B1G is down?

[Boilermaker]

This has been raised in a few threads this season and I’m interested in what Boiler Nation has to say about it. I think because neither UM, MSU, OSU, or IU is “at the top” gives some conference fans that impression (go no further than IMSKRONG’s opinion).

Does this impression, true or false as it may be, exist nationally as other historically strong school’s are not littering the top 10?

Is it a Purdue at #1 thing? If Purdue gets to be #1 several more times in the current future do they begin getting lumped into the conversation of what makes a year “strong”?

Or would Purdue have to make the F4 or even the championship game 2+ times before they achieve general consensus as a “strong” team in regards to when a year is considered up or down?

Or is it how many future 1st round NBA players you have? How many NBA all-stars? Margin of victories to go along with your win record? Quantity of alley-oop or windmill dunk highlights that make it on TV? Or maybe some combo of all of the above?

Gonzaga not that long ago used to be an afterthought, as did Duke in many’s living memories. Going back a bit further (still in living memories) most of the “Blue Bloods” weren’t very blue.

If this year in college basketball is indeed down, and maybe NIL and the portal have inexorably altered the landscape, will there be new school names on the list of what defines an up year? Or perhaps it will now vary so much that the old paradigm is forever broken (i.e. there will no longer be enough consistency to identify a set of schools that define an up year)?

I know I’ve asked a lot of questions (as is my way 😜) but curious what you all think, even the IU lurkers.

 

[Dryfly88]

Most every bracket has PU as a #1 seed. Rutgers is a #5 seed right now. That is a down year if it holds until March.

 

[Poprudy]

This has been raised in a few threads this season and I’m interested in what Boiler Nation has to say about it. I think because neither UM, MSU, OSU, or IU is “at the top” gives some conference fans that impression (go no further than IMSKRONG’s opinion).

Does this impression, true or false as it may be, exist nationally as other historically strong school’s are not littering the top 10?

Is it a Purdue at #1 thing? If Purdue gets to be #1 several more times in the current future do they begin getting lumped into the conversation of what makes a year “strong”?

Or would Purdue have to make the F4 or even the championship game 2+ times before they achieve general consensus as a “strong” team in regards to when a year is considered up or down?

Or is it how many future 1st round NBA players you have? How many NBA all-stars? Margin of victories to go along with your win record? Quantity of alley-oop or windmill dunk highlights that make it on TV? Or maybe some combo of all of the above?

Gonzaga not that long ago used to be an afterthought, as did Duke in many’s living memories. Going back a bit further (still in living memories) most of the “Blue Bloods” weren’t very blue.

If this year in college basketball is indeed down, and maybe NIL and the portal have inexorably altered the landscape, will there be new school names on the list of what defines an up year? Or perhaps it will now vary so much that the old paradigm is forever broken (i.e. there will no longer be enough consistency to identify a set of schools that define an up year)?

I know I’ve asked a lot of questions (as is my way 😜) but curious what you all think, even the IU lurkers.

I believe it's only a down year, because of the early B1G predictions. SI actually had Purdue as the 'dark horse'.

IU, Illinois, MSU and OSU are starting to become the teams that many predicted.... unpredictable. Unfortunately, when you're getting that from the top of your conference it looks like a down year.

That's why Purdue is the 'Cream' of the B1G. We have been the most consistent team this year from the start. Could that change in the next few weeks, sure......just don't see it.

 

[purduepat1969]

Most every bracket has PU as a #1 seed. Rutgers is a #5 seed right now. That is a down year if it holds until March.

Yet some of the top ranked teams from the Big 12 and SEC fell to unranked teams yesterday (Alabama, TCU, Iowa St, Auburn). So is it overrating teams from the other conferences or underrating the B1G? Because Purdue handled the top rated teams in non-conference with little issue. Teams like West Virginia, who beat Auburn yesterday.

 

[Poprudy]

Yet some of the top ranked teams from the Big 12 and SEC fell to unranked teams yesterday (Alabama, TCU, Iowa St, Auburn). So is it overrating teams from the other conferences or underrating the B1G? Because Purdue handled the top rated teams in non-conference with little issue. Teams like West Virginia, who beat Auburn yesterday.

Throw in Marquette and the Zags.

 

[SunnyFL24]

Still a lot of games to be played for some to give impressions before tourney picks!!! And what a wide open tourney it will be!!AL crapping the bed was a shocker!! Nice if Psu knocks off Rutgers today for more separation! IL making a run now....all their new Portal arrivals starting to gel! IU scarring me a bit more.... unfortunately looking real impressive as of late ...... 3rd best shooting percentage in nation! Gonna be a tough battle next Saturday to come out with a win! I know Edey talked about not getting into foul trouble....but we're gonna need him huge on that side of the ball so TJD doesn't go off on us!

 

[rgarlitz]

Both Warren Nolan and Jeff Sagarin have the BIG as the #2 conference behind the BXII. I think Pomeroy also does conference-level analysis in the pay portion of his site. Sagarin sees a significant gap between the B1G and the BXII, but he also had a similar gap between the B1G and the Big East/SEC, with the Pac12 and ACC even farther back. Just FYI: Sagarin has the American #8.

In my mind, thst doesn't really qualify as "down." Definitely not dominant, but not down, either.

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[titaniumbolt]

Tie between "Down" and "No different than prior years". Conference has been down for at least 3 years. Last time we had a final four team was 2019...

 

[Chi-Boiler]

I'd say it's down because there is only one "great" team. Usually there are 3-4 teams shooting for top 4 seeds in the tournament. This year we may only get one unless another team finishes strong. Meanwhile the Big 12 will have 7/10 teams in the tournament with a good chance of having 5 of them with Top 4 seeds.

That being said, the B1G's strength is its depth. Going down to 12, there are good teams. Teams that can beat good teams any given night. You really don't have that in the SEC or ACC, both of which have close to the same number of teams. The Big 12 is in another universe this year.

 

[Purdue Grad in Texas]

I'd say it's down because there is only one "great" team. Usually there are 3-4 teams shooting for top 4 seeds in the tournament. This year we may only get one unless another team finishes strong. Meanwhile the Big 12 will have 7/10 teams in the tournament with a good chance of having 5 of them with Top 4 seeds.

That being said, the B1G's strength is its depth. Going down to 12, there are good teams. Teams that can beat good teams any given night. You really don't have that in the SEC or ACC, both of which have close to the same number of teams. The Big 12 is in another universe this year.

Tend to agree - you could see a five and a bunch of 6-10/11 seeds for the conference. Big XII is very strong at the top......long way to go, and we'll see how things look into that second week of the NCAA Tournament.

 

[BoilerAndy]

Saw a graphic yeserday saying the B10 projects to have 8 teams in the NCAA, which is more than any other conference. Not sure I see it. I will say that B10 teams have beaten or played to the wire against top teams in the other conferences.

 

[Chi-Boiler]

Saw a graphic yeserday saying the B10 projects to have 8 teams in the NCAA, which is more than any other conference. Not sure I see it. I will say that B10 teams have beaten or played to the wire against top teams in the other conferences.

It's actually more like 9 according to most.

Purdue - lock
Rutgers - likely
Michigan St - likely
Indinia - likely
Illinois - likely
Northwestern - probable?
Maryland - probable
Iowa - probable
Penn St - probable
Wisconsin - possible
Ohio St - possible
Michigan - unlikely
Nebraska - no
Minnesota - no

 

[Wolegib]

As I look at the BIG 10, I see 12 of 14 teams with a winning record. I believe that’s pretty good

 

[Hatchets7times]

Big is down.
Purdue is up..

 

[Born Boiler]

Nine projected to make the NCAA, more than any other conference. Yeah, down, real down.

 

[BoilerAndy]

With NW and IU in the upper half of the B10, I can understand why some believe the rest of the conference is down. When was the last time that happened?

 

[Boilers424]

I'm okay with the BIG being down, if Purdue is up! We always hear about the Big Ten's struggle in the tournament even though they get 9 teams in the field. I think that's partially because they beat up on each other and get seed lines anywhere from 3 to 12 (which means they aren't expected to go far either). Villanova did well recently because their conference would only get 4-5 teams in and they were they were usually a 1 or 2 seed. If the BIG is down, and Purdue is the only legit team, I'm fine with that because it should be a better path to a 1 seed in the tourney and hopefully getting to a F4.

 

[wallyboiler79]

You can see why some bracket projections have 9 or 10 Big 10 teams in the tournament since Kenpom has 9 Big teams between 19-44 and NET has 9 between 20-53. The same four teams are out of those parameters - Michigan, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Minnesota. But you have believe that a strong finish from Mich. or Wisc. would get them in. So 12 Big teams still with a shot of getting in.

 

[Boiler Buck]

Nine projected to make the NCAA, more than any other conference. Yeah, down, real down.

How they might be seeded might tells truer story.

2021 a up year.... Best 5 seeds...
1,1,2,2,4

2022 a down year...best 5 seeds...
3,3,4,5,7

Other than Purdue (1) where do 23 top 4 seeds project.....5-11. Not sure that can be considered anything but down.

 

[Gemini95]

I wouldn't say BIG is down. I'd say it's more middle-heavy and deep (much like myself). Gonna be several teams seeded 6 to 11 that will be tough outs the first two rounds and probably pull some upsets.

 

[IMSKRONG]

Purdue
Indiana
Rutgers
Northwestern
Michigan State
Illinois

Maryland, Iowa, Penn State have some work to do for sure. Maryland kinda screwed themselves though with such a weak out of conference schedule.

Michigan, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Nebraska and Minnesota are just not in right now. And they are well on the wrong side of the bubble. Michigan, OSU and Wisconsin have a crazy amount of work to do. As of now Lunardi has....

South
1. Purdue
11. Penn State(Play-In, Last Four In)

East
10. Maryland(Last Four Byes)

Midwest
5. Indiana
9. Northwestern

West
5. Illinois
6. Rutgers
7. Michigan State
9. Iowa

 

[Boiler Buck]

Purdue
Indiana
Rutgers
Northwestern
Michigan State
Illinois

Maryland, Iowa, Penn State have some work to do for sure. Maryland kinda screwed themselves though with such a weak out of conference schedule.

Michigan, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Nebraska and Minnesota are just not in right now. And they are well on the wrong side of the bubble. Michigan, OSU and Wisconsin have a crazy amount of work to do. As of now Lunardi has....

South
1. Purdue
11. Penn State(Play-In, Last Four In)

East
10. Maryland(Last Four Byes)

Midwest
5. Indiana
9. Northwestern

West
5. Illinois
6. Rutgers
7. Michigan State
9. Iowa

When your conference (other than Purdue) seeds are 5-11, I don't know how people perceive it as an up year???

 

[typeviic]

It is down for 2 reasons.
1. N'western and Rutgers are near the top.
2. Indinia has beat Wisc, MSU, O$U. 90% of the time, its the other way around.

 

[GoldandBlackintheSaddleAgain]

Purdue
Indiana
Rutgers
Northwestern
Michigan State
Illinois

Maryland, Iowa, Penn State have some work to do for sure. Maryland kinda screwed themselves though with such a weak out of conference schedule.

Michigan, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Nebraska and Minnesota are just not in right now. And they are well on the wrong side of the bubble. Michigan, OSU and Wisconsin have a crazy amount of work to do. As of now Lunardi has....

South
1. Purdue
11. Penn State(Play-In, Last Four In)

East
10. Maryland(Last Four Byes)

Midwest
5. Indiana
9. Northwestern

West
5. Illinois
6. Rutgers
7. Michigan State
9. Iowa

Indiana is playing well lately, as their fans come back out of the woodwork. Know you guys are ranked again but it'll be interesting to see if they end up being seeded higher than Rutgers, who spanked IU pretty badly and think IU was at full strength for that one.

Penn state blew the absolute wheels off the Hoosiers too by around 30 points IIRC... think they'll be seeded a bit higher perhaps than last 4 in.

 

[IMSKRONG]

When your conference (other than Purdue) seeds are 5-11, I don't know how people perceive it as an up year???

Not really sure? If the Big Ten had 3-4 Top 4 seeds... Made. Right now though only 1.

 

[BoilerAndy]

When your conference (other than Purdue) seeds are 5-11, I don't know how people perceive it as an up year???

I suppose if you are talking quantity of competitive teams, it's an up year. But overall quality is down. I thought the past 2 years the B10 had multiple contenders for a national championship. This year, there are a lot of good teams, but only one appears to be a contender.

 

[IMSKRONG]

I suppose if you are talking quantity of competitive teams, it's an up year. But overall quality is down. I thought the past 2 years the B10 had multiple contenders for a national championship. This year, there are a lot of good teams, but only one appears to be a contender.

The bad part is that there were multiple contenders... And not a one made the Elite 8 last year which really hurt. It's hurt the B1Gs perception even more recently. Get 9 teams in and not get one past the Sweet 16? Not good.

Edit: year before last the Big Ten had 1 team reach the Elite 8. 1 seeded Michigan.... Who was also the only team who made the Sweet 16.

 

[Wolegib]

You talk about lack of contenders for a championship. How good is Houston or Alabama or Kansas? They have all shown vulnerabilities

 

[rgarlitz]

You can see why some bracket projections have 9 or 10 Big 10 teams in the tournament since Kenpom has 9 Big teams between 19-44 and NET has 9 between 20-53. The same four teams are out of those parameters - Michigan, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Minnesota. But you have believe that a strong finish from Mich. or Wisc. would get them in. So 12 Big teams still with a shot of getting in.

IMHO: time is really running out for both Wisconsin and Michigan. Michigan, in particular, has almost nothing at the top of their profile: 0-6 vs Q1 and just 4-9 vs Q1+Q2. Wisconsin does have 2 Q1 wins and is 6-8 v. Q1+Q2. They till have home games against Rutgers and Purdue. Bracket matrix has Wisconsin as an 11 seed today, but they're only in half the brackets. My question is: does Wisconsin have enough fire power to make a serious run down the stretch? Is a healthy Tyler Wahl enough to get them back to the form that beat Marquette and nearly upset Kansas?

 

[BoilerAndy]

The bad part is that there were multiple contenders... And not a one made the Elite 8 last year which really hurt. It's hurt the B1Gs perception even more recently. Get 9 teams in and not get one past the Sweet 16? Not good.

Edit: year before last the Big Ten had 1 team reach the Elite 8. 1 seeded Michigan.... Who was also the only team who made the Sweet 16.

Yep, the conference was dominant throughout the season and then embarrassed itself.

 

[IMSKRONG]

You talk about lack of contenders for a championship. How good is Houston or Alabama or Kansas? They have all shown vulnerabilities

Kansas got beat down at home last year by 30 against Kentucky. Right at this time of year... Still won the title. Never know what can happen in March.

 

[RossMackey]

Nobody thought the B1G was “down” last year, before we went belly-up in the NCAA

 

[Erock_94]

Big whatever is down down because they are playing rugby, not basketball. Hard to take that seriously

 

[IMSKRONG]

If this helps.... ESPN bracketology as of the morning of the 10th...(will be changing later today)

1. Purdue
5. Indiana
6. Rutgers
6. Iowa
6. Illinois
7. Maryland
8. Michigan State
9. Northwestern
First Four Out- Wisconsin

AP Top 25
1. Purdue
18. Indiana
24. Rutgers

Wanna see a conference that's UP?

1. Indiana
2. Iowa
3. Maryland
3. Michigan
4. Ohio State
9. Illinois
11. Purdue
12. Nebraska

AP Poll
2. Indiana
5. Iowa
8. Maryland
12. Michigan
13. Ohio State

Big Ten women's is killing it this year. And have 2 very legitimate title contenders in Indiana and Iowa. Plus the frontrunner for NPOY of the year as well in Clark but then along with another girl on Iowa being a candidate and Mackenzie Holmes for Indiana being a candidate.

And for the Purdue fans here, the game at Assembly Hall is sold out already. Which is just wild for a women's game.