Donald Trump removes the CJCOS from the NSC, replaces him with fringe rightwing news boss Bannon

[ComradeRedBoilermaker]

Not even the conservatives I know in real life are defending this. He is surrounding himself by yes men rather than actually qualified people.

If I voted for trump I would be embarrassed and ashamed right now

 

[32zone]

Not even the conservatives I know in real life are defending this. He is surrounding himself by yes men rather than actually qualified people.

If I voted for trump I would be embarrassed and ashamed right now

Drain the swamp!

 

[SKYDOG]

Drain the swamp!

Well Obama ran on getting rid of the lobbyist; did nothing, and Trump just did something about it. The swamp is starting to lose water.

 

[ComradeRedBoilermaker]

Well Obama ran on getting rid of the lobbyist; did nothing, and Trump just did something about it. The swamp is starting to lose water.

filling key cabinet positions with bankers and CEOs and putting american national security in the hands of a editor of a blog is "draining the swamp"?

 

[SKYDOG]

filling key cabinet positions with bankers and CEOs and putting american national security in the hands of a editor of a blog is "draining the swamp"?

I'm talking about lobbyist and you suggest I said what? Are you on something?

filling key cabinet positions with bankers and CEOs and putting american national security in the hands of a editor of a blog is "draining the swamp"?

He didn't appoint career politicians like has been done in the past. Who did you want him to appoint Madonna and Rachel Madoff?

 

[ComradeRedBoilermaker]

I'm talking about lobbyist and you suggest I said what? Are you on something?

He didn't appoint career politicians like has been done in the past. Who did you want him to appoint Madonna and Rachel Madoff?

Who gives a damn that he didn't appoint "career politicians" to those posts. People complain all the time about Washington corruption (and it is massively corrupt), but never ask who is doing the corrupting.

And yeah, you were talking about lobbyists. Who employs those lobbyists? All Donald trump has done is cut out the middle men. Instead of employing the representatives of the corrupting influences, he has employed the corrupting influences directly.


Donald Trump promised to guard the hen house. Instead he has appointed the very wolves that have always threatened it to guard it.

 

[lbodel]

Well Obama ran on getting rid of the lobbyist; did nothing, and Trump just did something about it. The swamp is starting to lose water.

And also weakened...

"Also, the new rules allow departing executive branch employees to take private sector jobs and then informally lobby the administration, as long as they are not registered as a lobbyist, a type of activity previously prohibited for two years."

 

[gr8indoorsman]

Drain the swamp!

The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, an appointed four-star FOGO, is part of "the Swamp"? Yikes.

 

[ecouch]

Flag officer/general officer. I learned something new today. I then managed to rabbit hole wikipedia on armed forces rankings and units for an hour.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_officer

 

[Purdue97]

Cannot say I think this is a good idea.

But would add there is plenty of military perspective/experience still on the NSC.

 

[Bruce1]

Who gives a damn that he didn't appoint "career politicians" to those posts. People complain all the time about Washington corruption (and it is massively corrupt), but never ask who is doing the corrupting.

And yeah, you were talking about lobbyists. Who employs those lobbyists? All Donald trump has done is cut out the middle men. Instead of employing the representatives of the corrupting influences, he has employed the corrupting influences directly.


Donald Trump promised to guard the hen house. Instead he has appointed the very wolves that have always threatened it to guard it.

Most liberals complain about appointing rich people to cabinet posts without assessing their capabilities to be effective. Too many people come to Washington with the objective of getting rich by cultivating relationships, endearing themselves to lobbyists, etc. Most of Trump's cabinet are wealthy people so what have they got to gain? Very little financially...they sure don't need the money. So why would they do it? Could it be possible that they love this country and want to do something to help? What a novel thought. Patriotism. SMH

 

[BoilerBiker]

Most liberals complain about appointing rich people to cabinet posts without assessing their capabilities to be effective. Too many people come to Washington with the objective of getting rich by cultivating relationships, endearing themselves to lobbyists, etc. Most of Trump's cabinet are wealthy people so what have they got to gain? Very little financially...they sure don't need the money. So why would they do it? Could it be possible that they love this country and want to do something to help? What a novel thought. Patriotism. SMH

i think you are correct.
nothing to gain financially, only patriotism, or power, clout, etc which cannot always be bought

some may not be burdened by the fact that income and performance would actually affect their job.
(unlike those who depend on job results and the corresponding money to live)

should also save much taxpayer money/budgets when they decline pay since it is not needed

 

[ComradeRedBoilermaker]

Most liberals complain about appointing rich people to cabinet posts without assessing their capabilities to be effective. Too many people come to Washington with the objective of getting rich by cultivating relationships, endearing themselves to lobbyists, etc. Most of Trump's cabinet are wealthy people so what have they got to gain? Very little financially...they sure don't need the money. So why would they do it? Could it be possible that they love this country and want to do something to help? What a novel thought. Patriotism. SMH

rich people don't become rich by getting to a position of wealth and saying to themselves "yeah, this is nice, i don't need anymore money"

 

[Beeazlebub]

Flag officer/general officer. I learned something new today. I then managed to rabbit hole wikipedia on armed forces rankings and units for an hour.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_officer

Rules of Acquisition 43.2 - Never admit to learning anything on the GD forum

 

[Purdue97]

rich people don't become rich by getting to a position of wealth and saying to themselves "yeah, this is nice, i don't need anymore money"

That may or may not be true. Depends on the individual.

And for successful/wealthy businessman, investors, etc., the last place they would go to make more money is the government. They simply do not need to.

If they really wanted more money they would have stayed in civilian sector. Tillerson/Mattis/banking execs simply do not care or need the $150,000-$200,000 they are making. All would have made exponentially more as civilians.

I think the problem is that one supports a certain party/politician, looks at the Clinton's and assume/project that is how all people are or why they are in government. Just not true.

 

[Bruce1]

rich people don't become rich by getting to a position of wealth and saying to themselves "yeah, this is nice, i don't need anymore money"

Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, etc. and by the way, the point was that the Libs, accuse them of going into office solely to make more money. The rich people could make more money by staying out of politics and focusing on themselves. On the otherhand Politicians want to win elections so that they can go to Washington to get connected to the rich so that they can get rich.

 

[kescwi]

Most liberals complain about appointing rich people to cabinet posts without assessing their capabilities to be effective. Too many people come to Washington with the objective of getting rich by cultivating relationships, endearing themselves to lobbyists, etc. Most of Trump's cabinet are wealthy people so what have they got to gain? Very little financially...they sure don't need the money. So why would they do it? Could it be possible that they love this country and want to do something to help? What a novel thought. Patriotism. SMH

Lord this gets funnier by the day, with Obama/Clinton it was crony capitalism, Goldman/Wall Street owned them... but with Trump, well it's just common sense, smart, to surround yourself with these people.

 

[kescwi]

The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, an appointed four-star FOGO, is part of "the Swamp"? Yikes.

I guess he really does feel he knows more than the generals.

 

[Purdue97]

Lord this gets funnier by the day, with Obama/Clinton it was crony capitalism, Goldman/Wall Street owned them... but with Trump, well it's just common sense, smart, to surround yourself with these people.

No would just say I think you missed the point.

Obama/Clinton ran campaigns attacking those people/groups. Reality was they were more in bed with them than any other politician in terms of donations, raising money, etc. Pretty two faced and hypocritical.

As for Trump he is real about it. He likes the fact that they are successful business people and know the art of the deal. That they are not nobody political hacks that could not do anything else so they went into politics. He bragged about them his entire campaign and has them in cabinet positions/advisory roles now.

That is the difference between the two.

Now will it work for him who knows? He has really pissed off a lot of his cabinet already with the immigration order. I do not think they really care too much about the NSC deal. The people that are no longer there will be there when their voice is needed on a subject and the JCOS will know what is going on from Mattis, etc

 

[kescwi]

No would just say I think you missed the point.

Obama/Clinton ran campaigns attacking those people/groups. Reality was they were more in bed with them than any other politician in terms of donations, raising money, etc. Pretty two faced and hypocritical.

As for Trump he is real about it. He likes the fact that they are successful business people and know the art of the deal. That they are not nobody political hacks that could not do anything else so they went into politics. He bragged about them his entire campaign and has them in cabinet positions/advisory roles now.

That is the difference between the two.

Now will it work for him who knows? He has really pissed off a lot of his cabinet already with the immigration order. I do not think they really care too much about the NSC deal. The people that are no longer there will be there when their voice is needed on a subject and the JCOS will know what is going on from Mattis, etc

No I didn't miss the point. It's been a problem with administrations from both parties for some time now, this is just business as usual but for some it's okay this time because Trump has an "R" beside his name.

 

[TopSecretBoiler]

Not even the conservatives I know in real life are defending this. He is surrounding himself by yes men rather than actually qualified people.

If I voted for trump I would be embarrassed and ashamed right now

Why? I think it's hilarious. Did anyone really doubt he would clean house? Lead, follow or get out of the way, but mostly, just get the f out of the way. lol

 

[lbodel]

No would just say I think you missed the point.

Obama/Clinton ran campaigns attacking those people/groups. Reality was they were more in bed with them than any other politician in terms of donations, raising money, etc. Pretty two faced and hypocritical.

As for Trump he is real about it. He likes the fact that they are successful business people and know the art of the deal. That they are not nobody political hacks that could not do anything else so they went into politics. He bragged about them his entire campaign and has them in cabinet positions/advisory roles now.

That is the difference between the two.

Now will it work for him who knows? He has really pissed off a lot of his cabinet already with the immigration order. I do not think they really care too much about the NSC deal. The people that are no longer there will be there when their voice is needed on a subject and the JCOS will know what is going on from Mattis, etc

It should concern you that you actually wrote "I don't think they really care too much about the NSC deal."

They don't care??

Just like how Trump doesn't need to read security briefings? And how Trump will just have someone else sit in meetings for him if he doesn't want to go?

There are aspects of being an "outsider" that's good, but he has no experience in any of this stuff - he should be trying to learn and its clear he doesn't want to learn, just go off his gut. We've already seen his cabinet positions get pissed off multiple times now that they weren't informed or consulted about things he's doing. Is that really how you want someone to handle our national security?

 

[Bruce1]

Lord this gets funnier by the day, with Obama/Clinton it was crony capitalism, Goldman/Wall Street owned them... but with Trump, well it's just common sense, smart, to surround yourself with these people.

I never complained about the appointees from the Clintons but now that you bring it up, hmmm, let's see who went from "not being able to pay their mortgage " to having a new worth of what? $150 million? In 15 years? Well, I rest my case.

 

[Purdue97]

It should concern you that you actually wrote "I don't think they really care too much about the NSC deal."

They don't care??

Just like how Trump doesn't need to read security briefings? And how Trump will just have someone else sit in meetings for him if he doesn't want to go?

There are aspects of being an "outsider" that's good, but he has no experience in any of this stuff - he should be trying to learn and its clear he doesn't want to learn, just go off his gut. We've already seen his cabinet positions get pissed off multiple times now that they weren't informed or consulted about things he's doing. Is that really how you want someone to handle our national security?

Because as far as the NSC deal goes there is plenty of military experience on there and the SecDef will let him/JCS what is going on if he is not there. Also, was reported yesterday that JCS will often be there but would not be involved if meeting was about natural disaster or dealt with interior. Trust me, not like the JCS does not have a million other things to do.

As far as Trump and meetings, and this applied to every President, one simply cannot make every one, and that is why you have a staff. And in fairness, Trump did say he would be notified of changes in briefings but did not need to sit in and read it if nothing changed-that he could remember it. Not as detached as it is made out to be. And in reality, security/intel briefings often have highlighted changes, so one does not have to read the entire deal.

Do I think Trump being an outsider will work? I think with some things it will be a good change, others not so much. Think I pointed that out that he already pissed off a lot of staff. That said, maybe his cabinet gets approved and some of these Sec get in his ear more about how to,roll things out. I like the NSC/NSA now much more than I did-not that that is saying much.

 

[Purdue97]

No I didn't miss the point. It's been a problem with administrations from both parties for some time now, this is just business as usual but for some it's okay this time because Trump has an "R" beside his name.

Point being, the people Trump appointed, and Trump himself are already wealthy. They did not use govt, or business connections in govt to get wealthy or raise a lot of money. Pretty big difference as of now. If it changes will stand corrected.

 

[kescwi]

Point being, the people Trump appointed, and Trump himself are already wealthy. They did not use govt, or business connections in govt to get wealthy or raise a lot of money. Pretty big difference as of now. If it changes will stand corrected.

I know and it sounds good in theory but I doubt Rubin, Paulson, Lew... needed money when they took over the Treasury, don't have time to go through all cab. positions. But then, yes, you have the other side of academics and bureaucrats who may not come in with money but seem to do pretty well when they leave.

Maybe this time will be different, but on the surface it looks to me like more of the same, just different rationalizations.