Top 3 coaches in Big Ten?
- Thread starter BubbaJ75
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Hard to argue with your list ... I think Collins deserves a lot of respect considering his situation. I don't know if Beilein is better than painter. Much of that depends on the decision an 18 year old makes ... a great recruiter can only do so much, but that decision by the player can make a mediocre coach look good or a great coach look mediocre.
Good list.
It's funny. For as strong as Purdue has been over the past couple years, I feel like Painter receives an awful lot of criticism around here. I would easily take him above most, if not all, of the other conference coaches.
Beilein is a really good coach, and for what it's worth, I think he has more integrity than Izzo; however, with regard to on-court success, there's absolute no arguing Izzo is #1. If you'd have asked this question at the beginning of last year, I would have said Bo Ryan. I also agree that Collins might work his way into the conversation if he keeps NW on its upward trajectory.
These thoughts are disjointed, I realize, but they were the thoughts spurred by the original post.
It's funny. For as strong as Purdue has been over the past couple years, I feel like Painter receives an awful lot of criticism around here. I would easily take him above most, if not all, of the other conference coaches.
Beilein is a really good coach, and for what it's worth, I think he has more integrity than Izzo; however, with regard to on-court success, there's absolute no arguing Izzo is #1. If you'd have asked this question at the beginning of last year, I would have said Bo Ryan. I also agree that Collins might work his way into the conversation if he keeps NW on its upward trajectory.
These thoughts are disjointed, I realize, but they were the thoughts spurred by the original post.
Historically, hard to disagree with the top 2. However, the question is, has Izzo peaked? Are his best days behind him? Wonder the same with Beilein. He's won a ton of games (800+), with 1 FF thanks to Burke. Kinda like Crean with Wade. Both still good coaches, but perhaps on the way down.
Collins may be on the way up. Who else would be better than Painter? Perhaps Turgeon is up there? Thad has dropped a little. Miles showed promise, but fell back. Fran hasn't quite got it together, nor has Rich P. Gard is too new. I think Matt gets 3rd by default.
Collins may be on the way up. Who else would be better than Painter? Perhaps Turgeon is up there? Thad has dropped a little. Miles showed promise, but fell back. Fran hasn't quite got it together, nor has Rich P. Gard is too new. I think Matt gets 3rd by default.
Many folks place a high value in NCAA tourney wins when evaluating coaches, though I agree with your position more. If Painter keeps producing top 15 teams, eventually NCAA wins will happen IMHO.
Matta might still deserve to be on this list also. Kinda depends whether the current funk they are in is just a two year slump like Painter had, or whether this is a downward trend that is going to result in either his imminent retirement or firing. I always figured that he was an excellent recruiter and an OK coach. Every program goes through a few down years though.
NCAA Tourney success is what's missing, no question about it. I'm a fan of Painter and want him here for a long time. But we need to get wins in March. That's what will (hopefully) quiet the majority of his critics. This team should get to the Sweet Sixteen (or further). Let's hope it happens this year.
Izzo has lost it. If he misses the tourney this year, that would be two out of the last three years. He lost in the first round last year as a two seed. Michigan isn't a lock to make the tourney this year. They had to play in a play in game last year, then they lost in the first round.
I would put Matta in as a top 3 recruiter, and probably CMP also, but not coach.
They've made the tourney 19 years in a row. I believe that is 3rd longest streak. They've also been to 7 FF in that time. He has not lost it.
All have been to the final four:
1. Izzo
2. Matta (people are forgetting how great he has been)
3. Beilein
Next tier is Painter, Gard, Collins, Turgeon, and Pitino. Painter and Turgeon need to make a deep tourney run at sometime to break through. Pitino and Collins are rising fast.
Next tier is Clappy, Fran, Miles, Chambers and Pikiell. Clappy is falling fast.
Groce is in his own special tier.
1. Izzo
2. Matta (people are forgetting how great he has been)
3. Beilein
Next tier is Painter, Gard, Collins, Turgeon, and Pitino. Painter and Turgeon need to make a deep tourney run at sometime to break through. Pitino and Collins are rising fast.
Next tier is Clappy, Fran, Miles, Chambers and Pikiell. Clappy is falling fast.
Groce is in his own special tier.
My problem with Beilein is he had one 3 year stretch from '12 - '14 where they won 2 B1G's and went to the FF. That's pretty much it for him. Granted, it's more than CMP, but at least CMP has had good teams with different classes.
Like anything, this all depends on the criteria. If you're going by body of work, Matta certainly comes in at #2 after Izzo. If we're talking about this year and which way programs are trending, things don't look as encouraging for Matta.
For me, it's about who I'd want leading our program going forward, and taking into account age, ability (yes, that leads to more criteria selection), and fit, I'm very happy with Coach Painter in charge.
Obviously, there's room for multiple arguments here.
For me, it's about who I'd want leading our program going forward, and taking into account age, ability (yes, that leads to more criteria selection), and fit, I'm very happy with Coach Painter in charge.
Obviously, there's room for multiple arguments here.
Well
Well, the list give the impression that this is tied to teh Big where coaches have teams that play each other and play others that each other plays. That is a more direct comparison that playing entirely different teams in different areas. Could you imagine teh many other decisions we make in life that we ignore direct comparisons and comparisons within a group to compare those in the groups to anything and everything outside of the groups. Yeah, well Jenny and Steve sell a house for 100,000 for x square feet and get within 5% of asking, but TJ sells that same house in such and such a place and gets offers 10% above asking and half the time on the market. Probably a little bit pronounced, but similar logic
Beilein made one FF. So did Crean. Both with a really good college guard. I don't think that makes them a great coach. I would put Beilein there for the FF plus overall record. Matta on the other hand made 2 FFs and won a number of Big Ten Tourneys.
But, in the short world of "what have you done for me lately" that is college basketball, I'm not sure many go above Painter since Bo retired. No one has had a decent tourney run (Elite 8 or farther) in a while. I'm hoping Biggie is Matt's Burke or Wade, and not his Zeller.
and coaching at all different levels....JC, Division I, II, and III, IIRC.
No the question was best coaches in B1G, not best resume from B1G portion of career only. I guess if Coach K were to take the Illinois job next year, you would rank him in last place since none of his final fours were in the B1G.
That's pretty decent, and I think Beilein needs to be right where he is. And this may be his best year of coaching with what his team has gone through...and they've turned that corner. Don't want to play them in the Big tourney at all. Would put Turgeon third, Painter 4th, and Matta 5th though he's done a hell of a job overall at Butler, Xavier, and OSU.
I still don't think he's done much outside of that 1 class and with their current roster, I don't see them being any better the next few years.
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