Shaka

[BoilerMaker P]

This is just dumb. Purdue under Painter has been to the S16 or better in 5 of the last 7 tourneys. There is only one other team that has had better consistency during that same period, Gonzaga. Add on top of that a Champ runner up and an elite 8 and you have a top 6-7 tourney performance in all of College bball.

Also that 4 year tourney run that you are talking about included a canceled tourney, and a S16. IF you didn't completely cherry pick your data to fit your narrative the book ends to that 4 year (with only 3 tourneys) was an E8 and a Finals appearance........

I get what you’re saying but a loss to a 15 seed who has no business beating a Purdue team with two future lottery picks on it is a bad loss whether it takes place in the sweet 16 or any other round especially sandwiched in between 1st round losses to a 14 and 16 seed.

That said, I’m glad Painter and Purdue got to the final game last year (on the back of Zach Edey) and Matt Painter has earned the right to stay as long as he wants.

 

[Riveting]

Does this make Shake 3-2 vs Painter?
Ever since his VCU days, I've really liked the way his teams play with their relentless pressure D, guards who can penetrate and kick out, and transition offense.
I've always thought he'd be a great replacement at Purdue when Painter hangs it up.

I hoop he doesn't replace Woody after he is fired.

 

[tjreese]

yes but memories you would love to hear ... RMK lost to Cleveland State, Richmond, Pepperdine in the first round of the NCAAs.

I recall the press of Cleveland State and I think Richmond as well, but lost on Pepperdine

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

You spelled Hummel wrong.

Ha nah Hummel has a great gig as the best in the biz for color commentary. Don’t think he wants to coach. PJ is gonna be next in 10-15 years.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

I get what you’re saying but a loss to a 15 seed who has no business beating a Purdue team with two future lottery picks on it is a bad loss whether it takes place in the sweet 16 or any other round especially sandwiched in between 1st round losses to a 14 and 16 seed.

That said, I’m glad Painter and Purdue got to the final game last year (on the back of Zach Edey) and Matt Painter has earned the right to stay as long as he wants.

They also beat a UK team in the first round who had 3 guys play in the nba at one point in their career and they also had the NPOTY. So…they were doing something right.

They dared the refs to call fouls and rhey didn’t that game. Texas tried to play that game the game before and we shot almost 50. Jaden also decided to play one of his worst games in a Purdue uniform. Zach was nowhere near what he turned out to be either.

 

[Boiler Buck]

Watching Creighton's coach get waxed by NE. Not impressed with how he is coaching using his Big guy. Even if they come back and win, since it is at Creighton they might, the way they play their Big and the lack of getting him the ball is ridiculous.

 

[iubhounds]

I recall the press of Cleveland State and I think Richmond as well, but lost on Pepperdine

Knight always had problems with the press while it is so simple to break. Even now they don't well against the press. Pepperdine was the Brian Evans year senior year I think. I don't think a press was involved in that game. They just got beat from A to Z.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

Watching Creighton's coach get waxed by NE. Not impressed with how he is coaching using his Big guy. Even if they come back and win, since it is at Creighton they might, the way they play their Big and the lack of getting him the ball is ridiculous.

Eh I mean, they used the same strategy they used vs us. Fronted Kalk, had weak side shadow behind and had others sag down in the lane. They dared Creighton shooters to make their 3s and they certainly did not…52 total shots and 42 (!!!!!) were 3s. And they potentially lost their PG for at least a few games if not more.

 

[Boiler Buck]

Eh I mean, they used the same strategy they used vs us. Fronted Kalk, had weak side shadow behind and had others sag down in the lane. They dared Creighton shooters to make their 3s and they certainly did not…52 total shots and 42 (!!!!!) were 3s. And they potentially lost their PG for at least a few games if not more.

I didn't watch the whole game, but it seems like PnR with Kalk was non existent during my viewing. All they did was hoist 3s.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

I didn't watch the whole game, but it seems like PnR with Kalk was non existent during my viewing. All they did was hoist 3s.

Nebraska really took him away by making sure he didn’t get any room to do anything. But 1 shot attempt (even tho he shot a good amount of FTs) is still inexcusable like you mentioned

 

[BoilerMaker P]

They also beat a UK team in the first round who had 3 guys play in the nba at one point in their career and they also had the NPOTY. So…they were doing something right.

They dared the refs to call fouls and rhey didn’t that game. Texas tried to play that game the game before and we shot almost 50. Jaden also decided to play one of his worst games in a Purdue uniform. Zach was nowhere near what he turned out to be either.

And that game was the first step in Calipari being shown the door at UK.

 

[JRKinn]

To the posters talking negatively about tourney success of Painter, you are being irrational. I would challenge you to name 10 coaches with more tourney success over the last 7 tournaments than Painter has had. Stop the strawman of pointing to seed numbers, since there are crazy upsets every single year, and look at actual tourney results.

During the above time frame Painter has taken the team to the tourney every year, made the second weekend a shocking 70% of the time, had 2 deeper runs including a runner up. When you are a top 10 team consistently you are prone for some upsets in the tourney, otherwise every year we would have 4 1 seeds in the FF.

There is 1 coach with more consistency than Painter and that is Few, there are a handful more that won their chip game and are a little less consistent who you could argue are ahead of Painter. The list is pretty slim since 4 of the 7 champ games were won by 2 coaches one of which is now retired and another champ winner that was arguable the biggest tourney choker in the league who won it all and retired.

All that said who exactly are these amazing coaches that are amazing tourney coaches? I can see Few, Self, Hurley (not consistent but 2 chips is 2 chips) seem likely a step up. Then you have a bunch of maybe about the same with Herbert, Drew, Oats, Sampson?

You are Purdue fans which leads me to believe you graduated from there. Almost every PU grad I have met has a very logically brain, and seeing some of the emotional hot takes about things that defy reality just don't seem to fit the mold that I have seen from Purdue grads......

 

[bonefish1]

yes but memories you would love to hear ... RMK lost to Cleveland State, Richmond, Pepperdine in the first round of the NCAAs.

I hate iu and Knight as much as the next PU fan, but BK did win 3 NCs.

 

[bonefish1]

To the posters talking negatively about tourney success of Painter, you are being irrational. I would challenge you to name 10 coaches with more tourney success over the last 7 tournaments than Painter has had. Stop the strawman of pointing to seed numbers, since there are crazy upsets every single year, and look at actual tourney results.

During the above time frame Painter has taken the team to the tourney every year, made the second weekend a shocking 70% of the time, had 2 deeper runs including a runner up. When you are a top 10 team consistently you are prone for some upsets in the tourney, otherwise every year we would have 4 1 seeds in the FF.

There is 1 coach with more consistency than Painter and that is Few, there are a handful more that won their chip game and are a little less consistent who you could argue are ahead of Painter. The list is pretty slim since 4 of the 7 champ games were won by 2 coaches one of which is now retired and another champ winner that was arguable the biggest tourney choker in the league who won it all and retired.

All that said who exactly are these amazing coaches that are amazing tourney coaches? I can see Few, Self, Hurley (not consistent but 2 chips is 2 chips) seem likely a step up. Then you have a bunch of maybe about the same with Herbert, Drew, Oats, Sampson?

You are Purdue fans which leads me to believe you graduated from there. Almost every PU grad I have met has a very logically brain, and seeing some of the emotional hot takes about things that defy reality just don't seem to fit the mold that I have seen from Purdue grads......

I'm just curious, since you want to talk seeding and upsets, what do you make of the stat that Painter has only beat 1 team (and that was St. Mary's, who's not even on the college basketball map) that was seeded higher and not a 8/9 game?

 

[proudopete]

Painter has made it to the championship game, something Shaka has never done, and frankly don't really ever see Shaka doing it. His tourney wins are very few.

You have to play a higher seed to beat one and Painter usually has Purdue in the tourney with a high seed. You been told this numerous times but somehow you think your made up “stat” is some kind of gotcha.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

I'm just curious, since you want to talk seeding and upsets, what do you make of the stat that Painter has only beat 1 team (and that was St. Mary's, who's not even on the college basketball map) that was seeded higher and not a 8/9 game?

I get your point, Lenny; however, to correct your stat, you need to include 2019 game with Tennessee, and the 2009 game with Washington, no? I think in the past, you also stated it had to be more than one-seed line higher, is that what you meant?

~
Your friendly Nerd, Tex.....😎

 

[PurdueDave]

You have to play a higher seed to beat one and Painter usually has Purdue in the tourney with a high seed. You been told this numerous times but somehow you think your made up “stat” is some kind of gotcha.

To your point, one of the most successful teams in NCAA tournament history (Duke) has been upset 25 times by a higher seed and has only upset a lower seed 6 times.

Of course those facts are meaningless as Bone will counter with "Duke gets a pass because of multiple natties". Hopefully one day Purdue will also get a pass in the same way!

 

[SIBoiler2]

I hate iu and Knight as much as the next PU fan, but BK did win 3 NCs.

Don't think his bully-boy coaching would succeed today. The portal is always an easy out.

 

[bonefish1]

I get your point, Lenny; however, to correct your stat, you need to include 2019 game with Tennessee, and the 2009 game with Washington, no? I think in the past, you also stated it had to be more than one-seed line higher, is that what you meant?

~
Your friendly Nerd, Tex.....😎

I believe the TN game was a 3/2 and I don't recall what the Wash game was, 8/9? I believe I've quantified my statement by saying that he's only once, beaten a team that was more than 1 seed difference (and again, does St. Mary's really count.....)

 

[bonefish1]

To your point, one of the most successful teams in NCAA tournament history (Duke) has been upset 25 times by a higher seed and has only upset a lower seed 6 times.

Of course those facts are meaningless as Bone will counter with "Duke gets a pass because of multiple natties". Hopefully one day Purdue will also get a pass in the same way!

You can't compare the history of Duke, UK, UNC, UConn tourney history with Purdue because there is no comparison. I'm just going to guess, but I bet each of those teams have been to 8-10 FFs or won multiple NCs in the 40+ years that Purdue has a single FF.

 

[bonefish1]

Don't think his bully-boy coaching would succeed today. The portal is always an easy out.

I don't disagree, but the fact remains, and I don't like it either, but he was one of the best of his time.

 

[PurdueDave]

You can't compare the history of Duke, UK, UNC, UConn tourney history with Purdue because there is no comparison. I'm just going to guess, but I bet each of those teams have been to 8-10 FFs or won multiple NCs in the 40+ years that aren't out of the norm

The point is that teams with lower seeds get upset way more than they do the upsetting. I think if you look at the history of all those teams you listed, the trend will remain for all of them. With respect to upsets, Purdue isn't all that different.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

I believe the TN game was a 3/2 and I don't recall what the Wash game was, 8/9? I believe I've quantified my statement by saying that he's only once, beaten a team that was more than 1 seed difference (and again, does St. Mary's really count.....)

it was a 4/5 game Lenny in Portland.....you actually just said higher seed, that was my point.....no big deal, your main point/premise remains.

 

[RDUBoiler]

I'm not a big fan of turning over the program to someone with zero HC experience at this level. Football has shown that can have disastrous results.
Additionally, I'd be in favor of bringing some new blood into the program.

Painter could easily coach another ten years, no? By then, PJ will likely have been a head coach somewhere else, and we'll know if he's ready. So far, PJ definitely seems to be showing a lot of potential.

 

[iubhounds]

I hate iu and Knight as much as the next PU fan, but BK did win 3 NCs.

You know I have thought about that hatred of each fan base. I tried to figure out when it changed for me and it was during the RMK - Keady years. Yet a lot times those games, both teams were ranked in the Top 10 which made for great rivalry games. I use to like watching Purdue play with their teams in the last 1960s ... I figure that is way before your time.

 

[spoilerdave]

No way. I think that would be a huge risk.

I think I would prefer to see Brandon Brantley, but it isn't happening anytime soon unless Painter jumps, and I don't see it without an administrative catastrophe. I would think Robbie Hummel would be another name to float in 10 years. Remember Izzo is 15 years older than Painter to keep things in perspective. Nothing happens for another 10 years without a significant surprise.

Is there a Shaka Smart type coach available for football though?

 

[bonefish1]

The point is that teams with lower seeds get upset way more than they do the upsetting. I think if you look at the history of all those teams you listed, the trend will remain for all of them. With respect to upsets, Purdue isn't all that different.

The point is that teams with lower seeds get upset way more than they do the upsetting. I think if you look at the history of all those teams you listed, the trend will remain for all of them. With respect to upsets, Purdue isn't all that different.

those teams have earned the right to be periodically upset because they get to the FF every 4-5 years.
In Purdue’s case, it was 40+ years while at the same time, getting upset by lower seeded teams.

 

[bonefish1]

Painter could easily coach another ten years, no? By then, PJ will likely have been a head coach somewhere else, and we'll know if he's ready. So far, PJ definitely seems to be showing a lot of potential.

Yeh, Painter absolutely will coach another 10. I think he wants a NC on his resume.
In that 10 years, I think PJ would have to get to at least a MAC level, show the ability to recruit, make the tourny, etc.
maybe he comes back as the associate HC for a year or two before Painter steps aside.

 

[northside100]

I'm just curious, since you want to talk seeding and upsets, what do you make of the stat that Painter has only beat 1 team (and that was St. Mary's, who's not even on the college basketball map) that was seeded higher and not a 8/9 game?

Yup, means that he’s had a lot of teams with fairly high seeds. Wouldn’t it be so cool if he earned some 11 seeds and pulled some first round upsets?

 

[northside100]

Yeh, Painter absolutely will coach another 10. I think he wants a NC on his resume.
In that 10 years, I think PJ would have to get to at least a MAC level, show the ability to recruit, make the tourny, etc.
maybe he comes back as the associate HC for a year or two before Painter steps aside.

Absolutely not going to happen. So long as MP maintains anywhere near his current level of success PJ doesn’t need to go anywhere to take the reigns.

 

[northside100]

You can't compare the history of Duke, UK, UNC, UConn tourney history with Purdue because there is no comparison. I'm just going to guess, but I bet each of those teams have been to 8-10 FFs or won multiple NCs in the 40+ years that Purdue has a single FF.

It’s ****ing elementary school math. The more often you earn a high seed the more frequently you’ll lose to a lower seed. That’s the nature of a single elimination tournament. Arguing anything else is intellectual laziness.

 

[bonefish1]

You know I have thought about that hatred of each fan base. I tried to figure out when it changed for me and it was during the RMK - Keady years. Yet a lot times those games, both teams were ranked in the Top 10 which made for great rivalry games. I use to like watching Purdue play with their teams in the last 1960s ... I figure that is way before your time.

Despite several family members and friends being iu grads, I hate iu with a passion.

 

[DwaynePurvis00]

It’s ****ing elementary school math. The more often you earn a high seed the more frequently you’ll lose to a lower seed. That’s the nature of a single elimination tournament. Arguing anything else is intellectual laziness.

I think you need to just have blue in your school colors for it to be ok to lose to a lower seed.

 

[BoilerMaker P]

Two things can be true at the same time. Matt Painter is a great coach who is in the golden era of his program that everyone should be appreciating…absolutely true. Also true, though, is that there have been some bad losses sprinkled throughout. Yes, part of that is from expectations being set by non-conference and regular season success. Still bad losses. Also, those aren’t unique to Painter. Keady had his fair share of tournament flameouts.

Calling bad losses bad losses isn’t necessarily saying you want a coaching change. At least that’s not my point of view. Hell, Brohm had plenty of bad football losses but I’d trade him for the current situation all day.

 

[bonefish1]

It’s ****ing elementary school math. The more often you earn a high seed the more frequently you’ll lose to a lower seed. That’s the nature of a single elimination tournament. Arguing anything else is intellectual laziness.

If it happens once, well OK. If it happens twice it's a concern. If it happens 3 times, all in short succession, it's a house on fire situation. That's what happened to Purdue. They had a historically bad 5 year run. There's not way around that. Thankfully, he came back with a FF and shot at the NC.

 

[iubhounds]

Despite several family members and friends being iu grads, I hate iu with a passion.

our feelings are the same. My niece in an interview for a pharmacist job was asked, "why did you go to Butler instead of Purdue" ... she replied 'if I had gone to purdue my uncle would have never spoke to me again" .. true story. Yet the interview was in Bloomington so that may have been a difference in giving an answer like that. Peegs asked me after the forum moved from the Indy Star to change my user name. It was IH8PU.

 

[bonefish1]

our feelings are the same. My niece in an interview for a pharmacist job was asked, "why did you go to Butler instead of Purdue" ... she replied 'if I had gone to purdue my uncle would have never spoke to me again" .. true story. Yet the interview was in Bloomington so that may have been a difference in giving an answer like that. Peegs asked me after the forum moved from the Indy Star to change my user name. It was IH8PU.

I've been banned from Peegs for about 8 years now. Bunch of snowflakes over there.