A.D. search

[njm8845]

He's trending upward for regular season success (i.e. reaching the tournament), but he's been on a straight line the past few years when it comes to postseason success.

I simply don't believe that certain coaches "can't" win in the tournament. It's like the baseball playoffs - a lot of luck with match ups, but if you just get there enough, eventually you'll break through.

Calipari, wright, and Ryan are examples of coaches who people said couldn't win in the ncaa tournament. Virginia's coach is currently like this. And it's bogus.

 

[nat100]

I simply don't believe that certain coaches "can't" win in the tournament. It's like the baseball playoffs - a lot of luck with match ups, but if you just get there enough, eventually you'll break through.

Calipari, wright, and Ryan are examples of coaches who people said couldn't win in the ncaa tournament. Virginia's coach is currently like this. And it's bogus.

When did anyone say calipari couldn't win in the tournament?

 

[Dakota Girl]

I'm not so sure. Purdue's track record is that of the 35 head coaches in its history, 18 have a .500 or better career record, albeit many early coaches were 1 or 2 years and gone.
Had you said recent track record, wellllll, a little different, but that would hardly be regardless of the AD though.
I'm not trying to slam Burke. Unfortunately recent football hires just haven't worked. I believe that he has tried to make good hires within the budget constraints that he felt appropriate. I have no problem with disagreeing with his assesments both as to budget constraints or hiring choices, but I really am finding it more and more tiresome to keep reading that it is either somehow intentional by him or that he simply doesn't care. I just find that hard to accept.

You touch on a topic I wonder about when reading comments on AD's. Many posters imply that Burke is cheap. I would assume that he is given a budget to manage, not an open ended fund to increase or decrease at his discretion, like my wife has. Point being that Burke and the next AD can only do so much. If we knew the breakdown of how he chose to slice the pie we could complain about that, and undoubtedly would, but the size of the pie is not the fault of the AD.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

I'm not so sure. Purdue's track record is that of the 35 head coaches in its history, 18 have a .500 or better career record, albeit many early coaches were 1 or 2 years and gone.
Had you said recent track record, wellllll, a little different, but that would hardly be regardless of the AD though.
I'm not trying to slam Burke. Unfortunately recent football hires just haven't worked. I believe that he has tried to make good hires within the budget constraints that he felt appropriate. I have no problem with disagreeing with his assesments both as to budget constraints or hiring choices, but I really am finding it more and more tiresome to keep reading that it is either somehow intentional by him or that he simply doesn't care. I just find that hard to accept.

No, he cares, and wants to do well for Purdue. He's just in way over his head.

 

[lbodel]

I'm not so sure. Purdue's track record is that of the 35 head coaches in its history, 18 have a .500 or better career record, albeit many early coaches were 1 or 2 years and gone.
Had you said recent track record, wellllll, a little different, but that would hardly be regardless of the AD though.
I'm not trying to slam Burke. Unfortunately recent football hires just haven't worked. I believe that he has tried to make good hires within the budget constraints that he felt appropriate. I have no problem with disagreeing with his assesments both as to budget constraints or hiring choices, but I really am finding it more and more tiresome to keep reading that it is either somehow intentional by him or that he simply doesn't care. I just find that hard to accept.

I don't think he doesn't care. I think he's the type of person that will take a risk on a cheap hire to make himself look good. And that comes across worse than I mean - but if he's given option 1 at a cheap, unsure rate and option 2 at a more expensive, but more reliable rate - he'll take the risk on option 1 - particularly after the Tiller success. He tried to duplicate a VERY unique situation with Keady/Painter transition - when it wasn't really similar other than the fact that Hope had been an assistant coach before and in completely different sports that are very different in terms of building programs.

That being said, he's not typically pro-active, not really adaptive, he's not very edgy or progressive and a lot of decisions are safe decisions. I've gone over this before, but he brought people from the steel mill with him to work at Purdue - an accountant oversees the marketing department, for example. The fact of the matter is, a school like Purdue in such a major conference is only going to do so much in those circumstances. You can't be vanilla and succeed when you compete against Michigan, Ohio State, etc. Look at Michigan State - while they have had more football success overall than Purdue, they went through some pretty rough stretches and they have a major big brother in their own state.

Unfortunately, a lot of the "progressive" things Purdue's instilled under Burke have been duds. Marketing and game experience has been rather cheesy (I still gag whenever I think of Purdue's marketing director welcoming the Orange Krush to Mackey at center court). But at the same time, what is Burke offering them? As I mention, they are run by an accountant. We're doing a freaking gofundme to raise money to have a proper video board in our premiere sport's venue - which just was renovated and didn't have that touched. The logic is just not all there...

 

[lbodel]

You touch on a topic I wonder about when reading comments on AD's. Many posters imply that Burke is cheap. I would assume that he is given a budget to manage, not an open ended fund to increase or decrease at his discretion, like my wife has. Point being that Burke and the next AD can only do so much. If we knew the breakdown of how he chose to slice the pie we could complain about that, and undoubtedly would, but the size of the pie is not the fault of the AD.

That's not terribly true. Can he spend whatever the hell he wants? No. But he's not "given" a budget like a typical department would by higher-ups. Purdue's athletic department budget operates independently of the university. The athletic department projects revenues and then base expenses on that. If the revenue doesn't meet their projections, they dip into a reserve fund, from the athletic department, to make up those resources. The budget is not a part of the university's.

So no, he's not "given" a budget by his supervisor - he works with one that he is in charge of and he has flexibility to work with. If he does a good job, that budget can go up significantly.

 

[indianphil]

Gentlemen, this is all about the BOT. Winning is all about money which in today's world is lots of money. You can punch Burke wherever you like, but the one thing he was unwilling to do was stand up to the BOT...no this has to happen or I am gone kind of confrontation. Something public and ugly. As was mentioned above, Painter did it and it worked.

We often talk about changing the culture of Purdue Athletics which in my mind means money first. In too many ways Burke was a typical Kranert graduate in his thinking and performance.

FWIW, let me throw this one out...Mitch hasnt raised tuition in four years. I for one believe that education is also a function to great deal on costs and the money to provide it. If the University is now being strangled economically like the Athletic Department, where will the school be in a decade?

Managed expectations is something we hear a lot of on this board which I detest. Secondly, I am growing awful tired of the Purdue Way as well. Institutional mediocrity is a nasty disease!

IMHO, the next AD isnt the importance we seem to place on it.

 

[PU52Chevy]

Well got my reply....I am not a candidate for the AD job going forward.

I failed my blood test...too much Purdue Koolaide!

Oh well I guess I will just have to support 110% positive from here.

Boiler Up!

 

[purdue4sure]

Gentlemen, this is all about the BOT. Winning is all about money which in today's world is lots of money. You can punch Burke wherever you like, but the one thing he was unwilling to do was stand up to the BOT...no this has to happen or I am gone kind of confrontation. Something public and ugly. As was mentioned above, Painter did it and it worked.

We often talk about changing the culture of Purdue Athletics which in my mind means money first. In too many ways Burke was a typical Kranert graduate in his thinking and performance.

FWIW, let me throw this one out...Mitch hasnt raised tuition in four years. I for one believe that education is also a function to great deal on costs and the money to provide it. If the University is now being strangled economically like the Athletic Department, where will the school be in a decade?

Managed expectations is something we hear a lot of on this board which I detest. Secondly, I am growing awful tired of the Purdue Way as well. Institutional mediocrity is a nasty disease!

IMHO, the next AD isnt the importance we seem to place on it.

I'm local, have a son who graduated from Purdue, another currently at Purdue, and many friends who are faculty. I can tell you that before Daniels arrived there was an unbelievable amount of waste and frivolous spending. It was not serving the university, the students, or the public. For several years, tuition was increasing 2-3 X the inflation rate and more. In 2009-2010, tuition increased 11.5% during a recession! Daniels did the right thing to reign it in and make the university operate within a realistic budget, just like the rest of the world.

I agree with your point that money is needed to have a top-rated athletic program. But I always wonder about those people who are strongly making that point -- are they big contributors?

 

[njm8845]

Unfortunately, a lot of the "progressive" things Purdue's instilled under Burke have been duds. Marketing and game experience has been rather cheesy (I still gag whenever I think of Purdue's marketing director welcoming the Orange Krush to Mackey at center court).

When on earth did this happen? I don't recall this at all. How is that even a marketing move?

 

[purdue4sure]

That's not terribly true. Can he spend whatever the hell he wants? No. But he's not "given" a budget like a typical department would by higher-ups. Purdue's athletic department budget operates independently of the university. The athletic department projects revenues and then base expenses on that. If the revenue doesn't meet their projections, they dip into a reserve fund, from the athletic department, to make up those resources. The budget is not a part of the university's.

So no, he's not "given" a budget by his supervisor - he works with one that he is in charge of and he has flexibility to work with. If he does a good job, that budget can go up significantly.

Do you know whether the athletic department keeps all of the revenues it generates, including the Big Ten Network revenues? I seem to recall someone pointing out that the BTN revenues do not stay with the athletic department. How about other revenues?

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Do you know whether the athletic department keeps all of the revenues it generates, including the Big Ten Network revenues? I seem to recall someone pointing out that the BTN revenues do not stay with the athletic department. How about other revenues?

The vast majority of BTN revenues stay with the AD. There was a time with Cordova when the AD was funneling a portion to the school but Daniels has essentially eliminated that practice. Like lbodel said above, the AD is largely stand alone. There are accounting transfers between the school and AD to cover various costs but it isn't significant.

 

[nagemj02]

"...Unfortunately, a lot of the "progressive" things Purdue's instilled under Burke have been duds. Marketing and game experience has been rather cheesy (I still gag whenever I think of Purdue's marketing director welcoming the Orange Krush to Mackey at center court)..."

When on earth did this happen? I don't recall this at all. How is that even a marketing move?

Is this the game you're referring to, lbodel? ('06-'07 season with Landry, Teague, freshmen Kramer and Grant, Gordon Watt, etc.): http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/GoIllini/20070128_boiled

 

[purdue4sure]

The vast majority of BTN revenues stay with the AD. There was a time with Cordova when the AD was funneling a portion to the school but Daniels has essentially eliminated that practice. Like lbodel said above, the AD is largely stand alone. There are accounting transfers between the school and AD to cover various costs but it isn't significant.

Good to know. I remember hearing that Cordova was dipping into the fund, but I didn't remember the details. They obviously have to get the football team back to being competitive to get fans in the stands.

 

[mathboy]

The vast majority of BTN revenues stay with the AD. There was a time with Cordova when the AD was funneling a portion to the school but Daniels has essentially eliminated that practice. Like lbodel said above, the AD is largely stand alone. There are accounting transfers between the school and AD to cover various costs but it isn't significant.

Ding ding ding. We have a winner here. Cordova cut into spending by the athletic department, funneling money to other programs. Where did that "funneled " money come from? The recruiting budget and assistant coaches salaries. That is why we saw our 3 signature sports starve from lack of talent. Cordova was a disaster for Purdue both academically and athletically.

 

[BoilerBiker]

Ding ding ding. We have a winner here. Cordova cut into spending by the athletic department, funneling money to other programs. Where did that "funneled " money come from? The recruiting budget and assistant coaches salaries. That is why we saw our 3 signature sports starve from lack of talent. Cordova was a disaster for Purdue both academically and athletically.

that may be true for asst. pay but i don't think it hurt the recruiting budget as much, at least significantly compared to our peers.

cordova was here from 2007-2012.
the data below was a five year recruiting budget average dating back to the 2008-09 season.
so that would be fairly comparable (even includes a 1 year lag for her implementations to affect a future budget).

purdue ranked 48th highest recruiting budget nationally during that span.
two schools that have had some of the best results in the big ten actually had the lowest budgets.

 

[Dakota Girl]

That's not terribly true. Can he spend whatever the hell he wants? No. But he's not "given" a budget like a typical department would by higher-ups. Purdue's athletic department budget operates independently of the university. The athletic department projects revenues and then base expenses on that. If the revenue doesn't meet their projections, they dip into a reserve fund, from the athletic department, to make up those resources. The budget is not a part of the university's.

So no, he's not "given" a budget by his supervisor - he works with one that he is in charge of and he has flexibility to work with. If he does a good job, that budget can go up significantly.

I did not know that. In that case then, the key is football success as it is by far the largest revenue generater in college sports. Thanks.

 

[nat100]

Ding ding ding. We have a winner here. Cordova cut into spending by the athletic department, funneling money to other programs. Where did that "funneled " money come from? The recruiting budget and assistant coaches salaries. That is why we saw our 3 signature sports starve from lack of talent. Cordova was a disaster for Purdue both academically and athletically.

Assistant pay was an issue before Cordova

 

[lbodel]

Ding ding ding. We have a winner here. Cordova cut into spending by the athletic department, funneling money to other programs. Where did that "funneled " money come from? The recruiting budget and assistant coaches salaries. That is why we saw our 3 signature sports starve from lack of talent. Cordova was a disaster for Purdue both academically and athletically.

This is not true.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

This is not true.

In what way? Not disagreeing with you, Ibodel.....but could you expand upon your answer?

I'm interested to know if it was just a portion of BTN revenue that was allocated to the General Fund.

 

[nat100]

In what way? Not disagreeing with you, Ibodel.....but could you expand upon your answer?

I'm interested to know if it was just a portion of BTN revenue that was allocated to the General Fund.

The flaw in mathboys post is saying that she took money from specific places. The btn money was new her first year on the job. It wasn't allocated to anything. It was initially earmarked to go to the general fund

 

[mathboy]

that may be true for asst. pay but i don't think it hurt the recruiting budget as much, at least significantly compared to our peers.

cordova was here from 2007-2012.
the data below was a five year recruiting budget average dating back to the 2008-09 season.
so that would be fairly comparable (even includes a 1 year lag for her implementations to affect a future budget).

purdue ranked 48th highest recruiting budget nationally during that span.
two schools that have had some of the best results in the big ten actually had the lowest budgets.

Much of the spend is dependent on how many a scholarships you have to fill, and just how much you must work for recruits. Sorry, but it is not a fair world. MSU could email an offer and get the kid. We would have to spend time at his home. I think if you look across more years, you will begin to see both of these factors in play.

If we do accounting the same as, say OSU, then why did Painter complain about the losy rental cars he and his staff were forced to use?

 

[mathboy]

The flaw in mathboys post is saying that she took money from specific places. The btn money was new her first year on the job. It wasn't allocated to anything. It was initially earmarked to go to the general fund

Other schools kept more of the BIG money in the athletic department. Makes no difference if it was the first year or if it had been flowing in for a decade. She saw this money as a honey pot for all kinds of personal projects.

Also, be very careful of the accounting differences between schools. The devil is in the details.

 

[nat100]

Other schools kept more of the BIG money in the athletic department. Makes no difference if it was the first year or if it had been flowing in for a decade. She saw this money as a honey pot for all kinds of personal projects.

Also, be very careful of the accounting differences between schools. The devil is in the details.

I know what other schools do. I was commenting on your statement she took it directly from recruiting and assistant budgets. It was never there in the first place.

 

[77 grad]

So, all we need is more revenue from our biggest (theoretically) revenue-producing sport.

How is football lately?

 

[mathboy]

I know what other schools do. I was commenting on your statement she took it directly from recruiting and assistant budgets. It was never there in the first place.

You are correct, but your statement seems to be parsing the language, and does not recognize the impact of her actions as a whole. She didn't make the specific decisions about what parts of the athletic budget were to be starved. She left that to Burke. He had to work with less money than needed to stay competative with other BIG schools.

We will never know if Hazel was a good game coach since he had to field team that lacked talent, speed, and size to compete at the BIG level. His recruiting was poor. Maybe his ability to... Say, recruit a QB out of Texas was hampered by lack of travel budget? Unlike Tiller.

 

[Inspector100]

Popcorn in hand. I will "like" the comments where I agree.

 

[nat100]

You are correct, but your statement seems to be parsing the language, and does not recognize the impact of her actions as a whole. She didn't make the specific decisions about what parts of the athletic budget were to be starved. She left that to Burke. He had to work with less money than needed to stay competative with other BIG schools.

We will never know if Hazel was a good game coach since he had to field team that lacked talent, speed, and size to compete at the BIG level. His recruiting was poor. Maybe his ability to... Say, recruit a QB out of Texas was hampered by lack of travel budget? Unlike Tiller.

Hazell? His recruiting issues are self inflicted. Also, he had talent at qb to win. Shoop (who was paid well) was a disaster. Money hasn't been he problem in the hazell era. He isn't a good coach. You can blame the entire hope hire and his staff on money

Painters recruiting you can partly place on money.

 

[mathboy]

Hazell? His recruiting issues are self inflicted. Also, he had talent at qb to win. Shoop (who was paid well) was a disaster. Money hasn't been he problem in the hazell era. He isn't a good coach. You can blame the entire hope hire and his staff on money

Painters recruiting you can partly place on money.

Agreed. My example was a poor one. Should stay away from the fab side of this discussion.

 

[Statey]

We will never know if Hazel was a good game coach since he had to field team that lacked talent, speed, and size to compete at the BIG level. His recruiting was poor. Maybe his ability to... Say, recruit a QB out of Texas was hampered by lack of travel budget? Unlike Tiller.

You have stated a lot of intelligent things on this message board... to put it politely, this is probably not your best work.

 

[mathboy]

You have stated a lot of intelligent things on this message board... to put it politely, this is probably not your best work.

Yes, I know I should stay away from football. It is a disaster with no fix in sight. Too bad. I had to enjoy Tillers basketball on grass.

 

[Cleanface]

You touch on a topic I wonder about when reading comments on AD's. Many posters imply that Burke is cheap. I would assume that he is given a budget to manage, not an open ended fund to increase or decrease at his discretion, like my wife has. Point being that Burke and the next AD can only do so much. If we knew the breakdown of how he chose to slice the pie we could complain about that, and undoubtedly would, but the size of the pie is not the fault of the AD.

Wait just a second...you're NOT a girl??

 

[New Pal Boiler]

Wait just a second...you're NOT a girl??

LOL -good catch.

 

[77 grad]

It's 2016, guys (?) Girls can have wives.

 

[Dakota Girl]

Wait just a second...you're NOT a girl??

Nope. What girl would possibly read this useless drivel? My user name is my dogs name. I hope I haven't created, and subsequently destroyed, any perverted forum fantasies.

 

[Chuchumutha]

Nope. What girl would possibly read this useless drivel? My user name is my dogs name. I hope I haven't created, and subsequently destroyed, any perverted forum fantasies.

Too late.

 

[purdue4sure]

It's 2016, guys (?) Girls can have wives.

Girls? GIRLS?! Looks like it was typed by a caveman.

 

[77 grad]

Your dog's name? Sweet. Who'd have guessed by clicking on our signature icon and profile?

 

[77 grad]

Your dog's name? Sweet. Who'd have guessed by clicking on our signature icon and profile?

Oops, "your."

 

[tjreese]

Wait just a second...you're NOT a girl??

my bias. When he started posting I couldn't believe he had the feel and knowledge for the game to be a ...drum roll please....girl...