I haven’t said that Braden will be the best player in the Big Ten. My assertion is that it’s ridiculous to say that Bruce Thornton has an argument as the best returning player in the conference.
Inside the Hall
- Thread starter Blimpy
- Start date
Playing schedules like that don’t help these days and can absolutely kill you if you lose a game or two to that competition.
How is it ridiculous to consider Thornton the best player in the Big Ten? Out of returning players only Dawson Garcia and Peyton Sandfort averaged more points and only Smith and Baldwin averaged more assists. So you're saying that expecting a guy who averaged 16 and 5 shouldn't be expected to be in the conversation for the best player in the B1G?
You said it yourself, high usage on bad teams. I added relatively low efficiency. That's not a good combination for somehow leaping to being the best player in the conference, particularly for a guy who isn't an elite athlete who came into the league near his physical max.
I like Thorton, I think he's a good player and would expect him to be incrementally better this season but yes, it's complete hyperbole to say that he 'has a pretty good case' to be expected to be the best player in the league. Just like it's ridiculous to say we have 'no clue' how Smith will play without Edey.
You make some good points. I agree with your assessment that beyond a small handful of players we don't yet know who the best players in the league will be and there will likely be several surprises, but you're also making exaggerated statements.
High usage rate? I never mentioned his usage rate or low efficiency. He had a usage rate of 23.4% and averaged 16 and 5. Shot over 50% from 2 and 33% from 3. That's not low efficiency. I pointed out that his efficiency had gotten better after the coaching change. His usage rate was only 3% higher than Smiths. Smith was a much better 3pt shooter but Thornton was also better from 2 and the FT line and a little better not turning it over(Smith at 19.4% TO rate to Thornton's 7.8%). The only thing ridiculous is saying Thornton has no argument as the best player returning to the Big Ten.
Rather than admitting that you've made some silly statements you're now saying not only that Thorton 'has a pretty good case' to be projected as the best player in the league this coming season, but that there's actually an argument that he's the best returning player?
I'm not sure how you can say that with a straight face given that Smith was first-team coach and media all-conference and Thorton didn't make any coaches all-conference team and was named third team by the media. At least if you're arguing for the coming season you can legitimately say that 'anything can happen. I can't think of an example of a PG who is an average athlete, average-sized and not particularly long, not getting any better physically, doesn't shoot well from three, and is a middle-of-the-pack assist guy transforming into a dominant player, but at least it's possible.
Maybe because Thornton is projected to be arguably the best player in the B1G because he's a Top 3 scorer and assist leader in the B1G? Doesn't shoot week from 3? When did 33% become bad? Average sized? So then what's Smith? Is top 3 middle of the pack?
Smith has a 6’5-6’6 wing span…and yeah 33% from 3 has been bad for quite some time now…
And I don't think you even understand the statement. Saying he has a case to be the best player next year and the best returning player, are one in the same. If you want talk about who was better last year, go for it. Because Thornton definitely has a case there too. That's kind of why he has the case going into next year.
In what world is 33% bad? I'll give you a hint.. none. Is it elite? Nope. But more than good enough to not get left open.
Dudes shooting 33% aren’t really that big of a threat…I mean not sure why you think that but you do you.
Btw who is making the case for Thornton besides you? I haven’t really seen his name even talked about for first team all B1G.
Literally every coach in the Big Ten and every media member who votes for all Big Ten teams disagreed with you. That's not debatable, it's a documented fact. Literally. Every. One. Thorton received zero (0) first team all big ten votes.
Well, there were 11 players in the Big Ten last year who took 174 or more three-pointers. Guess who ranked last in three-point shooting percentage among those players? Is that bad? It's certainly not good.
One more fun fact. Roughly 42 players in the Big Ten took 100 or more three-pointers last season. Out of those 42, eleven shot a worse percentage than Thorton. So yes, that's pretty bad. If you want to expand to lower volume there were sixty-some total Big Ten players who shot a better % from three than Thorton. Again, pretty bad for a guard, particularly one who had 79 fewer assists than a superstar like Elijah Hawkins.
Last edited:
To be 1 of those 11? You're trying to say he's bad because he was 11th of those players? You understand there were about 210 players in the B1G right?
For BTPOY? I haven't seen it anywhere. His name should be in the conversation with 10 or so other guys for first-team all-conference. There are some really high-level transfers coming in and two of the top three high school recruits in the country are coming into the Big Ten. Assuming that a guy who was borderline third-team all-conference last year will suddenly become a superstar because a bunch of players who were better than him left is myopic at best.
Yea that's pretty normal. Ohio State wasn't good. That's why he wasn't going to get any votes for first team. Ohio State finishes probably Top 4 or 5 in the B1G? He's probably 2md team and getting votes for 1st team. A player on a bad team would have to be going nuts on the stat sheet to get to first team.
It's not an accomplishment to shoot the 11th most three-pointers in the Big Ten if you're bad at doing it. Anyone else who was as bad at shooting three pointers as Bruce wasn't allowed to shoot that many. Among the worst shooters in the league among the forty-some who shot any level of volume. Bad, bad, bad.
Last edited:
When dudes leave and for the most part aren't replaced... That's normal to suggest he's going to be up there. I need to look more into what the West coast teams are bringing in though. The Big Ten overall will be down but there is some good perimeter talent that Thornton will be in a group of. Thornton, Smith, Harper, Carlyle, Rice, Sandfort, Berry, Baldwin. As of now, I would say Smith and Thornton are the Top 2, if not 1a and 1b.
Great, so in that scenario, assuming he's still allowed to jack up more threes than anyone else in the conference shooting that poor of a percentage and his stats don't decline, only 80% of the coaches and media members disagree with you.
33% is horrible 3pt shooting. Some of you need to raise your standards.
I’m pretty sure 33% is better than everyone or almost everyone on iu last year, so you have to understand where he’s coming from.
Understandable.
If you shoot 33% you should never take one.
There was a reason we were leaving Cupps, Galloway and Reneau wide open out there last year
