http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/26/politics/indiana-voter-fraud/index.html
but it's fake right? right qaz? right? It's all made up? right wing conspiracy! LOL
but it's fake right? right qaz? right? It's all made up? right wing conspiracy! LOL
And MORE voter fraud
- Thread starter TopSecretBoiler
- Start date
From your own link:
"Rick Hasen, an election law expert of University of California-Irvine, stresses that in general even if there is voter registration fraud, that doesn't translate to in-person fraud at the polls. In a recent blog post, he summed it up: "I never say voter fraud is non -existent," he said and noted that it happens occasionally with absentee ballots and that action needs to be taken to clean up voter registration rolls. "What is extremely rare and has not affected any election we know of since the 1980's is impersonation fraud," he said."
Another expert goes on to say that it's common to receive improperly filled out registrations because the law requires you to turn in ALL registrations you receive.
Lol is right...but you guys keep whining about nonexistent voter fraud while you keep losing national elections. I'm good with that.
Whatever happened to the good old days, like 2015, when even sober conservative R's basically admitted that this whole "voter fraud" schtick was a straw-man concocted to drive through state laws to make it much harder for the poor and elderly to vote?
Now Cheetoh Jesus has his delusional base supporters actually believing it exists.
Now Cheetoh Jesus has his delusional base supporters actually believing it exists.
ya you're right they don't show at the polls...they just mail them in instead! I always lose national elections. ron paul didn't win. ross perot didn't win. gary johnson won't win. It's cool. I've accepted politics is a team sport at the national level. But I don't have to accept plots against the american electorate. The fact that this is not alarming tells anyone all they ever need to know about you two.
It's not conspiracy. It's being investigated as election fraud. Good try...participation trophy awarded. This time, find a meme that fits.
lol yes a republican controlled government in one state is investigating a democratic organization in said state for voter fraud. An investigation that hasn't finished yet, but you've concluded is evidence of voter fraud that has existed apparently for multiple elections everywhere.
Conspiracy fits best, I suppose insane troll logic works though, let's see if they have one for that:
I'm not trolling. I posted a cnn article of an actual expanded investigation. It's not made up. It's not conspiracy. What will you say if they come back and find that registration records were tampered with? The supreme court could decide it happened and you still wouldn't accept it. People who disagree with you aren't trolls, all they have to be is objective.lol yes a republican controlled government in one state is investigating a democratic organization in said state for voter fraud. An investigation that hasn't finished yet, but you've concluded is evidence of voter fraud that has existed apparently for multiple elections everywhere.
Conspiracy fits best, I suppose insane troll logic works though, let's see if they have one for that:
I didn't say you were "trolling" I said you were exhibiting insane troll logic. I believe you believe this crap.
What will they find? They will find what they find anytime someone is required to turn in every single registration form they hand out. The vast majority will be legit. A few will not.
What they won't find is folks ACTUALLY VOTING ILLEGALLY. Which happens more rarely in this country today than you having a cogent thought.
It's interesting you say that when there is very little means to back that statement up. A fifty cent screw I buy from amazon gets more scrutiny and accountability than my vote for the most powerful person in the world. Where can I verify that my vote was counted? I can verify I bought that screw, or that at least someone pretending to be me bought it.
There are Dems and Reps, and backup Dems and Reps all throughout our system, verifying that fundamentally it is fair. A conspiracy to block your vote would require BOTH sides.
Now, if you want to make an argument that we could do better in our systems to make sure they are as accurate and error-free as possible, sure, we have some antiquated systems, and we have certainly room to improve to make sure our system is as error-free as possible.
But that has zero to do with voter fraud.
It has a lot to do with it. We can't confirm legitimate votes. We can't confirm illegal votes. Now we have an alleged situation where potentially 1000's of registered voter records have been modified. Can we confirm if any of those voted illegally? nope. awesome.
1000s???!! Oh no, you mean out of the 100+ million votes every national election, whole 1000s might, might be illegal??
Someone get me some smelling salts because I feel the vapors coming on.
why would it have anything to do with the national tally? All that matters is the state total. Everyday you prove you're just a shill. No creative thoughts. No critical thinking. Just keyboard diarrhea.
lol I forget, you think this is just the tip of the iceberg and there is MASSIVE voter fraud everywhere all towards the Dems.
LMAO yes you definitely have "creative" thoughts alright.
nope your words only. more diarrhea. still a shill no matter how much you LMAO LOLZOMG CATS.
On top of what's already been said, many of the few instances of documented voter fraud is not even "on purpose". So a person showed up, cast a ballot by someone they aren't - but it is often by mistake (i.e. similar names, maiden names, etc.). There's no malintent by any party.
This whole voter rights thing can be cleared up rather quickly. Electronic voting is the only way to go. To open a ballot you need to key in your SSN. Every citizen has one. A few dead people in Chicago might still vote but aliens won't. And people won't vote twice. This is easy to do. My little hick County in Indiana got a Federal grant for hi tech machines. One SSN one vote. If you go to vote and it says you already voted using that SSN, prove you are the San holder and the other vote won't count. With today's technology I can't believe this can't be fixed.
Well, there's obviously multiple factors involved.
One is the obvious - money. Could you keep track of eligible voters/living/dead/who's moved, who hasn't.....sure. But that all is $.
The fact of the matter is that widespread voter fraud would be incredibly hard to pull off. I could be registered in Virginia, move to North Carolina - and register to vote there. And in theory if I don't complete all of the paper work involved, I could be on the voter rolls in both states. Then I could go vote in North Carolina, then drive 4 hours to go vote in Virginia - but that's a helluva lot of effort to get 1 additional vote. To have that be some operation on a level where there's differences of thousands and thousands of votes in a razor close race on a statewide basis - it's just not terribly feasible. For example, Florida was extremely close in 2012 - 50.01% to 49.13% - but that's a difference of 80,000 votes. You aren't going to have some underground operation of 80,000 fraudulent voters and get away with it.
Except that mail in ballots and absentee votes overwhelmingly go to Republicans pretty much every year. So if there's voter fraud via mail, it's not really helping the blues.
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Many undocumented workers actually do have SSNs, that's how they end up getting hired and how they end up actually paying federal taxes. So you would need a better system for dealing with SSNs.
Having said that, I actually agree with the idea that the fact that we sill trudge down to public polling places to vote is archaic and ridiculous given the tech ability we have now. Even simple vote by mail, which several states do, would be better. There would be systems you could establish to minimize voter fraud or repeated voting. There would be no more concerns with voter suppression, no more need for early voting fights, or whatnot.
We make voting a lot harder than it needs to be.
exactly...republicans dominate early mail voting and absentee voting in most states, while dems dominate early in-person voting in most states.
what? So because more R's vote than D's via mail in, a D fraud scheme wouldn't help them? A vote is a vote, however it is cast.
The real question in this matter is why do they have so many conspiracy theories. They're loaded with them.
Shhhh. Stop with the facts; your disrupting a perfectly good conspiracy theory.
There's a couple of points here:
1) There's claims out there that early returns show Trump winning in a landslide. That's largely because early and absentee votes often lean heavily Republican and are rarely indicative of the overall outcome of the GE.
2) Of course more votes for D matters overall, but your point was that voter fraud is done by mail, and I'm telling you that Rs typically win mail and absentee votes by a landslide overall (though not in places like California), you're really complaining about voter fraud favoring Democrats but not even so much as to move the needle in an overall small portion of the general election.
3) We can get into the electoral college if you want, but a vote cast is not a vote cast as pertains to the GE, and the popular vote is meaningless. Fraud only matters if it tips the electoral vote, and there's literally zero evidence that's ever happened (or probably ever will). California is probably the heaviest vote-by-mail state there is, and yet I don't even think you would assert that voter fraud is the reason this state goes blue every single election.
In other words, this is another desperation ploy akin to what Bernie Sanders did, and will work out pretty much the same for Trump.
This isn't a ploy. My point was that fraud can and does happen. Our system is not truly audit-able. Maybe they didn't make a difference in the GE but that's different than not happening.
In North St. Louis, incumbent Penny Hubbard won the 2016 Democratic primary for Missouri’s 78th House District by 90 votes. Her challenger, Bruce Franks Jr., contested the results, citing a lopsided absentee vote tally that heavily favored Hubbard. Franks had carried the in-person vote. District Judge Rex Burlison determined that a sufficient number of improper absentee ballots had been cast to change the results of the election, and ordered a second election. Franks won the redo by a margin of 1,533 votes.
Tell me more about how it doesn't happen.
no one said anything about it's never happened in a single local election. We are talking about a national Presidential election. 127 million people voted in the 2012 election. Obama won by 5 million votes. There are not 1 million fraudulent votes. There aren't even 100K fraudulent votes. I'd guess there aren't even 10K fraudulent votes, but let's assume there are. No evidence there are that many, but let's use it for ease of calculation.
That's .007%
I don't doubt the claims you are noting, but it's interesting we are seeing a ton of good news for early voting for Dems particularly in:
NC
FL
TX
NV
The news is unclear in OH and while Dems lead in IA, it's not as good as 2012. Also Ds are behind a little bit in GA.
I suspect this is for two reasons:
1. GOTV operations are dominated by Dems this time around because Trump's GOTV is ridiculously bad.
2. Enthusiasm is higher among Dems now than Reps.
Which is another reminder about polls. Polls only tell you who is "likely to vote" but if your GOTV operation is greatly inferior, then your actual performance will under perform, because there are always 2-5% of folks that only come out because you more or less begged, pleaded, and cajoled to come out and more importantly you properly identified who you need to beg, plead and cajole.
I think it's possible, if not likely, that Trump could/would win if the moderate Republican base was willing to support him, but a significant number are not. The Libertarian vote may not move the needle enough to cause a striking difference in the electoral vote directly, but I think the numbers in some of the swing states are going to be enough to ensure Hillary wins the GE and maybe in a rout. States that Trump otherwise had a shot in surpassing her, where the Lib vote goes 10% or so, I'd say a majority of those voters were likely to vote R if not for Trump, and I do think that will at least impact the results of the election, if not the outcome.
I'd say 50/50 as I still think there are structural advantages to the EC that still strongly favor any D right now including Hillary with her flaws for President...but it would be a toss-up and much closer than it would be with a less scandal-tinged candidate, and the Senate would be much more iffy as well.
The powers to be want to re-classify critical thinking as conspiracy theory. All they want is a bunch of pharma zombies addicted to technology who watches the NFL and Kardashians and takes pics of their food from Applebee's. And it is working beautifully for them.
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