2020-21 redshirt(s)

[FirstDownB]

I touched on this on the thread about Mason and Brandon, but thought it could be explored as a separate discussion. Who, in your opinion, if anyone, will get a redshirt next season? This is assuming no additional roster changes between now and then.

My opinion: There will be one redshirt and it is between Morton and Thompson. I think Edey was also a prime candidate, but there is no way to get through 30+ games with only 2 guys who can play center. With the Gillis and Newman redshirts last season, Painter made it pretty clear that he doesn't believe in wasting a year of eligibility for <5 mpg. And he rarely if ever has gone more than 10 deep in his rotations. Can't redshirt Sasha, Wheeler, Newman, Gillis, or Dow.

The only problem with shirting Thompson is it puts him in the same class as Morton and Ivey (and Newman). But, he would have 3 more years of eligibility after Eastern graduates with only Morton as a true PG. The other logical candidate is Ivey, but he is (reportedly) too talented and has the ability to create his own shot, which will be needed on this team as long as he can play a lick of defense.

 

[Smokestack91]

We may have no redshirts next year. I doubt Ivey or Morton. Maybe Edey, but that depends on Dow, as you said. Thompson is interesting, but I don't see it happening.

 

[FirstDownB]

We may have no redshirts next year. I doubt Ivey or Morton. Maybe Edey, but that depends on Dow, as you said. Thompson is interesting, but I don't see it happening.

If everyone is healthy it is really hard to get 12 guys minutes, but that is assuming no injuries. The team was fairly healthy last year, and that can't be taken for granted. Often these things work themselves out without a need for redshirt. It is very possible that 12 players are needed to fill out a 9 or 10 man rotation.

 

[PurduePete98]

I’m going with Edey.

 

[FirstDownB]

I’m going with Edey.

Regarding Edey, just curious.. What do you envision happening if Tre picks up 2 early fouls in a game? Does Dow play 15 minutes straight or does someone else (who would that even be- Gillis? Wheeler? Eastern? walk on?) slide over to the 5 for a bit? Boudreax was barely adequate last year in that role and had 20 pounds on Wheeler and and inch or two on Gillis and Eastern. Or does Tre have to play less physical, trying to stay out of foul trouble? IMO we're going to need the Edey insurance policy at some point.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

I touched on this on the thread about Mason and Brandon, but thought it could be explored as a separate discussion. Who, in your opinion, if anyone, will get a redshirt next season? This is assuming no additional roster changes between now and then.

My opinion: There will be one redshirt and it is between Morton and Thompson. I think Edey was also a prime candidate, but there is no way to get through 30+ games with only 2 guys who can play center. With the Gillis and Newman redshirts last season, Painter made it pretty clear that he doesn't believe in wasting a year of eligibility for <5 mpg. And he rarely if ever has gone more than 10 deep in his rotations. Can't redshirt Sasha, Wheeler, Newman, Gillis, or Dow.

The only problem with shirting Thompson is it puts him in the same class as Morton and Ivey (and Newman). But, he would have 3 more years of eligibility after Eastern graduates with only Morton as a true PG. The other logical candidate is Ivey, but he is (reportedly) too talented and has the ability to create his own shot, which will be needed on this team as long as he can play a lick of defense.

Painter said they could have used Morton THIS year. I don’t see any way he redshirts, barring injury.

I’d say IT or Edey.

 

[PurduePete98]

Regarding Edey, just curious.. What do you envision happening if Tre picks up 2 early fouls in a game? Does Dow play 15 minutes straight or does someone else (who would that even be- Gillis? Wheeler? Eastern? walk on?) slide over to the 5 for a bit? Boudreax was barely adequate last year in that role and had 20 pounds on Wheeler and and inch or two on Gillis and Eastern. Or does Tre have to play less physical, trying to stay out of foul trouble? IMO we're going to need the Edey insurance policy at some point.

To be perfectly honest, I think Tre is our only serviceable 5. Since Dow has already redshirted, I believe Edey will. If Tre/Dow get in fouls trouble, I think we go small with Wheeler, Gillis, or eastern.

 

[kmaries29]

Regarding Edey, just curious.. What do you envision happening if Tre picks up 2 early fouls in a game? Does Dow play 15 minutes straight or does someone else (who would that even be- Gillis? Wheeler? Eastern? walk on?) slide over to the 5 for a bit? Boudreax was barely adequate last year in that role and had 20 pounds on Wheeler and and inch or two on Gillis and Eastern. Or does Tre have to play less physical, trying to stay out of foul trouble? IMO we're going to need the Edey insurance policy at some point.

They play small ball for awhile. Eastern at the 4/5, and 4 other guards. This team has talented enough guards to do that. And then whatever time that isn’t happening, Dow plays. I can even see Wheeler playing some 5 if needed- not extended minutes but some. I have NO clue on Edey, some say he is far too raw at this point but I have never seen him play. I’m sure it will depend on what the other team looks like too... should be interesting.

 

[TX4GB]

I don’t think Edey will redshirt now that Haarms transferred. He will rotate with Dow as a backup big in case Big Cat gets in foul trouble. 10 fouls to give between them.

 

[njm8845]

I don’t think Edey will redshirt now that Haarms transferred. He will rotate with Dow as a backup big in case Big Cat gets in foul trouble. 10 fouls to give between them.

yeah, I agree. And it’s really too bad because it seems like Edey could have benefited from the redshirt.

 

[TX4GB]

yeah, I agree. And it’s really too bad because it seems like Edey could have benefited from the redshirt.

It’s a shame that Haarms didn’t stick around to mentor Edey for a year like Haas did for Haarms.

 

[Dryfly88]

Morton and Ivey - No
IT - Likely
Edey - Likely

This is based on no more attrition.

 

[persapians]

I don't believe in red shirting anyone. Let the best player play and if that person can't get on the court, there is a reason

 

[IUhaterade]

I thought I was told that sophomores can’t redshirt unless they are injured? If Thompson is eligible for a redshirt then I think that is the best use of it.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

I thought I was told that sophomores can’t redshirt unless they are injured? If Thompson is eligible for a redshirt then I think that is the best use of it.

Anyone can redshirt any year. Brantley redshirted his sophomore year.

 

[ehuffma1]

NO WAY Thompson redshirts! Thompson was our best player on offense for small stretches. He must be out there at the end of the game for ball handling and foul shooting.

Edey could RS. CMP will get a read on how ready he is early. If he can prtoteft the rim and rebound he could contribute 5-10 minutes a game. He could be extremely raw and nowhere near being ready. He is very uncertain.

Overall- I like his upside.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

yeah, I agree. And it’s really too bad because it seems like Edey could have benefited from the redshirt.

Don’t forget CMP is still looking for a grad transfer.

 

[ehuffma1]

GT comes in and Edey def Puts on the RS. Not sure Painter brings someone else I to the mix. A GT probably doesn’t add too many wins. It could mess up the locker room. Who knows?!

 

[Roeder]

I see it as Edey or nobody redshirts.

If Dow is better than Edey, then Edey redshirts.

If Edey is better than Dow, nobody redshirts.

A grad transfer 5 obviously might change things.

Thompson plays IMO. The strength of this team will be it's guard play and I think we will see 4 guard lineups to simply get the best guys on the floor.

G - Nojel 30 mins
G - Hunter 25 mins
G - Sasha 20 mins
G - Morton 20 mins
C - Trevion 30 mins

G - Isaiah 15 mins
G - Newman 15 mins
G - Ivey 20 mins
F - Gillis or Wheeler 20 mins
C - Dow or Edey 5 mins

Every game will look a little different obviously with matchups, injuries, and foul trouble. As the year goes on, history tells us the rotation will tighten up more than this too. I like the flexibility and the ability to get up and down the floor on offense with this team too.

 

[ehuffma1]

I see it as Edey or nobody redshirts.

If Dow is better than Edey, then Edey redshirts.

If Edey is better than Dow, nobody redshirts.

A grad transfer 5 obviously might change things.

Thompson plays IMO. The strength of this team will be it's guard play and I think we will see 4 guard lineups to simply get the best guys on the floor.

G - Nojel 30 mins
G - Hunter 25 mins
G - Sasha 20 mins
G - Morton 20 mins
C - Trevion 30 mins

G - Isaiah 15 mins
G - Newman 15 mins
G - Ivey 20 mins
F - Gillis or Wheeler 20 mins
C - Dow or Edey 5 mins

Every game will look a little different obviously with matchups, injuries, and foul trouble. As the year goes on, history tells us the rotation will tighten up more than this too. I like the flexibility and the ability to get up and down the floor on offense with this team too.

You probably have some good points here. I think overall strategy must be to score more points. Obviously, play good defense but score in the mid 70’s or higher.

 

[purduedavie]

Edey redshirts, he needs a year of development, IT is a possibility, wouldn't mind see him get a extra year down the road. I do believe Painter picks up a grad transfer big, even if it's a middling guy from a small school.

 

[BBG]

Painter said they could have used Morton THIS year. I don’t see any way he redshirts, barring injury.

I’d say IT or Edey.

This to me is the most likely scenario and the two that probably benefit from it the most.

It's interesting because when Tre gets in to foul trouble (and he will, nature of his position and how he plays), I am not sure who better to com in and replace him. None of us have ever seen either Dow or Edey play meaningful let alone any college games yet. One would hope that with Dow already have a year and his athleticism, he at least could provide some defense and let the others do the scoring since we should have a lot of options.

The more I think about the team going forward, actually the more excited I become about it. We're going to be different and maybe even more up-tempo which is fun to watch and we should have a lot of people that can score.

We need a leader though as that was probably the biggest glaring weakness last season and no doubt cost us some games. Hunter I can see (and hope) steps in to that role as it really seems to fit his demeanor.

 

[Smokestack91]

I see it as Edey or nobody redshirts.

If Dow is better than Edey, then Edey redshirts.

If Edey is better than Dow, nobody redshirts.

A grad transfer 5 obviously might change things.

Thompson plays IMO. The strength of this team will be it's guard play and I think we will see 4 guard lineups to simply get the best guys on the floor.

G - Nojel 30 mins
G - Hunter 25 mins
G - Sasha 20 mins
G - Morton 20 mins
C - Trevion 30 mins

G - Isaiah 15 mins
G - Newman 15 mins
G - Ivey 20 mins
F - Gillis or Wheeler 20 mins
C - Dow or Edey 5 mins

Every game will look a little different obviously with matchups, injuries, and foul trouble. As the year goes on, history tells us the rotation will tighten up more than this too. I like the flexibility and the ability to get up and down the floor on offense with this team too.

I agree with all of this, and if Newman or Ivey end up getting more minutes that will be a good thing and mean they play better than anticipated in their first year.

 

[lbodel]

If everyone is healthy it is really hard to get 12 guys minutes, but that is assuming no injuries. The team was fairly healthy last year, and that can't be taken for granted. Often these things work themselves out without a need for redshirt. It is very possible that 12 players are needed to fill out a 9 or 10 man rotation.

I think it'll depend on how "D-1" ready a guy like Morton is. Not just talent wise, but physically, etc. Obviously you can't just walk onto the court and not be able to play defense either.

There's no sense in not redshirting and he gets in a few minutes a game. However, if he's ready physically and he lives up to what's been said about him, I could see him taking someone's minutes.

I said this elsewhere, but we have 4 freshman wildcards. If they happen to produce particularly on the offensive end, some of our upperclassmen may have to swallow their pride and become more role players than starters.

 

[njm8845]

Anyone can redshirt any year. Brantley redshirted his sophomore year.

and basil redshirted one of his later seasons too

 

[lbodel]

NO WAY Thompson redshirts! Thompson was our best player on offense for small stretches. He must be out there at the end of the game for ball handling and foul shooting.

Edey could RS. CMP will get a read on how ready he is early. If he can prtoteft the rim and rebound he could contribute 5-10 minutes a game. He could be extremely raw and nowhere near being ready. He is very uncertain.

Overall- I like his upside.

I'm not saying with regards to Thompson, but the problem is our roster is ridiculously deep.

Our roster is 10 deep - not counting Dow or Edey. Obviously at least one of those will be in the rotation.

 

[ehuffma1]

I'm not saying with regards to Thompson, but the problem is our roster is ridiculously deep.

Our roster is 10 deep - not counting Dow or Edey. Obviously at least one of those will be in the rotation.

Valid point. Thompson needs to lift a few weights. He needs to add a few lbs. he needs to work on D.

Offensively, he’s pretty good and should improve. I love his FT shooting. He’s a good ball handler and he isn’t afraid to shoot or try and create.

 

[Schnelk]

Put the redshirt on Edey until/if Dow proves to be incapable of providing serviceable minutes. Dow needs all the preseason minutes he can get anyway.

 

[FirstDownB]

NO WAY Thompson redshirts! Thompson was our best player on offense for small stretches. He must be out there at the end of the game for ball handling and foul shooting.

Edey could RS. CMP will get a read on how ready he is early. If he can prtoteft the rim and rebound he could contribute 5-10 minutes a game. He could be extremely raw and nowhere near being ready. He is very uncertain.

Overall- I like his upside.

IT shot 67% from the stripe. His best games generally came against teams with less athletic guards.

I like his upside too, but he needs to get a D1 body. If it comes down to too many guards and not enough minutes to go around, he’s in the redshirt discussion. A lot of that depends on whether Morton shows up ready to play ball.

 

[Dryfly88]

CMP has already said Morton could have helped this past season. He is going to play and probably significant minutes. Yes, we have a "deep" team if deep is defined as a bunch of players that play minutes because a core rotation of 7-8 haven't established themselves. My hope for this next season is that we do have an established rotation of 7-8 that can be counted on. Playing 10 guys every night hoping to find a workable combination is not the recipe for success.

RS or simply sitting players, either is ok. Every team in D1 has guys at the end of the bench that don't play unless it's garbage time. If better players come into the program, then they play.

 

[ehuffma1]

IT shot 67% from the stripe. His best games generally came against teams with less athletic guards.

I like his upside too, but he needs to get a D1 body. If it comes down to too many guards and not enough minutes to go around, he’s in the redshirt discussion. A lot of that depends on whether Morton shows up ready to play ball.

IT can close out a game with FT shooting. He will be closer to 80-85% for his career. He’s a fantastic shooter.

We agree that he needs more beef. I’m not really sure how much weight he’ll be able to gain, but he’s one of our best players.

 

[SIBoiler2]

I'm not saying with regards to Thompson, but the problem is our roster is ridiculously deep.

Our roster is 10 deep - not counting Dow or Edey. Obviously at least one of those will be in the rotation.

Do Duke or UK fans wring their hands and gnash their teeth in the off season every year because they're too deep? Just curious.

 

[PU52Chevy]

Even though we are headed for a recession, our Dow will be up next year.

Tre will start at the 5 spot but Dow will give us great minutes rebounding and playing hard and cleaning up the glass and putbacks.

I have faith in the young man as he works hard and is very athletic.

CMP may not run plays for him as much as Tre but it won't be needed as when Dow is in the game he will be in for shot blocking, rebounding, passing out to the open shooter and put backs on the offensive end...very athletic young man who is hungry.

I know I am excited to see him play....runs like a gazelle and is ripped physically. Reminds me of the McQuay brothers.......

Boiler Up!

 

[purduedavie]

Even though we are headed for a recession, our Dow will be up next year.

Tre will start at the 5 spot but Dow will give us great minutes rebounding and playing hard and cleaning up the glass and putbacks.

I have faith in the young man as he works hard and is very athletic.

CMP may not run plays for him as much as Tre but it won't be needed as when Dow is in the game he will be in for shot blocking, rebounding, passing out to the open shooter and put backs on the offensive end...very athletic young man who is hungry.

I know I am excited to see him play....runs like a gazelle and is ripped physically. Reminds me of the McQuay brothers.......

Boiler Up!

It's his third year of being here, was a top 100-150 recruit, if he can't contribute next year it's doubtful that he ever will.

 

[Purdue85]

IT can close out a game with FT shooting. He will be closer to 80-85% for his career. He’s a fantastic shooter.

We agree that he needs more beef. I’m not really sure how much weight he’ll be able to gain, but he’s one of our best players.

The weight thing is overplayed, IMHO.

IT is 6-1, 165. Could he us some additional muscle? No doubt. Is it what's holding him back? I doubt it. He simply needs to get more experience, get more aggressive, and he'll be fine. Again, IMHO.

.....

Just for fun, I decided to look for some other "undersized" guards in basketball.

Kihei Clark (UVA) is one of the better guards in CBB at 5-9, 160-165.
Ja Morant was 6-3, 174.

Trae Young is one of the top guards in the NBA at 6-1, 180. That's playing in the NBA with that build.
Kyrie Irving was 6-2, 180 in college.
Cowan at MD is 6-0 180.

While thinking back to some of the great guards, Gary Payton came to mind, at 6-4, 180.

Not a lot of difference in all those. Again, would the added bulk help? Probably, but I don't see that as hampering his game that much.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

Do Duke or UK fans wring their hands and gnash their teeth in the off season every year because they're too deep? Just curious.

It might be an actual problem if we were 11 deep with players who consistently produce. We’re not.

 

[jtanoos1]

Even though we are headed for a recession, our Dow will be up next year.

Tre will start at the 5 spot but Dow will give us great minutes rebounding and playing hard and cleaning up the glass and putbacks.

I have faith in the young man as he works hard and is very athletic.

CMP may not run plays for him as much as Tre but it won't be needed as when Dow is in the game he will be in for shot blocking, rebounding, passing out to the open shooter and put backs on the offensive end...very athletic young man who is hungry.

I know I am excited to see him play....runs like a gazelle and is ripped physically. Reminds me of the McQuay brothers.......

Boiler Up!

You would think Dow could give the team 5-10 minutes and allow CMP to redshirt Edey. If he's just half the athlete that the McQuays brothers were, how bad can he be?

This means that Tre has absolutely got to come to practice on Day 1 in the best shape of his life. There is quite a bit more pressure on him now. His conditioning has a domino effect on this team.

 

[ThreeTwaunMoore]

IT redshirting? That’s hilarious. He will be really solid, our best perimeter shooter along with Sasha.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

IT redshirting? That’s hilarious. He will be really solid, our best perimeter shooter along with Sasha.

I hope they are both much improved if that’s the case.

 

[lbodel]

Do Duke or UK fans wring their hands and gnash their teeth in the off season every year because they're too deep? Just curious.

Their teams typically are not deep because of constant turnover.

Their rosters are annual rosters more so than 4 year rosters.

Not a great comparison for 98% of the other teams out there.