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Ok, I think I get what you're saying. To answer your question, yes, I'm sure some other schools would find Painter inspiring as a potential new coach. And no, I have yet to hear anyone suggest someone that is realistic and inspiring to replace Painter here at PU. Could I be missing something? Yes, I absolutely recognize that.

I just get so tired of the whining and complaining about CMP and when you then try and pin that person down and ask for a specific solution you get:

Don't know
Just not Keady tree
Steve Fisher

I just would once like to see someone say "Painter needs to go and here is exactly what I would do to replace him" and then follow up with exact person they are going to hire. Without doing that what are you really adding? Nothing but negative energy with no solution.

While I don't disagree entirely with what you are saying...or your point in general...I think it is very different with respect to Purdue specifically, simply because it is Purdue.

Purdue, as a University, is not committed to winning...thus, while somebody could offer the greatest solution and what you desire to hear, it is irrelevant...as, at Purdue, it will/would not happen. Even you made point to mention that nobody had offered a "realistic" name...which I would suggest is more because of the fact that it is Purdue than it is that said candidate would not be a realistic option, never mind likely upgrade.

As stated, Painter is not going anywhere unless he chooses to do so on his own...heck, if Hazell and Versyp are still employees in good standing, Painter has NOTHING to worry about, as he is Vince Lombardi relative to those other two.

Painter has not done anything of significance at Purdue...nothing...he simply is fortunate enough to have followed someone that had the same virtual lifetime contract that he does with the same minimal expectations by those who employ him...that is not his fault certainly, but it is the fact of the matter. Thus, that is why you get "whining and complaining" as you alluded to...as even if there was an answer, it won't happen at Purdue.
 
The NCAA tourney is not the "Bidding Process." It is the final result. It is the most important part of the entire college hoops season. Unfair? Probably. With that being said, that is the reality of college basketball, and Purdue provided an inferior product when it mattered most.
As did your company ... you had a chance to be #1. The tourney is a presentation of the skills and experience and capabilities of your team. You avoided answering my question ... is he fired?
 
This. People on this board like to talk about how they work for a "highly successful company that would not tolerate this mediocrity."

Highly successful companies that I know have a motto: "Anyone can complain about a problem. If you don't have a specific solution, you are just whining." Based on that, the people on this board demanding their idea of excellence from a freaking basketball team don't seem to have it in their own lives.
You know what scares me ... and relates to your well-said post ... is if any of those posters have children. If their perfectionism is put upon their children ... well ...
 
To the narrow minded, short sighted and lack-of-real-basketball-knowledge it would be.

No, but your comment certainly fits each of those.

Awww "coaching is really hard." So are many other professions.

"Please don't criticize about things that you don't understand and have never attempted." ...another cop-out, bullsh** statement. Painter made mistakes that, unfortunately, for a coach who just wrapped up his 11th season, are unacceptable to make in the first round of the NCAA tournament against ARK LR. Criticism is more than fair. Get out of here with the "you can't criticize because you don't know." Bullsh**
 
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DG10, I am a rare poster on this board, but your assertion that "... Purdue as a University is not committed to being successful" is imbecilic and demands a response. As a 31-year professor here, I don't think you can imagine the degree to which my colleagues, students, and the University as a whole, are dedicated to "success." In pursuit of "success" for my students, and the University, I haven't taken a day off in more than three decades. What have you done to further the "success" of the University and its people in that span?

Admittedly my mistake...as I left out two key words in my assertion/statement, as I failed to include the words "in athletics".

I appreciate your service to Purdue...I appreciate your commitment to the University and your students (and thank you for it)...and I do apologize for not having been clear in my point...I took it for granted that it was understood that I was speaking about athletics, but I failed to clarify that.
 
As did your company ... you had a chance to be #1. The tourney is a presentation of the skills and experience and capabilities of your team. You avoided answering my question ... is he fired?

You act as if Purdue has been a consistent top 15 team over the last half-decade, which is simply not the case. Painter has not been able to get Purdue to the next level. I think this "company" aka Purdue basketball will be fine without Painter. Yes, I personally believe it is time to fire Painter.
 
No, but your comment certainly fits each of those.

Awww "coaching is really hard." So are many other professions.

"Please don't criticize about things that you don't understand and have never attempted." ...another cop-out, bullsh** statement. Painter made mistakes that, unfortunately, for a coach who just wrapped up his 11th season, are unacceptable to make in the first round of the NCAA tournament against ARK LR. Criticism is more than fair. Get out of here with the "you can't criticize because you don't know." Bullsh**
Actually no, your comment on here perfectly matches what I said. You see you throw around all these things like you are some sort of expert, but haven't the foggiest idea on what it takes to coach organized sports or probably even play it to begin with. So, you have no foundation for criticism because you lack the knowledge to do it in an efficient manner. All you have is what you watch on TV and what your expectations are and nothing more. My statement about you is factual, on target and describes everything to the letter. You can try and debate it all you want, but in the end I am still right and there is no changing that. Deal with it.
 
While I don't disagree entirely with what you are saying...or your point in general...I think it is very different with respect to Purdue specifically, simply because it is Purdue.

Purdue, as a University, is not committed to winning...thus, while somebody could offer the greatest solution and what you desire to hear, it is irrelevant...as, at Purdue, it will/would not happen. Even you made point to mention that nobody had offered a "realistic" name...which I would suggest is more because of the fact that it is Purdue than it is that said candidate would not be a realistic option, never mind likely upgrade.

As stated, Painter is not going anywhere unless he chooses to do so on his own...heck, if Hazell and Versyp are still employees in good standing, Painter has NOTHING to worry about, as he is Vince Lombardi relative to those other two.

Painter has not done anything of significance at Purdue...nothing...he simply is fortunate enough to have followed someone that had the same virtual lifetime contract that he does with the same minimal expectations by those who employ him...that is not his fault certainly, but it is the fact of the matter. Thus, that is why you get "whining and complaining" as you alluded to...as even if there was an answer, it won't happen at Purdue.
I respect your opinion and your position. Let me try to clarify my use of the word "realistic". There were a few suggestions from another thread:

Steve Fisher (SDSU) - 70 years old, why would a 70 year old leave San Diego?
Ben Jacobson (UNI) - Just signed a new contract less than a year ago. $3 million buy out
Marshall (WSU) - New Contract makes over $3 million now at WSU.

That is what I meant by realistic. If I'm being unfair or missing something that should be considered realistic I will be open to changing my mind. But to this point, I have not seen one suggestion that makes sense.
 
Admittedly my mistake...as I left out two key words in my assertion/statement, as I failed to include the words "in athletics".

I appreciate your service to Purdue...I appreciate your commitment to the University and your students (and thank you for it)...and I do apologize for not having been clear in my point...I took it for granted that it was understood that I was speaking about athletics, but I failed to clarify that.
 
You act as if Purdue has been a consistent top 15 team over the last half-decade, which is simply not the case. Painter has not been able to get Purdue to the next level. I think this "company" aka Purdue basketball will be fine without Painter. Yes, I personally believe it is time to fire Painter.
And thus more proof as to why you aren't the AD and shouldn't be commenting on anything basketball related. So thanks for that.
 
Actually no, your comment on here perfectly matches what I said. You see you throw around all these things like you are some sort of expert, but haven't the foggiest idea on what it takes to coach organized sports or probably even play it to begin with. So, you have no foundation for criticism because you lack the knowledge to do it in an efficient manner. All you have is what you watch on TV and what your expectations are and nothing more. My statement about you is factual, on target and describes everything to the letter. You can try and debate it all you want, but in the end I am still right and there is no changing that. Deal with it.

I will do my very best to deal with the insanely huge blow to my ego stemming from your claim that you are right and there is no changing that.

You have no knowledge of my basketball experience, or that of my relatives, who have deep roots in basketball, both playing and coaching, but I'm not here to "flaunt" that or act as if I know more because of that, as the OP did.
 
I respect your opinion and your position. Let me try to clarify my use of the word "realistic". There were a few suggestions from another thread:

Steve Fisher (SDSU) - 70 years old, why would a 70 year old leave San Diego?
Ben Jacobson (UNI) - Just signed a new contract less than a year ago. $3 million buy out
Marshall (WSU) - New Contract makes over $3 million now at WSU.

That is what I meant by realistic. If I'm being unfair or missing something that should be considered realistic I will be open to changing my mind. But to this point, I have not seen one suggestion that makes sense.

Ok...so just with respect to those three names:

Fisher indeed makes no sense...for the precise reasons that you mentioned, never mind others as well.

Jacobson on the other hand, is very much I think a realistic option or consideration. If the obstacle is the buyout, when you are raking in $30-$40m per from the BTN contract, that is pennies. If Jacobson is indeed believed to be a better coach, then I would definitely consider him a realistic consideration.

Same goes for Marshall, although I believe he is actually making a bit more than the $3m that you alluded to, and I would be shocked if he did not have a more significant buyout...plus, in his case, he has already passed on other jobs or openings...money matters aside, hard to believe that there is anything compelling about the Purdue job (particularly with the lack of support from the University) that would appeal to him and make it more attractive than some of the other jobs that he has already turned down.
 
And thus more proof as to why you aren't the AD and shouldn't be commenting on anything basketball related. So thanks for that.

Because Purdue's AD has done so well recently. Ha.

Obviously, I'm aware of other factors that have to be taken into account by the AD (buyout dollar value, coaching successors, etc.).

In my personal opinion, however, I have seen enough of Painter to know that he is not the right coach, in terms of taking Purdue basketball to the next level.

Also, in case you forgot...this is a basketball forum, where I am free to provide my opinion, including anything basketball related.

Hopefully you feel self-righteous as you continue to sport your gold and black Purdue glasses and resulting mediocrity.

You are aware that Purdue athletics is the laughing stock of P5 conferences, right? The results, the style, the mentality, the overall commitment to athletics by this great University, each present unique flaws, in some form or fashion.

I get it; this team just won 26 games (another "illusion" of a successful season). How could it possibly be warranted to fire the coach? It's that exact questioning that has been perpetuated by those who deem this as a successful season, whereas, in reality, with the talent this team had, along with the experience that this coaching staff (particularly, its head coach) should have been able to use to prevent a meltdown loss to Arkansas LR, this should have been a much more fruitful season.

I clearly come off as irrational to you, which is fair, I guess. However, if you really think that, after 11 years, Painter is still the man to take this program to greater heights, then we just agree to disagree. Simple as that.
 
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This is crazy talk. If you take a look at the football program and conclude that Hazell needs more time (2 years?!) and then look at the basketball program and conclude that Painter needs to go then I don't think I can lend any credence to that opinion. The only reason Hazell is still at Purdue is because it's too expensive to buy him out and getting rid of him would be an admission of failure by Burke.


Painter, had the "Baby Boilers" and we had all the hoopla going and Painter was considered a "Up and coming coach" for that class. We were a very highly ranked team and many of us believed we'd see a Final4 or more from them. So, he hit the ground running and had the table set to seal the borders as IU couldn't find their own ass with both hands. "HE" allowed the program to devolve into a mess, and his personal problems didn't help. So, the fact we sunk into the cellar and now only managed to eek out a tie for 3rd place is on him. Hazell is a much different animal. The football program was a mess when he arrived, and he's still trying to fix it. Will he? I don't know. But, one thing is for sure...he didn't pull us out of the mud then allow us to run off into the ditch again as Painter did. That's why I give Hazell this year and one more. What's so hard to understand about that logic?
 
Ok...so just with respect to those three names:

Fisher indeed makes no sense...for the precise reasons that you mentioned, never mind others as well.

Jacobson on the other hand, is very much I think a realistic option or consideration. If the obstacle is the buyout, when you are raking in $30-$40m per from the BTN contract, that is pennies. If Jacobson is indeed believed to be a better coach, then I would definitely consider him a realistic consideration.

Same goes for Marshall, although I believe he is actually making a bit more than the $3m that you alluded to, and I would be shocked if he did not have a more significant buyout...plus, in his case, he has already passed on other jobs or openings...money matters aside, hard to believe that there is anything compelling about the Purdue job (particularly with the lack of support from the University) that would appeal to him and make it more attractive than some of the other jobs that he has already turned down.
Fair enough: Then would you pursue Jacobson?
 
I have been around this board lately but glad to see all are happy with the way things are going. I wish I was so enlightened. I know it is hard to get the quality athletes to attend Purdue with all the challenges and lack of resources. Shouldn't expect to be able to beat schools from Little Rock with all the advantages they have. Thank goodness the basketball team is mediocre because the rest of the Purdue teams are awful.
 
OP here...

In response to comments about my 'humble-brag', it was more just a 'brag', I guess. I was just presenting evidence that I was a good high school basketball player, but found it very challenging to coach. Coaching wasn't nearly as easy as I thought it would be.

I did not intend to say that we can't criticize Painter, but it seems like any criticism should be offered with the realization that the task is much harder than most people realize.
 
The football program was coming off back to back bowls when Hazell took over. We have averaged 2 wins a season since. I knew within three games that Hazell was a mistake. If you aren't sure after three seasons then I just think it says something about you.
 
I grow a little weary of all the critics on this board. I would suggest that before anybody criticize Matt Painter, they should list their own coaching experience, at what level they coached, what their record was, and how many championships they won.

My son is now a sophomore in college and I coached him and his friends at multiple levels throughout his childhood. I was good Indiana high school player. I was the most valuable player in my conference, averaged 18 points as a senior and for 30 years held the all-time assist record at my high school. I had a fairly good grasp of basketball. It turns out I was mostly clueless as a coach - although I did get better as I did it more.

How many of you have ever actually tried to communicate a basketball truth to a kid? First, you must make them understand the concept. Then, you have to make sure they have the physical skills to put the concept into practice. Then, you have to get them to remember to do it scrimmage. Then, you have to make sure they remember to do today what you told them yesterday. Finally, and most difficultly, you need to try to make them remember in the game situation, while hundreds of other things are going through their minds, to do what you told them to do.

As an example, I tried to emphasize the importance of taking care of the ball and eliminating turnovers. But I distinctly remember games where I thought, "An outsider watching this game might conclude that this stupid coach never even mentioned that turnovers were a bad thing." My boys would often do the exact opposite of what I had told them repeatedly. The skill of effectively communicating truth is a very difficult skill to master and is very rare.

Coaching is really hard. It is very rare indeed to find the specific combination of intelligence, humor, communication, sales skills, rigor, discipline, and a host of other skills required to generate a coach of the caliber of Wooden,Knight, Krzyzewski, and so on.

Purdue is an engineering school, so you might think the members of this board would understand the bell curve. Hall of Fame Division 1 coaches probably fall somewhere around 99.9999% on the bell curve of college basketball coaches in their specific mix of skills. Very good coaches might drop a few decimals and be just at the 99.9% level.

I was heart-broken & frustrated to see Purdue lose to Little Rock. It really does sap much joy from the entire tournament. But I don't conclude that I could have done better. And I don't conclude that there are a ton of other coaches that could have done better also.

I think Painter is a very good coach. I think he may be capable of taking Purdue to a final four someday. If so, then he is a very rare person indeed.

In my mind, the chances that another coach who would take the job would be better than him is significantly less than 50%. That is, I suspect that the chances of hiring a coach that is better than Painter is probably in the 10-20% range. It's painful to lose, but many many teams are going through that same pain right now. This is not unique to Purdue.

Please don't criticize about things that you don't understand and have never attempted.


I grow weary of critical posts, criticizing critical posts. That's all I have to say about that.
 
Ok. While I agree that every fan has the right to complain about their team, I interpret the Op in a different way.

I have no problem with criticisms of Painter. I am all for keeping him but also have issues with some things he does. All I ask is that the criticisms be based on facts and that whomever is making them know something about the game of basketball.

When people say Painter doesn't know how to break a press or needs to teach the players how to break a press, they are just plain wrong. Period. he's not teaching the players to get trapped in the corner.
If you think Painter screaming at the refs and jumping up and down to get his players excited is gonna win us more games you are just wrong, besides the fact that it ain't gonna happen so either accept it or find another team.
If you say Painter doesn't make adjustments you are just wrong.....you may not agree with the adjustments or just don't know enough about the game to see them.
When you complain that Painter doesn't adjust his offense to his players you are dead wrong. Painter changed the entire offense to play through the post. He NEVER had a true center before AJ. The motion offense we ran before AJ was different than what we run now.
When you say Painter's teams lose leads and can't close out games you are actually right........as long as you're talking this particular group of players. It happened with Cincy last year and it happened a bunch this year, but there are common factors in the two years, the coach AND the players. We have blown leads before this team but it wasn't consistent by any means......it happens in college basketball. But suddenly after two first round exits in the dance after blowing late leads it becomes something that has plagued every Painter team. Not true.
If you think Painter should play Haas and AJ together you aren't considering what would happen on the defensive end. Either would get destroyed by a stretch 4.
If you think we had FF talent and the best in the B1G and you're wrong. This team had flaws from day one and Painter has been saying that if you were paying attention.


I could go on and on.

Before someone says it, just because I support the current staff it doesn't mean I accept mediocrity, I am OK with losing, I think Painter is perfect or another BS you want to use to deflect. That is a lazy, worn out argument.

Believe it or not, Painter has reasons for the decisions he makes on the floor. You may disagree with those decisions and choose to complain about them......but I guarantee you don't KNOW why he made them. You have zero information other than the stats and what you see on TV. Believe it or not, he may actually know more about the player or the situation than you do. He makes mistakes and admits them freely, something I find refreshing.
 
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Fair enough: Then would you pursue Jacobson?
What I would personally do is irrelevant...as Purdue will not pursue him...even if Purdue could land Coach K, they would not pursue him.

Personally, I like Jacobson...what he has done at UNI is far more impressive to me than anything Painter has done at Purdue. That said, Purdue has no interest in pursuing him, and, has been established, Painter is going to remain the HC at Purdue likely for as long as he wishes to remain the HC at Purdue.

I like Jacobson...I like Marshall...I like other guys as well...again, it is all a moot point though.
 
What I would personally do is irrelevant...as Purdue will not pursue him...even if Purdue could land Coach K, they would not pursue him.

Personally, I like Jacobson...what he has done at UNI is far more impressive to me than anything Painter has done at Purdue. That said, Purdue has no interest in pursuing him, and, has been established, Painter is going to remain the HC at Purdue likely for as long as he wishes to remain the HC at Purdue.

I like Jacobson...I like Marshall...I like other guys as well...again, it is all a moot point though.

Yeah Jacobson. Then at least we'll know our team can handle a press and not collapse at the end of a game. Oh wait.
 
Painters coaching collapse in one word: VAGINA.

Like Tiger Woods, CMP was on FIYA!!!

Multiple B1G COY, Baby Boilers, BTTs, S16s, highly touted as a BIG-TIME hot coach, offers from other P5 schools, etc etc.

THEN...he got caught with his hand in the vagina jar. Boom. It's been downhill ever since.

CMP = Tiger Woods. He's damaged goods and will never recover. Time to move on.

Case closed. You're welcome.
 
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