Injuries

[Tommaker]

Is there somewhere that a list is posted, and without violating HIPPA, does it say what the issue is for the player? Upon further review, and looking at the question "is it S&C issues", I think you can pretty easily break down the categories as to what may or may not be caused by training (or lack thereof). We have two concussion protocols and one broken leg, I'd say those fall into the "non-S&C" column. I'd add to that any illness, Injury received outside the confines of the program (thinking paintball to the eye here), deep muscle bruising, prior injury aggravation, and position related (meaning over time if you play a certain position you are going to have this injury no matter what, and no, I can't give any examples).

On the S&C that would leave pulls (hamstring, groin) ligament, tendon or muscle tears, turf toe (is that positional?), strains, and separations. I'd further divide that group into contact and non-contact (no amount of conditioning will save an ACL when a foot gets planted and a 300 pound linemen pushes the body in the wrong direction). Conversely, if a guy is running wide open and full out and suddenly falls to the ground grabbing his hamstring, there might be an issue with S&C.

 

[PaBoiler78]

Is there somewhere that a list is posted, and without violating HIPPA, does it say what the issue is for the player? Upon further review, and looking at the question "is it S&C issues", I think you can pretty easily break down the categories as to what may or may not be caused by training (or lack thereof). We have two concussion protocols and one broken leg, I'd say those fall into the "non-S&C" column. I'd add to that any illness, Injury received outside the confines of the program (thinking paintball to the eye here), deep muscle bruising, prior injury aggravation, and position related (meaning over time if you play a certain position you are going to have this injury no matter what, and no, I can't give any examples).

On the S&C that would leave pulls (hamstring, groin) ligament, tendon or muscle tears, turf toe (is that positional?), strains, and separations. I'd further divide that group into contact and non-contact (no amount of conditioning will save an ACL when a foot gets planted and a 300 pound linemen pushes the body in the wrong direction). Conversely, if a guy is running wide open and full out and suddenly falls to the ground grabbing his hamstring, there might be an issue with S&C.

any word on Deen, he's been playing pretty well, looked a little woozy coming off the field. On the other hand #44 looks good too.

 

[Purdue85]

Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA)... for this conversation, most notably covers confidentiality.

Speaking of which, how the HELL is it anyone's business whether or not I've been vaccinated for COVID?? Especially the "host" at O'Charley's, or Friday's or St. Elmo's.

HIPAA, anyone?

*ahem!*

Now... back to the topic.

Who is it you would like to know about? Here are the injuries:
D. Bell WR day-to-day - Concussion
( Sat, Sep 25)
S. James RB out for season - Eligibility
( Thu, Sep 23)
C. Trice CB Out indefinitely - Ankle
( Mon, Sep 20)
D. Washington OL Out indefinitely - Toe
( Mon, Sep 20)
J. Cravaack TE out for season - Knee
( Mon, Sep 20)
M. Rice WR Out indefinitely - Foot
( Mon, Sep 20)
Z. Horvath RB Out indefinitely - Undisclosed
( Mon, Sep 13)


Again, what would you like to know?

How would Strength and Conditioning have prevented a concussion? Or turning an ankle? Or, Horvath's broken leg?

Not being a d*ck here, but there's a lot of publicly available info. I've yet to see anything that would cause us to look at the S&C coaches as the source of the "problem".

What's more, there are many, many high profile programs in a similar boat (or worse).

 

[Tommaker]

Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA)... for this conversation, most notably covers confidentiality.

Speaking of which, how the HELL is it anyone's business whether or not I've been vaccinated for COVID?? Especially the "host" at O'Charley's, or Friday's or St. Elmo's.

HIPAA, anyone?

*ahem!*

Now... back to the topic.

Who is it you would like to know about? Here are the injuries:
D. Bell WR day-to-day - Concussion
( Sat, Sep 25)
S. James RB out for season - Eligibility
( Thu, Sep 23)
C. Trice CB Out indefinitely - Ankle
( Mon, Sep 20)
D. Washington OL Out indefinitely - Toe
( Mon, Sep 20)
J. Cravaack TE out for season - Knee
( Mon, Sep 20)
M. Rice WR Out indefinitely - Foot
( Mon, Sep 20)
Z. Horvath RB Out indefinitely - Undisclosed
( Mon, Sep 13)


Again, what would you like to know?

How would Strength and Conditioning have prevented a concussion? Or turning an ankle? Or, Horvath's broken leg?

Not being a d*ck here, but there's a lot of publicly available info. I've yet to see anything that would cause us to look at the S&C coaches as the source of the "problem".

What's more, there are many, many high profile programs in a similar boat (or worse).

Thanks, I just heard a number (9) but didn't have details. I think that was the point I was trying to make, I don't see anything above that couldn't be traced back to hard hits or awkward falls/contact. Hadn't heard but suspect Payne will be added for concussion protocol (again, not a S&C issue) and haven't heard what's up with King.

 

[Droid12345]

Speaking of which, how the HELL is it anyone's business whether or not I've been vaccinated for COVID?? Especially the "host" at O'Charley's, or Friday's or St. Elmo's.

If the restaurants were contacting your doctor and got your status without your consent, that’d be a HIPAA violation by your doctor. If they ask you directly, you have the option to tell them or not. This is not a HIPAA violation. They also have the right to refuse service for any reason (save for federal violations of federal anti-discrimination law), including based on your answer to — or refusal to answer — that question. HIPAA says YOU control your medical records and who gets to see them. It doesn’t say no one can ask you about them.

Who can ask about your vaccine status? Here's what you need to know about HIPAA

HIPAA, or the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, protects people’s private health information from being shared by certain health care entities without patient consent. But this 1996 law is far more narrowly defined than most people realize.

www.pbs.org

 

[Purdue85]

If the restaurants were contacting your doctor and got your status without your consent, that’d be a HIPAA violation by your doctor. If they ask you directly, you have the option to tell them or not. This is not a HIPAA violation. They also have the right to refuse service for any reason (save for federal violations of federal anti-discrimination law), including based on your answer to — or refusal to answer — that question. HIPAA says YOU control your medical records and who gets to see them. It doesn’t say no one can ask you about them.

Who can ask about your vaccine status? Here's what you need to know about HIPAA

HIPAA, or the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, protects people’s private health information from being shared by certain health care entities without patient consent. But this 1996 law is far more narrowly defined than most people realize.

www.pbs.org

cool story, bro.

Attempting to gain access to my medical info is a HIPAA violation, no matter how you choose to spin it.

 

[Droid12345]

cool story, bro.

Attempting to gain access to my medical info is a HIPAA violation, no matter how you choose to spin it.

Without your consent, yes. But, in the scenario you presented, no one is attempting to gain access to your medical info. When asking you a question about your status, you've been asked for your consent to provide that information. If you choose to provide said information, you have given your consent. If you do not consent to reveal your vaccination status, that's fine. If you believe that a restaurant host asking you your vaccination status violates your HIPAA rights, you should sue the restaurant. Clearly, you'd win, right?

You have the right to choose who gets to come into your house, yes? If I break in, I'm in violation of that right. If I ask your permission to enter, I am not in violation of that right.

 

[Peabodius]

cool story, bro.

Attempting to gain access to my medical info is a HIPAA violation, no matter how you choose to spin it.

No, that's not remotely how it works. If the restaurant provides medical services to you and then makes your medical data public, THAT would be a HIPAA violation. If they ask your vaccination status, you voluntarily share it, and they make you a sandwich, that is NOT a HIPAA violation.

 

[Purdue85]

Without your consent, yes. But, in the scenario you presented, no one is attempting to gain access to your medical info. When asking you a question about your status, you've been asked for your consent to provide that information. If you choose to provide said information, you have given your consent. If you do not consent to reveal your vaccination status, that's fine. If you believe that a restaurant host asking you your vaccination status violates your HIPAA rights, you should sue the restaurant. Clearly, you'd win, right?

You have the right to choose who gets to come into your house, yes? If I break in, I'm in violation of that right. If I ask your permission to enter, I am not in violation of that right.

yes, and IMHO they're not entitled to that information.

Can they refuse service? Certainly. The point remains, we've gone from an environment which is highly protective of any medically-related info, to people demanding to see medical papers.

 

[Purdue85]

No, that's not remotely how it works. If the restaurant provides medical services to you and then makes your medical data public, THAT would be a HIPAA violation. If they ask your vaccination status, you voluntarily share it, and they make you a sandwich, that is NOT a HIPAA violation.

see my other response.
we can argue the legal aspects, or have a conversation about the practical side of it.

 

[purduepat1969]

No, that's not remotely how it works. If the restaurant provides medical services to you and then makes your medical data public, THAT would be a HIPAA violation. If they ask your vaccination status, you voluntarily share it, and they make you a sandwich, that is NOT a HIPAA violation.

Here's what I don't understand. Why do restaurants care whether someone's been vaccinated? You can spread COVID even if vaccinated. A close relative of mine and her husband were both vaccinated and both got COVID. So what are restaurants and policy makers trying to prevent? I get the spread from unvaccinated to unvaccinated. But isn't that their choice to determine their own fate? Secondarily, if you're vaccinated, why are you worried about someone who's unvaccinated being in the restaurant?

 

[cgtboiler]

see my other response.
we can argue the legal aspects, or have a conversation about the practical side of it.

As someone who worked on educating people on HIPAA for IU Health for 8 years, you have no idea what you're talking about. I'd concede to the others on this one as they're doing a fine job of spelling it out for you. Get rid of your political biases and think logically.

 

[cgtboiler]

Here's what I don't understand. Why do restaurants care whether someone's been vaccinated? You can spread COVID even if vaccinated. A close relative of mine and her husband were both vaccinated and both got COVID. So what are restaurants and policy makers trying to prevent? I get the spread from unvaccinated to unvaccinated. But isn't that their choice to determine their own fate? Secondarily, if you're vaccinated, why are you worried about someone who's unvaccinated being in the restaurant?

you're far less likely to spread it if vaccinated

 

[purduepat1969]

you're far less likely to spread it if vaccinated

Far less likely, but still able to...

 

[cgtboiler]

Far less likely, but still able to...

perhaps you should read up on statistical probabilities and making decisions based on them

 

[Peabodius]

Here's what I don't understand. Why do restaurants care whether someone's been vaccinated? You can spread COVID even if vaccinated. A close relative of mine and her husband were both vaccinated and both got COVID. So what are restaurants and policy makers trying to prevent? I get the spread from unvaccinated to unvaccinated. But isn't that their choice to determine their own fate? Secondarily, if you're vaccinated, why are you worried about someone who's unvaccinated being in the restaurant?

There’s evidence that suggests vaccinated people are less likely to become infected, less likely to transmit to other, and less likely to get severely sick. We will continue to debate those things as more data comes in over the coming weeks and months.

My original point was about HIPAA violations, not vaccine efficacy. HIPAA doesn’t cover restaurants, it covers health care providers and insurance companies. Period. So yeah, if a business owner thinks proof of vaccination to enter best protects their customers and staff, I think that’s their right. It’s also your right to not patronize their business if you disagree.

 

[Purdue85]

As someone who worked on educating people on HIPAA for IU Health for 8 years, you have no idea what you're talking about. I'd concede to the others on this one as they're doing a fine job of spelling it out for you. Get rid of your political biases and think logically.

well, as someone who works in the world of HIPAA every day, I can tell you you're wrong. but, thanks for adding value to the conversation.

 

[Purdue85]

perhaps you should read up on statistical probabilities and making decisions based on them

you're welcome to share that info. We're simply having a conversation. talking down to people doesn't help.

 

[Droid12345]

yes, and IMHO they're not entitled to that information.

Can they refuse service? Certainly. The point remains, we've gone from an environment which is highly protective of any medically-related info, to people demanding to see medical papers.

You're right, they're not entitled to that information, and you have the choice to not give it to them. Nothing has changed, except that the restaurants have added a new condition you must meet in order for them to serve you. No different than a restaurant or other business refusing to allow you to bring in a gun, even though it's a constitutional right.

 

[Purdue85]

You're right, they're not entitled to that information, and you have the choice to not give it to them. Nothing has changed, except that the restaurants have added a new condition you must meet in order for them to serve you. No different than a restaurant or other business refusing to allow you to bring in a gun, even though it's a constitutional right.

I hope I'm following... it sounds like we're in agreement on that point.

 

[PUQBMan.]

cool story, bro.

Attempting to gain access to my medical info is a HIPAA violation, no matter how you choose to spin it.

Just because you don’t understand something doesn’t mean you can make stuff up and it be true. HIPAA governs medical professionals and relates to their handling of your personal medical information. Unless someone is involved in your medical care, nothing they do falls under HIPAA. Quit getting your information from Facebook.

 

[Droid12345]

I hope I'm following... it sounds like we're in agreement on that point.

Yes, just not in agreement that it's a violation of your HIPAA rights to ask you about your status.

 

[Purdue85]

Just because you don’t understand something doesn’t mean you can make stuff up and it be true. HIPAA governs medical professionals and relates to their handling of your personal medical information. Unless someone is involved in your medical care, nothing they do falls under HIPAA. Quit getting your information from Facebook.

LOL!
Wow!

It's certainly clear I've struck a nerve.

That's one of the most disappointing things about this topic: the cult-like responses one receives by simply questioning what's going on.

 

[Peabodius]

You're right, they're not entitled to that information, and you have the choice to not give it to them. Nothing has changed, except that the restaurants have added a new condition you must meet in order for them to serve you. No different than a restaurant or other business refusing to allow you to bring in a gun, even though it's a constitutional right.

Yeah, businesses can require all sorts of conditions for entry. They can make you dress fancy, they can subject you to a physical search, they can require ID, they can require proof of vaccine, they can make you leave your weapons in the car, they can require a minimum age, they can charge you a fee while ladies get in free. If you don’t like any of those things, don’t patronize the business.

 

[Purdue85]

Yes, just not in agreement that it's a violation of your HIPAA rights to ask you about your status.

don't think I've said it was/is a violation of my rights. (In fairness, if so, that really wasn't my intent.) my intent was simply as I stated above, in one of my earlier posts today:

The point remains, we've gone from an environment which is highly protective of any medically-related info, to people demanding to see medical papers.

 

[Purdue85]

Yeah, businesses can require all sorts of conditions for entry. They can make you dress fancy, they can subject you to a physical search, they can require ID, they can require proof of vaccine, they can make you leave your weapons in the car, they can require a minimum age, they can charge you a fee while ladies get in free. If you don’t like any of those things, don’t patronize the business.

I think we've clearly established agreement on that.

 

[PUQBMan.]

LOL!
Wow!

It's certainly clear I've struck a nerve.

That's one of the most disappointing things about this topic: the cult-like responses one receives by simply questioning what's going on.

That's a great defense mechanism you have there, but it doesn't change the fact that you have a great misunderstanding of HIPAA. We're just having a discussion, no need to get all worked up. The fact is, restaurants are not governed by HIPAA. None of these responses are "cult-like". The only thing "cult-like" is your propensity to spew misinformation and reject the truth when provided with an alternative (read as correct) counterpoint.

 

[Droid12345]

don't think I've said it was/is a violation of my rights. (In fairness, if so, that really wasn't my intent.) my intent was simply as I stated above, in one of my earlier posts today:

The point remains, we've gone from an environment which is highly protective of any medically-related info, to people demanding to see medical papers.

Ok, that's fine. I'm not sure I agree about the word "demand," since you have the option to not provide them. Nor do I agree that much has changed, because there have always been circumstances in which one had to provide medical records: sending kids to school and attending Purdue, as a couple of examples.

You did, in fact, say you thought it was a violation, but I'm glad we got it all cleared up!

Speaking of which, how the HELL is it anyone's business whether or not I've been vaccinated for COVID?? Especially the "host" at O'Charley's, or Friday's or St. Elmo's.

HIPAA, anyone?

cool story, bro.

Attempting to gain access to my medical info is a HIPAA violation, no matter how you choose to spin it.

 

[Peabodius]

I think we've clearly established agreement on that.

But I also feel like we’ve established that HIPAA laws don’t apply to restaurants, and it can’t be a violation in the first place if you are voluntarily offering your medical information.

Whatever the case, it’s been a slow work day, so the interruption has been nice. When you are ready, I’ll say “yes it is!” and you can say “no it isn’t!” and we’ll do that for a while.

 

[Peabodius]

Serious question: is there a legitimate reason why Brohm would have to limit what he’s able to say about injuries? Purdue has a medical staff that tends to players, so maybe some of those laws cross over. Not that I really care what a coach wants to say at a press conference, but I’m curious nonetheless.

 

[FirstDownB]

Serious question: is there a legitimate reason why Brohm would have to limit what he’s able to say about injuries? Purdue has a medical staff that tends to players, so maybe some of those laws cross over. Not that I really care what a coach wants to say at a press conference, but I’m curious nonetheless.

A perceived competitive advantage

 

[cgtboiler]

well, as someone who works in the world of HIPAA every day, I can tell you you're wrong. but, thanks for adding value to the conversation.

how exactly am I wrong? Show me documentation that says a restaurant can't ask someone for this information. I'll wait, and if you work with it every day then surely you can't be this misinformed.

 

[purduepat1969]

perhaps you should read up on statistical probabilities and making decisions based on them

I'm making decisions based on what I believe is right for me. Not for you. Not for statistics. Not to be politically correct. I'm vaccinated and believe in it. But I'm not supportive of vaccination mandates or keeping people out of places because they're not vaccinated.

 

[Peabodius]

how exactly am I wrong? Show me documentation that says a restaurant can't ask someone for this information. I'll wait, and if you work with it every day then surely you can't be this misinformed.

You aren’t wrong. That’s exactly why lawmakers across the country are trying to pass laws restricting businesses from asking about vaccination. They would have no reason to do that if HIPAA laws already prohibit asking.

 

[Purdue85]

That's a great defense mechanism you have there, but it doesn't change the fact that you have a great misunderstanding of HIPAA. We're just having a discussion, no need to get all worked up. The fact is, restaurants are not governed by HIPAA. None of these responses are "cult-like". The only thing "cult-like" is your propensity to spew misinformation and reject the truth when provided with an alternative (read as correct) counterpoint.

Not a defense mechanism, or any such nonsense." I've "spewed" nothing. You're trying too hard. No need to act like that.

I've worked within HIPAA since it's existence.

"misinformation"
Sounds familiar

 

[Purdue85]

Ok, that's fine. I'm not sure I agree about the word "demand," since you have the option to not provide them. Nor do I agree that much has changed, because there have always been circumstances in which one had to provide medical records: sending kids to school and attending Purdue, as a couple of examples.

You did, in fact, say you thought it was a violation, but I'm glad we got it all cleared up!

When politicians are putting vaccine card mandates in place, you don't consider that a "demand"?

 

[Purdue85]

But I also feel like we’ve established that HIPAA laws don’t apply to restaurants, and it can’t be a violation in the first place if you are voluntarily offering your medical information.

Whatever the case, it’s been a slow work day, so the interruption has been nice. When you are ready, I’ll say “yes it is!” and you can say “no it isn’t!” and we’ll do that for a while.

You seem to keep avoiding my point.

 

[Purdue85]

how exactly am I wrong? Show me documentation that says a restaurant can't ask someone for this information. I'll wait, and if you work with it every day then surely you can't be this misinformed.

You said I don't know what I'm talking about. That's wrong.

Wait as long as you like. This is clearly an emotional topic for you. It shouldn't be.

 

[Peabodius]

You seem to keep avoiding my point.

Your point that restaurants are trying to obtain your medical information? Sure, let's break that down. If you use Google's search engine through AT&T internet, there are two huge corporations that have seen every search about obscure skin conditions or rashes or STDs or anything else you type into the computer. When you order your cholesterol meds or insulin or whatever, Siri and Alexa are listening right along. You've given Facebook the rights to access your camera and your microphone and your search history. And forgive me if that's not you, but that's the majority of our population allowing unprecedented access to our private data on a whim. But now Todd the door guy at Appleby's wants you to flash a vaccine card and suddenly it's a steep descent into madness? Come on now.

Sorry, let's just stick with the restaurant. Let's play this out and see how it goes. You enter the building and are greeted by Todd. He asks for a vaccine card, which you reluctantly agree to. Todd hands you a menu and invites you inside. He doesn't care who you are. He's seen 200 vaccine cards today, and Todd really just wants to go home and play video games. Meanwhile, you have entered the building and have opened a tab at the bar. You hand your ID and a credit card to the bartender and breathe a sigh of relief that your precious medical data is once again safely tucked away. Across the room, the bartender has your name, address, drivers license number, height, weight, photograph, signature, credit card number, expiration date, and CVV number. Tell me again about your privacy concerns?

 

[Droid12345]

When politicians are putting vaccine card mandates in place, you don't consider that a "demand"?

Depending on the circumstances, perhaps, but you were talking about restaurants, which you always have the option to not patronize. As far as government-mandated vaccinations, we’ve had them for hundreds of years, so I’m not bothered by one more.