Biden targeting the private sector with vaccine mandates

[guidelinesa2]

It’s a fair question, but i don’t know that it’s proven that prior infection (especially someone who got COVID 1 year ago) is more effective than someone who recently has been vaccinated. I do now that prior infection + vaccination is even better, but that’s a different question.

Eventually you will either get COVID, get vaccinated or some combination of it. That seems inevitable. At least the vaccinated people have significantly less chance of serious symptoms and hospitalization.

That may be true in the short run, but natural immunity is 27x more effective. Certain vaccines can enhance the infection as well.

Mass vaccination doesn't work to stop flu and it won't work here. It will require continual revaccination, which is insanely dangerous.

 

[guidelinesa2]

You should be concerned because we could get to a point where we have mutations that evade a vaccine. It’s in the interest of public health to have as many people vaccinated as possible.

There’s a lot of misinformation floating around about the vaccines that’s also driving hesitancy. People are fed up with that too. There’s a choice, yes, but we’re never going to get back to any semblance of normalcy if we don’t go big here. We should all want that.

Stop - The vaccine will not eradicate the virus or stop it from spreading. Mutations are inevitable. Only natural resistance will work long term.

 

[jrcrist]

Just one more reason why these attempts at universal vaccination and blanket mandates are absolutely ridiculous and unscientific.

Study Finds Teenage Boys Six Times More Likely to Suffer Heart Problems From Vaccine Than be Hospitalized by COVID

Damning data proves clear risk of vaccinating children.

summit.news

 

[Boiler Buck]

First of all .. it’s vaccine mandate OR regular testing.

Second … a lot of major employers already have implemented this.

It’s also interesting that the Federalist (an extremely right leaning POV) thought vaccine mandates were fine a few years ago.

The Insane Vaccine Debate

We've had mandatory vaccine policies in the U.S. since before the Emancipation Proclamation. Why are they controversial now?

thefederalist.com

4 problems.....
1. The massive fines here and costs of testing imposed makes this less of a choice and more of an expensive business mandate.

2. Their is a real problem with pregnant women who are being fired by business because their Doc said do not get the shot while pregnant.

3. This does not respect the state government....one thing the great things from the last admin. who respected state rights. The Bidens are steamroling over state government choices. Not what our country is.

4. Ignores the science of natural immunity. (which I see you tried to address already)

 

[Level 42]

It's only a matter of time at this point before Adolph Bidet makes us wear gold stars and we are forced to goose step or face a gas chamber.

 

[boilersteel]

Btw, this is the first legal analysis iv’e seen of constitutionality of the mandate. I know many will say this is left wing swill, but the federalist article i posted above (from 2016) echoes the same sentiment.

View embedded media

1905? Come on man, this supreme court doesn't care about precedents. Everyone has the right to bodily autonomy and not take the vaccine, the government can't tell anyone what to do about anything!!

(That is, unless it doesn't follow the religious teachings of the right wing supreme court justices).

 

[BoilerBF]

Eventually you will either get COVID, get vaccinated or some combination of it. That seems inevitable. At least the vaccinated people have significantly less chance of serious symptoms and hospitalization.

Correct, but we already have a huge number of people that have already had covid. The science shows they have better protection than those vaccinated.

So why do Biden and Fauci act like the group that has had prior infection, but not vaccinated.....don't have protection. That group should enjoy the same rights and privileges as the vaccinated group. Why are Fauci and Biden ignoring the science?

And why are USPS workers exempted from Biden's mandate?

 

[Level 42]

Correct, but we already have a huge number of people that have already had covid. The science shows they have better protection than those vaccinated.

That is the key point that everyone that pushes the jab ignores, the jab doesn't prevent anything. It only lessens the impact of it where natural immunity is far better. But I guess they only want to 'follow the science' until it stops pushing the narrative.

 

[bear_down_chicago_89]

Correct, but we already have a huge number of people that have already had covid. The science shows they have better protection than those vaccinated.

So why do Biden and Fauci act like the group that has had prior infection, but not vaccinated.....don't have protection. That group should enjoy the same rights and privileges as the vaccinated group. Why are Fauci and Biden ignoring the science?

And why are USPS workers exempted from Biden's mandate?

As i said above, fair questions. I would guess the primary reasons are …

1. How do you demonstrate prior infection — would require an antibody test to determine levels. I know we have the capability, but i have no idea of the scale of availability on that.
2. When you consider the timing of prior infection and the level of your prior infection likely impacts how good your natural immunity is. Maybe if #1 can produce a clear level of antibody that could be used, but I’m guessing that’s not clear cut and would be confusing to implement.
3. Regardless, prior infection + vaccination is superior to just prior infection … i don’t think that’s debatable.

As far as USPS … i don’t know either. I know for some reason certain classes of federal employees are treated differently from private employers for various reasons (spanning many years and administrations). I’m guessing it’s buried in some carve out somewhere that prevents them from doing it.

 

[Hausta01]

Natural immunity is 27x stronger than vaccine immunity. THAT is the answer.

According to Israeli research the best immunity/results is natural antibodies plus 1 dose of the vaccine. (I don't recall the name of the vaccine, I think it is most similar to the Pfizer shot).

Edit: as an aside, Israel is also now mandating a 3rd shot and is treating 2 shotters as basically unvaccinated.

 

[guidelinesa2]

According to Israeli research the best immunity/results is natural antibodies plus 1 dose of the vaccine. (I don't recall the name of the vaccine, I think it is most similar to the Pfizer shot).

Edit: as an aside, Israel is also now mandating a 3rd shot and is treating 2 shotters as basically unvaccinated.

Its not even been a year.

FDA formerly required greater than 50% efficacy after 12 months.

Pfizer is coming up short.

 

[Hausta01]

Its not even been a year.

FDA formerly required greater than 50% efficacy after 12 months.

Pfizer is coming up short.

Don't argue against Science

 

[Nbergbuck]

Natural immunity is 27x stronger than vaccine immunity. THAT is the answer.

600,000 died without the vaccine. Currently 1000 a day are dying trying in vain for natural immunity. BTW, where did you get this 27X number?

 

[Hausta01]

600,000 died without the vaccine. Currently 1000 a day are dying trying in vain for natural immunity. BTW, where did you get this 27X number?

And approximately 80% of those were obese. Not being fat is a better vaccine than the vaccine.

 

[guidelinesa2]

600,000 died without the vaccine. Currently 1000 a day are dying trying in vain for natural immunity. BTW, where did you get this 27X number?

They died with virus particals in their nose, they did not die of the disease.

A case is not a case, a case is a positive test. Covid deaths are hugely exaggerated.

None the less, natural immunity is the only long term solution

 

[jrcrist]

And approximately 80% of those were obese. Not being fat is a better vaccine than the vaccine.

This x’s as many zeros as you can fit on this damn reply! This fact isn’t even discussed by the msm or Washington bureaucrats! Same for vitamin d deficiency. I don’t think it’s accidental. They want to keep Americans fat, unhealthy, and dependent on pharmaceuticals.

 

[Level 42]

Don't argue against Science

It's not science really, it's $cience.

 

[SKYDOG]

It's not science really, it's $cience.

I bet there’s more truth to that than we can imagine.

 

[Level 42]

 

[jrcrist]

And the mental gymnastics from the libs start in 3……2……1

 

[Level 42]

It's just one lie after another. Biden is literally everything the left told us Trump would be:

 

[PUBV]

When my kids were young, there was no chickenpox vaccine so when a family member got em, we took the kids over for exposure so they could develop natural immunity. So to speed up the natural immunity amongst trumpy anti vaxxers, would a quality visit for COVID exposure with an infected trumpy anti vaxxer in the ICU make sense? A 30-60 minute chit chat about the horrors of the vaccine and how Fauci is the anti christ should provide good exposure. Post exposure, some adult supervision at home would be necessary to keep the newly exposed inside for a time, but we managed to keep our kids quarantined with diversions like toys, cartoons, and ice cream. I think a similar strategy would work with these folks.

 

[FreedomWins]

When my kids were young, there was no chickenpox vaccine so when a family member got em, we took the kids over for exposure so they could develop natural immunity. So to speed up the natural immunity amongst trumpy anti vaxxers, would a quality visit for COVID exposure with an infected trumpy anti vaxxer in the ICU make sense? A 30-60 minute chit chat about the horrors of the vaccine and how Fauci is the anti christ should provide good exposure. Post exposure, some adult supervision at home would be necessary to keep the newly exposed inside for a time, but we managed to keep our kids quarantined with diversions like toys, cartoons, and ice cream. I think a similar strategy would work with these folks.

There are plenty of people who didn't vote for Trump who aren't getting vaccinated. Why are you singling out Trump voters? I voted for Trump and I'm vaccinated. Everybody in my family voted for Trump and we're all vaccinated.

 

[BoilerBF]

When my kids were young, there was no chickenpox vaccine so when a family member got em, we took the kids over for exposure so they could develop natural immunity. So to speed up the natural immunity amongst trumpy anti vaxxers, would a quality visit for COVID exposure with an infected trumpy anti vaxxer in the ICU make sense? A 30-60 minute chit chat about the horrors of the vaccine and how Fauci is the anti christ should provide good exposure. Post exposure, some adult supervision at home would be necessary to keep the newly exposed inside for a time, but we managed to keep our kids quarantined with diversions like toys, cartoons, and ice cream. I think a similar strategy would work with these folks.

Is that your plan for African Americans as well?

 

[FreedomWins]

Is that your plan for African Americans as well?

Only trumpy anti vaxxers because they're the scapegoats of the media. You have to blame somebody else for shortcomings and the failures of an administration for not shutting down the virus.

 

[Nbergbuck]

They died with virus particals in their nose, they did not die of the disease.

A case is not a case, a case is a positive test. Covid deaths are hugely exaggerated.

None the less, natural immunity is the only long term solution

All of these people who died just happened to have the virus in their nose? A case is not a case, it is a + test? And you have likes for this post? I didn't realize how screwed we are.

 

[Nbergbuck]

I'll explain it. The virus mutated into the delta variant which is far more contagious than the original virus. That drove the case load. Delta wasn't around a year ago.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

Animals are carriers for COVID, which is not the case for diseases like small pox and polio. It will never go away.

We’re gonna vax all the animals next. Duh.

 

[New Pal Boiler]

All of these people who died just happened to have the virus in their nose? A case is not a case, it is a + test? And you have likes for this post? I didn't realize how screwed we are.

Just like all the gunshot and car accident victims that got fraudulently categorized as Covid deaths.

 

[BoilerBF]

 

[jrcrist]

I'll explain it. The virus mutated into the delta variant which is far more contagious than the original virus. That drove the case load. Delta wasn't around a year ago.

Remind us how they test for the delta? Oh that’s right, they don’t, so you have no idea what variant it is or isn’t.

 

[Hausta01]

We’re gonna vax all the animals next. Duh.

PETA wouldn't let something that inhumane happen

 

[SKYDOG]

When my kids were young, there was no chickenpox vaccine so when a family member got em, we took the kids over for exposure so they could develop natural immunity. So to speed up the natural immunity amongst trumpy anti vaxxers, would a quality visit for COVID exposure with an infected trumpy anti vaxxer in the ICU make sense? A 30-60 minute chit chat about the horrors of the vaccine and how Fauci is the anti christ should provide good exposure. Post exposure, some adult supervision at home would be necessary to keep the newly exposed inside for a time, but we managed to keep our kids quarantined with diversions like toys, cartoons, and ice cream. I think a similar strategy would work with these folks.

Why would vaccinated people be concerned about unvaccinated people? Is it that the vaccine is not that good? If it is good and others choose not to get vaccinated, then why care? You being a pharmacist would have a better understanding of this than myself.

 

[Nbergbuck]

Remind us how they test for the delta? Oh that’s right, they don’t, so you have no idea what variant it is or isn’t.

5 Things To Know About the Delta Variant

Delta was a highly contagious SARS-CoV-2 virus strain that was first identified in India, and also circulated in the United States and other countries. The vaccines have proven to be highly effective against Delta, but anyone who is unvaccinated is at risk for infection by the variant.

www.yalemedicine.org

Educate yourself. Read the article. Then look at the first paragraph under #1.

 

[jrcrist]

Why would vaccinated people be concerned about unvaccinated people? Is it that the vaccine is not that good? If it is good and others choose not to get vaccinated, then why care? You being a pharmacist would have a better understanding of this than myself.

You’ve asked a question they can’t answer so they’ll throw out some generic bullshit or attack your character.

 

[jrcrist]

5 Things To Know About the Delta Variant

Delta was a highly contagious SARS-CoV-2 virus strain that was first identified in India, and also circulated in the United States and other countries. The vaccines have proven to be highly effective against Delta, but anyone who is unvaccinated is at risk for infection by the variant.

www.yalemedicine.org

Educate yourself. Read the article. Then look at the first paragraph under #1.

Your article didn’t address my point. I don’t deny the delta variant exists but they don’t differentiate testing between the delta and the origina strain, so how do you know all the continued infections are the delta variant? Again, you don't. Educate yourself

 

[Boiler Buck]

So to speed up the natural immunity amongst trumpy anti vaxxers,

I knew a smart man once, only problem is he had no wisdom. You remind me of that fellow.

Given 175 million non vaxed....is it possible their are anti vaxers who are NOT trumpers? The sheer number of nonvacinated would say yes (to anyone with wisdom), not to mention the large number of minorities who are not vaxed.

 

[Indy_Rider]

PETA wouldn't let something that inhumane happen

Unless they are the ones doing it.

 

[PUBV]

Why would vaccinated people be concerned about unvaccinated people? Is it that the vaccine is not that good? If it is good and others choose not to get vaccinated, then why care? You being a pharmacist would have a better understanding of this than myself.

Jesus skydog, what are you, an animal? You don’t have to be a pharmacist (retired) to care about everyone. The vaccinated, those not eligible for vaccination, the anti vaxxer trumpys, all of them. I think the vaccines are very effective. But let’s get those anti vaxxer trumpys that thumpin natural 27x natural immunity sooner rather than later. It would be good for public health & the patriotic thing to do

 

[boilersteel]

Why would vaccinated people be concerned about unvaccinated people? Is it that the vaccine is not that good? If it is good and others choose not to get vaccinated, then why care? You being a pharmacist would have a better understanding of this than myself.

Just a couple reasons:

• I have a 18mo old that can't get the vaccine..
• The unvaccinated has shutdown my child's daycare.
• The unvaccinated has shutdown my workplace (inconveniently not at the same time.)
• I like to have a drink at the bar while watching a purdue game and not have to wait 20 minutes for a beer because half the staff are out sick.

Pretty straightforward stuff if you think about it much at all.