Biggie SI Article (w/ lots of new info on his recruitment)

[pharoutengineer]

Not sure if it's been posted yet, but this article has a ton of behind the scenes info on how Biggie's recruitment shook out. New stuff I hadn't seen. Very interesting for those of you that sometimes wonder how these decisions get made.

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2017/02/15/caleb-swanigan-purdue-boilermakers-player-year

 

[NVBoilerFan]

Not sure if it's been posted yet, but this article has a ton of behind the scenes info on how Biggie's recruitment shook out. New stuff I hadn't seen. Very interesting for those of you that sometimes wonder how these decisions get made.

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2017/02/15/caleb-swanigan-purdue-boilermakers-player-year

If my son ever ends up in the recruiting process, this is exactly how I am going to handle it.

I wonder who the recruit was that had his offer put on hold was.

 

[Dryfly88]

If my son ever ends up in the recruiting process, this is exactly how I am going to handle it.

Do you mean the "business" like approach of choosing a school? Or the continued involvement after he gets on campus? Or both? I'm not trying to be cute about it. I seriously wonder what you mean.

My sons both played baseball so I have no idea what D1 basketball recruiting "looks" like. I'm guessing that unless you are a 5* recruit, your choices/demands/involvement don't look anything like this. If there is anyone that has gone through the process with a high caliber recruit I would love to hear their input. I'm not bashing CS or Barnes, just questioning how close to "normal" this recruitment was/is.

 

[pharoutengineer]

I wonder who the recruit was that had his offer put on hold was.

Pretty sure that was Tayler Persons. I think he ended up at Ball State.

 

[TC4THREE]

Trying to remember who the player was that we had on campus that we didn't end up offering so we could keep a scholarship open for Swanigan.

 

[FirstDownB]

Hadn't heard the part about Biggie holding a grudge against Purdue/Painter for not offering a scholarship early on. It definitely sounds like if not for the Barnes connection and commitment to making a rational decision we would have lost him. This is the relationship part of recruiting that I'm still not sure Painter has mastered as well as some other coaches. But man, recruiting just sucks. If you get involved with a recruit too late --> hurt feelings. If you get involved too early --> hurt feelings.

 

[NVBoilerFan]

Do you mean the "business" like approach of choosing a school? Or the continued involvement after he gets on campus? Or both? I'm not trying to be cute about it. I seriously wonder what you mean.

My sons both played baseball so I have no idea what D1 basketball recruiting "looks" like. I'm guessing that unless you are a 5* recruit, your choices/demands/involvement don't look anything like this. If there is anyone that has gone through the process with a high caliber recruit I would love to hear their input. I'm not bashing CS or Barnes, just questioning how close to "normal" this recruitment was/is.

Business approach, mostly hands off after that.

 

[klmLB]

Nice read. Thanks!

Rosey is like a modern day Mr. Miyagi. You have no idea why he's teaching you these odd things, but if you trust him and put your 100% effort into what he is saying, you end up being fully prepared to reach your goals and dreams.

That level of disciple is difficult for anyone, let alone a young person who has to miss out on a lot of fun things your peers get to do in college.

Congrats to both Biggie and Barnes.

...and damn, Biggie and his family have had to deal with things most people can't imagine (including myself). Props to Mr. Barnes for making a difference in a young man's life. And - it's been said before - but to detractors of Mr Barnes who say he's in it for himself, the guy is independently wealthy from already being a successful agent and Biggie was the furthest thing from a prospect when Barnes took him under his wing.

 

[boilernuke]

Hadn't heard the part about Biggie holding a grudge against Purdue/Painter for not offering a scholarship early on. It definitely sounds like if not for the Barnes connection and commitment to making a rational decision we would have lost him. This is the relationship part of recruiting that I'm still not sure Painter has mastered as well as some other coaches. But man, recruiting just sucks. If you get involved with a recruit too late --> hurt feelings. If you get involved too early --> hurt feelings.

It also confirms the rumors he was going to Cal, then the sudden change to MSU. Even when the recruit committed to making a business decision, emotions still got in the way!

 

[BoilerStation]

Correct me if I'm way off here or I'm thinking of somebody else but wasn't the reason often given here for not offering when Biggie was in high school early on that he was more than likely going to be playing college football? I thought Alabama had interest in him then he grew to 6'8 or whatever he is now and only then it started looking like he would go the basketball route.

 

[tigerchump]

Not sure if it's been posted yet, but this article has a ton of behind the scenes info on how Biggie's recruitment shook out. New stuff I hadn't seen. Very interesting for those of you that sometimes wonder how these decisions get made.

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2017/02/15/caleb-swanigan-purdue-boilermakers-player-year

Excellent read .Thanks.

 

[TC4THREE]

I would guess there are no regrets at this point. Purdue was the right decision for him. It's just too bad that we didn't nail that down much earlier because having a top player in a recruiting class early can help draw interest from other top players.

The whole story shows how tough a game recruiting is. In hindsight, offering Swanigan early looks like a no brainer but I'm guessing that it looked much different when he was still a 300+ pound underclassman in high school. I'm guessing there are many other instances that Painter has offered early that didn't end up so well and I think he has become more careful about throwing out early offers than he was a few years ago. Thankfully this one went our way.

 

[BoilerDeac]

Not sure if it's been posted yet, but this article has a ton of behind the scenes info on how Biggie's recruitment shook out. New stuff I hadn't seen. Very interesting for those of you that sometimes wonder how these decisions get made.

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2017/02/15/caleb-swanigan-purdue-boilermakers-player-year

Wow, so Purdue almost F'd up big time by not offering Biggie earlier.

Isn't that what happened with Glenn Robinson III?

WTF Painter!??!

 

[euchre13]

Wow, so Purdue almost F'd up big time by not offering Biggie earlier.

Isn't that what happened with Glenn Robinsin III?

WTF Painter!??!

He offered Basil early. He offered Bryson early. He offered Hartman early. WTF Painter!??!

You people and your crystal balls.............

I remember reading an article when all these sophomores were committing to programs about how Crean and Painter were "leading the way" in this new trend. How has that worked out for either program? One example doesn't prove or disprove theory.

 

[BoilerDeac]

He offered Basil early. He offered Bryson early. He offered Hartman early. WTF Painter!??!

You people and your crystal balls.............

I remember reading an article when all these sophomores were committing to programs about how Crean and Painter were "leading the way" in this new trend. How has that worked out for either program? One example doesn't prove or disprove theory.

Point is, everyone was patting Painter on the back for finally landing a 5-star, yet we now have confirmation that Purdue landed Biggie in spite of Painter.

Where was Biggie ranked as a freshman? I'd be interested to know that.

 

[euchre13]

Point is, everyone was patting Painter on the back for finally landing a 5-star, yet we now have confirmation that Purdue landed Biggie in spite of Painter.

Where was Biggie ranked as a freshman? I'd be interested to know that.

I think people were patting him on the back in the same way we'll be happy when we win a NC, just to shut up all the people whining that it hasn't happened. I agree, a 5 star fell in Painter's lap. IU has 3 McDonald's AAs on their roster, they must be great right? I tried to find what he was ranked as a freshman and couldn't find that.

Purdue has a very unique situation this year where only 7 people are getting real minutes. If we had a roster full of top 100 kids would that be ok with the players not playing? We're not Duke. There is no bonus about going to Purdue to not play. If a stud kid goes to Purdue they expect to play immediately.

 

[TC4THREE]

He offered Basil early. He offered Bryson early. He offered Hartman early. WTF Painter!??!

You people and your crystal balls.............

I remember reading an article when all these sophomores were committing to programs about how Crean and Painter were "leading the way" in this new trend. How has that worked out for either program? One example doesn't prove or disprove theory.

Recruiting is so much easier to do after the players have graduated and/or gone pro.

 

[depthcharge623]

Here's another way to look at it. Would Biggie have been as good if he had been offered as a Freshman or Sophomore? It seems possible that he worked harder without the offer (and with a chip on his shoulder) then he might have if he had been offered early. Perhaps Rosie wouldn't have let that happen, but I don't think Rosie would be as effective if the kid didn't want it.

 

[TC4THREE]

Here's another way to look at it. Would Biggie have been as good if he had been offered as a Freshman or Sophomore? It seems possible that he worked harder without the offer (and with a chip on his shoulder) then he might have if he had been offered early. Perhaps Rosie wouldn't have let that happen, but I don't think Rosie would be as effective if the kid didn't want it.

So what you're saying is that Painter was a mad genius in waiting longer in efforts to motivate him as much as possible without losing him. I think we can all agree on that.

 

[depthcharge623]

So what you're saying is that Painter was a mad genius in waiting longer in efforts to motivate him as much as possible without losing him. I think we can all agree on that.

Haha no, not what I was saying. Quite the opposite. We can't know exactly what consequences our actions can have in the long run. So all the hindsight talk either way seems pointless to me. The fact is that we got a five star recruit, and he's turned out to be great for the program.

 

[JohnHoosierr]

Wow even after he committed he still said he didn't want to come here. Didn't even tell painter made barnes do It for him. I think this shows that for high level prospects there seems to be a lot of psychology involved and that's something painter just doesnt seem to be very good at.

 

[nagemj02]

I just read the article. So is Barnes basically living with Swanigan in WL during the basketball season?

 

[DG10]

I just read the article. So is Barnes basically living with Swanigan in WL during the basketball season?

Not with him, but nearby.

 

[DG10]

Not sure if it's been posted yet, but this article has a ton of behind the scenes info on how Biggie's recruitment shook out. New stuff I hadn't seen. Very interesting for those of you that sometimes wonder how these decisions get made.

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2017/02/15/caleb-swanigan-purdue-boilermakers-player-year

Thanks for posting the link to the article.

While informative, I don't know that it is fair to suggest that this is typical as to how such decisions are made, as the circumstances, his situation and story are incredibly unique.

More interesting to me was that this story was known...but that it was never written by anyone local or familiar with it at the time that it happened.

Ultimately, a pretty incredible and amazing story...as a big Purdue fan, but an even bigger Swanigan fan, I sure am hoping that it has an incredible ending.

 

[Dryfly88]

Thanks for posting the link to the article.

While informative, I don't know that it is fair to suggest that this is typical as to how such decisions are made, as the circumstances, his situation and story are incredibly unique.

More interesting to me was that this story was known...but that it was never written by anyone local or familiar with it at the time that it happened.

Ultimately, a pretty incredible and amazing story...as a big Purdue fan, but an even bigger Swanigan fan, I sure am hoping that it has an incredible ending.

Now hear me out on this before everybody loses their minds: Is it possible that this whole story wasn't told by local sources because from the outside it doesn't really look good? You have a father living in an apartment and working with the player during the season. The rest of the story is good and feels good. A kid was in trouble, a guy helps him out of trouble and now the kid is an all-american candidate. The details and the "controlling" part aren't nearly as appealing and don't fit nicely into the package.

I have nothing against CS or Barnes. I'm glad that he decided to come to PU even if it wasn't his first choice. If I weren't a PU fan I would probably read this whole story with a different view however, and that is why I don't think any local sources produced it earlier. They obviously knew the details but chose not to publish them.

 

[Boiledin90]

Now hear me out on this before everybody loses their minds: Is it possible that this whole story wasn't told by local sources because from the outside it doesn't really look good? You have a father living in an apartment and working with the player during the season. The rest of the story is good and feels good. A kid was in trouble, a guy helps him out of trouble and now the kid is an all-american candidate. The details and the "controlling" part aren't nearly as appealing and don't fit nicely into the package.

I have nothing against CS or Barnes. I'm glad that he decided to come to PU even if it wasn't his first choice. If I weren't a PU fan I would probably read this whole story with a different view however, and that is why I don't think any local sources produced it earlier. They obviously knew the details but chose not to publish them.

But don't miss the point...PURDUE WAS HIS FIRST CHOICE!

 

[DG10]

Now hear me out on this before everybody loses their minds: Is it possible that this whole story wasn't told by local sources because from the outside it doesn't really look good? You have a father living in an apartment and working with the player during the season. The rest of the story is good and feels good. A kid was in trouble, a guy helps him out of trouble and now the kid is an all-american candidate. The details and the "controlling" part aren't nearly as appealing and don't fit nicely into the package.

I have nothing against CS or Barnes. I'm glad that he decided to come to PU even if it wasn't his first choice. If I weren't a PU fan I would probably read this whole story with a different view however, and that is why I don't think any local sources produced it earlier. They obviously knew the details but chose not to publish them.

I see it the same...but, that being the case, sure seems odd/strange to me that it was made public now...by a national source. Barnes has maintained an incredibly low profile...virtually said nothing...but was very forthcoming in the article, to somebody with less knowledge of the matter than literally just about anyone else.

It does not change the bigger story in any way...it does shed a light on things that I am pretty sure that Purdue/Painter wished it probably didn't...like say, I just found it interesting that this just now was made public and by the source that it was. I get why Painter and Purdue would not want it shared, as that is pretty obvious, but, really hard to believe that others would not have pursued and shared it (i.e., Indy Star certainly, but, even Chicago outlets or especially Michigan outlets).

 

[Dryfly88]

But don't miss the point...PURDUE WAS HIS FIRST CHOICE!

Fair point. It originally was before no offer came when he wanted it.

 

[Boiler Buck]

But don't miss the point...PURDUE WAS HIS FIRST CHOICE!

To me it reads....Purdue was his first choice and Painter nearly messed that up, and we are fortunate he is here.

Then again, it is a media story and what can you believe in the media?

In any case it has been an enjoyable 2 years........now Painter go land another Top 40 kid somehow in 18.

 

[mathboy]

The article also points out how careful Painter is giving offers, or even inviting kids to visit. Painter seems to measure out carefully which kids he makes offers to, and how they will fit in the team. Unlike some other schools, he does not give offers to 20-30 kids when all he needs is a couple.

 

[FirstDownB]

To me it reads....Purdue was his first choice and Painter nearly messed that up, and we are fortunate he is here.

Then again, it is a media story and what can you believe in the media?

In any case it has been an enjoyable 2 years........now Painter go land another Top 40 kid somehow in 18.

Painter doesn't strike me as the type of coach who likes spending a lot of his free time building relationships with recruits. Some would call it pandering or groveling. Others call it "showing the love". I'm a grown man. It get it. I think some of Crean's antics, for example, are creepy, and if I were Painter I wouldn't enjoy that part of the job either. But I'm pretty sure every coach who recruits really well at least has guys on staff who make sure recruit relations are as warm as possible. One thing I'm not real clear on is who that person is on Painter's staff. And with the financial backing after the Mizzou fiasco, I would think money should no longer be an obstacle here to have one or two hair-on-fire lives-to-recruit type coaches.

The Biggie story tells me some things: (1) There was a clear and effective message for Biggie as to why Purdue was his best option (2) Either the Purdue coaching staff wasn't delivering that message effectively to Biggie or (more likely) Biggie didn't have a good enough relationship with the Purdue staff that he would accept the message (3) Barnes got that message through to Biggie, which is the only reason we got him. Maybe that is due to Biggie's background, possibly some trust issues. But then again he was apparently willing to listen to whatever Cuonzo was telling him. Or at least follow Rabb and Brown, who were listening to Cuonzo. And seeing as how landing a 5 star recruit is the outlier, it may not be completely wrong to extrapolate this to recruiting misses such as JJJ, GRobIII, Harris, etc.

Just some thoughts. Would be interested in thoughts on whether there are any ace recruiters on this staff and whether or not that is holding back our recruiting in any way.

 

[pharoutengineer]

Kind of off topic, but I hope Painter has learned from his mistake with Biggie. He's got another potential big time player coming up in the class of 2020 who has publicly said he wants to go to Purdue. That is Tayson Parker. I know he was just on campus recently but nobody has reported that Purdue has offered. Many seem to think he's the best Indiana player in the 2020 class.

 

[boilerzz]

Kind of off topic, but I hope Painter has learned from his mistake with Biggie. He's got another potential big time player coming up in the class of 2020 who has publicly said he wants to go to Purdue. That is Tayson Parker. I know he was just on campus recently but nobody has reported that Purdue has offered. Many seem to think he's the best Indiana player in the 2020 class.

It's funny that people see that as a mistake with the benefit of hindsight. Was it also a mistake to offer Travis Carroll early (top 50 recruit as a freshman), or Basil Smotherman (the same)?

When Biggie wanted the offer, he didn't look like a high major player at 6'7, 320.

 

[DG10]

It's funny that people see that as a mistake with the benefit of hindsight. Was it also a mistake to offer Travis Carroll early (top 50 recruit as a freshman), or Basil Smotherman (the same)?

When Biggie wanted the offer, he didn't look like a high major player at 6'7, 320.

Wonder how many other guys that averaged 37 points and 24 rebounds were deemed to "not look like a high major player" or were passed on with respect to receiving an offer?

I am fully confident that Carroll never put up those numbers at any point in time, anywhere.

 

[boilerzz]

Wonder how many other guys that averaged 37 points and 24 rebounds were deemed to "not look like a high major player" or were passed on with respect to receiving an offer?

I am fully confident that Carroll never put up those numbers at any point in time, anywhere.

There have been a lot of guys who put up big numbers but there were questions whether they would translate to the college game.

 

[Mandeville LA]

Now hear me out on this before everybody loses their minds: Is it possible that this whole story wasn't told by local sources because from the outside it doesn't really look good? You have a father living in an apartment and working with the player during the season. The rest of the story is good and feels good. A kid was in trouble, a guy helps him out of trouble and now the kid is an all-american candidate. The details and the "controlling" part aren't nearly as appealing and don't fit nicely into the package.

I have nothing against CS or Barnes. I'm glad that he decided to come to PU even if it wasn't his first choice. If I weren't a PU fan I would probably read this whole story with a different view however, and that is why I don't think any local sources produced it earlier. They obviously knew the details but chose not to publish them.

I have no issues with what Barns is doing regardless of the optics. CS is 18 years old and has had a pretty hard life. From the SI story Barns suggests he fears an eating disorder is in play with Biggie. If they both feel that is what's best to help him stay on track I am fine with it. Each kid is different and they all need something. Until someone tells me different I believe Biggie needs Roosevelt and he is lucky he has him.

 

[B-Westy]

Trying to remember who the player was that we had on campus that we didn't end up offering so we could keep a scholarship open for Swanigan.

Tayler Persons. He's at Ball State now.

 

[Dryfly88]

I have no issues with what Barns is doing regardless of the optics. CS is 18 years old and has had a pretty hard life. From the SI story Barns suggests he fears an eating disorder is in play with Biggie. If they both feel that is what's best to help him stay on track I am fine with it. Each kid is different and they all need something. Until someone tells me different I believe Biggie needs Roosevelt and he is lucky he has him.

I'm not surprised that you don't have any issues with it. You are a PU fan. There is a reason local media left part of the story out. I think I've read every story about him and never heard about Barnes living in WL and working CS out during the season until this article came out. Just saying that it doesn't look that great and I'm sure CMP would have preferred it stayed out of the media.

 

[pharoutengineer]

It's funny that people see that as a mistake with the benefit of hindsight. Was it also a mistake to offer Travis Carroll early (top 50 recruit as a freshman), or Basil Smotherman (the same)?

When Biggie wanted the offer, he didn't look like a high major player at 6'7, 320.

I don't think Carroll or Smotherman were mistakes. Both appeared to be solid prospects but didn't pan out as well as hoped. That's ok. Let me ask you this. Who did Painter have a legit shot at in the 2015 class that was a better bet than the prospect Biggie was when he averaged 37 and 24 knowing that Biggie wanted to be a Boilermaker or at least was very interested? I think it's fair to say it was a mistake in evaluation. Did they take into account his rapid improvements with his body and his game? Anyway I'm not trashing Painter. Sometimes in recruiting you miss the boat. It happens. See Gary Harris and GR3. Just saying that we've got another prospect coming up in Tayson Parker that wants to be a Boiler. Hope this time he hits the mark on his evaluation before that relationship sours. Do we have clearly better options at that position in the 2020 class? Maybe we do but knowing Purdue recruiting it's unlikely.

 

[boilerzz]

I don't think Carroll or Smotherman were mistakes. Both appeared to be solid prospects but didn't pan out as well as hoped. That's ok. Let me ask you this. Who did Painter have a legit shot at in the 2015 class that was a better bet than the prospect Biggie was when he averaged 37 and 24 knowing that Biggie wanted to be a Boilermaker or at least was very interested? I think it's fair to say it was a mistake in evaluation. Did they take into account his rapid improvements with his body and his game? Anyway I'm not trashing Painter. Sometimes in recruiting you miss the boat. It happens. See Gary Harris and GR3. Just saying that we've got another prospect coming up in Tayson Parker that wants to be a Boiler. Hope this time he hits the mark on his evaluation before that relationship sours. Do we have clearly better options at that position in the 2020 class? Maybe we do but knowing Purdue recruiting it's unlikely.

It was Biggie's freshman year and he had yet to reclassify so he was a 2016 recruit. And Purdue was still filling the 2014 class.