BIG questions/problems with Purdue WBB

[MichaelRR]

Against UMich Petree did not play but 11 minutes and was pretty much ineffective even in those minutes -AND we saw Madison Layden return to last years performance level.....

We have 12 games left and we absolutely need to win 8 to have any hope of an NCAA bid, and we have 2 games against IU, one against OSU and at UILL, all pretty likely losses.... we have zero margin for error in the other 8 games, they are all must wins.

We have little to no identity, Courtney Delks (Moses) was very complimentary of UMich and how their coach had built them in her image.... and she also mentioned that Purdue lacked any identity and that she would like to see something from the players that they hate losing, but has not seen it yet.....

Well over halfway through the season and KG just realized we don't play team ball? Things I complained about since game one she is just now trying to address, what was she watching in our first dozen games???? I think making the easy hire of promoting an NAIA coach is starting to bite us in the butt.

So, its your decision, play Petree and let her dominate our offense to the detriment of others, or bench her and try to develop a team identity without Petree hunting shots for herself all the time????

Terry has had two tough games in a row, but still is Purdue's best player across all stats. In the BT top 25 players, Terry is listed 4 times and leads Purdue in Assists, Sto TO ratio, Rebounding, and Steals.

 

[HoopDad317]

Against UMich Petree did not play but 11 minutes and was pretty much ineffective even in those minutes -AND we saw Madison Layden return to last years performance level.....

We have 12 games left and we absolutely need to win 8 to have any hope of an NCAA bid, and we have 2 games against IU, one against OSU and at UILL, all pretty likely losses.... we have zero margin for error in the other 8 games, they are all must wins.

We have little to no identity, Courtney Delks (Moses) was very complimentary of UMich and how their coach had built them in her image.... and she also mentioned that Purdue lacked any identity and that she would like to see something from the players that they hate losing, but has not seen it yet.....

Well over halfway through the season and KG just realized we don't play team ball? Things I complained about since game one she is just now trying to address, what was she watching in our first dozen games???? I think making the easy hire of promoting an NAIA coach is starting to bite us in the butt.

So, its your decision, play Petree and let her dominate our offense to the detriment of others, or bench her and try to develop a team identity without Petree hunting shots for herself all the time????

Terry has had two tough games in a row, but still is Purdue's best player across all stats. In the BT top 25 players, Terry is listed 4 times and leads Purdue in Assists, Sto TO ratio, Rebounding, and Steals.

It’s interesting when asked about Petree KG remarks “there’s a lot that goes into wearing this uniform.” Obvious reference that Petree’s in the dog house. Yet Layden can go MIA when things get rough and it was obvious to us all that KG was mute on the matter. Coaches responding like this, where you infer something negative about one, while protecting the other, could be why this group is imploding. I can see Petree calling out KG for her continual pacification of one, while throwing others under the bus. This is KG’s inexperience showing big time. Have to be able to manage your personnel. It’s ironic that Petree gets benched and Layden decides she feels like showing up. Just my observations….

 

[MichaelRR]

It’s interesting when asked about Petree KG remarks “there’s a lot that goes into wearing this uniform.” Obvious reference that Petree’s in the dog house. Yet Layden can go MIA when things get rough and it was obvious to us all that KG was mute on the matter. Coaches responding like this, where you infer something negative about one, while protecting the other, could be why this group is imploding. I can see Petree calling out KG for her continual pacification of one, while throwing others under the bus. This is KG’s inexperience showing big time. Have to be able to manage your personnel. It’s ironic that Petree gets benched and Layden decides she feels like showing up. Just my observations….

I think its been a problem all year and KG has not managed the locker room with this team well either season. Last year after the season was over we hear about locker room dissent and it was inferred Moore was the problem. (not happy playing behind golden girl Hardin) This year we have had definite chemistry issues all along, but it takes until game 16 for the coach to start trying to address it.... She claimed Hardin hasn't been shooting the ball well as justification for pulling her, but Hardin is hitting a better percentage than last season and only a little worse than the pre-conference season.... so did KG not ever actually look at the stats before this week or is it cover for something else? So much about this game and the way personnel were managed and responded point to a team in massive disarray and a coach that is only now noticing it. I would like to know a lot more about the Petree vs Layden issue, and why it was left to fester so long... but we will likely never know. KG finally acknowledged what I have been saying for the last 18 months, Hardin is not a good defender, and apparently she threw Petree under that bus as well.

 

[GemstateBoiler]

Yes, I feel doom may be on the horizon for the rest of the season. I hope I am wrong and some Nested Do Loop can be found within our team.

Sorry for the Fortran analogy.

Go Boilers!

 

[purduedavie]

Also, I find it odd that the Frosh don’t play at all, both top 100 (lower end) girls that don’t sniff the court. Stoddard is an athlete, at the least she should have been redshirted if there was no shot of playing her.

 

[MichaelRR]

Also, I find it odd that the Frosh don’t play at all, both top 100 (lower end) girls that don’t sniff the court. Stoddard is an athlete, at the least she should have been redshirted if there was no shot of playing her.

Zero sum game, we already play 9 players around double digits, any minutes the frosh would get take away from someone else.... who do you want to strip minutes from for each of them?

 

[HoopDad317]

Zero sum game, we already play 9 players around double digits, any minutes the frosh would get take away from someone else.... who do you want to strip minutes from for each of them?

I agree. Most freshmen don’t play much their freshman year across the board, in a majority of programs. Emphasis is placed on getting stronger physically and adjustment to speed of the game. While frustrating to them I am sure, I think we have to stick with experienced players if we hope to get to just the NIT.

 

[MichaelRR]

I agree. Most freshmen don’t play much their freshman year across the board, in a majority of programs. Emphasis is placed on getting stronger physically and adjustment to speed of the game. While frustrating to them I am sure, I think we have to stick with experienced players if we hope to get to just the NIT.

Just for Doc:

I am sure this was just a couple of setbacks before we start an epic 21 game winning streak and everything will be awesome and there is nothing to worry about.....

 

[purduedavie]

Zero sum game, we already play 9 players around double digits, any minutes the frosh would get take away from someone else.... who do you want to strip minutes from for each of them?

I’ve watched Woltman, Give Stoddard some minutes, as for Potts, Give her some minutes, Painter sure had no problems throwing his Frosh guards to the wolves. It would be different if the players were killing it, they look terrible lately, maybe putting some new blood in will wake them up.

 

[purduedavie]

Just for Doc:

I am sure this was just a couple of setbacks before we start an epic 21 game winning streak and everything will be awesome and there is nothing to worry about.....

Also, you made a post yesterday about the horrors if players like Woltman and Terry play a 5th year elsewhere next season, I’m sorry, if there’s no tourney appearance what’s the big deal if they leave? Purdue has a pretty old/experienced team, I’m sorry, another year in the NIT shouldn’t make anyone worry about if they’ll be here next season. I hope they turn this around, however, after watching last night I don’t see them beating many teams above them.

 

[MichaelRR]

Also, you made a post yesterday about the horrors if players like Woltman and Terry play a 5th year elsewhere next season, I’m sorry, if there’s no tourney appearance what’s the big deal if they leave? Purdue has a pretty old/experienced team, I’m sorry, another year in the NIT shouldn’t make anyone worry about if they’ll be here next season. I hope they turn this around, however, after watching last night I don’t see them beating many teams above them.

Difference in winning 18 games or 8 IMO.

 

[purduedavie]

Difference in winning 18 games or 8 IMO.

It depends on who they would get to replace them. Woltman has been here 4 years, I don’t see much from her, this is not a dis, just don’t think she’s very good. As for Terry, she’s a flawed player, she can’t shoot, and in my opinion isn’t that athletic. I’m sorry 3-12 the last two games with 11 or 12 turnovers is inexcusable. I’m not saying she should be benched, however, not sure that warrants 30 minutes a game. Maybe Potts isn’t ready, however, it’s odd that she gets zero minutes. If she can’t play a second on this team perhaps it’s time to question why she was recruited and flipped to Purdue? Purdue’s mens team starts two Frosh in the backcourt, Smith wasn’t a top 100 recruit.

 

[MichaelRR]

It depends on who they would get to replace them. Woltman has been here 4 years, I don’t see much from her, this is not a dis, just don’t think she’s very good. As for Terry, she’s a flawed player, she can’t shoot, and in my opinion isn’t that athletic. I’m sorry 3-12 the last two games with 11 or 12 turnovers is inexcusable. I’m not saying she should be benched, however, not sure that warrants 30 minutes a game. Maybe Potts isn’t ready, however, it’s odd that she gets zero minutes. If she can’t play a second on this team perhaps it’s time to question why she was recruited and flipped to Purdue? Purdue’s mens team starts two Frosh in the backcourt, Smith wasn’t a top 100 recruit.

A) the men have better talent around the frosh. B) the talent in the men's games is still much deeper than the women's. C) I don't disagree with you that Terry is a flawed player, but I don't see ANYONE better than her on the team right now.

Exactly who had looked good in both of the last two games? Certainly none of the starters, and I mean all 7 that have started the last two games... Learn didn't exactly impress against UMich..... And who picks up all the slack from Terry's contributions, and why aren't they doing it now? There are certainly many better players in wbball than Terry, but I don't think any of them are on our roster

 

[purduedavie]

A) the men have better talent around the frosh. B) the talent in the men's games is still much deeper than the women's. C) I don't disagree with you that Terry is a flawed player, but I don't see ANYONE better than her on the team right now.

Exactly who had looked good in both of the last two games? Certainly none of the starters, and I mean all 7 that have started the last two games... Learn didn't exactly impress against UMich..... And who picks up all the slack from Terry's contributions, and why aren't they doing it now? There are certainly many better players in wbball than Terry, but I don't think any of them are on our roster

They all looked lost, the thing that bothered me was Michigan got most of the loose balls, I didn’t see much fight. I’ve been optimistic about this team, that Mich game really made me rethink that. Also, this is not a cut down on the girls as people, I’m sure they’re great kids and ambassadors of the university. However, this team is pretty old, if some elect to take their 5th year elsewhere so be it. Purdue needs a step up in recruiting, team needs top 25-50 players, those in the 80-100 range are fine but not likely to compete for Big Ten titles.

 

[MichaelRR]

They all looked lost, the thing that bothered me was Michigan got most of the loose balls, I didn’t see much fight. I’ve been optimistic about this team, that Mich game really made me rethink that. Also, this is not a cut down on the girls as people, I’m sure they’re great kids and ambassadors of the university. However, this team is pretty old, if some elect to take their 5th year elsewhere so be it. Purdue needs a step up in recruiting, team needs top 25-50 players, those in the 80-100 range are fine but not likely to compete for Big Ten titles.

I agree with all of the above. BUT I still think we're be a better team with Woltman starting at center and Harper at PF. If Potts can do half of what Terry does and is sitting behind Hardin and Smith, then talent on the floor is a far less of an issue than talent at the coaching staff level. Save with Stoddard and Woltman. I've seen from the start this wasn't an NCAA team, and have tried moderating my criticism until others caught up to that realization. Every problem that has become glaringly obvious in the last two games had been there from the start of the season.

 

[GemstateBoiler]

I agree with all of the above. BUT I still think we're be a better team with Woltman starting at center and Harper at PF. If Potts can do half of what Terry does and is sitting behind Hardin and Smith, then talent on the floor is a far less of an issue than talent at the coaching staff level. Save with Stoddard and Woltman. I've seen from the start this wasn't an NCAA team, and have tried moderating my criticism until others caught up to that realization. Every problem that has become glaringly obvious in the last two games had been there from the start of the season.

They have actually surprised me at times this year, like vs Texas A & M and Oklahoma State, but that was then and this is now. I'll say it again, they can be agonizing to watch. I still do it though, but I like fingernails on chalkboards also..............
...........Someone is going to ask what is a chalkboard. Rrrr.

 

[MichaelRR]

They have actually surprised me at times this year, like vs Texas A & M and Oklahoma State, but that was then and this is now. I'll say it again, they can be agonizing to watch. I still do it though, but I like fingernails on chalkboards also..............
...........Someone is going to ask what is a chalkboard. Rrrr.

OkSt and TxA&M aren't that good of teams, neither has much of a prayer of making the dance. You can make lots of mistakes and look good against worse opponents

 

[GemstateBoiler]

OkSt and TxA&M aren't that good of teams, neither has much of a prayer of making the dance. You can make lots of mistakes and look good against worse opponents

A & M isn't, but I think I did just see Oklahoma State beat Baylor two days ago, and they are 12 and 4 this year. That said, they aren't top 25 teams though, so I get your point.

 

[purduedavie]

They have actually surprised me at times this year, like vs Texas A & M and Oklahoma State, but that was then and this is now. I'll say it again, they can be agonizing to watch. I still do it though, but I like fingernails on chalkboards also..............
...........Someone is going to ask what is a chalkboard. Rrrr.

Yep, they look like they’re stuck in mud many times, they’re slow and lumbering. Going forward, athleticism has to improve, good Big Ten teams will eat them alive. Let’s hope this was their down stretch, most teams go thru it, we’ll see if they can bounce back.

 

[MichaelRR]

A & M isn't, but I think I did just see Oklahoma State beat Baylor two days ago, and they are 12 and 4 this year. That said, they aren't top 25 teams though, so I get your point.

OkSt got skull drug by both KSU and KU, one at home... But Baylor with their bargain basement coach has played sporadically all year, so take this as more of an indictment against BU's poor coaching than a sign OkSt is anything more than mediocre

 

[GemstateBoiler]

OkSt got skull drug by both KSU and KU, one at home... But Baylor with their bargain basement coach has played sporadically all year, so take this as more of an indictment against BU's poor coaching than a sign OkSt is anything more than mediocre

I can't stand Baylor's coach and her drama. I don't know how she continues to get good recruits with that. I don't know that she would be considered a poor coach though since she has history of producing good teams over the years. And then again my point was, especially after our last two games, I'm surprised we beat these teams even if they weren't all stellar programs this year, because we are not close either. I could include Syracuse as a surprise also, since they have a decent record this year. Onward.

 

[MichaelRR]

A & M isn't, but I think I did just see Oklahoma State beat Baylor two days ago, and they are 12 and 4 this year. That said, they aren't top 25 teams though, so I get your point.

OkSt got skull drug by both KSU and KU, one at home... But Baylor with their bargain basement coach has played sporadically all year, so take this as more of an indictment against BU's poor coaching than a sign OkSt is anything more than

I can't stand Baylor's coach and her drama. I don't know how she continues to get good recruits with that. I don't know that she would be considered a poor coach though since she has history of producing good teams over the years. And then again my point was, especially after our last two games, I'm surprised we beat these teams even if they weren't all stellar programs this year, because we are not close either. I could include Syracuse as a surprise also, since they have a decent record this year. Onward.

Kim Mulkey is in her first year at LSU... She was told to leave as Baylor could no longer afford her services. They then hired Collen(sp?) for about 10% of what they had been paying Mulkey

 

[GemstateBoiler]

OkSt got skull drug by both KSU and KU, one at home... But Baylor with their bargain basement coach has played sporadically all year, so take this as more of an indictment against BU's poor coaching than a sign OkSt is anything more than

Kim Mulkey is in her first year at LSU... She was told to leave as Baylor could no longer afford her services. They then hired Collen(sp?) for about 10% of what they had been paying Mulkey

Yep, you are right. I forgot that. Actually the new coach has Purdue ties.

 

[purduedavie]

OkSt got skull drug by both KSU and KU, one at home... But Baylor with their bargain basement coach has played sporadically all year, so take this as more of an indictment against BU's poor coaching than a sign OkSt is anything more than

Kim Mulkey is in her first year at LSU... She was told to leave as Baylor could no longer afford her services. They then hired Collen(sp?) for about 10% of what they had been paying Mulkey

Baylor’s AD and Mulkey couldn’t stand each other, I think that probably has more to do with her being gone than money. Mulkey might be a great Coach, as a person not a fan at all.

 

[MichaelRR]

Baylor’s AD and Mulkey couldn’t stand each other, I think that probably has more to do with her being gone than money. Mulkey might be a great Coach, as a person not a fan at all.

Baylor had a 16 or so million dollar shortfall and Mulkey was an easy place to save 2 million. Baylor is pulling in it's horns on many fronts. If they had the money, no way they let her go to LSU with a free release just to get out of her contact

 

[MichaelRR]

Another new lineup, more confusing substitutions and combinations on the floor, and Petree and Harper both continue to struggle. NU lost to us, because I don't think with our execution we could have beaten any other BT team today. Other than Ellis, Smith and Terry, shooting was sporadic and for long stretches, no one else would shoot. Petree went 1-5... Harper played 16 minutes, got 4 points, 4 fouls, and only 1 rb...... that is pretty poor from your starting post player. I don't think this team has regrouped yet, and the next few games could be VERY ugly.

 

[tjreese]

They have actually surprised me at times this year, like vs Texas A & M and Oklahoma State, but that was then and this is now. I'll say it again, they can be agonizing to watch. I still do it though, but I like fingernails on chalkboards also..............
...........Someone is going to ask what is a chalkboard. Rrrr.

Fortran...chalkboard???? you are old!

 

[GemstateBoiler]

Fortran...chalkboard???? you are old!

Yep, but I'm successful and have left my daughters a good life for their families, my friend . I agree, I am an old fart.. Just play'n with you.

 

[GemstateBoiler]

Another new lineup, more confusing substitutions and combinations on the floor, and Petree and Harper both continue to struggle. NU lost to us, because I don't think with our execution we could have beaten any other BT team today. Other than Ellis, Smith and Terry, shooting was sporadic and for long stretches, no one else would shoot. Petree went 1-5... Harper played 16 minutes, got 4 points, 4 fouls, and only 1 rb...... that is pretty poor from your starting post player. I don't think this team has regrouped yet, and the next few games could be VERY ugly.

But a win is a win. Being supportive, I'm stoked they won.

Go Boilers!

 

[MichaelRR]

But a win is a win. Being supportive, I'm stoked they won.

Go Boilers!

winning an ugly game you did not execute well in is better than losing one like that for sure.... but that execution level won't beat Nebraska

 

[GemstateBoiler]

winning an ugly game you did not execute well in is better than losing one like that for sure.... but that execution level won't beat Nebraska

Agreed, but it is our team. I still think it is better than the end of the SV era. Baby steps are best for me at present so I give some waiver. I was around when we won the NC so I cringe now, but I still want to envision new horizons can happen. Just my feelings. Go Boilers!

 

[BoilerRingside]

winning an ugly game you did not execute well in is better than losing one like that for sure.... but that execution level won't beat Nebraska

Such a Grinch.

Please find something that brings you joy... Other than endless complaints about a program/staff/players you clearly don't have any true insight on aside from being a lazyboy coach.

 

[purduedavie]

Such a Grinch.

Please find something that brings you joy... Other than endless complaints about a program/staff/players you clearly don't have any true insight on aside from being a lazyboy coach.

Michael sure takes the women’s program seriously. I want them to win but the men are the team I truly care about. As for the women, small steps, my goal was 20 wins, my guess is that doesn’t happen, maybe 17-18ish?

 

[JeffBoiler]

I bought tickets earlier today (Saturday) for the IU game on Feb 5. Haven’t been to a WBB game at Mackey for a loooong time - like 15 years maybe. I’ll be anxious to see how they look in person (energy, body language, etc).

Last year’s game was one of their absolute best of the season - IIRC, they took IU to OT. Haven’t seen that level of play from them this year and it’s disappointing as I thought they would show at least some incremental improvement. Careless, sloppy play seems to have re-established itself lately.

Good to see Ellis with a nice game today. Glad she got the start - love her energy and motor.

 

[DocRon]

Such a Grinch.

Please find something that brings you joy... Other than endless complaints about a program/staff/players you clearly don't have any true insight on aside from being a lazyboy coach.

I partially agree with you. His constant negative take on almost everything is so tiresome. But he does, for me at least, provide some insight at times. I guess he is what he is.
_____________________

 

[MichaelRR]

I bought tickets earlier today (Saturday) for the IU game on Feb 5. Haven’t been to a WBB game at Mackey for a loooong time - like 15 years maybe. I’ll be anxious to see how they look in person (energy, body language, etc).

Last year’s game was one of their absolute best of the season - IIRC, they took IU to OT. Haven’t seen that level of play from them this year and it’s disappointing as I thought they would show at least some incremental improvement. Careless, sloppy play seems to have re-established itself lately.

Good to see Ellis with a nice game today. Glad she got the start - love her energy and motor.

IU was without their starting center and starting PG last year at Mackey on a team that only played 7 players meaningful minutes...... It was not that we played up to their level, it was they were playing with one hand tied behind their backs playing without their leading scorer, rebounder, assist leader, steals leader and team captains.

 

[MichaelRR]

Michael sure takes the women’s program seriously. I want them to win but the men are the team I truly care about. As for the women, small steps, my goal was 20 wins, my guess is that doesn’t happen, maybe 17-18ish?

This team is literally the only sports team I follow anymore, once the men's game started emulating the punking and dunking style of the NBA with all two man games and clear outs I lost all interest. College football is so corrupt that I cannot watch without feeling dirty for supporting it.


No I am not all wine and roses.... and anyone who doesn't know that by now isn't too bright. If you don't want critical analysis that may hurt your sensitive feelings, I suggest you don't read me. This is, or at least used to be, a high profile college program that inspire(s)(d) strong emotions. This is not a biddy ball league where you just want them to be happy and have fun. Stop treating this team like little girls that need protecting and recognize them for the high profile athletes they are, which comes with the same levels of criticism as the men..... IF that statement offends you, you are sexist and need to sit down and think about your attitude long and hard. I am so sick of the condescending attitudes towards our team, "stop picking on them they are just girls"....

 

[HoopDad317]

I bought tickets earlier today (Saturday) for the IU game on Feb 5. Haven’t been to a WBB game at Mackey for a loooong time - like 15 years maybe. I’ll be anxious to see how they look in person (energy, body language, etc).

Last year’s game was one of their absolute best of the season - IIRC, they took IU to OT. Haven’t seen that level of play from them this year and it’s disappointing as I thought they would show at least some incremental improvement. Careless, sloppy play seems to have re-established itself lately.

Good to see Ellis with a nice game today. Glad she got the start - love her energy and motor.

Ellis plays with a ton of energy and a high motor. Really like watching her play. She does try to do too much at times but I imagine she might get tired of the lack of emotion and effort from others. She seems to enjoy the game.

 

[purduedavie]

This team is literally the only sports team I follow anymore, once the men's game started emulating the punking and dunking style of the NBA with all two man games and clear outs I lost all interest. College football is so corrupt that I cannot watch without feeling dirty for supporting it.


No I am not all wine and roses.... and anyone who doesn't know that by now isn't too bright. If you don't want critical analysis that may hurt your sensitive feelings, I suggest you don't read me. This is, or at least used to be, a high profile college program that inspire(s)(d) strong emotions. This is not a biddy ball league where you just want them to be happy and have fun. Stop treating this team like little girls that need protecting and recognize them for the high profile athletes they are, which comes with the same levels of criticism as the men..... IF that statement offends you, you are sexist and need to sit down and think about your attitude long and hard. I am so sick of the condescending attitudes towards our team, "stop picking on them they are just girls"....

Hmmn, to each their own, not sure how anyone could enjoy watching a womens game more than a men’s game. The turnovers and below the rim play isn’t my thing, you’re missing a fun Boiler team. I do root for the women and watch, however, at times it’s really difficult, the play is slow, boring, sloppy for much of many games.

 

[purduedavie]

I know it’s the women’s board but what a huge win today, screw Sparty and Izzo!