Drayvn Gibbs Lawhorn

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DAG10

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Nov 2, 2018
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Dag10, I usually agree with most of your post but I think this is where not just Purdue fans but also the college basketball world at large missed the boat on last years team. At the beginning of the year it looked like we had a really deep team. Heck we even redshirted a top 50 recruit. Furst started out playing really well and we all anticipated Newman being the player he was the year before. But Furst's contributions really fell off and Newman was only a shell of the player he had been in the past. IT starting the first half of the year might have lead many to believe that maybe he was as good or better than Hunter. He wasn't.

By the end of the year guys like Morton, Furst and IT were coming in to give guys a break not because Painter thought they were going to provide a spark. Thompson, Furst, and Morton all averaged less than 3 points per game in conference play and Newman didn't play much after the B1G season started. There were times we struggled at the point but didn't have an alternative. When Sasha went cold at the end of the year, we didn't have a backup plan. So were was all the depth?

We didn't have two equal starting fives, We had two really good centers that split time and two or three guys who came in to give the starters a break. That's it.
There is some validity to what you have shared, but, there are some things that (while true) raise questions as well.

I do think that Purdue had a deep team, and, the decision to redshirt a top-50 recruit supports that...it also raises questions to my initial point.

Furst's failure to develop and continue to contribute and become more of a key player ultimately raises some questions as well.

Newman's falling off raises questions...he still showed himself capable at the end of the year.

IT was never the same after he got hurt early in the year...that said, the decision to take him out of the starting line-up impacted him...directly...but, the team as well...it changed rotations and line-ups and I firmly believe that Purdue was not better in light of it (and, there were more losses after that decision than before it that would be further support of/for that).

I feel like in hindsight, Tre was hurt with how things worked out and went...he was underused if you will.

And, none of that accounts for the defensive woes that were never fixed...or even addressed in ways.

Bottom line...I don't feel like last year was one of the better coaching efforts or performances...there was way more than enough there and to work with for Purdue to not just be really good, but, genuinely great...and, it did not happen ultimately unfortunately. I am not hating or bashing, just sharing my thoughts on the matter(s). Depth in my mind was indeed a strength and existed...there were other things that kept it from becoming what it could/should have been.
 

boilerball2021

Redshirt Freshman
Jul 29, 2021
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There is some validity to what you have shared, but, there are some things that (while true) raise questions as well.

I do think that Purdue had a deep team, and, the decision to redshirt a top-50 recruit supports that...it also raises questions to my initial point.

Furst's failure to develop and continue to contribute and become more of a key player ultimately raises some questions as well.

Newman's falling off raises questions...he still showed himself capable at the end of the year.

IT was never the same after he got hurt early in the year...that said, the decision to take him out of the starting line-up impacted him...directly...but, the team as well...it changed rotations and line-ups and I firmly believe that Purdue was not better in light of it (and, there were more losses after that decision than before it that would be further support of/for that).

I feel like in hindsight, Tre was hurt with how things worked out and went...he was underused if you will.

And, none of that accounts for the defensive woes that were never fixed...or even addressed in ways.

Bottom line...I don't feel like last year was one of the better coaching efforts or performances...there was way more than enough there and to work with for Purdue to not just be really good, but, genuinely great...and, it did not happen ultimately unfortunately. I am not hating or bashing, just sharing my thoughts on the matter(s). Depth in my mind was indeed a strength and existed...there were other things that kept it from becoming what it could/should have been.
On Kaufman redshirting…. I think that points to how deep the frontcourt was. There just wouldn’t have been enough minutes to play 5 guys consistently at the 4/5.

I do think the depth at the 1-3 was very overrated. We will ultimately see this year when those backups are now our featured players in the backcourt.
 
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SCBoiler1

Redshirt Freshman
Feb 10, 2014
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There is some validity to what you have shared, but, there are some things that (while true) raise questions as well.

I do think that Purdue had a deep team, and, the decision to redshirt a top-50 recruit supports that...it also raises questions to my initial point.

Furst's failure to develop and continue to contribute and become more of a key player ultimately raises some questions as well.

Newman's falling off raises questions...he still showed himself capable at the end of the year.

IT was never the same after he got hurt early in the year...that said, the decision to take him out of the starting line-up impacted him...directly...but, the team as well...it changed rotations and line-ups and I firmly believe that Purdue was not better in light of it (and, there were more losses after that decision than before it that would be further support of/for that).

I feel like in hindsight, Tre was hurt with how things worked out and went...he was underused if you will.

And, none of that accounts for the defensive woes that were never fixed...or even addressed in ways.

Bottom line...I don't feel like last year was one of the better coaching efforts or performances...there was way more than enough there and to work with for Purdue to not just be really good, but, genuinely great...and, it did not happen ultimately unfortunately. I am not hating or bashing, just sharing my thoughts on the matter(s). Depth in my mind was indeed a strength and existed...there were other things that kept it from becoming what it could/should have been.
I think Purdue had enough to be better than they were but I'm not sure it was because of the depth. It was good enough because we had 3 B1G level players playing on our team. It really hurts that we couldn't find away to have Edey and Williams on the court at the same time. It must have been a train wreck in practice to not even give it a try during the preseason games.

Newman not being able to replicate his freshmen year really killed us at the backup at the 2 and 3 positions. You need scorers at these positions and having Morton fill that role really killed us especially when Sasha struggled at the end of the year.
 

mathboy

All-American
Feb 4, 2004
10,704
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A couple thoughts... Kuafman red shirted because he was injured IIRC, and needed some recovery time. Could he have played later in the year? Yes! But we had a traffic jam at the 4/5. We really didn't need another forward.

We needed ball handlers more than shooters last year, so Newman couldn't bring as much to the table as the team needed. I think that's why he road the beanch and IT played so much (although he was a bit of a defensive liability).

While it seems that later in the season the team lost some of its mojo, much of that might be because they were scouted so well earlier, and we faced much better coaches every 3 days. Of course, our preseason had some great teams, but they had not played against Painter as often as the Iowa's and MSU's. Nor were we playing a BIG-tough team at the BIG season rate. Familiarity is a liability in basketball. That's why it is so difficult to beat a team 2-3 times in a season.

:cool:
 
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*Shockerrr*

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Apr 26, 2015
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For someone that supposedly thought he was better than Purdue after a good aau summer has the he even picked up any new offers outside of Memphis since decommitting? I may be wrong but that seems a little funny to me.
 
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For someone that supposedly thought he was better than Purdue after a good aau summer has the he even picked up any new offers outside of Memphis since decommitting? I may be wrong but that seems a little funny to me.
There will be many more. It's a shame that Purdue can't compete against the likes of mighty Memphis, or is it Memphis State?
 
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boilerball2021

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I am so lost on this thread and posts, not sure who is arguing for what exactly.
The Purdue BS (fitting name) was upset that we couldn’t recruit better than Memphis, because he clearly doesn’t follow college basketball recruiting and didn’t know Memphis has been recruiting at an elite level under Hardaway.

He’s also been one of the posters saying Painter doesn’t recruit well enough and recruiting is all that matters. He’s kinda stuck between a rock and a hard place in this argument.
 
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Have you seen the on court results!? If he only knew how to coach, he might be deadly.
So you are writing him off after only 4 years? Harsh judgement for a coach with a .664 win percentage, who has stellar recruiting, and who also won the NIT. His ceiling is unknown while Painter's has been established.
 
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The Purdue BS (fitting name) was upset that we couldn’t recruit better than Memphis, because he clearly doesn’t follow college basketball recruiting and didn’t know Memphis has been recruiting at an elite level under Hardaway.

He’s also been one of the posters saying Painter doesn’t recruit well enough and recruiting is all that matters. He’s kinda stuck between a rock and a hard place in this argument.
Let's see, that seems to be tenet #4 of the math-fanboi type handbook. Just make stuff up. No one ever said "recruiting is all that matters". A good coach and great recruiting can go far. A good coach and middle of the Big Ten recruiting, well you know where that goes. Although one thing that has been proven after 42 years of Kea-nter: recruiting does matter. What other factor could be at work since many of you math-fanboi types say Kea-nter is a great coach. What could be missing? Anybody, anybody know the answer? The only BS here will be the excuses the math-fanboi types come up to explain no FF's in 42 years. I'll even give you a hint: The answer is RECRUITING.
 
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boilerball2021

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Let's see, that seems to be tenet #4 of the math-fanboi type handbook. Just make stuff up. No one ever said "recruiting is all that matters". A good coach and great recruiting can go far. A good coach and middle of the Big Ten recruiting, well you know where that goes. Although one thing that has been proven after 42 years of Kea-nter: recruiting does matter. What other factor could be at work since many of you math-fanboi types say Kea-nter is a great coach. What could be missing? Anybody, anybody know the answer? The only BS here will be the excuses the math-fanboi types come up to explain no FF's in 42 years. I'll even give you a hint: The answer is RECRUITING.
If you keep this up, you may be able to take over for Patty as President of the PHC!
 

boilerball2021

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Just as I suspected from a math-fanboi type, no answers and no substance. Not even a good excuse! Darn.

P.S. Who's Patty?
There is no point in giving you an answer with substance (as I did in the other thread many times), because your mind is made up and there is no changing it.
 
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SDBoiler1

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Jul 30, 2001
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I get it. It was all set up for us. We beat Yale, a Texas team that had lost 3 of their last 4 and then lost to St Peters. St Peters lost by 20 to North Carolina. But lets not forget we lost 6 conference games and finished third in the conference. We also lost in the B1G tournament championship game to Iowa, which in turn lost its opening round tournament game to Richmond.

To me our regular season failures were as bad as the tournament. The St Peters game wasn't just a fluke. We were never ranked outside the top 10 but we lost 6 conference games in a conference that didn't have one team advance to the Elite 8 and the B1G was 4th in conference RPI.

Many on this board thought the team was the best Purdue team ever but after we beat Villanova and North Carolina in November we never really did anything. Everyone just kept thinking we should be that good but as it turns out we really weren't. In hindsight I for one question whether Purdue was really ever a top 5 or even top 10 team, because we really never accomplished anything to earn it.
Purdue beat two FF teams and won the tournament in CT?
 
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No arguments here. This is actually a perfect argument against the Painter Haters Club that think recruiting is more important than coaching.
Ever hear of Sharon Versyp? A below average coach and below average recruiter who went to two EE's. How did a below average coach get to two EE's? She did it because she inherited Kristy Curry's great recruits. See how that recruiting stuff works? Can you imagine what a good coach like Painter could have done with the right recruits? He could have transformed Purdue into a nationally prominent basketball power. There is no doubt about it, but that ship has sailed.
 

bonefish1

All-American
Oct 4, 2004
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Let's see, that seems to be tenet #4 of the math-fanboi type handbook. Just make stuff up. No one ever said "recruiting is all that matters". A good coach and great recruiting can go far. A good coach and middle of the Big Ten recruiting, well you know where that goes. Although one thing that has been proven after 42 years of Kea-nter: recruiting does matter. What other factor could be at work since many of you math-fanboi types say Kea-nter is a great coach. What could be missing? Anybody, anybody know the answer? The only BS here will be the excuses the math-fanboi types come up to explain no FF's in 42 years. I'll even give you a hint: The answer is RECRUITING.
It's because we're not near a beach......and it's cold in the winter.
 
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boilerball2021

Redshirt Freshman
Jul 29, 2021
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Ever hear of Sharon Versyp? A below average coach and below average recruiter who went to two EE's. How did a below average coach get to two EE's? She did it because she inherited Kristy Curry's great recruits. See how that recruiting stuff works? Can you imagine what a good coach like Painter could have done with the right recruits? He could have transformed Purdue into a nationally prominent basketball power. There is no doubt about it, but that ship has sailed.
You know you’ve lost when you start trying to use women’s sports in your argument.
 
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Poprudy

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247 Just published their updated 2023 rankings.

Colvin: 78 to 70

DGL: 58 to 81

Don't let him drop out of the top 100. This thread isn't helping to many arguments on here.
 

purduepat1969

All-American
Sep 28, 2011
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No arguments here. This is actually a perfect argument against the Painter Haters Club that think recruiting is more important than coaching.

Can you please supply the post where anyone, including myself, have said that recruiting is more important that coaching? I consider them equally important. But you only hear what you think makes your argument...
 

*Shockerrr*

True Freshman
Apr 26, 2015
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247 Just published their updated 2023 rankings.

Colvin: 78 to 70

DGL: 58 to 81

Xavier Booker went from 6 to 59? Lol these rankings are so jacked up!
Colvin should be a top 50 kid.
 

SDBoiler1

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There is a lot to like with Colvin.

DGL and Booker are good prospects and all, but I’m glad Colvin is our guy out of the 3.
I’d rather have all 3 of them. That would be one hell of a class. Isn’t going to happen. The way Purdue wins MBB NCs is stacking classes of athletic, smart, high-level recruits.
 
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