Transfer Portal Recruiting
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That's half the story. So only Minnesota is in a worse position? Have you looked at all other guards across the B1G?
I like Morton and Newman. But neither scored much last year. So who's going to take over during crunch time when we need a basket?
Gotta give more credit to Painter.
Have seen him doing wonders with a lot less than who we have coming back.
Plus we are getting some talents!
He will orchestrate this team on its strength.
Hopefully will have more cheers in March!
Boiler Up!!
That would have been my guess, pretty sophisticated view.
Totally legitimate question, I don’t know. It’s all relative though, lots of teams don’t have that guy, including some pretty good Purdue teams.
I think Brandon and Ethan will be very good. Not all conference good but better than average Big Ten players. Loyer, Smith and another newcomer are going to have to play, I think they’ll be fine.
Not sure what answer you were expecting when you asked a simple question? Returning players plus the incoming recruits would indicate we don't have much talent at the guard positions next year.
All of that is true, but it’s intellectually lazy to say that because Ethan and Brandon weren’t called upon to score last season that they can’t play that role. Neither seems likely to be a Carsen / Jaden type star, but Brandon has shown that he can really score at the Big Ten level and Ethan was a big time scorer and facilitator in high school.
The freshmen / newcomers in the backcourt don’t need to stand out, they just need to be relatively solid, as PJ, IT and EHJ were as freshmen.
I could be wrong and the backcourt could really struggle, but to say that it will be one of the worst in the conference because talented guys have to play new roles is just a lazy view.
That is the answer I was expecting given your view. Who knows, you may be right, we’ll find out.
Ethan was good in high school so let's just disregard his college career this far. Wow, such deep intellectual thinking going on. You've certainly convinced me! We'll have at minimum a top 3 guard room in the b1g next year, possibly the nation!!!
That’s the conclusion I’d expect you to draw from that post. Well done, you are consistent.
Agree. That's why I thought it was hilarious the guy above brought up Ethan being a "big time scorer" for some podunk Pennsylvania school as if it means anything at all regarding next year, then proceeds to call us lazy and stupid. Talk about ironic.
This just isn't true. Newman's role last year was supposed to be Sasha and Ivey's primary backup. He struggled mid season so Painter sat him down. At the end of the year Sasha really struggled and we could have used a consistent scorer off the bench. Newman had one good game to help fill the void, but there certainly was an opportunity there for him to really help out on the offensive end near the end of the year.
Another flaw here is that somebody does need to standout. I'd agree with you that at least one of the freshmen would be okay if they were surrounded by proven veterans, but the only guy that has a legitimate chance to be "the guy" next year is Newman and we don't know if we are going to get the 2020-2021 Newman or the 2021-2022 Newman. I think we're all hoping Newman will be a better version of himself but that's not guaranteed.
You can obviously choose to believe whatever you like and you may be right. The data supports what MP, Brian and Brandon have repeatedly said, which is that Brandon was quite good (although inconsistent) in the 23 games he started as a redshirt freshman and struggled coming off the bench at the end of that year and last season. If you believe that he's fundamentally gotten worse as a player during the last year and a half, you're obviously entitled to believe that.
I don't think there's any arguing that the role of starter playing big minutes in long stretches as a primary scoring option versus a backup coming in for five minute stretches are very different but there's no guarantee that I'm right to believe that to be the primary issue rather than Brandon having regressed as a player.
No guarantees, agree with you 100%. There's certainly a worst case scenario in which the backcourt is really bad and the team really struggles. IMO that's by no means the most likely scenario. I recognize that that involves projecting players into lead roles that they've not had to play in the past. What I object to is the argument that a player won't or can't do something because they haven't been asked to play that role in the past. We see every season across college basketball that roles and opportunities matter. (I'm not saying that's your argument, just saying in general).
I agree with you. I actually don't know what to expect from Newman next year. He's going to have every opportunity to shine next year and I think he may be quite good.
Is he talented enough to be a guy like Edwards or Ivey? I have my doubts. Even if he is, are any of the freshman going to be a better version of a senior Sasha or as good as Cline or Mathias from day 1? That's why I have concerns.
Agree with this, saying "a lot less coming back at the guard position" is hyperbole, but there are examples of similar situations. The top returning back court players on the 2016-2017 team that won 27 games and finished first in the Big Ten were junior year PJ and Dakota, neither of which had done a hell of a lot statistically up to that point. That wasn't a great backcourt but it was middle of the pack in the Big Ten, which was good enough combined with a very strong front court.
Similar story with the previous year's team that finished third in the Big Ten after posting a losing season the year prior.
Agree, I'd be very surprised to see Brandon perform at an Edwards / Ivey level. If he does, or even if he's at the level where he contends for an all conference position, this team may contend for the Big Ten title in a down year for the conference.
I don't think that it's realistic to expect any of the freshmen to perform at an upper classman Sasha / Dakota / Cline level. I do think it's realistic to expect some combination of Smith / Loyer / Waddell / Heide to perform at a similar level to those guys, PJ, EHJ, etc. when they were freshmen, which was a mixed bag but generally solid although not exceptional.
Here's my rationale. I think that it's realistic to expect Brandon to perform at a level that puts him in the top five in his position in the conference. I expect Ethan to be in the top half of the conference at his position, recognizing that a lot of that will come in the form of intangibles (hitting open shots, rebounding, good passing, etc.). I'd expect the combined freshmen to play at a a level that's at the top of the bottom third (top ten) for their position. The combined result is a middle of the pack back court to go with a front court that should be one of the best in the conference.
He had flashes of being an elite 3 level scorer who could play both sides of the ball. He showed against PSU that he still has it. Kid needs a major confidence boost going into this season.
Just so I don't come off as Debbie Downer. I believe we'll have one of the better front courts in the country. If we could have gotten an elite guard in the portal, I think we could have been competing for a B1G title.
If I was going to take a shot of what to expect from Newman, I'd guess I'd go with the production of someone like Terone Johnson. Good player but never could quite make it as the guy who was going to be "the man" for a really good team. Other guys I could see him growing into are guys like Dj Byrd, David Teague or Kenny Lowe. I think getting production along the lines of a guy like Chad Austin might be a stretch.
If I was going to take a shot of what to expect from Newman, I'd guess I'd go with the production of someone like Terone Johnson. Good player but never could quite make it as the guy who was going to be "the man" for a really good team. Other guys I could see him growing into are guys like Dj Byrd, David Teague or Kenny Lowe. I think getting production along the lines of a guy like Chad Austin might be a stretch.
He was player of the year for PA, played at the highest level in the state and played for USA basketball, but that's not the point. The point is that players have roles on teams and those roles often evolve over the course of their career. The last thing that Purdue needed last year was another high usage scorer. In fact that's why TKR redshirted, because that was seen by the staff as his strength and there wasn't room for it with Tre, Zach, Jaden and Sasha all needing shots. They needed guys who would take care of the ball, play defense, rebound and make good passes and that's exactly what Ethan did. He'll be asked to play a different role next year and while I don't expect him to be a 15ppg scorer, he's a kid that Painter was thrilled to land out of high school and continues to be very high on. He shot 44% from three last year, had a solid assist to turnover ratio and played good defense. The fact that he hasn't been asked to put up big stats to date in no way indicates that he's not capable of being a better than average Big Ten starter.
I apologize for my responses to you last night. I don't think I called anyone stupid, but I was a jerk. With respect to intellectual laziness, that comment was not aimed directly at you. The view that you've taken, looking at the stats of who is returning, who has left and their stats along with the rankings of incoming freshmen, is the exact approach that many national writers take when they want to get content out and don't want to take the time to do deep analysis.
If I may chime in, a potential problem for Purdue is not necessarily quality of guards, oddly enough, it may be quantity.
Four on the whole roster is not usually enough.
Four on the whole roster is not usually enough.
Mixing in our 3's would help tremendously in the backcourt. We have some that are capable of helping.
Agree with this. It’s actually six with Waddell and Heide but if Brandon and Ethan can’t carry 30 to 35 mpg they’ve got trouble. Better hope they stay healthy.
I think a number of posters are completely ignoring the history of our program. We graduate a couple great players and “OMG what will we do next year? “. I have been on this board for probably 20 years and every year it’s the same. A couple pansy’s decide that we will never replace (fill in the name) and there is no way we can escape the bottom of the BIG. Every year Painter fields a competitive team and the negative Nancy’s seem to disappear, only to resurface the next off season. It’s almost as regular as the total dominance of IU during the summer season. Just have to laugh. Alway entertaining. 
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.If you’ve been on this board for 20 years, then you’ve seen plenty of down years.I think a number of posters are completely ignoring the history of our program. We graduate a couple great players and “OMG what will we do next year? “. I have been on this board for probably 20 years and every year it’s the same. A couple pansy’s decide that we will never replace (fill in the name) and there is no way we can escape the bottom of the BIG. Every year Painter fields a competitive team and the negative Nancy’s seem to disappear, only to resurface the next off season. It’s almost as regular as the total dominance of IU during the summer season. Just have to laugh. Alway entertaining.
I don't know about that. Sure, we've had some underwhelming years, but 13 out of 16 available tournaments with almost a 50% chance to make the S16 out of those 13 years. I'm going to guess not to many teams can say that.
Sorry, this is strictly under CMP not the past 20 years.
I haven't seen anyone predict much worse than a middle of the pack B1G finish, Purdue will do "okay" just because of our front line. I believe the "pansy's" (your spelling) on here are just saying its going to be hard to compete for a B1G championship without additional help at the guard position. Someone who was negative could argue Purdue is in line for a bottom third of division finish. I haven't seen much of that.I think a number of posters are completely ignoring the history of our program. We graduate a couple great players and “OMG what will we do next year? “. I have been on this board for probably 20 years and every year it’s the same. A couple pansy’s decide that we will never replace (fill in the name) and there is no way we can escape the bottom of the BIG. Every year Painter fields a competitive team and the negative Nancy’s seem to disappear, only to resurface the next off season. It’s almost as regular as the total dominance of IU during the summer season. Just have to laugh. Alway entertaining.
Under Painter, Purdue has finished the season ranked 10 out of his 17 years. That's pretty good. Is it unrealistic to think that next year may be his 8th team that will wind up unranked? All the experts either have us ranked in the 20s or unranked, so its not an unreasonable take.
Who knew Painters refusal to use the portal last year to get a top tier PG transfer would screw us for 2+ years?
Is that Morton's personal twitter account?
If Morton is playing PG, he'd be a bottom 25% PG in the B10.
What has shown them to have the potential to be 'better than avg' B10 players? One is a streaky spot up jump shooter who was buried on the bench of the year and the other is a solid defensive player who hits an occasional 3 but lacks the athletic ability to break down the defense.
Bad case of the Mondays? You said IT and Hunter were abused on defense. I don’t think that will be the case with the Mortifier.
That’s crazy to say he refused this year. Have you been following the NIL stuff?
I've said Morton is a solid defender, but he's going to struggle offensively if he's being relied on to score (and....I was 100% correct on IT and Hunter).
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