Purdue/Michigan overview

[nagemj02]

When: Friday, March 10th

Where: Verizon Center, Washington DC

Tip-Off: Noon (ET)

TV: ESPN


Head Coaches:

Purdue: Matt Painter (12th season)

Michigan: John Beilein (10th season)



Projected Starters:

Purdue

1/2 #11 P.J. Thompson 5'10 175 (Jr.): averaging 7.3 PPG, 2.1 RPG, 1 SPG, 3 APG, 45% FG's (75-167), 74% FT's (29-39), 39% 3PT's (46-118), and 28.2 MPG in 31 GP this season

2/1 #31 Dakota Mathias 6'4 195 (Jr.): averaging 10.1 PPG, 3.8 RPG, 3.6 APG, 49% FG's (108-221), 84% FT's (32-38), 48% 3PT's (65-136), and 31.2 MPG in 31 GP this season

2 #14 Ryan Cline 6'5 190 (So.): averaging 5.7 PPG, 42% FG's (52-123), 82% FT's (9-11), 41% 3PT's (41-99), and 21.3 MPG in 27 GP this season

3/4 #12 Vincent "Vince" Edwards 6'8 215 (Jr.): averaging 12.3 PPG, 4.8 RPG, 3.3 APG, 48% FG's (135-282), 85% FT's (70-82), 42% 3PT's (42-99), and 28.5 MPG in 31 GP this season

5/4 #50 Caleb "Biggie" Swanigan 6'9 245 (So.): averaging 18.7 PPG, 12.6 RPG, 2.8 APG, 3.3 TPG, 2.8 FPG, 54% FG's (198-367), 79% FT's (152-192), 45% 3PT's (31-69), and 31.9 MPG in 31 GP this season


Michigan

1 #10 Derrick Walton 6'1 185 (Sr.): averaging 14.7 PPG, 4.7 RPG, 1.1 SPG, 4.5 APG, 44% FG's (138-316), 85% FT's (115-135), 42% 3PT's (79-189), and 34.2 MPG in 32 GP this season

2/1 #12 Muhammad-Ali Abdur-Rahkman 6'3 180 (Jr.): averaging 9.4 PPG, 2.7 RPG, 1 SPG, 2 APG, 47% FG's (104-223), 74% FT's (55-74), 40% 3PT's (38-95), and 29.7 MPG in 32 GP this season

3/2 #21 Zak Irvin 6'6 215 (Sr.): averaging 12.8 PPG, 4.4 RPG, 2.9 APG, 43% FG's (159-366), 69% FT's (47-68), 32% 3PT's (43-133), and 34.8 MPG in 32 GP this season

4/5 #5 D.J. Wilson 6'10 225 (RS So.): averaging 10 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 1.3 BPG, 54% FG's (126-232), 82% FT's (37-45), 38% 3PT's (32-84), and 29.8 MPG in 32 GP this season

4/5 #13 Moritz "Mo" Wagner (pronounced vog-ner) 6'11 230 (So.): averaging 12.2 PPG, 4.3 RPG, 1 SPG, 2.7 FPG, 57% FG's (143-253), 72% FT's (63-87), 42% 3PT's (41-98), and 24.4 MPG in 32 GP this season



Projected Reinforcements

Purdue

1 #55 Michael "Spike" Albrecht 5'11 180 (RS Sr.) (graduate transfer from Michigan): averaging 1.8 PPG, 27% FG's (10-37), 95% FT's (18-19), 21% 3PT's (5-24), and 12.9 MPG in 24 GP this season

1/2 #3 Carsen Edwards 6'0 185 (Fr.): averaging 10.2 PPG, 2.6 RPG, 1 SPG, 38% FG's (113-299), 71% FT's (45-63), 35% 3PT's (45-129), and 23.4 MPG in 31 GP this season

5 #44 Isaac Haas 7'2 280 (Jr.): averaging 12.6 PPG, 5.1 RPG, 2.4 TPG, 58% FG's (137-236), 72% FT's (117-162), no 3PT's attempted, and 19.9 MPG in 31 GP this season


Michigan

1/2 #3 Xavier Simpson 5'11 170 (Fr.): averaging 1.8 PPG, 37% FG's (15-41), 79% FT's (22-28), 26% 3PT's (5-19), and 9.2 MPG in 32 GP this season

3/2 #22 Duncan Robinson 6'7 215 (RS Jr.): averaging 8 PPG, 48% FG's (90-187), 81% FT's (21-26), 43% 3PT's (56-131), and 19.7 MPG in 32 GP this season

4/5 #34 Mark Donnal 6'8 225 (RS Jr.): averaging 4.3 PPG, 2.2 RPG, 64% FG's (47-74), 78% FT's (36-46), 47% 3PT's (7-15), and 13 MPG in 32 GP this season


Who Might Play:

Purdue

no one else likely to play


Michigan

2/3 #23 Ibi Watson 6'5 185 (Fr.): averaging 1.3 PPG, 35% FG's (10-29), 75% FT's (3-4), 6% 3PT's (1-18), and 4.4 MPG in 19 GP this season

5 #15 Jon Teske 6'11 240 (Fr.): averaging 0.3 PPG, 14% FG's (1-7), 50% FT's (3-6), 0% 3PT's (0-1), and 3.2 MPG in 19 GP this season

 

[SqueakyClean]

kinda jumping the gun here a bit, aren't you?

 

[nagemj02]

kinda jumping the gun here a bit, aren't you?

I'm going to post an overview for Illinois as well.

 

[nagemj02]

If the Boilers end up playing Michigan, what do they need to do differently on D to give themselves a better chance of getting payback in this (hypothetical) rematch?

 

[Purdue0034]

Not sure what we need to do differently, but hopefully Wagner doesn't go off again. I think a neutral site will be helpful to the Boilermakers. Michigan is playing pretty good down the stretch, but they have been pretty consistently inconsistent most of the year! Hopefully Illinois beats them or at least gives them a good game to wear them out!
If we end up playing Michigan, I would start Carsen in this one. We definitely need to do better from 3 point range in the rematch and keep our free throw percentage up!

 

[tjreese]

If the Boilers end up playing Michigan, what do they need to do differently on D to give themselves a better chance of getting payback in this (hypothetical) rematch?

*************************
Well I thought this was interesting since I questioned if this was possibly true and apparently it was.

4/5 #5 D.J. Wilson 6'10 225 (RS So.): averaging 10 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 1.4 BPG, 54% FG's (122-227), 81% FT's (35-43), 38% 3PT's (31-82), and 29.7 MPG in 31 GP this season

4/5 #13 Moritz "Mo" Wagner (pronounced vog-ner) 6'11 230 (So.): averaging 12.4 PPG, 4.4 RPG, 2.7 FPG, 57% FG's (140-245), 72% FT's (63-87), 43% 3PT's (41-95), and 24.2 MPG in 31 GP this season

So, as I questioned...whoever Biggie guards that person can float outside if Michigan wants as there isn't a whole lot of difference. I had not seen the data, but when all this went down I proposed that this scenario might exist...which I didn't know and do today. As I said then...Purdue can't make Michigan play their players where Purdue wants...

 

[New Pal Boiler]

If the Boilers end up playing Michigan, what do they need to do differently on D to give themselves a better chance of getting payback in this (hypothetical) rematch?

Biggie and Haas cannot guard either Moe or DJ. They could very well beat us again. Rooting for Illinois.

 

[nagemj02]

Biggie and Haas cannot guard either Moe or DJ. They could very well beat us again. Rooting for Illinois.

Could Purdue employ an offense/defense substitution (as frequently as possible) for Haas throughout the game? Vince Edwards could guard Wagner and Swanigan could guard Wilson.

It would be nice to have Matt Haarms or Jacquil Taylor available to play right now.

 

[nagemj02]

I'm starting to work on the Purdue/Illinois overview thread and while trying to find information on Mike Thorne, Jr.'s status (I don't think he's played for several games) I found this article that could be an inspiration for Purdue if they match up with Michigan on Friday:

http://herald-review.com/blogs/mark...cle_c23f7f54-d882-11e6-976d-67b390442a48.html

 

[tjreese]

Biggie and Haas cannot guard either Moe or DJ. They could very well beat us again. Rooting for Illinois.

that is out on the perimeter. if neither shoots like they did...they are beatable, but yeah teh bookends could be a problem if Purdue cannot flip it and make them guard inside and have problems doing so...kinda going back to what I wondered when many were blaming Matt for having Biggie guarding Wagner. If I'm Michigan...whoever Biggie is guarding I put him in space

 

[nagemj02]

that is out on the perimeter. if neither shoots like they did...they are beatable, but yeah teh bookends could be a problem if Purdue cannot flip it and make them guard inside and have problems doing so...kinda going back to what I wondered when many were blaming Matt for having Biggie guarding Wagner. If I'm Michigan...whoever Biggie is guarding I put him in space

just curious tj, why do you write "teh" instead of "the" all of the time?

Also, Purdue could put VE on Wagner instead of Swanigan. I'd rather Wagner be trying to post up VE for 2 points inside than shooting threes over Swanigan and Haas all game. I'd put Swanigan on Wilson.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

Granted, it was Nebraska, but Michigan went 14-27 from deep on Sunday....hopefully, they don't sustain that type of shooting this week. They'll get some looks, and I would suspect Purdue will try some of the switching it did in the second half in Ann Arbor. Nebraska tried it to no avail.

As others have said....need to be more efficient on offense as well. Having a second shot at the Wolverines should be a good thing for them.

But.....don't count out the Illini just yet.

 

[tjreese]

Could Purdue employ an offense/defense substitution (as frequently as possible) for Haas throughout the game? Vince Edwards could guard Wagner and Swanigan could guard Wilson.

It would be nice to have Matt Haarms or Jacquil Taylor available to play right now.

They could do it more than an usual game...start it sooner if needed. However, the odds are pretty good that Wagner and Wilson do NOT go off like Wagner did in such a short time frame. I wish I could find the time span of hte game when MO hit about three 3's it seemed like very quickly. Biggie and/or Haas will be in the game at one time...and NO MATTER who is in there Michigan has the option of placing five behind the arc. If Michigan gets the same number of shots and hits 40%, you have to shoot 60% to match outside of the FT line. PART of the problem beside the problems in matching up to them with the players Purdue has was intensity last time...that and them being home and feeling very confident. They know they can beat Purdue, but they know they are NOT going to sneak up on Purdue as Purdue will be ready this time...both teams know it. It very well could be that Irvin goes off this game. This is a contrast of player personnel and style. Michigan certainly has the length to defend Purdue...and the Bigs that can face up and score against Purdue, but they have lost games for a reseason this year. Whoever Purdue plays...I hope Purdue always remembers their strengths ...even if the are very hot in the first half...grind and work it inside. DJ and Mo can't score if they are on the bench...

 

[tjreese]

just curious tj, why do you write "teh" instead of "the" all of the time?

Also, Purdue could put VE on Wagner instead of Swanigan. I'd rather Wagner be trying to post up VE for 2 points inside than shooting threes over Swanigan and Haas all game. I'd put Swanigan on Wilson.

******************
bad habits. First years of putting in data I have created a bad habin with aligning my fingers. Second, it became worse when I dislocated my ring finger back in the 90's going up for a rebound pretty bad. I actually moved it back about 1/2 inche and turned it perpendicular to the rest of the finger. It went completely numb and never hurt a bit. I stopped the game and guys almost got sick. I type so much I just get it close and don't worry about my typos. So teh comes out many times instead of the. You ought to see my voice texts with autocorrect...

 

[tjreese]

just curious tj, why do you write "teh" instead of "the" all of the time?

Also, Purdue could put VE on Wagner instead of Swanigan. I'd rather Wagner be trying to post up VE for 2 points inside than shooting threes over Swanigan and Haas all game. I'd put Swanigan on Wilson.

I'd rather him shoot threes and miss and keep away from the fouls. No matter what Michigan can exploit Purdue's bigs and so THAT needs flipped

 

[nagemj02]

******************
bad habits. First years of putting in data I have created a bad habin with aligning my fingers. Second, it became worse when I dislocated my ring finger back in the 90's going up for a rebound pretty bad. I actually moved it back about 1/2 inche and turned it perpendicular to the rest of the finger. It went completely numb and never hurt a bit. I stopped the game and guys almost got sick. I type so much I just get it close and don't worry about my typos. So teh comes out many times instead of the. You ought to see my voice texts with autocorrect...

gotcha

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

They could do it more than an usual game...start it sooner if needed. However, the odds are pretty good that Wagner and Wilson do NOT go off like Wagner did in such a short time frame. I wish I could find the time span of hte game when MO hit about three 3's it seemed like very quickly. Biggie and/or Haas will be in the game at one time...and NO MATTER who is in there Michigan has the option of placing five behind the arc. If Michigan gets the same number of shots and hits 40%, you have to shoot 60% to match outside of the FT line. PART of the problem beside the problems in matching up to them with the players Purdue has was intensity last time...that and them being home and feeling very confident. They know they can beat Purdue, but they know they are NOT going to sneak up on Purdue as Purdue will be ready this time...both teams know it. It very well could be that Irvin goes off this game. This is a contrast of player personnel and style. Michigan certainly has the length to defend Purdue...and the Bigs that can face up and score against Purdue, but they have lost games for a reseason this year. Whoever Purdue plays...I hope Purdue always remembers their strengths ...even if the are very hot in the first half...grind and work it inside. DJ and Mo can't score if they are on the bench...

TJ,

In the first half, here's Wagner's made three-point FG's:

@ 9:34, 8:31, 6:10, and 4:44.....four in a five-minute span (with a lay-up mixed in for good measure @7:04). That's 14 of his 22 points right there. He had two early lay-ups and a jumper, and then another FG before the half ended. If Purdue plays Michigan, I would hope VE and CS take it as a personal challenge to contain him....I expect there will be some talking from both sides......could be fun.

 

[rustcr]

Could Purdue employ an offense/defense substitution (as frequently as possible) for Haas throughout the game? Vince Edwards could guard Wagner and Swanigan could guard Wilson.

It would be nice to have Matt Haarms or Jacquil Taylor available to play right now.

Besides Vincent guarding Wagner in the second half of that game, I thought we did a lot better switching on the perimeter as well. I expect better defense from the Boilers if they play UM again.

 

[tjreese]

TJ,

In the first half, here's Wagner's made three-point FG's:

@ 9:34, 8:31, 6:10, and 4:44.....four in a five-minute span (with a lay-up mixed in for good measure @7:04). That's 14 of his 22 points right there. He had two early lay-ups and a jumper, and then another FG before the half ended. If Purdue plays Michigan, I would hope VE and CS take it as a personal challenge to contain him....I expect there will be some talking from both sides......could be fun.

Thank you...you do a great job of finding things. Well, my hunch was right assuming roughly 150 seconds for each team 14 points for one guy. As I have said many times the game can turn in a two minute span...sometimes happens quicker than anyone thinks it will...but usually it doesn't. Was it luck...do we let it play out..do I change things...oops he has 14

 

[tjreese]

Besides Vincent guarding Wagner in the second half of that game, I thought we did a lot better switching on the perimeter as well. I expect better defense from the Boilers if they play UM again.

I think the whole if not most of the second half was switching all positions and I certainly did not like seeing PJ underneath on a big. It helped keep them in front, but once a switch is an advantage for Michigan they can pull their players away so they cannot switch back and take advantage of that situation. Haas will play adn if he can dominate inside...that will be a huge plus.

 

[Dryfly88]

Vince on Wagner and you hope that Wilson doesn't go off on Caleb. Michigan has lost a lot of games this year. Many of them to teams much less talented than PU. We ran into a buzz saw in Ann Arbor. I'm betting it doesn't happen again. I look for a much closer game, more of a grinder, with PU playing better and MI playing worse.

 

[tjreese]

Vince on Wagner and you hope that Wilson doesn't go off on Caleb. Michigan has lost a lot of games this year. Many of them to teams much less talented than PU. We ran into a buzz saw in Ann Arbor. I'm betting it doesn't happen again. I look for a much closer game, more of a grinder, with PU playing better and MI playing worse.

that is what I expect, but with two bookends...it could be DJs day. I don't think either is as hot as Wagner was and Purdue wins...

 

[daisyrail1619]

If only our bench bros can play but it's just a dream. Wilson will go off if Wagner goes off. It depends on their X factor. So just keep Wagner low and the others wouldn't go off that much. And add more focus. Last time we didn't really focus and I'd like to see Haas staying inside of the paint and don't move too far. Right now my biggest concern is on Haas.

 

[nagemj02]

"If only our bench bros can play but it's just a dream."

I'm not following you on this, daisy. What do you mean?

 

[typeviic]

Remember, Meat-Chicken is a different animal when playing away from home......

 

[Boiler Buck]

When: Friday, March 10th

Where: Verizon Center, Washington DC

Tip-Off: Noon (ET)

TV: ESPN


Head Coaches:

Purdue: Matt Painter (12th season)

Michigan: John Beilein (10th season)



Note: (These are my Michigan player stats of note (rotation guys) going into their game vs. Illinois on Thursday, March 9th.)



Projected Starters:

Purdue

1/2 #11 P.J. Thompson 5'10 175 (Jr.): averaging 7.3 PPG, 2.1 RPG, 1 SPG, 3 APG, 45% FG's (75-167), 74% FT's (29-39), 39% 3PT's (46-118), and 28.2 MPG in 31 GP this season

2/1 #31 Dakota Mathias 6'4 195 (Jr.): averaging 10.1 PPG, 3.8 RPG, 3.6 APG, 49% FG's (108-221), 84% FT's (32-38), 48% 3PT's (65-136), and 31.2 MPG in 31 GP this season

2 #14 Ryan Cline 6'5 190 (So.): averaging 5.7 PPG, 42% FG's (52-123), 82% FT's (9-11), 41% 3PT's (41-99), and 21.3 MPG in 27 GP this season

3/4 #12 Vincent "Vince" Edwards 6'8 215 (Jr.): averaging 12.3 PPG, 4.8 RPG, 3.3 APG, 48% FG's (135-282), 85% FT's (70-82), 42% 3PT's (42-99), and 28.5 MPG in 31 GP this season

5/4 #50 Caleb "Biggie" Swanigan 6'9 245 (So.): averaging 18.7 PPG, 12.6 RPG, 2.8 APG, 3.3 TPG, 2.8 FPG, 54% FG's (198-367), 79% FT's (152-192), 45% 3PT's (31-69), and 31.9 MPG in 31 GP this season


Michigan

1 #10 Derrick Walton 6'1 185 (Sr.): averaging 14.5 PPG, 4.7 RPG, 1.1 SPG, 4.5 APG, 43% FG's (131-302), 86% FT's (114-133), 42% 3PT's (75-179), and 34.1 MPG in 31 GP this season

2/1 #12 Muhammad-Ali Abdur-Rahkman 6'3 180 (Jr.): averaging 9.2 PPG, 2.7 RPG, 2 APG, 46% FG's (97-210), 74% FT's (54-73), 40% 3PT's (36-91), and 29.5 MPG in 31 GP this season

3/2 #21 Zak Irvin 6'6 215 (Sr.): averaging 12.6 PPG, 4.3 RPG, 3 APG, 43% FG's (151-352), 69% FT's (47-68), 32% 3PT's (41-127), and 34.7 MPG in 31 GP this season

4/5 #5 D.J. Wilson 6'10 225 (RS So.): averaging 10 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 1.4 BPG, 54% FG's (122-227), 81% FT's (35-43), 38% 3PT's (31-82), and 29.7 MPG in 31 GP this season

4/5 #13 Moritz "Mo" Wagner (pronounced vog-ner) 6'11 230 (So.): averaging 12.4 PPG, 4.4 RPG, 2.7 FPG, 57% FG's (140-245), 72% FT's (63-87), 43% 3PT's (41-95), and 24.2 MPG in 31 GP this season



Projected Reinforcements

Purdue

1 #55 Michael "Spike" Albrecht 5'11 180 (RS Sr.) (graduate transfer from Michigan): averaging 1.8 PPG, 27% FG's (10-37), 95% FT's (18-19), 21% 3PT's (5-24), and 12.9 MPG in 24 GP this season

1/2 #3 Carsen Edwards 6'0 185 (Fr.): averaging 10.2 PPG, 2.6 RPG, 1 SPG, 38% FG's (113-299), 71% FT's (45-63), 35% 3PT's (45-129), and 23.4 MPG in 31 GP this season

5 #44 Isaac Haas 7'2 280 (Jr.): averaging 12.6 PPG, 5.1 RPG, 2.4 TPG, 58% FG's (137-236), 72% FT's (117-162), no 3PT's attempted, and 19.9 MPG in 31 GP this season


Michigan

1/2 #3 Xavier Simpson 5'11 170 (Fr.): averaging 1.8 PPG, 38% FG's (15-40), 77% FT's (20-26), 26% 3PT's (5-19), and 9.2 MPG in 31 GP this season

3/2 #22 Duncan Robinson 6'7 215 (RS Jr.): averaging 8.2 PPG, 48% FG's (89-186), 81% FT's (21-26), 43% 3PT's (56-131), and 19.9 MPG in 31 GP this season

4/5 #34 Mark Donnal 6'8 225 (RS Jr.): averaging 4.4 PPG, 2.3 RPG, 64% FG's (47-74), 78% FT's (36-46), 47% 3PT's (7-15), and 13.2 MPG in 31 GP this season


Who Might Play:

Purdue

no one else likely to play


Michigan

2/3 #23 Ibi Watson 6'5 185 (Fr.): averaging 1.3 PPG, 35% FG's (10-29), 75% FT's (3-4), 6% 3PT's (1-18), and 4.4 MPG in 19 GP this season

5 #15 Jon Teske 6'11 240 (Fr.): averaging 0.3 PPG, 14% FG's (1-7), 50% FT's (3-6), 0% 3PT's (0-1), and 3.2 MPG in 19 GP this season

As I said in another thread MICH is a dark horse team for me....they have to get by 2 real tough defensive teams in ILL (lately) and Purdue....hard for them.

But here is what I like about them...while they can beat 1-2 teams with their hot shooting what I like about them is the play of their PG. DWJ has been dominate late....and outside of Biggie and Trimble is a B1G game changer. DWJ has put up double digit assists this season and did so last year in the tourney - so he is a big game guy that MICH can go to war with a lot of teams and has him as a steady force. The problem is yes, team shooting fades every now and again and might do so in a back to back to back game format as why I have them third in this darkhorse group behind MN & Iowa as likely to make a run. As the main thing is....they play some strong defensive teams in Illinois (as of late) and for sure Purdue that likely either very much could destroy their hopes real quick.

 

[boilerzz]

If the Boilers end up playing Michigan, what do they need to do differently on D to give themselves a better chance of getting payback in this (hypothetical) rematch?

Michigan scored 28 points in the first 18 minutes of the 2nd half after Purdue started switching everything. They scored 9 in the last 2 minutes because of Walton's ridiculous three as the shot clock expired (while standing on PJ's foot) and Purdue fouling to extend the game.

 

[daisyrail1619]

"If only our bench bros can play but it's just a dream."

I'm not following you on this, daisy. What do you mean?

Taylor and Haarms

 

[NVBoilerFan]

Biggie and Haas cannot guard either Moe or DJ. They could very well beat us again. Rooting for Illinois.

Neither of those guys can guard VE or Biggie either.

 

[hamcoboiler]

They have to go with Swanigan on Wilson. If Wilson gets going from 3, I would move Swanigan to Irvin. Irvin is their worst 3 point shooter among the starters.

I know its been talked about constantly on this board, but if there was a matchup to try zone this is it. Keep Haas or Swanigan in the middle of a 2-3 zone and extend the other defenders to the 3 point line. Michigan gets it going from 3 then kills you with dribble penetration and back cuts. A rim defender at the hoop at all times takes away the back cuts and dribble penetration.

I understand CP's opinion on zone, but I don't agree with it. Belechick went from a 4-3 to a 3-4 in Super Bowl 39. Donovan McNabb was interviewed afterwards and said they prepared for 2 weeks and never considered the Patriots doing that. Every single player on Purdue has played zone, its not like a foreign language to them. You can insert for a game and go back to man to man or if it goes terribly you can go back to man in the game.

Sometimes Purdue's insistence on man seems to be rooted in stubbornness not winning.

 

[lbodel]

Michigan scored 28 points in the first 18 minutes of the 2nd half after Purdue started switching everything. They scored 9 in the last 2 minutes because of Walton's ridiculous three as the shot clock expired (while standing on PJ's foot) and Purdue fouling to extend the game.

You touched on an important part of the Michigan game - our biggest deficit came well after Edwards was put on Wagner.

 

[FirstDownB]

*************************
Well I thought this was interesting since I questioned if this was possibly true and apparently it was.

4/5 #5 D.J. Wilson 6'10 225 (RS So.): averaging 10 PPG, 5.4 RPG, 1.4 BPG, 54% FG's (122-227), 81% FT's (35-43), 38% 3PT's (31-82), and 29.7 MPG in 31 GP this season

4/5 #13 Moritz "Mo" Wagner (pronounced vog-ner) 6'11 230 (So.): averaging 12.4 PPG, 4.4 RPG, 2.7 FPG, 57% FG's (140-245), 72% FT's (63-87), 43% 3PT's (41-95), and 24.2 MPG in 31 GP this season

So, as I questioned...whoever Biggie guards that person can float outside if Michigan wants as there isn't a whole lot of difference. I had not seen the data, but when all this went down I proposed that this scenario might exist...which I didn't know and do today. As I said then...Purdue can't make Michigan play their players where Purdue wants...

TJ, considering Wagner and Wilson are similar players who would pose the same match-up problems, would it make sense to start Biggie on Wilson and switch to VE if Wilson gets going? Perhaps even switch back several times during the game just to give them a different type of defender and keep either one out of the comfort zone that Wagner found in the first half last time? Just looking at the Michigan box scores, it seems both are streaky players.

 

[Heller]

I've never seen Wagner do a lot when he posts up. So I agree with those who say put Vince on Wagner.

 

[tjreese]

Remember, Meat-Chicken is a different animal when playing away from home......

so far... history this year says that...

 

[tjreese]

TJ, considering Wagner and Wilson are similar players who would pose the same match-up problems, would it make sense to start Biggie on Wilson and switch to VE if Wilson gets going? Perhaps even switch back several times during the game just to give them a different type of defender and keep either one out of the comfort zone that Wagner found in the first half last time? Just looking at the Michigan box scores, it seems both are streaky players.

Just for clarification...I'm sure they were allowed to switch as needed before (in a possession), but your question is to switch initial players you guard...and yes I too would start Vince on Wagner. Michigan spreads you and so switching back and forth between those two are probably minimal times within a possession. I "think" that Wagner may be the more fluid player and that would give an edge to Vince. Yes, my thoughts are in agreement with you.

I think Purdue must really understand who they are and work hard to get the passes on time where they need to go and that Purdue players 1-3 contain the dribble on Walton in particular and yet make the passes from all 1-3 players of Michigan difficult to not find Wagner and Wilson in a sweet spot. I doubt Purdue sees the same MIchigan team and won't be surprised if Irvin isn't more of a factor...just like Biggie will be.

Michigan is an offensive team and I would like their energy expended playing D on Purdue for extended minutes and for Purdue to control tempo..running every time their is a Purdue advantage. I don't want to see Purdue running up and down the court for the sake of running and exchanging baskets. I want Michigan's mindset focused on stopping Purdue instead of scoring for Michigan.

I just watched NW again last night and I must say BIGGIE worked his A$$ off posting in that game. Can you imagine the endurance needed to push on guys for position for extended durations, bust your butt to find the ball on rebounds and have enough energy to finish WITHOUT chasing guys on the perimeter? THAT too is another reason to have Vince...

 

[FirstDownB]

Just for clarification...I'm sure they were allowed to switch as needed before (in a possession), but your question is to switch initial players you guard...and yes I too would start Vince on Wagner. Michigan spreads you and so switching back and forth between those two are probably minimal times within a possession. I "think" that Wagner may be the more fluid player and that would give an edge to Vince. Yes, my thoughts are in agreement with you.

I think Purdue must really understand who they are and work hard to get the passes on time where they need to go and that Purdue players 1-3 contain the dribble on Walton in particular and yet make the passes from all 1-3 players of Michigan difficult to not find Wagner and Wilson in a sweet spot. I doubt Purdue sees the same MIchigan team and won't be surprised if Irvin isn't more of a factor...just like Biggie will be.

Michigan is an offensive team and I would like their energy expended playing D on Purdue for extended minutes and for Purdue to control tempo..running every time their is a Purdue advantage. I don't want to see Purdue running up and down the court for the sake of running and exchanging baskets. I want Michigan's mindset focused on stopping Purdue instead of scoring for Michigan.

I just watched NW again last night and I must say BIGGIE worked his A$$ off posting in that game. Can you imagine the endurance needed to push on guys for position for extended durations, bust your butt to find the ball on rebounds and have enough energy to finish WITHOUT chasing guys on the perimeter? THAT too is another reason to have Vince...

Yes, I meant switch the players they are initially guarding. Like maybe coming out of a timeout if Wilson is on a roll.
I am not too worried about Irvin as we will have the cowboy on him! Walton could have another good game though.
Agreed with making them work, and I don't think they will have the energy they had on senior day.

 

[Boiler Buck]

so far... history this year says that...

↑
Remember, Meat-Chicken is a different animal when playing away from home......
so far... history this year says that...

Don't tell that to NE

 

[lbodel]

↑
Remember, Meat-Chicken is a different animal when playing away from home......
so far... history this year says that...

Don't tell that to NE

While their straight up win/loss record on the road is not impressive, it doesn't necessarily tell the tale.

For example, they lost to Minnesota and Iowa on the road - both of them in overtime. Earlier in the season, they also beat Marquette and SMU at a neutral site - both handily.

However, they also beat Rutgers recently on the road by 4 and have lost many other games on the road.

 

[tjreese]

Yes, I meant switch the players they are initially guarding. Like maybe coming out of a timeout if Wilson is on a roll.
I am not too worried about Irvin as we will have the cowboy on him! Walton could have another good game though.
Agreed with making them work, and I don't think they will have the energy they had on senior day.

I got the Boilers for all those reasons...AND that was a game Biggie never got a double -double. Biggie gets it in the Michigan game and he ties the most in Big Ten and then can break it the next game to add to his POTY resume

 

[tjreese]

↑
Remember, Meat-Chicken is a different animal when playing away from home......
so far... history this year says that...

Don't tell that to NE

I think it was ZO that liked playing away more. I can't speak to NE since I'm not sure how the teams they beat were doing at the time they beat them, but yes their record at the start was impressive away. Michigan has drilled teams big time at home though.

Here is an interesting one for you. Purdue lost three games in the BIG to teams they only played ONCE...NE, MInny,Michigan. The other was at Iowa after drilling them with a hellfire of threes early at Mackey