CMP B1G COY?
- Thread starter Cevol03
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Uhhh him sweeping Collins doesn't matter in terms of what Collins has accomplished. NU has way less talent and had their best team ever. I still think Pitino will win it though. Fantastic turnaround by Minny from last year to this year.
I think it should go to Pitino, they had that attrition and upheavel last year and only 5 wins I believe
I think 2011....didn't CMP win and JaJuan Johnson won POY....have to check.
Otherwise, it would be '94 with Gene Keady and Glenn Robinson.
The head to head matchup with Painter should be much more relevant than the fact NU had their best team ever. Past performances by NU teams should have no bearing on this.
It's not like Purdue has the most talent in the big ten either and finished at least 2 games ahead of everyone else. NW finished 4 games behind Purdue, so even though it's a "good story" (really just a sad story...apologies for being harsh) I don't think it's enough to surpass what Painter had accomplished this year. Remember that Purdue was picked 4th in the preseason this year, not TWO games ahead of 2nd place. If Minny somehow beats whisky today to tie Maryland for second, then I can see Pitino winning COY due to huge turnaround...voters love that.
Yeah, leading a horrible program to a good but not great season is a nice story, but Collins shouldn't be COY. It should be Painter or Pitino. When was the last time a 10-8 record won a guy the COY?
When is the last time a coach took NW to the NCAA tourney?
When Painter recruited the 2014 class, which is the core of the team, the program was struggling and few would have projected that 3 years later Purdue would be winning a B1G conference season championship. (Even Bryant McIntosh didn't believe in what Matt Painter was doing and chose Northwestern over Purdue.) Painter deserves a lot of credit for building and coaching the team that just won the conference championship by two games.
Personally I don't get the case for Collins at this point just because Northwestern achieved a pedestrian accomplishment that by itself would not impress hardly any other fan base. It either has to be Pitino or Painter in my opinion but I suspect the media talked themselves into Collins weeks ago.
I can find ways to justify why Pitino and Collins should win the award.
I can not come up with a reason why Painter shouldn't win the award.
I can not come up with a reason why Painter shouldn't win the award.
Did anyone see Collins trying to pump up the crowd? I didn't have much of an opinion about him before this last game, but it seemed a bit amateur hour. What kind of coach does that except for someone like Crean? Can you think of any great coach (in your book) that tries to pump up his crowd? I don't have an issue with players doing it, but the head coach? Coach the game, work the refs, manage your staff, worry about the game and let the cheerleaders do their jobs, coach. This might be a bit nit-picky on my part, but when people are talking about him winning coach of the year, this seemed a bit low class. I'm kinda old fashioned though (don't like over-emphatic dunks, big celebrations after touchdowns & sacks, etc.), but am I way off base here?
I think it will be Collins because Northwestern is the media darling of the B1G this season, but Minnesota did have a massive turnaround from last season (2-16 in conference, 8-23 overall) to this season (11-7 in conference play, 23-8 overall thus far) and Purdue went from tied for third last season and a projected top 4 B1G finisher in preseason to outright B1G title winners (14-4, 25-6 overall thus far).
That he did, though with that scowl and one aggressive fist-pump it was more in the manner of "Get off your asses and make some noise you sonsofbitches!" rather than the contemporary rah-rah stuff often seen.
Yep. Made the same observation in the game thread. Actually lost respect for him as a coach when he morphed into a cheerleader there late in the game.
Be careful, though, Collins hasn't led Northwestern to the NCAA tournament yet. They're down to around 50 in the RPI. Things could get ugly if Northwestern goes 0-for-DC.
Now, we could say that he's worthy of consideration for leading NU to its first winning B1G record in nearly half a century.
The only thing I would say with respect to Collins is that yes, they're going to make the tourney. And they went 10-8 in conference, which ties them for fifth place.
However, last year they were 8-10 and finished the regular season 20-11. That's not THAT big of a turnaround - they won a few more games in conference against middle of the pack teams. Against the top 5 teams in the Big Ten, Northwestern went 1-5.
Northwestern also went 11-2 in non-conference play. So them making the tournament is almost as much of what they did out of conference than what they did in conference. I'm not sure if making the NCAA Tournament is grounds for winning conference coach of the year.
I thought coach of the year was for conference play, but maybe it's full season? In conference play alone, they did not do anything remarkable - they beat middle of the pack teams and bottom feeders (which granted that is something that has slipped them up before), but went 1-5 against the top 5 teams. I'm not sure in a more "traditional" year, they would be looking at the NCAA Tournament right now.
Don't know about basketball, but Northwestern's Denny Green won the B1G football coach of the year award in 1982 after going 3-8. A handful of other football coaches (Bill Mallory, Leon Burtnett, John Makovic) have won the award after middling or slightly better seasons. But there's more parity in B1G basketball than football.
Collins and Pitino are likely the front runners simply because of where their programs were and where they are now. Painter made a case for himself by winning the Big Ten by two games a year after losing Hammons, Davis, and Hill. Taylor gets hurt for the season and Smotherman was removed from the team. That is a lot to lose. It does help to have a national player of the year candidate, but the growth and improvement of all of the players has been impressive. Of course, all of that means nothing if he doesn't make some noise in the NCAA tournament. I would like to see atleast an elite 8 run.
It would be great to see a run, but putting these random benchmarks is ridiculous. You realize, going by seeds, if Purdue is a 5 seed, they would be favored to win 1 game in the NCAA Tournament. A 4 seed, you'd be favored to win 2 games.
In what world should we "at least" be making the Elite 8? We haven't sniffed the top 8 all season.
While he got a little too into it for my taste, I also don't blame him given NW's situation. That was such a big game and probably the best atmosphere I've ever seen for a NW basketball game.
If that became a regular thing, it'd get old. But I give him a pass for this game.
This is a great point. When all is said and done, they are really only a couple games better in a weaker conference just like we are. That's why I could make a case for Pitino over Painter but not for Collins. Maybe if they hadn't been swept by Illinois and given the game away at IU in the past few weeks I'd feel differently. We are talking about a team that has lost 6 of its last 9 games.
You keep saying this but "a couple games better" can be the difference between winning out right conference championships and being 4th place. The margins are tight in basketball. That's just how it is.
A couple games better in an equal or improving conference says something to me. In this year's Big Ten compared to last year's Big Ten it doesn't mean very much in my opinion. I don't want to diminish the championship. We are clearly the best team in my opinion. I just don't think the other teams are as good. Not just my opinion either. I posted last year's final polls before the NCAA tournament in another thread and MSU was a top 3 team in both. IU was 10th in both. We were about the same place in both (13th) as we are currently and then both Maryland and Iowa were also ranked in both while Wisconsin was 25th in one and the top team getting votes (ie 26th) in the other. We just don't have that same quality this year. That's why I found it funny that some of these people are still getting upset that I say this year's team and last year's team are very close to the same level. When you look at the polls, they are finishing up in roughly the same place.
Absolutely. Look at NW - they are considered in with a very similar record as last year.
That being said, I do think that NW's season is different this year but a couple wins against middle of the pack Big Ten teams that they didn't have last year. They went 1-5 against the top 5 teams in the Big Ten. I just don't know if that's deserving of COY if you're strictly looking at conference play. If you're looking at the full season, sure I guess. But again, they finished last year 20-11. They finished this year 21-10.
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