ADVERTISEMENT

Haas

He didn't play a full game either. Thus my dislike for all those per minute stats. I once scored 2 points in a junior high game playing 30 seconds. I made two free throws, so my ft % was 100%. I also grabbed two rebounds and made 0 turnovers. Using per minute stats, I would have been a basketball stud.

It's not really worth arguing the point. Simple statement... Swanigan played in tandem with Hammons, why didn't he play much in tandem with Haas?
 
He gave us 19.5mpg last year shooting 58% from the field and 71% from the free throw line and drawing a TON of fouls. I'll take whatever he can give us.

Purdue needs more than 19.5 MPG from him this season. Hopefully, he's in the best basketball shape of his life.
 
Purdue needs more than 19.5 MPG from him this season. Hopefully, he's in the best basketball shape of his life.
I'm sure he's just been sitting around eating cheetos...cmon man. That dude works. You don't get to be that size and have a 6 pack like that on accident. I have no doubt he will give us every second he can muster.
582e57a7e5e10.image.jpg
 
Purdue needs more than 19.5 MPG from him this season. Hopefully, he's in the best basketball shape of his life.
The last three seasons Purdue's options when Haas wasn't on the floor were AJ and Biggie. This year he is clearly superior to any of our other options at the 5. My guess is he will play 25 mins/game minimum.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dakota Girl
Purdue needs more than 19.5 MPG from him this season. Hopefully, he's in the best basketball shape of his life.
If you are simply reading his per game average minutes you are missing the why part of the story. Stats without context are at best suspect and likely misleading. Now add context. He has previously been the backup 5 to AJ and biggie. He is in incredible physical shape. Your conclusion should be different than your original inference that he is not in adequate shape to play more minutes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BoiledSteel
Haas will have competition this year from both Haarms and Taylor for playing time, and maybe Ewing. if V Edwards slides over to PF, Ewing may slide over to C in a small ball lineup.

Haas averaged 19 minutes last year , when he could have averaged more with biggie at PF. But painter didn't like that pairing for some reason.

Going in this year, Taylor is fully healthy. he was a stud in high school as a junior before his injuries. Maybe he'll return to form. Ewing was the juco's #1 best PF last year. I have to believe he'll have something to prove.

I want to see Haas succeed, but he will have quality competition. and that's a good thing.
 
  • Like
Reactions: nagemj02
Haas will have competition this year from both Haarms and Taylor for playing time, and maybe Ewing. if V Edwards slides over to PF, Ewing may slide over to C in a small ball lineup.

Haas averaged 19 minutes last year , when he could have averaged more with biggie at PF. But painter didn't like that pairing for some reason.

Going in this year, Taylor is fully healthy. he was a stud in high school as a junior before his injuries. Maybe he'll return to form. Ewing was the juco's #1 best PF last year. I have to believe he'll have something to prove.

I want to see Haas succeed, but he will have quality competition. and that's a good thing.
Calling Taylor a stud in high school is a little over the top. I hope he is good but he was an unranked 3 star.

Every indication is that Haarms isn't ready physically to play center. I hope he is by the season's start but am not confident.

Ewing is 6'7 max. He' played some center for his JUCO but he's a PF for a Big Ten team.

No way barring injury does Haas average less than 25 minutes IMO.
 
Calling Taylor a stud in high school is a little over the top. I hope he is good but he was an unranked 3 star.

Every indication is that Haarms isn't ready physically to play center. I hope he is by the season's start but am not confident.

Ewing is 6'7 max. He' played some center for his JUCO but he's a PF for a Big Ten team.

No way barring injury does Haas average less than 25 minutes IMO.

Where is this info on Haarms. I think it was BoilerBuck that said Haarms would not be ready to contribute much this year. I'm by no means saying either of you are wrong, just that I am unaware of how he is doing. I know nto going to China sets him back some, but the rest I don't know. Are there articles, people watching practice...coaching leaks...what are the info on Haarms and where do I read it if possible. I think I saw him up to 250# which is heavier than many playing the 5 spot...and many of those 5's not having his length.

Again, none of this says Haarms will see a lot of time...I just want to learn what others apparently know...
 
Haas will have competition this year from both Haarms and Taylor for playing time, and maybe Ewing. if V Edwards slides over to PF, Ewing may slide over to C in a small ball lineup.

Haas averaged 19 minutes last year , when he could have averaged more with biggie at PF. But painter didn't like that pairing for some reason.

Going in this year, Taylor is fully healthy. he was a stud in high school as a junior before his injuries. Maybe he'll return to form. Ewing was the juco's #1 best PF last year. I have to believe he'll have something to prove.

I want to see Haas succeed, but he will have quality competition. and that's a good thing.
I don't have stats to back up my memories of last season but my guess as to why Haas and Biggie were not on the floor together more frequently is that having two bigs with less than remarkable lateral agility hurt us defensively. I liked them together on offense but on defense they created copious pick and roll opportunities.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Roeder
Calling Taylor a stud in high school is a little over the top. I hope he is good but he was an unranked 3 star.

Every indication is that Haarms isn't ready physically to play center. I hope he is by the season's start but am not confident.

Ewing is 6'7 max. He' played some center for his JUCO but he's a PF for a Big Ten team.

No way barring injury does Haas average less than 25 minutes IMO.
Taylor will shut all the negative critics up this year and next....

He going to ball out and rip some rims off.

JT is ripped and ready to rumble!
 
Taylor will shut all the negative critics up this year and next....

He going to ball out and rip some rims off.

JT is ripped and ready to rumble!

Hope so, Chevy. JT is one of the "wild cards" for this season. Worst case scenario, CMP doesn't have as much flexibility to rest or keep Isaac Haas out of foul trouble. I think the big fella as a senior is ready to go if that's the case.

We don't know how this season will play out results wise, but I'm starting to think that maybe the ceiling is actually a little higher this year, despite losing a great leader with the retirement of the "Chairman of the Boards." Of course, with the summer sun down here, I've usually got my B & G shades handy.
 
Taylor will shut all the negative critics up this year and next....

He going to ball out and rip some rims off.

JT is ripped and ready to rumble!
I hope for JT and yourself that you are right. I have pulled for this kid and you have pulled even harder...I hope he gets reaches his goal this year
 
  • Like
Reactions: SIBoiler2
Calling Taylor a stud in high school is a little over the top. I hope he is good but he was an unranked 3 star.

Every indication is that Haarms isn't ready physically to play center. I hope he is by the season's start but am not confident.

Ewing is 6'7 max. He' played some center for his JUCO but he's a PF for a Big Ten team.

No way barring injury does Haas average less than 25 minutes IMO.
IIRC, before his injury, Taylor was very highly regarded. His low rating was based on no one seeing him play. One analyst admitted it.

I'm curious about "every indication" saying Haarms is not physically ready to play center. He gained weight and muscle (up to 250 lbs). He has practiced for a year against Haas and Biggie. G&B had a story stating Painter and players are very pleased with his progress. What indications have you seen that are different?
 
  • Like
Reactions: punaj
Where is this info on Haarms. I think it was BoilerBuck that said Haarms would not be ready to contribute much this year. I'm by no means saying either of you are wrong, just that I am unaware of how he is doing. I know nto going to China sets him back some, but the rest I don't know. Are there articles, people watching practice...coaching leaks...what are the info on Haarms and where do I read it if possible. I think I saw him up to 250# which is heavier than many playing the 5 spot...and many of those 5's not having his length.

Again, none of this says Haarms will see a lot of time...I just want to learn what others apparently know...

Matt Painter was quoted a couple of months ago something to the effect of "Matt Haarms is going to be good. We just don't know when."

The implication most media members took from that was that he was a ways off from being productive.
 
Matt Painter was quoted a couple of months ago something to the effect of "Matt Haarms is going to be good. We just don't know when."

The implication most media members took from that was that he was a ways off from being productive.
Yes I remember that. I never took it the same way. I think that may have been in Mackey with those in perfect attendance. I also recall and posted after that get together that Matt stated he was a steal. I took it that Matt was VERY happy to have Haarms and his celing was really high...not sure how long it would take him to get as good as he could. I never took that as negative...but I could have taken it wrong. We shall soon see, but boy would I like for him to be a contributor with his height adn lateral movement. Can you imagine "IF" he can pass..and with his shooting be at the high post with Haas sealing down low?
 
  • Like
Reactions: nagemj02
I remember Taylor being one of the top 10 rated centers in his class before his injury. he was considered a coup when we first started recruiting him. and then by not playing his senior year, his ranking took a nosedive. that being said, this will be his 3rd (?) year at Purdue. I'm not sure if he's fully healthy. I also don't know if he will be as good as he once was. I had thought he'd be fully healthy last year. he's obviously a wildcard. but he also shouldn't be discarded. At one time , he was rated higher than Haas. but admittedly, that was 4/5 years ago.

To me, Haarms is a project. he can shoot the three. he's tall and big and supposedly quick. but his competition has been very suspect. I have no idea about his ability to play defense. When being recruited, the reports on him were that he was a very tall perimeter player, and not a dominant inside man. based on those reports, my thoughts were that we still needed a dominant inside man, because Haarms was better suited to be a 4 than 5.

this brings up two questions. Haarms spent half of last year practicing at Purdue. Did he spend that time learning how to play inside? and the center position? Did he learn how to play defense? or did he just spend his time bulking up? perhaps that was what Painter was alluding to. Haarms is a great physical specimen, but he hasn't quite learned how to play the position Painter wants him to play. He has talents, but also deficiencies. is that what painter meant when he said he'd be great some day? then again, very few coaches berate their players' ability.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mathboy
Yes I remember that. I never took it the same way. I think that may have been in Mackey with those in perfect attendance. I also recall and posted after that get together that Matt stated he was a steal. I took it that Matt was VERY happy to have Haarms and his celing was really high...not sure how long it would take him to get as good as he could. I never took that as negative...but I could have taken it wrong. We shall soon see, but boy would I like for him to be a contributor with his height adn lateral movement. Can you imagine "IF" he can pass..and with his shooting be at the high post with Haas sealing down low?


I can't imagine that. As was pointed out earlier, Painter didn't like pairing has with Swanigan. So I doubt he pairs Haas up with haarms very much if at all this year. I can see Haas paired up with V Edwards or Ewing, or Wheeler. has and Haarms on the floor at the same time? I don't see it, but it could prove interesting. When the rest of the world goes small ball, we go BIG !
 
I don't have stats to back up my memories of last season but my guess as to why Haas and Biggie were not on the floor together more frequently is that having two bigs with less than remarkable lateral agility hurt us defensively. I liked them together on offense but on defense they created copious pick and roll opportunities.
From what I remember, Painter was not happy with the level of TO's the team would suffer when both of them were in there together. That coupled with your point of defensive shortcomings is probably the main reasons we didn't see them together. Though I do recall a few stretches of pure domination when they were in there together...
 
I remember Taylor being one of the top 10 rated centers in his class before his injury. he was considered a coup when we first started recruiting him. and then by not playing his senior year, his ranking took a nosedive. that being said, this will be his 3rd (?) year at Purdue. I'm not sure if he's fully healthy. I also don't know if he will be as good as he once was. I had thought he'd be fully healthy last year. he's obviously a wildcard. but he also shouldn't be discarded. At one time , he was rated higher than Haas. but admittedly, that was 4/5 years ago.

To me, Haarms is a project. he can shoot the three. he's tall and big and supposedly quick. but his competition has been very suspect. I have no idea about his ability to play defense. When being recruited, the reports on him were that he was a very tall perimeter player, and not a dominant inside man. based on those reports, my thoughts were that we still needed a dominant inside man, because Haarms was better suited to be a 4 than 5.

this brings up two questions. Haarms spent half of last year practicing at Purdue. Did he spend that time learning how to play inside? and the center position? Did he learn how to play defense? or did he just spend his time bulking up? perhaps that was what Painter was alluding to. Haarms is a great physical specimen, but he hasn't quite learned how to play the position Painter wants him to play. He has talents, but also deficiencies. is that what painter meant when he said he'd be great some day? then again, very few coaches berate their players' ability.

This will be Jacquil Taylor's fourth year at Purdue. He was part of the 2014 class with Mathias, V. Edwards, Haas, and Thompson (and grad transfer PG Jon Octeus). Taylor was 19 when he graduated HS, so he's actually the oldest player on the team.
 
From what I remember, Painter was not happy with the level of TO's the team would suffer when both of them were in there together. That coupled with your point of defensive shortcomings is probably the main reasons we didn't see them together. Though I do recall a few stretches of pure domination when they were in there together...
Yes, that does sound familiar. There were some stretches high low basketball that were beautiful but other issues killed it.
 
I am a big fan of Isaac Haas. He plays best and is most effective when he gets mad, which is rare because he is such a nice guy. When he gets mad, he gets aggressive. When he gets aggressive he goes up strong to the basket rather than fading away.

When he gets the ball and goes straight up with it, he is unstoppable and usually draws a foul.
 
I can't imagine that. As was pointed out earlier, Painter didn't like pairing has with Swanigan. So I doubt he pairs Haas up with haarms very much if at all this year. I can see Haas paired up with V Edwards or Ewing, or Wheeler. has and Haarms on the floor at the same time? I don't see it, but it could prove interesting. When the rest of the world goes small ball, we go BIG !

It wasn't necessarily Biggie & Haas that Painter didn't like together. Last season Biggie only sat 7.5mpg & Isaac played 19.5mpg which seems to indicate Biggie was on the floor more often than not during Isaac's minutes.

The actual lineup philosophy change that Painter made in the middle of the season was to stop playing Biggie, Vince, and Isaac all at the same time. Remember, they all started together for the first 7 games (Haas & Biggie ended up starting the first 15 together). I seem to remember Painter specifically citing TOs as the reason for the change. The move seemed to help. The team was at 15.7 TO/g thru Louisville & averaged 12.3 TO/g the rest of the way. Vince, in particular, seemed to hold on to the ball much better after becoming the starting "4." Vince was at 3.1 TO/g thru Louisville, and dropped to 1.3 TO/g the rest of the way.

I'm not sure what that tells us about next year except I expect Vince to begin this season as the starting "4."
 
I can't imagine that. As was pointed out earlier, Painter didn't like pairing has with Swanigan. So I doubt he pairs Haas up with haarms very much if at all this year. I can see Haas paired up with V Edwards or Ewing, or Wheeler. has and Haarms on the floor at the same time? I don't see it, but it could prove interesting. When the rest of the world goes small ball, we go BIG !
I don't know how quick Haarms is. He may be better than biggie off the dribble on O and not sure how his D shakes put. Every team wants 7 footers that play like guards. Matt will play what will work for the best combination on O and D since a player has to do both. I'm anxious to learn about the players.
 
The big reason Haas and Biggie did not play more last year was that in a game early on, they both got into foul trouble and when Smotherman left that was MP's biggest nightmare. Purdue was at its best with our front court of Haas, Biggie and Vince. We dominated with that lineup, but IMO MP kept talking himself out of it. I love Matt, but that was his biggest mistake last year by far.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mediaexpert
I have an opinion about Haas and the calls. I believe we are being told a bunch of bunk about the officials and their problem with his size. I think he is doing little things to get called for fouling. And the coaching staff has not been able to help him adjust. The pro-evaluation camp is a great place to learn more about that and that to me is the only hope that he will finally make that adjustment. He does reach a lot on defense. Foul. He doesn't have good defensive footwork. Foul. He gets those things straightened out and he will be really good. Fundamentals, fundamentals, fundamentals. Get in the stance.
Last year there was a story published about how a referee admitted that they were not giving Haas a fair shake.

Many times we saw an opposing player put his face against the back of Haas' arm, step under it so that his own head went backwards, and then act like Haas initiated the contact. The refs fell for it way too many times.
 
The big reason Haas and Biggie did not play more last year was that in a game early on, they both got into foul trouble and when Smotherman left that was MP's biggest nightmare. Purdue was at its best with our front court of Haas, Biggie and Vince. We dominated with that lineup, but IMO MP kept talking himself out of it. I love Matt, but that was his biggest mistake last year by far.

You said it yourself though...when Smotherman left, it took CMP's ability to do so out the window. If Haas and Biggie got 3 fouls quickly, who would have played the 5?
 
There were many times last year we could have used Taylor. And a couple of times when I thought Painter gave consideration to actually putting Haarms in and wasting his red shirt year. And there were a couple of games when it looked like Painter told Swanigan and Haas to be less aggressive and hopefully not get another foul. It was obvious by their court efforts when they were aggressive and when they played matador defense .
 
You said it yourself though...when Smotherman left, it took CMP's ability to do so out the window. If Haas and Biggie got 3 fouls quickly, who would have played the 5?

That is EXACTLY my point. We lost a minimum of 4 games, because we were afraid of a worse case scenario. I understand the fear, but it is like playing a star player less, because you would have trouble replacing him, if he got injured.
 
I have no idea what smotherman did, nor do I care. but his loss did affect several games we could have won which ultimately led to a lower seed. if we had won two more games, we could have easily been a #3 seed and avoided Kansas. although the #2 seeds were no slouch. However, we wouldn't have had to play Kansas at Kansas.
 
The big reason Haas and Biggie did not play more last year was that in a game early on, they both got into foul trouble and when Smotherman left that was MP's biggest nightmare. Purdue was at its best with our front court of Haas, Biggie and Vince. We dominated with that lineup, but IMO MP kept talking himself out of it. I love Matt, but that was his biggest mistake last year by far.

Analytics from last season showed that Purdue was more effective (at least offensively) when V. Edwards, Swanigan, and Haas were NOT all in the game at the same time. There are decisions (or indecisions) made by CMP that I don't agree with, but this was not one of them.
 
that's what I like about this year's team. it will be very hard to double team one player, because another one will burn you. and unlike the past, where we've seen sagging defenses, we have the perimeter power to keep teams honest.

I even think we might have the skill players to incorporate a full court press.
Would that be a zone press, by chance?
 
I expect a big year from Haas. He's out of the shadows of BIggie and AJH and will need to be a leader. His skill set is more polished than at any time before and I have seen more than one senior get the benefit of favorable officiating in the B1G and think that may be the case here. If so he'll get as many minutes as he can handle and on a per minute basis nobody is better.
 
The big reason Haas and Biggie did not play more last year was that in a game early on, they both got into foul trouble and when Smotherman left that was MP's biggest nightmare. Purdue was at its best with our front court of Haas, Biggie and Vince. We dominated with that lineup, but IMO MP kept talking himself out of it. I love Matt, but that was his biggest mistake last year by far.
no question Purdue was thin with Taylor hurt and Basil gone. However, even when Basil was there many considered to O smoother when only one big was in. This is a new year with some different pieces. I have no idea what will happen because I really don't have an idea of strengths and weaknesses...I only surmise based on what I read...which may be 180 degrees off
 
For Purdue to be a top ten team this year, Haas will have to play at least 28 minutes per game. Our offense will center around getting the ball down to Haas, which will open up the 3 point game. Haas will also shoot more left hand hooks and take a lot more jump shots, as his FT% suggests he should. Haas is also our best TEAM defender. Vince, Dakota, PJ and Carson all did very well on their man and also surprised many a player on their double teams, BUT when Haas was in the game the opp scored a lot less inside. Haas needs to grow in one area - rebounding. Now that we have depth at the big man spot, Haas can be more aggressive. Last year, he settled for keeping his man off the board. This year, Haas needs to go nuts and go after every D rebound. Go Haas GO! We have faith in you.
 
  • Like
Reactions: todd brewster
For Purdue to be a top ten team this year, Haas will have to play at least 28 minutes per game. Our offense will center around getting the ball down to Haas, which will open up the 3 point game. Haas will also shoot more left hand hooks and take a lot more jump shots, as his FT% suggests he should. Haas is also our best TEAM defender. Vince, Dakota, PJ and Carson all did very well on their man and also surprised many a player on their double teams, BUT when Haas was in the game the opp scored a lot less inside. Haas needs to grow in one area - rebounding. Now that we have depth at the big man spot, Haas can be more aggressive. Last year, he settled for keeping his man off the board. This year, Haas needs to go nuts and go after every D rebound. Go Haas GO! We have faith in you.

I disagree. If Ewing is what they are talking him up to be, he brings a great change of pace. Ewing/Taylor are better for Carsen/Eastern because they are a threat outside the post and stretch the defense. If Eastern and Ewing are good enough to take major minutes, Haas. Hold hold steady at 20 minutes and they will be highly successful. We had nothing like Ewing, Eastern, or Wheeler on the roster last year. If Paintee follows the same formula as last year you are correct. If he adapts, there are many other roster choices.
 
  • Like
Reactions: boilermc
He didn't play a full game either. Thus my dislike for all those per minute stats. I once scored 2 points in a junior high game playing 30 seconds. I made two free throws, so my ft % was 100%. I also grabbed two rebounds and made 0 turnovers. Using per minute stats, I would have been a basketball stud.

It's not really worth arguing the point. Simple statement... Swanigan played in tandem with Hammons, why didn't he play much in tandem with Haas?
Come on Wolegib you're a math guy. You KNOW your 30 second stats are an incredibly small sample size compared to Haas' 3 seasons:rolleyes:.
The reason the approach changed from the 2015 season to the 2016 season is because the offenses guard/wing play was so much better in 16 than 15. Remember no one in 2015 shot all that well from deep range. That is why we saw five defenders with at least one foot in the paint at all times.
 
  • Like
Reactions: todd brewster
Where is this info on Haarms. I think it was BoilerBuck that said Haarms would not be ready to contribute much this year. I'm by no means saying either of you are wrong, just that I am unaware of how he is doing. I know nto going to China sets him back some, but the rest I don't know. Are there articles, people watching practice...coaching leaks...what are the info on Haarms and where do I read it if possible. I think I saw him up to 250# which is heavier than many playing the 5 spot...and many of those 5's not having his length.

Again, none of this says Haarms will see a lot of time...I just want to learn what others apparently know...
TJ, you referring to the WUG? Its in Taiwan this year.
 
Analytics from last season showed that Purdue was more effective (at least offensively) when V. Edwards, Swanigan, and Haas were NOT all in the game at the same time. There are decisions (or indecisions) made by CMP that I don't agree with, but this was not one of them.

Sorry, my response to your post earlier was not posted for some reason.

I am asking for the source of the analytics for last year. I am a numbers guy and I watched all the games last year and with few exceptions, our big lineup dominated. When they were together either the score went in our directions or their big men picked up multiple fouls. Ingrained in my mind was in the Tournament and how the big lineup was a game changer against Vermont and it set up the win against Iowa State. We went to it too late against Kansas.
 
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT