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Hawthorne departs....

PaBoiler78

All-American
Jan 18, 2002
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where does CJB go next? another OL recruit, JC transfer, or creates room for another recruit. What think guys?
 
Any ideas why? Homesick (from Arizona)? Injury? Grades? (Arizona staff poached during bowl week? JK)
He's already used a redshirt year, so sitting out again as a transfer wouldn't be great.
From his PurdueSports bio, you'd think he'd have quite a lot of ceiling in an area of need for us (OL).
HIGH SCHOOL
• Four-year letterwinner.
• As a senior, was named first team all-state, all-district, all-section.
• Team won 2014 and 2015 state championships.
• Second team all-state and all-district as a junior.
 
I know nothing about the kid and wish him well, but I do know we're still about a half-dozen over the schollie limit and still hoping to sign Moore.
 
Any ideas why? Homesick (from Arizona)? Injury? Grades? (Arizona staff poached during bowl week? JK)
He's already used a redshirt year, so sitting out again as a transfer wouldn't be great.
From his PurdueSports bio, you'd think he'd have quite a lot of ceiling in an area of need for us (OL).
HIGH SCHOOL
• Four-year letterwinner.
• As a senior, was named first team all-state, all-district, all-section.
• Team won 2014 and 2015 state championships.
• Second team all-state and all-district as a junior.
maybe he has some friends on Zona's team and they convinced him to come aboard
 
Other will transfer. We are 8 over and Brohm wants to bring in some good Transfers

I'm not sure if we're 8 over, but academically, if our bow l game was representative of players being academically eligible to play, we did a lot better than anticipated. Our attrition will have to come from willing transfers rather than academic casualties.
 
I'm not sure if we're 8 over, but academically, if our bow l game was representative of players being academically eligible to play, we did a lot better than anticipated. Our attrition will have to come from willing transfers rather than academic casualties.
We're over 8
 
That's not good.

We can forget the late signing period and transfers unless brohm can convince another 10 to leave. My guess is Wilson will be one of the 8 to lose a scholarship.

I took a look at Hazell's 2016 class, and all I could say was yikes.

Brohm already said they have room to add more to the roster via signees and transfers.
 
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Brohm already said they have room to add more to the roster via signees and transfers.


I saw Brohm say he had a little wiggle room. I doubt that wiggle is very big.

Purdue 11 says we're 8 over. So in order to add one, we must drop 9. I can't see us dropping any of our signees. So if we add Moore, that means we'll have to drop 9 existing players. it appears Wilson was the only academic casualty. That would mean 8 other players would have to agree to transfer.

the last time I speculated who might be leaving, people got upset with my speculations. Looking at our current roster depth, I think we have too many QBs, WRs and Dbacks. and 1 too many kickers.

I guess we could wait until after the Spring Semester before we added any grad transfers. I'm not sure how I feel about adding a player like McDuffie. I like McDuffie, but I feel we may need a more experienced grad transfer.

I know there is a plan, but I can see some popular players leaving.
 
I saw Brohm say he had a little wiggle room. I doubt that wiggle is very big.

Purdue 11 says we're 8 over. So in order to add one, we must drop 9. I can't see us dropping any of our signees. So if we add Moore, that means we'll have to drop 9 existing players. it appears Wilson was the only academic casualty. That would mean 8 other players would have to agree to transfer.

the last time I speculated who might be leaving, people got upset with my speculations. Looking at our current roster depth, I think we have too many QBs, WRs and Dbacks. and 1 too many kickers.

I guess we could wait until after the Spring Semester before we added any grad transfers. I'm not sure how I feel about adding a player like McDuffie. I like McDuffie, but I feel we may need a more experienced grad transfer.

I know there is a plan, but I can see some popular players leaving.
We won't add McDuffie. Apparently he's struggling in the classroom
 
I saw Brohm say he had a little wiggle room. I doubt that wiggle is very big.

Purdue 11 says we're 8 over. So in order to add one, we must drop 9. I can't see us dropping any of our signees. So if we add Moore, that means we'll have to drop 9 existing players. it appears Wilson was the only academic casualty. That would mean 8 other players would have to agree to transfer.

the last time I speculated who might be leaving, people got upset with my speculations. Looking at our current roster depth, I think we have too many QBs, WRs and Dbacks. and 1 too many kickers.

I guess we could wait until after the Spring Semester before we added any grad transfers. I'm not sure how I feel about adding a player like McDuffie. I like McDuffie, but I feel we may need a more experienced grad transfer.

I know there is a plan, but I can see some popular players leaving.

Brohm knows how many and who is leaving. Some may have been agreed to prior to the season as some may be in line to graduate in the spring. Others may simply look elsewhere as they aren't going to play.

Moore is coming to Purdue and they plan to add at least two grad transfers.
 
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I saw Brohm say he had a little wiggle room. I doubt that wiggle is very big.

Purdue 11 says we're 8 over. So in order to add one, we must drop 9. I can't see us dropping any of our signees. So if we add Moore, that means we'll have to drop 9 existing players. it appears Wilson was the only academic casualty. That would mean 8 other players would have to agree to transfer.

the last time I speculated who might be leaving, people got upset with my speculations. Looking at our current roster depth, I think we have too many QBs, WRs and Dbacks. and 1 too many kickers.

I guess we could wait until after the Spring Semester before we added any grad transfers. I'm not sure how I feel about adding a player like McDuffie. I like McDuffie, but I feel we may need a more experienced grad transfer.

I know there is a plan, but I can see some popular players leaving.

CJB already knows who is leaving, that's why he signed such a huge class before even addressing transfers. He will encourage some to leave for playing time, but if that doesn't work I am sure he has several that won't qualify academically or who violated team rules. I imagine he aims to add 3 more. Moore plus two transfers on the defensive side. If Hunter decides to leave Clemson, CJB will find a spot if he wants it. This Purdue still has a loooooot of fat to trim from previous recruit classes.

This '18 class was very good compared to what Purdue has had in the past, and future classes should be even better. There won't be this much attrition once he gets his own guys. CJB has been incredible in identifying needs and filling them anyway he could. He also finds a way to get all of his guys to give more and be better.

Just as important as signing transfers is CJB maintaining his assistants. He has put together one of the best coaching staffs in the nation. Got to keep as much as we can.
 
You’all have forgotten that all scholarships are not four year guaranteed. I trust in the Coach knowing what numbers he has and what he needs!
 
Brohm knows how many and who is leaving. Some may have been agreed to prior to the season as some may be in line to graduate in the spring. Others may simply look elsewhere as they aren't going to play.

Moore is coming to Purdue and they plan to add at least two grad transfers.
wonder what will happen to guys like BLJ, Wegher, and Franklin to name a few.
 
No such rule that I know of...but I could be wrong.


the rules changed in 2014 with the establishment of the power 5 schools the BIG 10 was the leader in the rule change. Once a scholarship is signed and agreed upon, it is for 4 years, and the school cannot revoke it without either academic, drug, or crime related cause. The player must voluntarily leave / transfer..
 
the rules changed in 2014 with the establishment of the power 5 schools the BIG 10 was the leader in the rule change. Once a scholarship is signed and agreed upon, it is for 4 years, and the school cannot revoke it without either academic, drug, or crime related cause. The player must voluntarily leave / transfer..
That was my recollection as well.
 
the rules changed in 2014 with the establishment of the power 5 schools the BIG 10 was the leader in the rule change. Once a scholarship is signed and agreed upon, it is for 4 years, and the school cannot revoke it without either academic, drug, or crime related cause. The player must voluntarily leave / transfer..
Makes me wonder why it applies to football, but not basketball.
 
I believe the rules apply to all athletes in ALL sports of the POWER 5 conferences. . This is not new, and neither are the links. this started in 2014. Obviously the word was not received by the fans. Read the last link.

I quote from the 2014 NY times article "
Earlier this month, the Big Ten announced that it would become the first conference to guarantee its athletic scholarships for four years, a change from the widely followed practice of offering a single-year scholarship that can be renewed. Effective immediately, the Big Ten will ensure that none of its recruited athletes — in any sport — can lose their financial aid because of injury, poor play or coaches’ judgment.

Jim Delany, the league’s commissioner, said, “To make a four-year commitment and give student-athletes the security, it’s the right thing to do.”

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/...ntees-four-year-scholarships-student-athletes

https://informedathlete.com/the-facts-about-guaranteed-multi-year-ncaa-di-scholarships/

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/29/...olarships-reflects-players-growing-power.html
 
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Some additional insight. If you read the second link I provided, it gives the criteria for a player to lose his scholarship. but more importantly it states these new rules were only agreed upon and will only apply to the POWER 5 conference schools.

there are many elite college basketball programs that are not considered as a POWER 5 school. This new rule was voted in by the universities of the “Power 5” conferences – the ACC, Big Ten, Big 12, PAC-12, and SEC, as well as Notre Dame.

So teams like Cincy, Xavier , all of the BIG East, MVC, MAC and other primary basketball oriented schools don't have to follow the rules. But for Power 5 conference schools it applies to ALL sports.
 
Seems like I read somewhere that schools (maybe IU??) were cutting players from the roster, but continuing to pay their tuition for the full 4 years. In other words, this is not a guarantee that you will be on the team and occupy one of the allotted scholarship, but a guarantee that you will have your degree paid for. Is there anything in the links that clarifies whether it is a 4 year athletic scholarship that counts against the limit? I see it includes players returning to school to complete their degrees later - obviously those don't count against the 85.
 
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the rules changed in 2014 with the establishment of the power 5 schools the BIG 10 was the leader in the rule change. Once a scholarship is signed and agreed upon, it is for 4 years, and the school cannot revoke it without either academic, drug, or crime related cause. The player must voluntarily leave / transfer..

Wolegib, your son has a partial athletic scholarship. My daughter had a partial athletic scholarship as well. Each year, she had a post season meeting with the coach to evaluate her performance for the prior season and to set expectations for the future. Very, very candid meetings. The meeting also discussed the athletic scholarship amount to be expected for the upcoming year. This amount could be increased/decreased year by year (it could go to zero!). Once it got closer to June, she would receive the OFFICIAL scholarship form from the school, with the amount (coach would let her know exact amount prior to the letter), she would sign, and the amount would be applied against her tuition. Important note, the official scholarship form (a legal contract) contained the DATES for which it applied and it was always 12 months (July-June). Separately, she received additional athletic scholarship $'s for summer school classes that went above/beyond the July-June form. I do not remember her ever signing a form for that - I think it was more of a thank-you/reward from the coach and was not offered to many players.

I assume your son signs the same papers - and they also contain the dates for which the scholarship is effective. Were they for 12 months as well?

Why do I say all this? I know your son, nor my daughter, played a revenue-producing sport at a P5 school. So I would LOVE to see the legal athletic scholarship contracts that are signed by a B1G football or basketball player, just to see the dates. You have correctly pointed out that he P5 conferences have agreed to honor 4 years of athletic scholarship, but until I see it WRITTEN IN THE SCHOLARSHIP CONTRACT I will always be leery. I believe the P5 conferences can say they have 4 year guaranteed scholarships - and as a 'gentleman's agreement' the schools within these conferences more-often than not abide - but until it is written in the scholarship contract it means very little (at least to me). Can anyone confirm it is WRITTEN in the contracts these athletes sign?
 
Seems like I read somewhere that schools (maybe IU??) were cutting players from the roster, but continuing to pay their tuition for the full 4 years. In other words, this is not a guarantee that you will be on the team and occupy one of the allotted scholarship, but a guarantee that you will have your degree paid for. Is there anything in the links that clarifies whether it is a 4 year athletic scholarship that counts against the limit? I see it includes players returning to school to complete their degrees later - obviously those don't count against the 85.


this would appear to be a lop hole.

"Violates a university policy or rule which is not related to athletic conditions or ability (such as a university policy on class attendance, or an athletic department policy regarding proper conduct on a team trip)."

if a player misses a class or doesn't wear his tie properly, the school could say you violated a team rule. And each team could have their own set of team rules.

Those 3 articles are a little vague in that the y talk about an athlete being able to turn pro early, like Swanigan, and then be able to return back to school at a later date and be able to use his scholarship to pay for his school. I can't believe if Swanigan returned to Purdue in 10 years, he'd count against the scholarship total.

And admittedly, all three of these articles were written in 2014-2015 when the rules were first being put in place. I'm confident there have been some revisions and clarifications.

it's sad that only the Power 5 conference teams have to play by these rules and the other schools don't. but that's who agreed upon it.
 
Wolegib, your son has a partial athletic scholarship. My daughter had a partial athletic scholarship as well. Each year, she had a post season meeting with the coach to evaluate her performance for the prior season and to set expectations for the future. Very, very candid meetings. The meeting also discussed the athletic scholarship amount to be expected for the upcoming year. This amount could be increased/decreased year by year (it could go to zero!). Once it got closer to June, she would receive the OFFICIAL scholarship form from the school, with the amount (coach would let her know exact amount prior to the letter), she would sign, and the amount would be applied against her tuition. Important note, the official scholarship form (a legal contract) contained the DATES for which it applied and it was always 12 months (July-June). Separately, she received additional athletic scholarship $'s for summer school classes that went above/beyond the July-June form. I do not remember her ever signing a form for that - I think it was more of a thank-you/reward from the coach and was not offered to many players.

I assume your son signs the same papers - and they also contain the dates for which the scholarship is effective. Were they for 12 months as well?

Why do I say all this? I know your son, nor my daughter, played a revenue-producing sport at a P5 school. So I would LOVE to see the legal athletic scholarship contracts that are signed by a B1G football or basketball player, just to see the dates. You have correctly pointed out that he P5 conferences have agreed to honor 4 years of athletic scholarship, but until I see it WRITTEN IN THE SCHOLARSHIP CONTRACT I will always be leery. I believe the P5 conferences can say they have 4 year guaranteed scholarships - and as a 'gentleman's agreement' the schools within these conferences more-often than not abide - but until it is written in the scholarship contract it means very little (at least to me). Can anyone confirm it is WRITTEN in the contracts these athletes sign?


I can't confirm that as my son is on an academic scholarship, which took precedence over his athletic scholarship and paid for everything. They gave his partial athletic track scholarship to a different athlete. He was supposed to receive a partial scholarship this year based on his performance last year, but there was nothing left to pay. He joined the team initially as a preferred walk-on in part because he was already on an academic scholarship. And while he participates on a top 20 ranked Division 1 school for track, his school is not in one of the power 5 conferences; so they don't have to follow the same legal rules.

I can confirm that he and almost every other track athlete sits down at the end of the year to discuss their performance and the amounts of their partial scholarships. And their scholarship % are determined by their meet performance. And there were several athletes on his team that were Olympic athletes that received a full scholarship.

my son is at a crossroads as he red shirted one year . His academic scholarship paid for that year. He plans to return to school for a 5th year. His academic scholarship runs out this year. if he were to become the conference champion or top 3 finisher in his event , I'm not sure how much of a partial scholarship he would receive.

But then again, my son is an MVC athlete. He competes against BIG 10 and SEC schools. but his school doesn't have to follow the scholarship rules they do.

I imagine power 5 schools also have partial scholarships for their non-revenue sports. I'm not sure if this rule applies to the partial scholarships given. A question would be if a track or swimming athlete receives a 4 year scholarship. In reading the article, a POWER 5 school can't take that back. but could they take back a partial scholarship? I don't know.

I do know because of their past success, my son's school added twice as many athletes this year than in years past. And a couple were said to be on a full scholarship. I have to believe they will retain their scholarships. I also know two years ago, our coaches left for Miss or Miss St, and about 4-6 of our best athletes transferred with them. There would have been more except for the fact the new school could not offer all of them the full scholarship they were already receiving.

My son is in a different sport and a different school with different rules. one rule that seems similar - if an athlete tests positive, the coach lies about it, and the athlete has a fake injury reported and sits out a meet. Our team seems to be very injury prone.
 
one rule that seems similar - if an athlete tests positive, the coach lies about it, and the athlete has a fake injury reported and sits out a meet. Our team seems to be very injury prone.

That made me laugh!

I can confirm that NCAA D1 and NCAA D2 allow athletic scholarships to be 'partial' for most sports (not football or basketball). Track, volleyball, softball, baseball, tennis...all award scholarships from partial to full. For baseball/softball, there may be 10 scholarships available (I made this number up, it is different between NCAA D1 and NCAA D2). Of the 10, 20 athletes could all get 50% rides, 40 athletes could all get 25% rides, etc. In baseball and softball, full rides are RARE. Being an ace pitcher or dominant catcher can really improve your athletic scholarship amounts vs. other positions. And as we all know, NCAA D3 does NOT give out athletic scholarships.

Academic scholarships can certainly help along with the athletic scholarships. As your son has found out! I'm very thankful my daughter had academic money as well. But I am still curious and have yet to see a definitive answer....do P5 NCAA football/basketball legal scholarship contracts, as signed by the student/athlete and the university, contain dates for 4 full years? So they are only signed once at the time the student enters school? Or are those contracts still written every 12 months and signed once per year?
 
That made me laugh!

I can confirm that NCAA D1 and NCAA D2 allow athletic scholarships to be 'partial' for most sports (not football or basketball). Track, volleyball, softball, baseball, tennis...all award scholarships from partial to full. For baseball/softball, there may be 10 scholarships available (I made this number up, it is different between NCAA D1 and NCAA D2). Of the 10, 20 athletes could all get 50% rides, 40 athletes could all get 25% rides, etc. In baseball and softball, full rides are RARE. Being an ace pitcher or dominant catcher can really improve your athletic scholarship amounts vs. other positions. And as we all know, NCAA D3 does NOT give out athletic scholarships.

Academic scholarships can certainly help along with the athletic scholarships. As your son has found out! I'm very thankful my daughter had academic money as well. But I am still curious and have yet to see a definitive answer....do P5 NCAA football/basketball legal scholarship contracts, as signed by the student/athlete and the university, contain dates for 4 full years? So they are only signed once at the time the student enters school? Or are those contracts still written every 12 months and signed once per year?

that's a good question. Unfortunately, my son is an athlete at a non power 5 school in a non revenue sport. His sport still has annual reviews. And I'm not sure what happens to the athletes who are on full scholarship

and the athlete transfers in track seem to be different. the players who left could participate immediately, although they did require our school's official release. We lost a long jumper last month, but we gained a better one this month from Univ of Tennessee who will participate immediately. the rules are different for track.
 
No such rule that I know of...but I could be wrong.


the rules changed in 2014 with the establishment of the power 5 schools the BIG 10 was the leader in the rule change. Once a scholarship is signed and agreed upon, it is for 4 years, and the school cannot revoke it without either academic, drug, or crime related cause. The player must voluntarily leave / transfer..

Two exceptions: Walk-ons and/or late scholarships are NOT 4 year scholarships...take it to the bank!
 
FR offensive lineman Jalen Jackson has left the program which leaves us sitting at -4 over
 
It says Jackson did not make the bowl trip.
Anyone know who else stayed behind? Reading some tea leaves...
 
It says Jackson did not make the bowl trip.
Anyone know who else stayed behind? Reading some tea leaves...


Wilson also stayed behind. I'm reading the same tea leaves. however, I believe this year that there were a lot fewer tea leaves that remained in WL.
 
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