Backcourt outlook vs pre-season?

What was your mid case outlook for this backcourt pre-season?


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northside100

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Ok, time to fess up, how good did you think this backcourt would be prior to the start of the season? I'll lead, I wasn't as nervous as many as I was confident that Newman and Morton would be solid and that Jenkins would be playable, so anything from the freshmen would be gravy. Overall I had the backcourt as middle of the pack in the Big Ten, outside of the top third of the conference as a ceiling but better than the bottom quarter as a floor.

I think there's a lot left to learn about this group over a full season, but my view is now that their floor is the top half of the conference and if they continue to improve could be one of the best backcourts in the B10. It will be interesting to see if those who predicted this to be one of the worst backcourts in the conference to come clean here.
 
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Jan 30, 2003
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I thought we’d be okay with Newman, Morton and Jenkins with Loyer and Smith being typical freshmen. So I guess middle of the pack. But when I started hearing good things from the coaches and players about Smith and Loyer I trusted that they knew what they were talking about. I usually watch and wait before I think one way or the other about a Purdue team.
 

Wolegib

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northside, you should have stepped on the wolegib bandwagon. I posted about 20 million times that freshmen can start and actually be good. and that they do so on many top 10 teams. so why not Purdue. I also said Painter looks for somebody to provide an outside offense scoring option. Where's my back, so I can pat it?

You lost your focus and zeroed in on my tkr comments. Two years ago, I speculated Newman might consider transferring based on his lack of use. Purdue and NCAA history dictates when somebody succeeds, somebody will be the odd man out. to predict success, is it not reasonable to also predict failure?
 

mathboy

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northside, you should have stepped on the wolegib bandwagon. I posted about 20 million times that freshmen can start and actually be good. and that they do so on many top 10 teams. so why not Purdue. I also said Painter looks for somebody to provide an outside offense scoring option. Where's my back, so I can pat it?

You lost your focus and zeroed in on my tkr comments. Two years ago, I speculated Newman might consider transferring based on his lack of use. Purdue and NCAA history dictates when somebody succeeds, somebody will be the odd man out. to predict success, is it not reasonable to also predict failure?
We know, we know, it's all about you. Maybe you could give the Wolegib bandwagon a rest? I got to call you out on this post.

We all remember your early season posts about the team. I would recommend you maintain a lower profile and be a spit more accurate about what you claim to have said. I remember your TKR comments. How about your Smith comments? Morton comments? Newman comments? Jenkins comments? You have been pretty strong on negative comments about most of these players, and now you want to tell us how we should all be on your bandwagon??? WTF? Why do you still think someone is going to transfer out? Will you be pleased if they do since it justifies YOUR speculation? There is a reason a few guys have put you on ignore.

:cool:
 

northside100

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northside, you should have stepped on the wolegib bandwagon. I posted about 20 million times that freshmen can start and actually be good. and that they do so on many top 10 teams. so why not Purdue. I also said Painter looks for somebody to provide an outside offense scoring option. Where's my back, so I can pat it?

You lost your focus and zeroed in on my tkr comments. Two years ago, I speculated Newman might consider transferring based on his lack of use. Purdue and NCAA history dictates when somebody succeeds, somebody will be the odd man out. to predict success, is it not reasonable to also predict failure?
You have confused me once again. Did you say that in general freshmen can start and be good or did you say that you thought that Loyer and Smith would form an excellent backcourt as freshmen? I can buy that you said the former. I don't have any recollection of the latter, but if you actually said that I would happily say that I'm impressed.
 

Do Dah Day

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Nov 8, 2015
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We know, we know, it's all about you. Maybe you could give the Wolegib bandwagon a rest? I got to call you out on this post.

We all remember your early season posts about the team. I would recommend you maintain a lower profile and be a spit more accurate about what you claim to have said. I remember your TKR comments. How about your Smith comments? Morton comments? Newman comments? Jenkins comments? You have been pretty strong on negative comments about most of these players, and now you want to tell us how we should all be on your bandwagon??? WTF? Why do you still think someone is going to transfer out? Will you be pleased if they do since it justifies YOUR speculation? There is a reason a few guys have put you on ignore.

:cool:
Wolegib's bandwagon has no room for anyone to hop on - it only has one seat and he occupies it.
 

Gemini95

Sophomore
Nov 15, 2012
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Purdue and NCAA history dictates when somebody succeeds, somebody will be the odd man out. to predict success, is it not reasonable to also predict failure?
Success is not zero-sum. Someone might have less success, or success in different areas, but many people would rather be a smaller(but still successful in their own way) part of a successful team than a bigger individual success on a less successful team. By your account someone must be failing bc Smith and Loyer are exceeding expectations. Yet I don't see anyone on the team failing.
 

Boiler Buck

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I remember posting after Austin P where backcourt had 10 points total between the starters....that that was some lower third of B10 basketball. It was. Certainly not pretty. Alot of players were off that game...I don't think Gillis even scored.

But these kids are learning they are growing in confidence into their roles. They are looking like top 1/3 recently. Both are playing great D when compared to our average frosh who can't stay on the court because they just can't D it up. Both are awesome at their roles of late. Smith just took over a couple games lately. Loyer is hitting 3s well. Hopefully, games like AP are way in their rear view mirror.
 

Do Dah Day

All-American
Nov 8, 2015
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Success is not zero-sum. Someone might have less success, or success in different areas, but many people would rather be a smaller(but still successful in their own way) part of a successful team than a bigger individual success on a less successful team. By your account someone must be failing bc Smith and Loyer are exceeding expectations. Yet I don't see anyone on the team failing.
OMFG ... I have him blocked. But for Someone's sake ... who in the hell cares about his ridiculous posts? YES! WHO is failing on this team? WOLEGIB - Name the one~!
 

boilernuke

Sophomore
Jul 10, 2008
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OMFG ... I have him blocked. But for Someone's sake ... who in the hell cares about his ridiculous posts? YES! WHO is failing on this team? WOLEGIB - Name the one~!
I've had him blocked for a long time. Don't know why people waste time reading his mess
 
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Boiler_HD

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Oct 26, 2011
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Middle to top third, honestly depth at PG is my only concern, I don't mean to talk down on Jenkins, but he has been less than stellar at the 1 ( I realize he has played the 2 the majority of this career). Hopefully time and experience with this group will help him become more comfortable.
 

KentuckyBoiler

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Jul 6, 2011
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I like how our freshman guards have come in and performed well. That has been a pleasant surprise, since having an all freshman starting backcourt is usually less than ideal.

I know after the Pack offseason situation that I was worried about our PG play. However, Smith has handled the pressure well, he takes it to the hole, passes extremely well (sometimes he will try to fit into areas that are too tight, but that will improve with experience), and he has a nice pull up shot.

Similar to everyone else, everyone has embraced their roles on this team. Cannot say that was the case all the time last year.
 

mathboy

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I've had him blocked for a long time. Don't know why people waste time reading his mess
Meh. He and Bonefish have been around a while. They are not trolls, just often have a weird take on the team, or on the sport. We get our share of nasty trolls like Coach Geez and others. I dislike them because they are here under false colors. Brigalow and Lenny are Purdue fans, just a bit off center.

:cool:
 
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BoilerAndy

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Meh. He and Bonefish have been around a while. They are not trolls, just often have a weird take on the team, or on the sport. We get our share of nasty trolls like Coach Geez and others. I dislike them because they are here under false colors. Brigalow and Lenny are Purdue fans, just a bit off center.

:cool:
"A bit..." You are a nice person. 😁
 

SCBoiler1

Redshirt Freshman
Feb 10, 2014
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I'll preface by saying that by January we could be ranked number 1 in the country. The schedule until then is really week and our guard play is good enough when paired with Edey for us to win every game the rest of the calendar year.

But I struggle evaluating our guard play. Smith is really good. Loyer is promising but his statistics aren't at Sasha's Jr/Sr level yet. Morton is the glue guy and is distributing the ball really well but his shooting percentages are woeful (29% overall, 16% from three).. We're only shooting 33% from three point land (206th in the country) and our best three point shooter by percentage is Gillis who isn't a guard. Edey is shooting 64% the rest of the team 40%.

What's phenomenal is our opponents are only shooting 37% against us and 24% from three which is 6th in the country. We've played some pretty good teams so we're either doing something right or we've been pretty darn lucky. I guess time we'll tell.
 
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johnboiler123

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Jul 23, 2020
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Middle to top third, honestly depth at PG is my only concern, I don't mean to talk down on Jenkins, but he has been less than stellar at the 1 ( I realize he has played the 2 the majority of this career). Hopefully time and experience with this group will help him become more comfortable.
Have to agree. Has been the weak link in the offense so far. Also seems to play outside of the offense a lot when he tries to score, which leads to bad shots.
 

mathboy

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Jenkins is a great ball handler. He ran the W.Va. press into the ground. I recall one of the WV guards sliding on his ass while trying to keep up with Jenkins’s drive down the center of the court. He was also instrumental in handling the Duke press at the end of the game. He doesn’t will the team to win as much as Smith, but his role is to give Smith enough rest that he finishes strong. That’s the absolute key to our winning out.

:cool:
 

Boiler Buck

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I'll preface by saying that by January we could be ranked number 1 in the country. The schedule until then is really week and our guard play is good enough when paired with Edey for us to win every game the rest of the calendar year.

But I struggle evaluating our guard play. Smith is really good. Loyer is promising but his statistics aren't at Sasha's Jr/Sr level yet. Morton is the glue guy and is distributing the ball really well but his shooting percentages are woeful (29% overall, 16% from three).. We're only shooting 33% from three point land (206th in the country) and our best three point shooter by percentage is Gillis who isn't a guard. Edey is shooting 64% the rest of the team 40%.

What's phenomenal is our opponents are only shooting 37% against us and 24% from three which is 6th in the country. We've played some pretty good teams so we're either doing something right or we've been pretty darn lucky. I guess time we'll tell.

We have a very good team. However the shooting percentages show me why we are over ranked. VA for example has at least 4 guys shooting threes @ 40-50%, the whole team shoots 45% from 3.....to compare to another team ranked similarly. Note I know nothing about VA other than they shoot well....they could be over ranked too??

I am very encouraged by the rebounding & the defensive numbers,and the improved PG play over a typical Purdue team.... but it takes a high scoring team that can knock down 3s to win in the end. Perhaps, this team improves it's shooting and it's a moot point, but right now that is a team flaw.
 
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mathboy

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We have a very good team. However the shooting percentages show me why we are over ranked. VA for example has at least 4 guys shooting threes @ 40-50%, the whole team shoots 45% from 3.....to compare to another team ranked similarly. Note I know nothing about VA other than they shoot well....they could be over ranked too??

I am very encouraged by the rebounding & the defensive numbers,and the improved PG play over a typical Purdue team.... but it takes a high scoring team that can knock down 3s to win in the end. Perhaps, this team improves it's shooting and it's a moot point, but right now that is a team flaw.
Understandable caution. I agree. However, I think Virginia’s high stats might be a factor of who they have played, and where they played them. West Virginia, Gonzaga, and FSU (played away from home nets) are well known for their overall defense, including defense against the 3-pt shot through their pressure on the ball. Could it be our shooting stats are a reflection of who we played as well?

:cool:
 

Boiler Buck

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Understandable caution. I agree. However, I think Virginia’s high stats might be a factor of who they have played, and where they played them. West Virginia, Gonzaga, and FSU (played away from home nets) are well known for their overall defense, including defense against the 3-pt shot through their pressure on the ball. Could it be our shooting stats are a reflection of who we played as well?

:cool:

Noted. I saw VA barely survive today against FSU on VA homecourt. Did not see game so don't know how they shot.

Purdue still good top 10 team imo......We will take our lumps in B10 like everyone else..... hopefully our frosh don't hit a wall & we take less lumps than 13 others.
 

BoilerAndy

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Aug 31, 2010
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Understandable caution. I agree. However, I think Virginia’s high stats might be a factor of who they have played, and where they played them. West Virginia, Gonzaga, and FSU (played away from home nets) are well known for their overall defense, including defense against the 3-pt shot through their pressure on the ball. Could it be our shooting stats are a reflection of who we played as well?

:cool:
And Virginia is a veteran team. I'll wait until the Purdue guys play together and are in mid-season form before I decide what their weaknesses are.
 
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Mar 25, 2022
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Ok, time to fess up, how good did you think this backcourt would be prior to the start of the season? I'll lead, I wasn't as nervous as many as I was confident that Newman and Morton would be solid and that Jenkins would be playable, so anything from the freshmen would be gravy. Overall I had the backcourt as middle of the pack in the Big Ten, outside of the top third of the conference as a ceiling but better than the bottom quarter as a floor.

I think there's a lot left to learn about this group over a full season, but my view is now that their floor is the top half of the conference and if they continue to improve could be one of the best backcourts in the B10. It will be interesting to see if those who predicted this to be one of the worst backcourts in the conference to come clean here.
I’m not one for rankings but when I saw the freshman do the big thing in my mind break the press and score I’m okay with them
 

Boileratthebeach

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Oct 14, 2011
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Noted. I saw VA barely survive today against FSU on VA homecourt. Did not see game so don't know how they shot.

Purdue still good top 10 team imo......We will take our lumps in B10 like everyone else..... hopefully our frosh don't hit a wall & we take less lumps than 13 others.
OR despite shooting woefully the team is 7-0 AND then imagine what this team looks like if they start shooting the ball like we know they are capable of doing...
 
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mathboy

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If Jameel Brown had stayed with Purdue, Painter almost certainly would not have offered Smith.

Brown is averaging 1.0 pt, 1.3 rebs, and 0.0 assists for a 6-2 team.
Sometimes it is good to be lucky. On the other hand, maybe Brown would have much better stats on Purdue's team where we have shooters and big time scorers. You can't set an assist if the other guy doesn't score.
 

BoilerAndy

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Sometimes it is good to be lucky. On the other hand, maybe Brown would have much better stats on Purdue's team where we have shooters and big time scorers. You can't set an assist if the other guy doesn't score.
I like the total package that Smith offers. If the other players aren't scoring, he may not get his assists, but he'll pick up the scoring slack. At 1.0 ppg, Brown doesn't appear to be there yet.
 

northside100

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If Jameel Brown had stayed with Purdue, Painter almost certainly would not have offered Smith.

Brown is averaging 1.0 pt, 1.3 rebs, and 0.0 assists for a 6-2 team.
Do you think that's true? Very different players at different positions. I think it would have meant over signing at the time but I believe Purdue ended up having an extra scholarship heading into this year.
 

BoilerAndy

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Brown was recruited to play PG. He's a combo guard in the mold of Painter's typical PG recruits. As Mathboy stated, Brown's decommitment and Smith being available was a "gift".
 

dwhitebash11

Redshirt Freshman
Oct 15, 2011
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We honestly have the best complimentary backcourts in the nation. Alone they're not as great, although still good, but put Edey in the mix, and we are, to this point, the best team in the nation with the best player in the nation and the best back court that could compliment him in the nation.

Prove me wrong
 

BoilerAndy

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Aug 31, 2010
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We honestly have the best complimentary backcourts in the nation. Alone they're not as great, although still good, but put Edey in the mix, and we are, to this point, the best team in the nation with the best player in the nation and the best back court that could compliment him in the nation.

Prove me wrong
Hoping this team proves you right.
 

mathboy

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We honestly have the best complimentary backcourts in the nation. Alone they're not as great, although still good, but put Edey in the mix, and we are, to this point, the best team in the nation with the best player in the nation and the best back court that could compliment him in the nation.

Prove me wrong
I just don’t watch enough other teams to know if you are right. There are good backcourts all over the NCAA. Some we will match up well with, others not so well. Much depends on skill sets, size and athleticism.

:cool:
 

BoilerAndy

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Ok, time to fess up, how good did you think this backcourt would be prior to the start of the season? I'll lead, I wasn't as nervous as many as I was confident that Newman and Morton would be solid and that Jenkins would be playable, so anything from the freshmen would be gravy. Overall I had the backcourt as middle of the pack in the Big Ten, outside of the top third of the conference as a ceiling but better than the bottom quarter as a floor.

I think there's a lot left to learn about this group over a full season, but my view is now that their floor is the top half of the conference and if they continue to improve could be one of the best backcourts in the B10. It will be interesting to see if those who predicted this to be one of the worst backcourts in the conference to come clean here.
I was cautiously optimistic, but I would not have expected the 2 freshmen to start and each average >3 assists per game. Historically, 3 apg was the ceiling for a senior Purdue PG.