Pacers fans
- Thread starter Summy1
- Start date
Mark Jackson. Also only three players should return. PG Turner Solomon Hill. Trade GHill. Obviously I know they will keep other. But I'd like to see them try and sign Conley, Nene' and make a run at Harrison Barnes.
NO! I've actually liked Vogel over the years. But game 5 is unforgivable - to bring it back to Purdue, worse loss than UALR. Honestly, I would love to see them let Bird go too. I think he's as much an issue as Vogel is, but he's got unearned immunity.
As far as who I'd like to see, no clue. But I do think every coach has a window, especially in the NBA, if you don't make the leap in the first 4-5 years, you get tuned out. Ideally someone with gravitas. I'd be good with Jax, only cuz he was my favorite pacer.
Disagree vehemently takedown about Nene and Harrison Barnes. Don't think the former has much left, and I've always thought the latter was overrated. Also with PG (who does not want to play the 4) and Hill, spending $$ on Barnes doesn't make as much sense if we are focused on need. Tough thing is I don't really think there are great realistic options this summer. Would love to see Mike Conley though, he would be an upgrade.
Do we trust Monta? I am not opposed to keeping him, but as a scoring punch off the bench. Mahimi is also a good backup. can we get Kawhi Leonard back??
As far as who I'd like to see, no clue. But I do think every coach has a window, especially in the NBA, if you don't make the leap in the first 4-5 years, you get tuned out. Ideally someone with gravitas. I'd be good with Jax, only cuz he was my favorite pacer.
Disagree vehemently takedown about Nene and Harrison Barnes. Don't think the former has much left, and I've always thought the latter was overrated. Also with PG (who does not want to play the 4) and Hill, spending $$ on Barnes doesn't make as much sense if we are focused on need. Tough thing is I don't really think there are great realistic options this summer. Would love to see Mike Conley though, he would be an upgrade.
Do we trust Monta? I am not opposed to keeping him, but as a scoring punch off the bench. Mahimi is also a good backup. can we get Kawhi Leonard back??
Game 3 was equally unforgivable...
I like Vogel, and I think he is a good coach. I don't know that they can do better, nor that Jackson even constitutes better for that matter...I mean, he had issues with and could not win with Golden St., and if he could not win there with what he had to work with, how in the world is he going to win in Indianapolis with what they have?
Personally, like you, I see Bird as the bigger issue/problem. In addition, while your point about coaches having a "window", I think there is some validity to that. However, in the case of the Pacers, they have had such a roster overhaul that it is almost like starting anew or a fresh window.
PG is a 2. I think Barnes at the 3. Nene for cheap at the 4. He makes the pacers a million times better rebounding team. Turner at the 5. Fournier Noah and Rondo will all be out there too. What do you think about those players?
Noah is past his prime and has health issues...so not a great guy to go after or invest big in seemingly. Rondo is simply a cancer and a head case and would likely be more of a detriment than not.
I don't know that it matters what number you assign to PG...he is THE guy regardless of position, and it does not change how he plays either. It changes who he is matched up with, but once the Pacers went with Turner consistently at the 4, whether PG plays the 2 or 3 really does not matter or change much, opposed to when he was legitimately playing the 4.
I won't be shocked if Vogel is not back, but I also don't believe that Vogel is the biggest problem or issue.
They have two really nice players in PG and Turner...and then some other guys that are solid...it will be interesting to see what moves they do make though.
I don't even know why you would let Bird go. Every time he leaves the team had sunk to pre Larry Brown stink.
Larry wants small ball and Vogel does not buy into it. Time for a mutual parting of the ways. Safe to say on Mark Jackson that the perpetually injured Curry didn't help. Just recently did he make a whole season.
Should have picked up Solo's option. Very bad form.
Larry wants small ball and Vogel does not buy into it. Time for a mutual parting of the ways. Safe to say on Mark Jackson that the perpetually injured Curry didn't help. Just recently did he make a whole season.
Should have picked up Solo's option. Very bad form.
Bring back only 3 players? It's not a video game... Mahinmi had really come on and play well, and although realistically he's a backup, I think resigning him will help with the recruitment of fellow Frenchman Nick Batum. Batum, Pau Gasol, Al Horford, and Conley are my favorite free agent targets, and I think Conley and Batum will be the pacers' most likely pick ups.
If you've watched the bulls at all, the idea of PG playing the Jimmy Butler role with Gasol is very enticing. Also, Horford is just a fundamental beast and having him doing the dirty work alongside Myles in the front court would be awesome, too. First priority though: you just have to bring Frank back. He is PG's coach, and this is PG's franchise, not Larry Bird's. You lose Frank, and that could play a huge role in the possibility of PG defecting to LA. Lose PG and this team goes back to the perpetual mediocrity of the mid 2000s.
If you've watched the bulls at all, the idea of PG playing the Jimmy Butler role with Gasol is very enticing. Also, Horford is just a fundamental beast and having him doing the dirty work alongside Myles in the front court would be awesome, too. First priority though: you just have to bring Frank back. He is PG's coach, and this is PG's franchise, not Larry Bird's. You lose Frank, and that could play a huge role in the possibility of PG defecting to LA. Lose PG and this team goes back to the perpetual mediocrity of the mid 2000s.
I think they have to bring back Frank... If not it will be like Carlisle, except worse.. I think they'll rue the day they let him go. Frank is still learning, and other than rotations, and maybe offensive sets, he's pretty dang good. I still think that he will improve there, and his other areas make up for those deficiencies. Maybe he lost gm 5 with his rotations, but maybe any other coach we would get would have already lost that game or even not made it to the playoffs by "losing his team" long before that. Frank is a great motivator, and that really is one of the primary jobs of a NBA coach when it comes down to it.
Vogel doesn't go insanely deep for an NBA team he just does platoon swaps often its just frustrating as a fan.
The wrong guy got fired, IMO. Larry Bird is the one who I think needed to go.
yeaah... after seeing some of the names being thrown around I change my mind on keeping Vogel. I would be "ok" with Mark. But Shaw??? he flamed out completely in Denver. Nate, its been a long time since he's been a HC. I saw Woodson too- WTF
Also, anyone read Bird's explanation and how he went about executing the firing... embarrassing stuff.
I have no idea what Bird will do, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Vogul get the Houston job.
Classless on Bird's part with respect to how he handled it, as well as the things that he shared regarding the conversation with Vogel.
I personally don't believe that Vogel is/was the problem, and I also think that he is a good coach.
Bird has some ridiculous philosophy with respect to coaches having a shelf life...that as much as anything dictated the move that he made...hard to see the job as all that appealing to a prospective coach who knows that they will be in the position for 3-4 years at best even if they are successful.
He has made some horrible personnel decisions...and he likely will make more unfortunately, but hold someone else accountable rather than looking in the mirror.
Did you not follow Larry Bird through his career? When has Larry ever been one to hold his tongue?
The same guy of the if Isiah was white comment?
Bird never wanted Frank. They weren't close at all.
I think you have that one reversed.It was Isiah who made the classless comment. Bird took the high road and Isiah later thanked him for not making it a bigger deal than the media was already making it.
Isiah is a racist scumbag.
I think Rodman actually made the original comment, and then isiah backed him up and/or agreed with him.
Several thoughts actually...
First, if you did not bring back the head coach, how do you replace him with his top assistant?
Second, in that Bird did not like Vogel's style/approach, when anyone looks at McMillan's style/approach, it is eerily similar.
Third, if you are Vogel, you have to feel like you were stabbed in the back.
With respect to McMillan directly...hardly any sort of inspiring choice.
Finally, my opinion of Bird remains unchanged...Bird is actually the issue...and I do not care for him, which was compounded by the lack of class in which he handled the dismissal of Vogel, and then has handled the media since, including blatantly lying to them on Friday regarding the search for Vogel's replacement.
Highly uninspired. Does PG at least like Nate? That would be the icing on the cake ...
Seems to be a Pritchard hire more because of past ties, but I would think Bird's dwindling popularity and respect as a front office guy will be further questioned. If NM doesn't work out, the bird will be flying back south pretty quick I would think.
