Who's gonna coach creighton next year?
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Hope this is a joke. They lost their best player and pg that made them a top 10 team this season.
No joke. If I've read it once I've read it a 1000 times on this board. You lose in March you should get fired. No excuses.
Arguably McDermott has had more success in March than CMP. In CMP's time as HC, Purdue has yet to find relative stable success. Bad teams to start, 2008-2011 were successful, 2012-2014 were flat out horrible, and since has had a steady increase in success. With his body of work overall, you could easily make a case to find a coach that wouldn't do much worse given the things working in Purdue's favor (talent rich state/region, facilities, salary, fan support, new AD). That doesn't mean I think he should be fired but if MBob isn't putting CMP over the coals for a bit given his talk during the fall wouldn't be surprising. I am in the boat that likes CMP and realizes he has his flaws but he needs to be showing improvement as a coach to stay here (recruiting, in game substitution patterns, March success that matches team potential/expectations, and more consistency in the program similar to Wisconsin). Those aren't unattainable results at Purdue and a huge influence those would leave me and most fans incredibly happy...but the Jekyl and Hyde we have seen at times in season and with the program in CMP's tenure is worrying, imo.
It seems like almost every coach (save one) can't win the big game in March.
He's gotta go otherwise Creighton is The Settlers... you know... like the DirecTV commercial.
Um, what?
McDermott has been a Division 1 head coach for 18 years and he's never made it past the second round of the NCAA Tournament.
What's the "argument" that he's had more success exactly?
I am back one last time to tell you you are a freaking dumbazz and what world do you live in?
"With his body of work overall, you could easily make a case to find a coach that wouldn't do much worse given the things working in Purdue's favor (talent rich state/region, facilities, salary, fan support, new AD). "I am in the boat that likes CMP and realizes he has his flaws but he needs to be showing improvement as a coach to stay here (recruiting, in game substitution patterns, March success that matches team potential/expectations, and more consistency in the program similar to Wisconsin). Those aren't unattainable results at Purdue and a huge influence those would leave me and most fans incredibly happy...but the Jekyl and Hyde we have seen at times in season and with the program in CMP's tenure is worrying,"
Purdue won the Big 10 championship outright this year. Matt got a contract back in what 2011 that raised his salary to avg most good programs in the country. Yes Indiana has alot of good talent and Matt competes against alot of top programs within the area for recruits. Indiana fired Crean for not doing that. Compared to IU Purdue's fan support is lacking. In fact back in 2011 it was determined the John Purdue Club was no larger then NC State's fan base. West Lafayette is such a great campus town to live in compared to say Bloomington or other college campus. That was sarcasm.
I have a family member that lives in Atlanta. He told me when Purdue hired that AD from Georgia Tech. The reaction at Georgia Tech was "wow how bad do we suck that Purdue hired away out AD."
Look at the programs not in the tournament. Do you watch these games at all? Do you not see outside the 16 seeds how freaking hard it is to win these games today when you are depending on 20 year old's to play in national exposure under one and done pressure. Should Vandy fire Drew for that kid fouling with a 1 pt lead?
Notre Dame's radio play by play guy was on JMV's radio program last week. He stated fans don't want to hear it. But if you make the NCAA tournament you have already had a successful season. I agree 100%. If Purdue loses to Iowa St a very tough matchup are you going to demand Painter be fired? I am not. Yes it's frustrating to lose but why don't people like you sit back and relax and enjoy the freaking games for the entertainment value. Rather then worry whether Purdue has made a Final 4. If Painter makes the tourney for the next 10 years and has middling success I will not be complaining.
Purdue's entire athletic program is no where near as good as fans like you think it is... No where near unless the school is going to go SEC and take away money for schooling to fund athletics. Which I hope they never do. You must lead a charmed life if this is what you have to bitch about. Demanding Painter do better in March.
These boards leave me shaking my head. That Iowa fan was on here trashing Iowa St players saying they will end up as dishwashers etc... What a JERK. Yes Iowa St is a cocky team. Beat them and they won't be soo cocky. Iowa fan on here butt hurt cause Iowa St is in tourney and Iowa beat Iowa St and isn't. So predict Iowa St players will be dishwashers or in prison in the future. What a Jerk.
That simply isn't true. In 2012, Creighton made it to the third round (second weekend) and were beaten by UNC. That season they were an 8 seed. In 2013, Creighton again made the third round but were beaten by Duke. Creighton lost today but were a top 15 team before losing their best player.
In comparison, CMP has taken Purdue to two sweet 16's. When you get down to it, they are pretty similar but McDermott has done it at Northern Iowa, struggled at Iowa State, and then has built Creighton in to a program that competes in the Big East at a high level. Arguably, he has had more success in March than CMP.
Again, I'm not calling for CMP to be fired..rather it should be the standard to place in the top 4 of the conference (arguably the best or second best conference most seasons) and then make it to the Sweet 16. Not really sure why I am being called out for what is arguably a very rational opinion of what Purdue should be capable of achieving.
Hopefully someone who is good enough to fulfill their contract and not walk away with unmerited money.
The "third round" is the round of 32. For a few years when the first four games were introduced, they called that the first round, then the round of 64 was the second round, and the round of 32 was the third round. You can't make it to the second weekend winning one game. Also, you're citing an injury as a reason for their flame out this year, but apparently that's not valid for Painter. Also, Creighton has only made the NCAA Tournament 2 of the 4 years they've been in the Big East - but they are consistently competing at a high level?
Creighton has never won more than 1 game in the NCAA Tournament under McDermott.
You're completely hypocritical if you think McDermott is doing great, but then are lodging complaints about Painter.
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mcdermott essentially already did get fired - from isu.
he had no winning seasons let alone tourney success as a power conf coach
then he settled on the missouri valley job, and began winning again.
he now makes 1.3M and has continued to do well in their transition to a better conf.
his history/background is quite different than painter to make many accurate, current comparisons
he had no winning seasons let alone tourney success as a power conf coach
then he settled on the missouri valley job, and began winning again.
he now makes 1.3M and has continued to do well in their transition to a better conf.
his history/background is quite different than painter to make many accurate, current comparisons
Okay, since the MSU game's getting boring, I have some time to reply to this.
As lbodel notes above, 2012 was back in the days when the NCAA insisted on calling the Round of 32 the "Third Round" because the round of 64 was the "Second Round" and the play-in games were the "First Round." So, strike one, McDermott has never taken a team to the Sweet Sixteen.
Here's a quick comparison of McDermott and Painter in March (including data from all of their D1 head coaching positions):
Seasons Coaching: Painter 14, McDermott 17
NCAA Tournaments: Painter 10, McDermott 7
Average Seed: Painter 6.4, McDermott 8.4
Expected Tournament Wins (by seed): Painter 9, McDermott 5
Actual Tournament Wins: Painter 9, McDermott 3
Sweet Sixteens: Painter 2, McDermott 0
So Painter gets to the tournament more frequently, his teams get higher seeds, and those teams perform roughly to their seed expectation, while McDermott gets to the tournament less often, his teams get lower seeds, and those teams then perform slightly below expectation. I'd like to hear the argument that McDermott has more success in March.
Bad teams to start, you say. 2006? Yes. 2007? Uh, no. They went to the tournament and lost in a tight 2nd round game to eventual champion Florida. 2012-2014 were horrible you say. 2012, really? The year where we had a top 10 offense nationally and lost in the 2nd Round to national runner-up Kansas in a game that we controlled for roughly 38 minutes?
What I see in Painter's time at Purdue is actually extremely consistent, with a single two-year blip in the 2012-13 and 2013-14 seasons. You can only pretend he's been inconsistent if you ignore decent seasons and pretend like they were horrible.
No one's not calling you out. We're responding to your incorrect picture of Painter's success at Purdue. He's not perfect, but he is an above average power conference coach, and that is a pretty select group.
Okay, now back to watching Michigan State throttle the U.
As lbodel notes above, 2012 was back in the days when the NCAA insisted on calling the Round of 32 the "Third Round" because the round of 64 was the "Second Round" and the play-in games were the "First Round." So, strike one, McDermott has never taken a team to the Sweet Sixteen.
Here's a quick comparison of McDermott and Painter in March (including data from all of their D1 head coaching positions):
Seasons Coaching: Painter 14, McDermott 17
NCAA Tournaments: Painter 10, McDermott 7
Average Seed: Painter 6.4, McDermott 8.4
Expected Tournament Wins (by seed): Painter 9, McDermott 5
Actual Tournament Wins: Painter 9, McDermott 3
Sweet Sixteens: Painter 2, McDermott 0
So Painter gets to the tournament more frequently, his teams get higher seeds, and those teams perform roughly to their seed expectation, while McDermott gets to the tournament less often, his teams get lower seeds, and those teams then perform slightly below expectation. I'd like to hear the argument that McDermott has more success in March.
Bad teams to start, you say. 2006? Yes. 2007? Uh, no. They went to the tournament and lost in a tight 2nd round game to eventual champion Florida. 2012-2014 were horrible you say. 2012, really? The year where we had a top 10 offense nationally and lost in the 2nd Round to national runner-up Kansas in a game that we controlled for roughly 38 minutes?
What I see in Painter's time at Purdue is actually extremely consistent, with a single two-year blip in the 2012-13 and 2013-14 seasons. You can only pretend he's been inconsistent if you ignore decent seasons and pretend like they were horrible.
No one's not calling you out. We're responding to your incorrect picture of Painter's success at Purdue. He's not perfect, but he is an above average power conference coach, and that is a pretty select group.
Okay, now back to watching Michigan State throttle the U.
Fair enough about the 'third round' back in my posts since they recently went back to the original format of the third round being the Seeet Sixteen.
However, it doesn't change my opinion of McDermott having more success in March. The way I am seeing it is that McDermott has done a majority of his work in lower level conferences that frequently only get one team in to the tourney. You could be a 19 win team and get in the tourney in the bigger conferences but be a 26 win team in a smaller conference and get left out (Illinois State this year). I had forgotten about his time at Iowa State so you could argue when given the chance at similar circumstances to Painter, he flamed out.
Initially my intent of the post was to just point out the idiocy of the OP's constant posts any time another team loses and those like it. It turned in to a stream of thoughts I didn't really fact check, which if you go back through my post history is what I usually try to do...provide a bit of stats or facts to my posts. I'll accept my thought stream is flawed by the counter points some have brought forward
However, it doesn't change my opinion of McDermott having more success in March. The way I am seeing it is that McDermott has done a majority of his work in lower level conferences that frequently only get one team in to the tourney. You could be a 19 win team and get in the tourney in the bigger conferences but be a 26 win team in a smaller conference and get left out (Illinois State this year). I had forgotten about his time at Iowa State so you could argue when given the chance at similar circumstances to Painter, he flamed out.
Initially my intent of the post was to just point out the idiocy of the OP's constant posts any time another team loses and those like it. It turned in to a stream of thoughts I didn't really fact check, which if you go back through my post history is what I usually try to do...provide a bit of stats or facts to my posts. I'll accept my thought stream is flawed by the counter points some have brought forward
As lbodel notes above, 2012 was back in the days when the NCAA insisted on calling the Round of 32 the "Third Round" because the round of 64 was the "Second Round" and the play-in games were the "First Round." So, strike one, McDermott has never taken a team to the Sweet Sixteen.
Here's a quick comparison of McDermott and Painter in March (including data from all of their D1 head coaching positions):
Seasons Coaching: Painter 14, McDermott 17
NCAA Tournaments: Painter 10, McDermott 7
Average Seed: Painter 6.4, McDermott 8.4
Expected Tournament Wins (by seed): Painter 9, McDermott 5
Actual Tournament Wins: Painter 9, McDermott 3
Sweet Sixteens: Painter 2, McDermott 0
So Painter gets to the tournament more frequently, his teams get higher seeds, and those teams perform roughly to their seed expectation, while McDermott gets to the tournament less often, his teams get lower seeds, and those teams then perform slightly below expectation. I'd like to hear the argument that McDermott has more success in March.
No one's not calling you out. We're responding to your incorrect picture of Painter's success at Purdue. He's not perfect, but he is an above average power conference coach, and that is a pretty select group.
Okay, now back to watching Michigan State throttle the U.[/QUOTE]
Great post Septimus. Absolutely nothing personal against Johnny Doe but this is how it's done folks when a claim is made on the innerwebs.
Here's a quick comparison of McDermott and Painter in March (including data from all of their D1 head coaching positions):
Seasons Coaching: Painter 14, McDermott 17
NCAA Tournaments: Painter 10, McDermott 7
Average Seed: Painter 6.4, McDermott 8.4
Expected Tournament Wins (by seed): Painter 9, McDermott 5
Actual Tournament Wins: Painter 9, McDermott 3
Sweet Sixteens: Painter 2, McDermott 0
So Painter gets to the tournament more frequently, his teams get higher seeds, and those teams perform roughly to their seed expectation, while McDermott gets to the tournament less often, his teams get lower seeds, and those teams then perform slightly below expectation. I'd like to hear the argument that McDermott has more success in March.
No one's not calling you out. We're responding to your incorrect picture of Painter's success at Purdue. He's not perfect, but he is an above average power conference coach, and that is a pretty select group.
Okay, now back to watching Michigan State throttle the U.[/QUOTE]
Great post Septimus. Absolutely nothing personal against Johnny Doe but this is how it's done folks when a claim is made on the innerwebs.
You said that you like Painter and you are not calling for him to be fired...yet you were still called a dumbazz that lives a charmed life...basically just because you would like to see him do a little better in March. Ah the joys of internet forums. There are always folks on every board that can't handle different opinions and resort to name calling and insults. Just enjoy the many intelligent posters we have on this board and ignore all the name callers (I need to do a better job taking my own advice).
Some of these folks kind of remind me of Dan Dakich. I listened to his podcast today and yesterday. He basically wants to hire an "IU guy" and is calling anyone who disagrees with him idiots, clowns, and dumba$$es. He even called his co-workers Andy Katz and Jay Williams idiots and clowns because they had different opinions. I think it shows a lack of emotional maturity on his part that he cant have intelligent discussions with those who disagree with him without resorting to name calling and insults.
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