Why the F was spike on the bench
- Thread starter slidde01
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I thought Painter left Thompson & Mathias in for too long of a stretch in the 2nd half. There were several things that dictated the outcome but I agree that Spike (& Carsen) should have came back in, say, after the under 8 minutes timeout. At least see what they can do for a few minutes before deciding whether or not to go back to Thompson & Mathias.
He couldnt? He looked pretty good to me in the minutes he played. Even if Painter favors Thompson & Mathias, why play them for basically 10 minutes straight to end the game? They're not so valuable that they need to play that long of a stretch.
Maybe it was because CE threw some bad passes? Maybe it was because PJ had a hot hand at times? Remember the half court shot? Maybe it was because Spike was getting out of position defensively, and was not fast enough to recover?
You put your 5 best guys out there and go against their best 5. Haas hits those FT's and we wouldn't be discussing this garbage.
You put your 5 best guys out there and go against their best 5. Haas hits those FT's and we wouldn't be discussing this garbage.
His inability to stay with guards as alleged was not the issue, nor is it accurate for that matter.
I am only guessing, but, I have to assume Painter was trying to limit his minutes or that he had indicated that he was not 100%...as there was no question that he played well when he did and that he is a rock solid guard and player for Purdue.
Mathias is generally a really heady and nice player, but, he was recruited for his ability to shoot the basketball, and he has struggled in that regard since he arrived, and missed several wide open and uncontested looks yet again...shots that he was recruited to make, and shots three years in that he simply has to make for Purdue to be as good as it can be, and certainly in order to be able to win a game like the one tonight.
my guess and like others just a guess is that Matt is more comfortable with PJ at this time. That may change over time, but PJ has been in some close games and understands what Matt wants. I think Spike could be a starter by the Big season and I too thought he would get more time. I just suspect it is a comfort level over many games with PJ...
Could be I suppose, but hard not to feel comfortable with a guy that has the experience that Spike does (and that far outweighs that of Thompson), never mind that he has been (and had been) productive when provided minutes and the opportunity.
I think with time you will see that. PJ has two whole seasons with Matt...Spike two games in a season. I really like Spike, but I'm guessing it was a comfort level in that he knew PJ knew what Matt wanted done...and sometimes coaches just get caught up in the moment. A close game blows up to 8 in 20 seconds sometimes...
Don't disagree on either, although I like Edwards ability and talent...he played like a freshman in his first big college basketball game unfortunately...but he did some nice things as well at both ends of the floor, and the guy is talented and has some moxie...I like what his future could hold, as he will improve in those areas that you had alluded to, and when he does, he is going to be a really nice player for Purdue I think.
You could very well be right...but, again, it was not as if Spike had not been productive and played well with the minutes that he got in the first half that he then saw zero in the second half if that is indeed the reason...that is why I suggested that it had more to do with limiting minutes or Spike maybe indicating that he was hurting or in some pain...he even moved from the point in the first half and played the 2, so, there was the opportunity to have him play with PJ.
The kid contributed when he was out there, and he has both experience, and big game experience...so no reason to not feel comfortable with him on the floor...maybe not as comfortable as with PJ due to his not having played as long or as much for Purdue, but, he certainly has shown the ability to be really good over his career and did nothing tonight with his extended minutes in the first half to raise any concerns about that.
Don't disagree with anything you said...but also know coaches and comfort level that gets earned. That is why I think Spike wins out over time...
I was surprised as well, especially towards the end when we needed a shooter (even a cold one from the bench... was CS the designed final shot?)
I just assumed he may have simply tweaked his hip or something when the handoff/offensive foul occurred
The only thing I think is it might have been due to his conditioning and recovery. He hasn't played in a game in a year? Dakota's one thing, make threes, was a void the last 5-6 minutes
no Biggie was NOT the designed shooter as I would be surprise if there was a single designed shooter. Instead it was more likely that scenarios were set, the team looked for an opening and Biggie tried to take it. Moments before Haas was removed with Nova going to the line up one with two FT's knowing a 3 would be needed. If it is a two or one point game or even a 3 with time...a play could be set up. In this situation, I suspect that Purdue just plays with their team understandings and roles as well as Nova knowing there is no threat to guard the 2. There were many single items that Purdue could have done over the game to win, but basically dribble penetration hurt as early season refs are calling it tighter. Carsen was put in because he doesn't need help to have a chance to hit a three and others do...and Nova was worried about any drives...just the three ball. Can't make it ...if you can't get it off
I can only answer for the last 15 seconds of the game. We needed to get a steal or foul immediately when Villanova was inbounding the ball. We had no timeouts left. The quickest/best guards Purdue has for that situation are PJ and Carsen. Then, after Villanova free throws, we had to push the ball up the court as quick as possible and also have somebody that can create their own shot if needed. Again, Carsen probably does that better than Spike.
I think Spike is great and a gamer. I want him in the game for key minutes too. But I think I understand the logic at the end of the game at any rate.
I think Spike is great and a gamer. I want him in the game for key minutes too. But I think I understand the logic at the end of the game at any rate.
Exactly on both counts - when they have five guys all quicker than Spike with their toes on the 3-point line ... he's not our best fit for that situation.
Regarding the whole 2nd half .... I am sure we don't have the breadth of info that the HC does. And there could be solid debate that he is the best guard we have. At least not for many situations. Especially ones against some of the quickest guards in the game.
Spike is twice as quick as Dakota.
If Dakota doesn't step it up, cline should be a shoe in to take the majority of his minutes.
PJ shot only 4 times all game; I would assert that his presence on the court was most definitely not because of his hot hand. The beyond half-court shot was electric when it went in, but those are a lot more luck than anything else. There's a reason people don't shoot often from 54 feet... it's kind of a low percentage area of the court. Him making it should in no way factor into a "hot hand" conclusion.Maybe it was because CE threw some bad passes? Maybe it was because PJ had a hot hand at times? Remember the half court shot? Maybe it was because Spike was getting out of position defensively, and was not fast enough to recover?
You put your 5 best guys out there and go against their best 5. Haas hits those FT's and we wouldn't be discussing this garbage.
I agree with your FT comment... seems like that one reared it's ugly head again early in the season. Free throw shooting is so critical in close games. Nova iced theirs, Purdue didn't. That was the clencher.
Agree, I mentioned the final play(s) since that is when I realized again he had not been in for so long!
Hopefully he can be healthy and available for more minutes soon
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I love them both. Dakota is the best post feeder I have seen in a long, long time. Not relevant at the end of this game, but totally relevant for the rest of the season. I think basing any assessments of future playing time on the 2nd game of the season is foolish. As long as we want most plays to go through our post players, Dakota will play.
He's also slow-footed for this level of basketball and was recruited in-part for his shooting, but he hasn't shot it all that well. He needs to step up and be more like how he was vs. Maryland last season.
Yep. we climbed back into the game with the players we ended with. Don't screw with what works.Maybe it was because CE threw some bad passes? Maybe it was because PJ had a hot hand at times? Remember the half court shot? Maybe it was because Spike was getting out of position defensively, and was not fast enough to recover?
You put your 5 best guys out there and go against their best 5. Haas hits those FT's and we wouldn't be discussing this garbage.
Maybe it is because, at this early juncture of the season, Painter is comfortable playing the guys he has had for 3 years now and knows exactly what he is going to get. Did you also think that Spike may be now feeling some soreness and stiffness from his recovery from double hip surgery? They may still be trying to figure out how to keep him warm during halftime so he doesn't stiffen up...or it could just be CMP makes the playing time decisions and is comfortable with other players at this point.
I've said it many times, but I think that Dakota is the most under-appreciated player on the team. He's a huge part of the reason why the bigs had so much success against Nova and his D is much better than he gets credit for. Although he has occasional off night's shooting the ball, he shoots well, passes well, generally doesn't turn the ball over, and makes great decisions, most of the time.
Even if that's true, which is isn't... why wouldn't you have him in for the last possession when we needed a 3?
agree, but I knew one way another that Biggie was going to take that last 3 and of course forced a awkward shot up
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