable this season.
Gillis coming back would further complicate an already complicated situation.
But I would love it.
Eh, you’re leaving out the fact that people were saying Colvin and Heide should play over Morton in particular. It was a no brainer.
There is no Morton next year. Morton, bless his heart, is not even close to the caliber of athlete + player Colvin, Heide, Harris and Catchings are/can be.
Purdue will be even more athletic next year and in years to come, assuming everyone stays for 2 - 3 seasons.
When have I ever said Painter wasn't a successful college coach? I've said the exact opposite. He's a great college coach. He's just not a great tourney coach.
To be a great tourney coach, the S16 can't be your ceiling every year.
If Painter doesn't make a FF or win a NC, he's be saddled with the same qualifier Keady is: "great coach, just couldn't get it done in March"
And again, for the record, I do think he gets the FF this year, in which case, many people with have to change their opinion.
You said he wasn’t successful in the tourney. I disagree with that. 5 out of 7 sweet sixteens is unquestionably “successful”.
Now you’re saying he hasn’t been “great” in the tourney. I agree with that.
But I would also argue that Shaka, Crean, Frank Martin, Porter Moser and Dusty May aren’t “great tourney coaches” just because they made it one round further than Painter has, one time, while otherwise doing much worse than Painter in the tournament, or even worse, not making it at all.
Would you trade Purdue’s NCAA performance over the last 15 years for South Carolina’s? I wouldn’t.
There's a subjective nature to whether or not making the Sweet is a success. Really, there's a subjective nature to what "success" is/looks like, in general (if we want to get philosophical about it haha).
For example, the players on this Purdue team have openly said making the Sweet 16 this season is NOT a success.
You can disagree all you want, and you have every right to do that, but it's still just your opinion.
Agree that any minutes Morton played the first 20 games or so should have gone to Colvin and Heide. Painter knew what Morton would provide on off/def. and that was not much of either.
Colvin would be a lot better all around, Heide more consistent.
Painter finally realized Colvin and Heide would help get us to F4 or championship. Hope his massive brain farts did not hold either Colvin or Heide back too much.
Don’t forget……….. Morton could come back too! Just think Morton. Gillis and Edey all coming back!
You all want Gillis to come back with the knowledge we’re already. 1 player over our scholarship limit! Just think if Morton decided to come back. If Morton did actually decide to come back, could Purdue legally stop him from doing so?
You all want Gillis to come back with the knowledge we’re already. 1 player over our scholarship limit! Just think if Morton decided to come back. If Morton did actually decide to come back, could Purdue legally stop him from doing so?
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