Armaan.....My Condolences
- Thread starter BoilerGal74
- Start date
I know exactly what it means and the context was used properly. The only way IT is playing major minutes as a freshman is if Carsen and Eastern are no longer around, Newman commits elsewhere and Painter doesn’t have an emergency back up plan (ie grad transfer). In that scenario we are probably looking at some pretty grim days ahead anyway with IT being forced to take on a major role before he’s ready because he’s the only other option, aka playing out of necessity.
Last edited:
Or......IT grabs the bull by the horns...…...who knows?
Keep digging that hole LOL. You are going to be fun on game night.
Other programs knew about his brother and how much Isaiah had been around the program. It didn't matter if he had an offer or not, it was early, and they knew they were battling from behind. Yeah, when you coach in the Big Ten, you recruit good players and sometimes they play similar positions. Shocking, I know. Tyger and Phinisee would have provided depth at point guard this season. That's why those players were somewhat important, because it helped with this season. Their recruitments had nothing to do with Isaiah. He offered Thompson after Phinisee decided because they are in different classes. Obviously you are going to focus a little more on the 2018 guy before the 2019. That's how recruiting works. Francis was a national recruit, so I'm not sure I see your point in how offering Thompson after Francis committed to UNC is any big deal.
Newman and Thompson play different positions. Newman's recruitment has no impact on his playing time. I see Thompson playing 10-12 minutes as a frosh behind Nojel. If Carsen stays, he will redshirt to put on strength.
This isn’t registering with you. Had Francis, or Phinisee for that matter committed to Purdue, I’m not convinced that Painter offers IT at the juncture he did and that’s because you would have Eastern (2017) and Phinisee/Francis (2018) all playing PG. But because Painter missed out on his top two PG recruits for 2018, it now then made some sense to finally offer IT, who wasn’t being recruited by anyone else. The fact that Painter started recruiting Tyger once he re-classified (and after IT was already committed) as well as two more guards in the 2019 class (Franklin and Newman) whom Painter both wanted, just goes to show you he likely didn’t plan on using IT much as an underclassmen. Now if he keeps on whiffing on some high priority guards (Tyger/Franklin/possibly Newman) IT could end up playing a lot, but it won’t be by design. Hope that clears things up.
So you're changing how you said it, because earlier you said "Isaiah isn't going to crack the rotation as an underclassmen unless out of necessity." You said that's a fact. It's not. It's an opinion. Learn what fact means. But that's very different from saying he likely won't be getting major minutes as a freshman.
Because Eastern isn’t going anywhere. Mgk started this nonsense by saying IT was going to start all 4 years. And he didn’t claim IT was only going to start out of necessity, he claimed IT was going to start because as a freshman he’d be capable, something I vehemently disagree with. Sure, there is a scenario(s) where IT starts as a freshman, but none of those have happy endings.
Based on what? He is a shooting guard. An elite shooter who is not a great ball-handler. Nothing about his game right now says he can fill in at PG as a freshman, and I doubt he will play point any point in his career. That's not who he is. He's a great player, and I hope we get him. But just because he's highly ranked doesn't mean he can play PG.
He's not going to start in front of Nojel, you're right. But he'll be contributing at some point as an underclassmen.
Who knows what would have happened. Also, I'd say Jaelin Llewellyn was much more of a priority than Phinisee. Phinisee never wanted to come to Purdue. I know one thing, I'm happy we got the guard who can shoot over one who can't.
You guys do realize that there really isn't that much of a gap between the 2 of them. IT and Phinisee I believe were both ranked around the same PG maybe not overall rank but that happens. Yes, IT will play big minutes his freshman year just like Phinisee will for IU.
I think you are drawing incorrect conclusions about the sequence of offers with regard to IT. IT was always coming to Purdue and made that preference known well before schools would even consider making of the offers. Painter always knew he had IT coming in. He made offers to 2018 kids before he made offers to 2019 kids. Imagine that?
Additionally, IT was injured last year and did not play during evaluation seasons, so I suspect many scouting services have under-rated him. The kid is a prolific scorer, and has a natural feel for the flow of the game. Does he need to add strength for playing in the BIG? Probably yes. However, defense is more about footwork, and foot & hand speed, and less about muscle.
No I don’t think IT is the next Tyler Ulius. I do think that the comparison in size is very fair. Ulius showed us that a 6’ guard can be very effective in college ball. IT is quick enough to off-set he size disadvantage. I think these are all points that your perspective omits.
He isn't wrong on this. Phinisee was a known IU lean under Crean and when Archie made his first visit as an IU coach to Phinisee with his then HC at McCutcheon....it was a lock. Everyone with any knowledge knew that about Phinisee. As a local kid, I hope he does very well....except when he plays Purdue. In that instance, I hope he misses every single shot and goes 0'fer against Purdue over his career.
And again, people who still don't understand the way CMP schemes and plays the game is astounding. In Painter's most successful season, he has been able to play the 1-3 interchangeably in terms of defense. On the offensive side, the 1-3 in a motion style offense is more about getting the match-up that you believe you have an advantage in through the work of the offense. If they believe Carsen has an advantage straight up, then he'll likely bring the ball up more often than not...BUT if they need to get him off screens and get a switch (or some one else for that matter), they'll work the offense more and more.
That concept is obvious when you listen to CMP's radio shows when he says things like...'I would rather the guys pass up a good shot 10 seconds in to the shot clock to get a great shot later on.' A great shot could mean a matchup where a poor defender is having to guard Carsen or Nojel, especially if they have to defend the dribble drive. It could mean getting a poor close-out defender on Cline so he can hit a three off a screen.
The interesting aspect will be CMP's obvious switch to a more position-less idea for the 1-4 while having some athletic bigs who can defend the paint, rebound, and boost the overall athleticism.
What does any of that have to do with the PG depth when PJ was starting as a sophomore? I'm well aware that being a PG at Purdue has little to no meaning. It still stands that IT will not be able to start over Nojel and Hunter at the guard position his first two years at Purdue.
Trust me, I agree with you. Add in that Purdue is probably going to land Brandon Newman and then with Wheeler who can play the 3 as well as the 4, it could potentially steer Painter away from his traditional 3 guard lineup and implement a longer, more athletic lineup that just takes more guard minutes from IT. Hall is also definitely in play as well who can also play the 3 or 4. I think IT will exclusively be Eastern's backup as a freshman and play anywhere from 8-12 mpg, depending on how many quality minutes Eastern can go.
Don't we go over this every year? Freshmen struggle! Freshmen are never as good as they will be the year after and so on. I consider it a fact after watching and hoping that an incoming freshman can come and prove me wrong so many times.
Yep and that's just the nature of going from high school to college. Not only is there a huge difference in terms of the physical aspect of the game, going from playing against 15-18 year old and then 6 months later playing against 21, 22, and 23 year old grown men who have all been college weight rooms for multiple years, but the speed of the game is exponentially different, especially for a PG. Passes need to be that much crisper, defenders are that much bigger and stronger, it's a whole different ballgame. There's only X amount of players who from a physical standpoint come in with a college ready frame. And if you aren't physically ready you better be that talented to mask that (I'm looking at the 5* players who are just possessed with that much natural talent and ability).
People who think, "Well player X shot 45% from three in high school or during a 5 game AAU tournament so that will translate immediately" are just clueless. Dakota Mathias shot 32% from 3 as a freshman compared to 46% as a senior. And it's not like Dakota came in as a bad 3 point shooter and then suddenly learned how to shoot. Rather, he got used to the speed of the game, to more athletic and longer players closing out, etc
I agree with your point, and it was a huge factor in all of the facts based points I laid out why Romeo Langford will not be as good as expected, but Vince was a freshman under Painter who was really good. AJ Hammons was really good as a freshman. Robbie Hummel was really good as a freshman. Etwaun Moore was really good as a freshman.
Even Ryan Cline came in and shot 39% from 3 on over 3 attempts per game as a freshman, which is pretty much all that was expected from him offensively as a freshman. If you remember, he basically won the game at Pitt his freshman year by shooting Purdue to victory late. So while he wasnt a total game changer, he filled a role.
And then of course HAARMS last year. Was elite defensively and paired that with a TS % of .586 and an ORtg of 111.9 on the offensive.
Nojel Eastern was a terrific defender and rebounder as a freshman.
So theres some good examples of freshman being good right away under Matt Painter. Often times, freshman arent able to put it all together and focus on one facet of the game to contribute while theyre getting acclimated to college basketball. Clines shooting, Easterns defense, etc.
Romeo will be good this year just due to the amount of attempts he will allowed to take. I don’t think he will be as good as IU fans seem to believe, such as top 10 player in the league, but he will be good and yes, even as a freshman.
Yeah I agree, Ibe been saying as much for months now. I would be shocked if Romeo is completely terrible. I think he will be a decent freshman as well. I think hes drawing dead to be an all conference player and its not even realistic to include him in PoTY discussions, and Ive already covered why ad nasuem.
If I had to guess, I would say his freshman stats will closely enough resemble Carsens.
Carsen was 10.3 ppg
1.8 assists / 1.8 turnovers
.486 TS %
34% from 3
74% FT
2.1 Box +/-
1.9 win shares
Those seem like as good as guesses as possible for Romeo IMO, give or take.
Nonsense. Offering other players "just reaffirms that IT won't crack the rotation"? You obviously come up with this stuff on your own. You seem unable to comprehend the difference between fact and opinion when it comes to projecting future events.
You’re assuming Romeo is going to have the exact usage as freshman Carsen though, that isn’t the case. Carsen Edwards played with an AA Swanigan, Vince Edwards, and Haas who commanded a bunch of touches while he was in the game. Romeo will have double the usage of Carsen, even with Juwan Morgan on the court. The offense is going to go through Romeo. Archie’s offense revolves around driving and cutting. Carsen as a freshman played in an offense that went inside out. Romeo by design is going to be taking 14-15 shots a game and that’s not including FT’s for a guy who can get to the hole. Even if Romeo only shoots 40-45% from the field, he’s still going to average at minimum 14-15ppg, and that’s purely by design. I think at minimum you’ll see at stat line of
15ppg
2.5asst/2.0TO
35% from 3
70% on FT with 6-7 attempts a game.
Just so we are clear
Carsen Edwarda used 26.8%( https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/carsen-edwards-1.html ) of the possessions his freshman year. You are not only predicting Romeo Langford will use more than that, which is highly unlikely in and of itself, you're predicting he shatters the all time college basketball usage record by doubling that and using over 53% of Indianas possessions while hes on the court?
Even Trae Young, who was Oklahomas entire offense, only had a usage rate of 37.1.
Lol
Just so we are clear
Carsen Edwarda used 26.8%( https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/carsen-edwards-1.html ) of the possessions his freshman year. You are not only predicting Romeo Langford will use more than that, which is highly unlikely in and of itself, you're predicting he shatters the all time college basketball usage record by doubling that and using over 53% of Indianas possessions while hes on the court?
Even Trae Young, who was Oklahomas entire offense, only had a usage rate of 37.1.
Lol
I already edited what I original said because that wasn’t the way I meant to interpret usage. Carsen only played 23mpg as a freshman and wasn’t in an offense revolves around him. Romeo will be in a role will the offense is catered to him, and will play significantly more minutes. If Romeo averages a similar stat line to freshman Carsen but plays 10+ more mpg, he’s going to go down as one of the least effficient players in the country. I think a good comparison in terms of minutes and usage for Romeo is Eric Gordon.
Gordon in his line season at IU averaged 35mpg with a usage around 30%, and that’s with playing along side DJ White who was the B10 POY. Gordon averaged 21ppg and surprisingly only did it on 33% 3pt shooting. Your biggest knock on Romeo is that by % he isn’t a good 3pt shooter. Well neither was Eric Gordon and that’s because he shot a lot of 3’s. Eric Gordon scored a lot of points because a) he took a lot of shots and b) could get to the line with relative ease (almost 9 attempts a game). Romeo is a) going to take a lot of shots next year for IU, and that’s by design just like it was for Gordon, and b) Romeo is going to get to the line a lot because he’s 6’5 with a 6’10 wingspan. Not saying Romeo is going to have a replica freshman season of Gordon, but he’s going to have a high usage, with a bunch of shots while playing a bunch of minutes. He’s going to average more than 10 points purely on design.
Juwan Morgan is going to be the biggest beneficiary of having a dominant guard like Romeo. Lots of PnR and dump offs at the rim. Ask DJ White whether or not he loved playing with Eric Gordon.
Last edited:
2008 B10 POY and first round draft pick. Shorter version of JaJuan Johnson (imo).
Now since you're such a big IU fan and a little nostradamus. Preach to another board how good IU is and how Romeo will be the next great in the B1G! Bye, Felicia!
Similar threads
