Recruiting Question
- Thread starter hunkgolden
- Start date
I think the simple answer is that we don't know. We can speculate what is said in those pitches based on the bits of information we know, but we don't know for sure.
With that being said, I'm guessing Brohm isn't telling big time talent that if they come in and work hard enough, they might be able to earn minutes quickly. I would think he would be telling these big time recruits that they will come in and be impact players from day 1.
Playing time would be my guess for one. He had to build from nothing as well where Painter has good players ahead of people. And there is more leeway on putting a player in a different position other than what they played in high school.
Plus let's be real, the competition from other schools in the are is not that great. Meaning our biggest threat there is ND. IU/Ball State/ etc are not as good of a destination if you want to play football.
And lastly, we have a fantastic recruiter. Something CMP probably needs an upgrade on if we're being honest.
That is an easier sell when the cupboard is bare to begin with. CMP doesn't have that problem.
Yeah but how does Saban do it year in year out at Alabama where the cupboard is crammed full?
I would say the same with Duke or Kentucky but those kids leave after a year.
I agree with that, but based on what we have heard Painter doesn't use that approach.
I believe you need to re-evaluate the criticism you are giving Painter and the praise you are giving Brohm. Compared to Hazell, and Hope, Brohm looks awesome. Brohm has yet to sign a 5* recruit yet or a top 50 player. On the other hand, we get terribly upset when Painter signs a 3* recruit. People get upset when Painter just misses out on JJJ who was a projected top 5 MBA lottery and we feel great Brohm signed a 3* RB.
People also got very excited Brohm won a bowl game which in tourney status would have been at the NIT level.
Painter suffers from the fans having much higher expectations. Painter actually has a BIg 10 title.
People also got very excited Brohm won a bowl game which in tourney status would have been at the NIT level.
Painter suffers from the fans having much higher expectations. Painter actually has a BIg 10 title.
Football recruiting and Basketball recruiting are two different animals. It's key in basketball to get high ranked talent. In football, it's just as likely that a 3* guy becomes an all american as it is a 5* does.
I think what the OP was saying is that Brohm seems to be landing more of his "Plan A" guys, while Painter struggles to do so. It's early in the Brohm years though, so things could change. Also, whether people will admit it or not, we care waaaaaaaay more about basketball than we do football.
First of all, Indiana is NOT a football state, so the competition for the players is not as intense as it would be in basketball. Other than ND, Purdue really doesn't have a real instate competition in football, whereas in basketball, it has to compete with IU, Butler, and ND. That is not even counting the outside competitions like OSU and MSU. Kids in HS don't come to Indiana to play football; they come to play basketball. So Matt Painter has to compete with basically everyone in top 25 basketball team (plus IU 
) for in-state recruits, while Brohm only really has to compete with ND. For example, Oregon came all the way from the West Coast to steal Okoro away from us.
Second, there are way more fish in the football ocean. football rosters are in the order of 80+, almost 100 in some places. Usually you have to be a top 100 recruit in the country to be a 5, 4-star in basketball. In football, the number goes up to something like ~300.
Third, there is no one-and-done in NFL. Even really good players usually jump to NFL after their sophomore year, so they tend to stick around the school more than their basketball counterpart so they must really like the school and coach. In basketball, if your are 5-star recruit, or highly touted 4-star who considers himself to be NBA draft worthy, you plan on staying in school for only a year. It matter less how school is, or the coach is like, as long as it can get him the fame and media focus within the next year. It's different with football. Many players from the smaller and less known schools have been drafted by or gotten a FA contract from an NFL team, so the personal relationship with the coach matters very much. In basketball, as in the Biggie's case, it often is more of a business decision, which rarely works for Purdue basketball.
) for in-state recruits, while Brohm only really has to compete with ND. For example, Oregon came all the way from the West Coast to steal Okoro away from us.Second, there are way more fish in the football ocean. football rosters are in the order of 80+, almost 100 in some places. Usually you have to be a top 100 recruit in the country to be a 5, 4-star in basketball. In football, the number goes up to something like ~300.
Third, there is no one-and-done in NFL. Even really good players usually jump to NFL after their sophomore year, so they tend to stick around the school more than their basketball counterpart so they must really like the school and coach. In basketball, if your are 5-star recruit, or highly touted 4-star who considers himself to be NBA draft worthy, you plan on staying in school for only a year. It matter less how school is, or the coach is like, as long as it can get him the fame and media focus within the next year. It's different with football. Many players from the smaller and less known schools have been drafted by or gotten a FA contract from an NFL team, so the personal relationship with the coach matters very much. In basketball, as in the Biggie's case, it often is more of a business decision, which rarely works for Purdue basketball.
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Based on Painter's success in the Big Ten and consistently getting to the tournament, it should be expected for him to land his top level recruits yearly.
3* guys aren't bad to get in basketball but you want them sprinkled around 4* Top 100 kids not the other way.
Okay, don't get me wrong. I want Purdue basketball to succeed and all. But what you are saying is too idealistic. Even the likes of Dukes and NC don't have a roster filled with 4-stars. UK fills it with 5-stars but only because they run it by replenishing it every year.
I can’t understand this self-deserving attitude about Purdue requiring to get 4-stars. Painter should strive to get that, but thinking we deserve it is not logical.
Hmm not sure why this is even a question.....
CMP has 5 4 Stars on the team now (Haarms, Eastern, Hunter, Dow and Williams and another 4 star committed for 2019 Thompson.
Also has 5 3 stars on team like Boogie, Wheeler, Cline, Boudreaux and Sasha.
Step away from the ledge.....
CMP has 5 4 Stars on the team now (Haarms, Eastern, Hunter, Dow and Williams and another 4 star committed for 2019 Thompson.
Also has 5 3 stars on team like Boogie, Wheeler, Cline, Boudreaux and Sasha.
Step away from the ledge.....
I believe another part of the problem is that Painter goes after the best players and misses . While Brohm has set his sights a little lower and wins.
Take a look at Grant. He is one of the best safeties in high school, but he is not close to being the Best safety in high school. JJJ could be considered as the best! Langford and Diop were also considered as part of the best,
Look at Brohm's QB and WR recruitment. Brohm is targeting 4&3 star players. Hunter may be a 5 star QB, but he was not a Brohm target.
I will admit Brohm is targeting a lot higher recruit than Hazell did. But he still has a long way to go before he starts recruiting the level of players Painter is recruiting.
Let's be honest. We're getting excited about a football team that went 7-6 and we're criticizing a basketball team and coach that only won 30 games last year as being a disappointment ? A guy like Dow would start for most Division 1 teams, yet some of our fans want him to red shirt because they don't believe he's good enough?
Take a look at Grant. He is one of the best safeties in high school, but he is not close to being the Best safety in high school. JJJ could be considered as the best! Langford and Diop were also considered as part of the best,
Look at Brohm's QB and WR recruitment. Brohm is targeting 4&3 star players. Hunter may be a 5 star QB, but he was not a Brohm target.
I will admit Brohm is targeting a lot higher recruit than Hazell did. But he still has a long way to go before he starts recruiting the level of players Painter is recruiting.
Let's be honest. We're getting excited about a football team that went 7-6 and we're criticizing a basketball team and coach that only won 30 games last year as being a disappointment ? A guy like Dow would start for most Division 1 teams, yet some of our fans want him to red shirt because they don't believe he's good enough?
I must say, I don’t understand this Brohm-Painter comparison. Brohm just got 3 4-stars for his 80+ roster. He has playing time for 22 starters and 22 second strings, plus a special team.
Painter almost got Okoro, still hunting for a 5-star TJD, and competing for 4 more 4-stars in Hall, Franklin, Newman and Timme for his 13 man roster. He can only start 5, and probably will have to rely on 9 man main roster. Do the math.
Painter almost got Okoro, still hunting for a 5-star TJD, and competing for 4 more 4-stars in Hall, Franklin, Newman and Timme for his 13 man roster. He can only start 5, and probably will have to rely on 9 man main roster. Do the math.
It is simply stating that teams who make deep runs (elite 8, final 4, national champions) have 4 and 5 star players.
I'm not saying it is a given we should get those type of players but the balance has to be heavier for guys ranked 40-110 range v 100-250 range.
Michigan has had only 3 top 100 guys in the last 4 years, one of whom left after 2 years.
Villanova has had 6 top 100 guys in the last 4 years. Probably why they have been so dominant for the last few years.
So you are complaining that we are not being the number 1 team in the country? Please. I want us to be, but I don’t think we have to be.
Villanova has had 6 top 100 guys in the last 4 years. Probably why they have been so dominant for the last few years.
So you are complaining that we are not being the number 1 team in the country? Please. I want us to be, but I don’t think we have to be.
I'm not complaining just stating that I think Painter can do better.
Or... He has 2 4 stars (Eastern/Carsen) on the team now, and none committed (247 sports composite ranking).
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Then tell this website they have it all wrong.....
http://www.verbalcommits.com/schools/purdue
Just reading what they have listed Einstein.
I guess it just matters what website you take the rankings from......
Stars really don't matter to me....high character guys who put team, family and school/academics first is what matters to me...
Lol... don't use verbal commits in a rankings argument... at the very least use ESPN or Rivals, but 247 sports composite is easily the most respected recruiting rankings.
Who is arguing.....read my posts......only dumbasses who do not know basketball care about stars.
ESPN has and always will be dumbass talking heads.....
247 Crystal Ball predictions is a guessing game at best.....
It’s the other way around. He needs to get to the Final Four first to be able to draw constant stream of 4-stars. That is the one missing link in his recruiting pitch. He had his chances but something always blew them up. First it was Hummel’s you-know-what, and this year it was Haas’ elbow.
It is so frustrating to watch Painter being a solid B+ coach for so many years only to see him fall short of getting into the next tier of coaches. But what is more frustrating is to listen to some fans nagging like he is a C- just because he missed a recruit, or better yet now, just because a football coach got one.
I think I’m being overly sensitive because I saw something similar before with Tiller. Fans were unhappy with him during his rebuilding and they pushed him out. I don’t need to explain what happened after that. I just don’t want the same thing happening to Purdue Basketball.
You're on point....most of these so called fans on here are negative dumbasses.....
Not every Purdue fan is a good one or positive one.....
I have half of them on ignore and about to add some more.
I said nothing about crystal ball predictions. Those are a joke. Their rankings are not.
If stars don't matter, why has there only been one national champion since 1978 without one?
As a season ticket holder, I am very happy with what Brohm is doing. As a former basketball season ticket holder, I still support Painter. I spend my winters in FL now so I gave up my BB tix. The thing that I struggle with more than anything is exactly what do these kids want? Hard for me to understand why a kid wanting a good education doesn't want to come and play for Painter. I get the one and dones not coming to Purdue, but some of the guys we have lost over the years is difficult for me to understand. Guess I'm just getting old.
That’s the million dollar question.
I guess back to the OP - maybe Painter could learn a thing or two from Brohm’s crew.
Speaking of I hope that Painter and staff push for visits over football game weekends. Campus will be hype for those night games.
Kids that age aren't thinking about their education.
The simple answer is that football and basketball recruiting are two very different things.
You also have to keep in mind the quantities. One four star recruit in a class of 4 basketball players is the same as having 7 four stars in a class of 25 football recruits.
I think there is truth on both sides.. Basketball and football recruiting are 2 different animals. Surprised nobody has mentioned AAU or shoe companies. But think about Brohm out-recruiting local star Karlaftis over ND/Michigan/OSU vs. Phinisee choosing IU and there might be something to be said for needing big time recruiters on staff.
Odd you would say this. All of our current commitments are 4 star players. Hunter,Williams and Dow are 4 stars for next year. Thompson is also a 4 Star for the year after.
http://www.verbalcommits.com/schools/purdue
Come on math, I clearly pointed to 247 sports composite rankings, which I (and most) believe to be the best rankings.
Those players are all 3* recruits in those rankings.
Okay. There does seem to be a real difference of opinion on the matter. Most other services do rank Hunter and Williams as 4 stars. Dow has been all over the place from unranked to 4 Star. I have seen Thompson as bot 3 & 4 star rated.
Use which ever rating service you think most accurate. I did read that 247 does not have as much insight into the Midwest as other sites, so they rely heavily on the AAU activity. That can skew their ratings.
