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CMP Salary Increases? Should Be a Final 4 Bonus...

Would you be fine with Painter as coach had we secured that rebound vs Virginia?
I am fine with Painter as Coach without the rebound...the rebound is always brought up, but, a guy that is literally in the basketball HOF for FTs missing a FT just before that ensuing debacle is almost never brought up, and, is not just the more important piece, but, also entirely out of the hands of Painter.

My point was that on the heels of the point that you were trying to make...namely, that whereas Purdue had some high level national success that would suggest that it was poised for more...it has not ensued, despite the fact that it seemingly could (and maybe arguably should) have.
 
Look. I’m a Painter fan, and I want him to succeed. But let’s not pretend that he (or Keady) have taken us to unprecedented heights.
Or overachieved...outside of being better during the regular season than expected at times.
 
I am fine with Painter as Coach without the rebound...the rebound is always brought up, but, a guy that is literally in the basketball HOF for FTs missing a FT just before that ensuing debacle is almost never brought up, and, is not just the more important piece, but, also entirely out of the hands of Painter.

My point was that on the heels of the point that you were trying to make...namely, that whereas Purdue had some high level national success that would suggest that it was poised for more...it has not ensued, despite the fact that it seemingly could (and maybe arguably should) have.
And as has been discussed Painter/Purdue have a number of factors working against it that make consistent national success unlikely.
 
And as has been discussed Painter/Purdue have a number of factors working against it that make consistent national success unlikely.
Consistent national success is unlikely for any given school. Until it isn't. There were factors against Duke, Gonzaga, Nova, Virginia, etc etc. Those factors were overcome by... top coaching.
 
Consistent national success is unlikely for any given school. Until it isn't. There were factors against Duke, Gonzaga, Nova, Virginia, etc etc. Those factors were overcome by... top coaching.
Oh wow, if it’s that easy, why doesn’t every school do it??? Who would have thought the solution was so simple?
 
Oh wow, if it’s that easy, why doesn’t every school do it??? Who would have thought the solution was so simple?
The solution is indeed simple in that there is a common denominator in each case, a genuine elite HC...which is precisely the point that so many people/posters have tried to make during the course of this thread.

My guess is that Jay Wright...Brad Stevens...Tom Izzo...Mark Few...those guys have the same success in West Lafayette that they have had where they are/were...so, a truly elite HC will overcome those ALLEGED "number of factors" preventing Gene Keady and Matt Painter from having experienced the same.

My guess as well is that if Gene Keady or Matt Painter were the HC at Gonzaga...or Butler...or MSU...or Villanova...that, those same schools do not have the same success that they have had, and, at best, they have what Purdue has had with them...and I am not even sure that happens at some of those places (namely Gonzaga and Butler).
 
How is Illinois a "destination school"? How is Gonzaga a "destination school"? How is Villanova a "destination school"? Give me a break...
I'm curious to know what a "destination" school is as well? Does that mean geographical destination or a blue blood program like UK ,Duke, UNC?
 
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You don’t get very much credibility when you say Cronin has been to the championship game (he hasn’t) and that he has had UCLA in the top 25 for “several years”. He’s only been at UCLA for 2 years. UCLA makes him a better recruiter. He didn’t do shit at Cincinnati. UCLA tried to get Painter after they failed to get Calipari before they had to settle for Cronin.

Hamilton can’t hold a candle to Painter. Laughable to consider him a better coach.

You have an overinflated view of what Purdue basketball is capable of. We have been very fortunate to have Painter and Keady for the last 40+ years. Both coaches have overachieved vs what should be expected.
Essentially, what you're saying is that Painter is the best possible coach Purdue could ever get, no coach would be an improvement and that we should just be satisfied (settle). Is that correct?
 
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Our average here is so much lower than what Keady and Painter have given us. We will never recruit at a higher level than we have under them. They get the most out of their players though.

Lavin went to 5 Sweet 16s and an Elite 8 in seven seasons at UCLA.
Wow....you're definitely a pessimist. I'm curious what you do for a living?

If Scott Drew came to Purdue, would the recruiting change? How about Izzo?
 
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My personal guess would be that Painter hand picks his replacement, and we keep chugging along with man to man D and motion offense, with similar results that we have now.
God, I hope not. I hope MBob has the vision to realize that we need a cultural and philosophical change for Purdue basketball. 42 years with 2 head coaches (who are very similar in many ways) and 0 FF or NCs at what most would consider to be a very solid Bball program should be cause for change of philosophy.
 
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The solution is indeed simple in that there is a common denominator in each case, a genuine elite HC...which is precisely the point that so many people/posters have tried to make during the course of this thread.

My guess is that Jay Wright...Brad Stevens...Tom Izzo...Mark Few...those guys have the same success in West Lafayette that they have had where they are/were...so, a truly elite HC will overcome those ALLEGED "number of factors" preventing Gene Keady and Matt Painter from having experienced the same.

My guess as well is that if Gene Keady or Matt Painter were the HC at Gonzaga...or Butler...or MSU...or Villanova...that, those same schools do not have the same success that they have had, and, at best, they have what Purdue has had with them...and I am not even sure that happens at some of those places (namely Gonzaga and Butler).
So you want to risk it all on the very very small chance our next coach is “elite”? Hazel 2.0 incoming.
 
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So you want to risk it all on the very very small chance our next coach is “elite”? Hazel 2.0 incoming.
Yes, I kind of do. I'd like to see what someone from outside of Purdue can do with the culture and with the commitment to make Purdue a perennial FF contender like MSU.
Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
 
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Real Estate investing.

No, I don’t believe Drew or Izzo would improve recruiting.
Then you're just blindly loyal to Painter if you don't believe anyone would do better at Purdue than he has.

And to be fair, we won't know either way until he's gone and the new guy takes over. But saying that no one would do better is short sighted. However, what we can do is compare schools in similar circumstances and see how they've done.
I think it can be argued that schools like Baylor, Oregon, Nova, and even MSU are in similar circumstances as Purdue but their HC have had more success.
 
Then you're just blindly loyal to Painter if you don't believe anyone would do better at Purdue than he has.

And to be fair, we won't know either way until he's gone and the new guy takes over. But saying that no one would do better is short sighted. However, what we can do is compare schools in similar circumstances and see how they've done.
I think it can be argued that schools like Baylor, Oregon, Nova, and even MSU are in similar circumstances as Purdue but their HC have had more success.
Did I say no one could do better? There is a very small chance we find that person that can do better, though.

I’ll try to put it to you in real estate terms. What we currently have with Painter is a property that is cash flowing at a high level. You want to sell that off and take a chance on a riskier property like a property in the Metaverse. There is a small chance that would be a better investment, but the chance of striking out is far greater. The grass is not always greener on the other side.
 
Did I say no one could do better? There is a very small chance we find that person that can do better, though.

I’ll try to put it to you in real estate terms. What we currently have with Painter is a property that is cash flowing at a high level. You want to sell that off and take a chance on a riskier property like a property in the Metaverse. There is a small chance that would be a better investment, but the chance of striking out is far greater. The grass is not always greener on the other side.

Have you ever been to Vegas? If so, did you gamble or just attend some shows?

Painter is what he is and we know what we're getting with him. He's been a solid coach and representative of Purdue. He wins a lot of pre-conference and conference games, but struggles in a tourney setting.

Is he the best Purdue can get? Will Purdue have more success when we eventually get a new coach? Maybe, maybe not, impossible to know at this point. It will eventually happen, possibly in the next 5 years or so. Then we'll see how committed Purdue is to being more than a solid B10 program.
 
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Have you ever been to Vegas? If so, did you gamble or just attend some shows?

Painter is what he is and we know what we're getting with him. He's been a solid coach and representative of Purdue. He wins a lot of pre-conference and conference games, but struggles in a tourney setting.

Is he the best Purdue can get? Will Purdue have more success when we eventually get a new coach? Maybe, maybe not, impossible to know at this point. It will eventually happen, possibly in the next 5 years or so. Then we'll see how committed Purdue is to being more than a solid B10 program.
Yes I’ve been to Vegas, and yes I gamble. I would not gamble if my job depended on it.

Can you honestly say that if you were Mbob and your job depended on it that you would gamble replacing Painter with an unknown coach (and let’s not pretend like a known coach with a better resume than Painter would come here).

IU has better resources and has clearly made a huge investment into their basketball program… look where it’s got them.
 
Did I say no one could do better? There is a very small chance we find that person that can do better, though.

I’ll try to put it to you in real estate terms. What we currently have with Painter is a property that is cash flowing at a high level. You want to sell that off and take a chance on a riskier property like a property in the Metaverse. There is a small chance that would be a better investment, but the chance of striking out is far greater. The grass is not always greener on the other side.
Your sense of elite/premier/high level is warped...

Painter is a really good coach and has done a nice job certainly, but, he has missed out on some golden opportunities to have done much better (and, had some really bad luck at times that ruined other such opportunities).

That said, the chances of him reaching a FF/winning a National Championship were pretty remote pre-NIL, and, almost zero post-NIL.

That could be similar with other coaches...but, not necessarily with genuinely elite ones (which was the entire point of the thread).

Nobody at any point has debated whether he is a good Head Coach or not, nor called for him to be replaced...but, the whole notion that he is the best that Purdue could have done or could do is definitely debatable, if not very much debatable.
 
Your sense of elite/premier/high level is warped...

Painter is a really good coach and has done a nice job certainly, but, he has missed out on some golden opportunities to have done much better (and, had some really bad luck at times that ruined other such opportunities).

That said, the chances of him reaching a FF/winning a National Championship were pretty remote pre-NIL, and, almost zero post-NIL.

That could be similar with other coaches...but, not necessarily with genuinely elite ones (which was the entire point of the thread).

Nobody at any point has debated whether he is a good Head Coach or not, nor called for him to be replaced...but, the whole notion that he is the best that Purdue could have done or could do is definitely debatable, if not very much debatable.
There have been multiple posters calling for him to be replaced. Bonefish is one.

If there were a high probability of replacing Painter with an elite coach, I would be all for it. However, the probability of the next coach being elite is very very small.

Im sure if we had the results that UK has had under Cal you guys would still be bitching like some of the UK fans are now.
 
11 pages! Have we now exhausted this repetative topic? Every year we go through this same wash-rinse-repeat cycle.

Let's simply this whole deal:

1. Painter is not going anywhere

2. He is one rebound/free throw away from a FF, and this board is one rebond/free throw away from "Painter can make the FF, but he can't win the NC".

3. Each year we field a competative, exciting team that is really fun to watch

4. Are there better coaches out there than Painter? Maybe/maybe not. We will not know until Matt retires.


Can we now put this mess away until next year? We have way too many fun things happening around the BIG to dwell any further on this.

:cool:
 
11 pages! Have we now exhausted this repetative topic? Every year we go through this same wash-rinse-repeat cycle.

Let's simply this whole deal:

1. Painter is not going anywhere

2. He is one rebound/free throw away from a FF, and this board is one rebond/free throw away from "Painter can make the FF, but he can't win the NC".

3. Each year we field a competative, exciting team that is really fun to watch

4. Are there better coaches out there than Painter? Maybe/maybe not. We will not know until Matt retires.


Can we now put this mess away until next year? We have way too many fun things happening around the BIG to dwell any further on this.

:cool:
Agree on the first point...although, I still believe he is closer to being done that many/most believe or want to think.

Easy to say that on the second point, but, he was a miracle call and 3 FTs made by Carsen from bowing out yet again in the Sweet 16 (and, it is his only Sweet 16 win).

Won't agree on the 3rd point...would agree if you had said "most" years rather than "each" year, and, let's check back in March and see where things stand with this team.

What are the other "fun things" that we are missing out on?
 
Morgan Burke Acquatic Center has attracted Olympic caliber divers. The Loeb Stadium for baseball looks nice. The Golf Complex has good reviews. Maybe good we have these in place now in this environment. More $ towards Bball and Football going forward.
I agree. The facilities are decent for the relatively small complement of varsity sports.
 
Morgan Burke Acquatic Center has attracted Olympic caliber divers. The Loeb Stadium for baseball looks nice. The Golf Complex has good reviews. Maybe good we have these in place now in this environment. More $ towards Bball and Football going forward.

Getting the late Pete Dye involved to re-design the Kampen course was a very good move, IMO.....naturally, it won't have the revenue-generating potential of the flagship sports of football and basketball.

In current Boiler golf news.....Adam Schenk made the cut @ the FedEx St. Jude Championship in Memphis (the first playoff event). He'll need a big finish to move up in the standings and qualify for the next event (top 70 move on). On a side note, maybe he needs to rethink the surname, which phonetically is not great for a professional golfer. :)
 
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Getting the late Pete Dye involved to re-design the Kampen course was a very good move, IMO.....naturally, it won't have the revenue-generating potential of the flagship sports of football and basketball.

In current Boiler golf news.....Adam Schenk made the cut @ the FedEx St. Jude Championship in Memphis (the first playoff event). He'll need a big finish to move up in the standings and qualify for the next event (top 70 move on). On a side note, maybe he needs to rethink the surname, which phonetically is not great for a professional golfer. :)
I believe Kampen was always Pete Dye. He recently re-designed Ackerman
 
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