Governor Pence on "This Week"

[Beeazlebub]

He must love to double-down on stupidity.

Did he not anticipate the repeated and obvious question? What the hell was he thinking?

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/indiana-gov-mike-pence-controversial-religious-freedom-law/story?id=29985752

 

[qazplm]

he is hoping it is temporary

but here is the thing, if anti gay discrimination ISNT the purpose of the bill, then just pass legislation barring anti gay discrimination, like Illinois has.

Easy peasy.

 

[kescwi]

So there is gross misunderstanding of the law but he can't answer a simple yes or no question to shed light on the bill.

While I may not agree I can at least respect the free market crowd who say a business should be allowed to discriminate because it follows logically their belief. This clown however doesn' have the guts to answer a simple question he just kept blowing the AM radio/ Fox dog whistle about tolerance, Clinton, Obama... blah blah blah.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[ecouch]

Re: he is hoping it is temporary

Nope. Not a chance.


"I support religious liberty, and I support this law," Pence said in
an exclusive interview. "But we are in discussions with legislative
leaders this weekend to see if there's a way to clarify the intent of
the law."


The governor, although not ready to provide details on
what the new bill will say, said he expects the legislation to be
introduced into the General Assembly this coming week.


Asked if
that legislation might include making gay and lesbian Hoosiers a
protected legal class, Pence said, "That's not on my agenda."
So we get a reworked bill this week but yet no protections afforded to gays. This should be interesting. Unfortunately, the damage is done in my opinion. Rewriting the bill sends a terrible message.

IRFRA Round #2

 

[ecouch]

The just like the federal law/Clinton and Illinois/Obama and 30 other states talking points were debunked early in the week. I realized they were workshopped months ago in anticipation of selling this bill, but come on. The optics of repeating them over and over in a 12 minute window was simply cringeworthy. Hire a better ad firm.

Everyone knows why the bill was signed but no one wants to own it.

 

[indyogb]

I hope it is temporary.

I hate when bulls**t political stories cross over into sports - my escape from such nonsense.

 

[lbodel]

It's funny to see this blow up in his face.

I think everything has been blown way out of proportion, but Pence & the Indiana Republicans deserve every bit of it for staging the political stunt to begin with. And he's doing it with terrible timing with the Final Four.

 

[indyogb]

Never been a Pence fan.

Hopefully this ends any national political ambitions. I hate that he has dragged my beloved state's name through the mud in the process, however (even though I think all this backlash is ridiculous and based on over-stated misunderstandings).

 

[kescwi]

Re: Never been a Pence fan.

If it is just over stated misunderstandings then why can't a simple yes/no question regarding discrimination based on sexual orientation be answered? Seems like all the misunderstanding and bad press could've been cleared up pretty fast.

 

[indyogb]

Re: Never been a Pence fan.

I'm not a fan or supporter of this bill, but I don't think it is discrimination wrapped in another name as so many seem to believe. It appears as though people have jumped on this because of what it could be used to do, rather than what it says. Could it be used to attempt to discriminate against gays under the guise of religion? I suppose so. However, it would have to be proven in a court that doing so was a "substantial burden" or "likely to be a substantial burden" to the respondent. He could be reluctant to answer the question to avoid his answer being dissected and taken out of context (Headlines would ready "Pence admits RFRA could be used to discriminate against gays"). In practice, considering such tactics could have happened in the last 20 years on the Federal level but haven't, at least at a concentration to have caused much of an uproar, I think the worry is overstated.

On a broader, more general level, it seems that the younger generations (if that is what is driving this resistance... maybe it's just contemporary America, as a whole) are much more open to reduced "individual liberty" all in the name of legislated "tolerance". I think this combined with gay rights activists becoming more emboldened is why the bill that 19 other states (and the Federal government... -even if that only applies to them and not private parties) already have is just now, suddenly, "discriminatory". If you want to repeal it, fine - just know that sets the bar on the level of sensitivity to "unjust discrimination" pretty high - lots of rights 'could' be used to discriminate, but they still exist (for now) and are imperative to individual liberty. I suppose "religious freedom" no longer is in that category, which is sad, even for someone lacking much faith, such as I.

 

[LUV4PU]

Re: Never been a fan Of the news media

Can't report the facts! Report the news. Don't make the news !

 

[bodog57]

Obviously he is moronic, but I'm hopeful that this bill will allow me to partake in the scripture of the First Church of Cannabis and then shoot out the tires of the Jehovah's Witnesses who drive up to my house to enlighten me.

 

[lbodel]

Re: Never been a Pence fan.

I don't want to answer for the post you responded to, but to me - I think the reaction has been a bit over the top/a stretch, however, Pence has justified it by not answering questions and not saying what it is/cannot be. So I don't feel bad for the reaction - they've earned it.

 

[kescwi]

While the reaction may be extreme, I think the reaction is about deeper issues for both sides than gay rights.

There is a group of "Christians" who seem to be attempting to impose their own extreme religious beliefs on more and more aspects of life. It could be as simple as the none stop crying every freaking Christmas that they don't get put a nativity on the federal building, or the abortion issue, same sex marriage, creationism being taught in public schools... people are growing weary of the ridiculous of it all, like the if I can't discriminate then I'm being discriminated against BS.

It's become so much that I think people are pushing back and have less and less patience for this group, whose members have made a choice to be Christian, it isn't genetic, attempting to impose their world view on all of society.

This has just been one stop.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[Ross Mackey]

Yep...

The "Christian" Taliban in this country is'nt any more palatable than the radical Muslims we all fear...

IMO both are anathema to American democracy and civil discourse.

 

[Beeazlebub]

Originally posted by kescwi:
While the reaction may be extreme, I think the reaction is about deeper issues for both sides than gay rights.

There is a group of "Christians" who seem to be attempting to impose their own extreme religious beliefs on more and more aspects of life. It could be as simple as the none stop crying every freaking Christmas that they don't get put a nativity on the federal building, or the abortion issue, same sex marriage, creationism being taught in public schools... people are growing weary of the ridiculous of it all, like the if I can't discriminate then I'm being discriminated against BS.

It's become so much that I think people are pushing back and have less and less patience for this group, whose members have made a choice to be Christian, it isn't genetic, attempting to impose their world view on all of society.

This has just been one stop.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

Indeed. One of the authors of this bill, Dennis Kruse from Auburn, is notorious for trying to get creation into science class.

I think they've overstepped this time. If this fiasco doesn't put the super majority in jeopardy during the next election, nothing will.

 

[indyogb]

While we're on opposite sides on this issue (somewhat) - I will absolutely agree that super-majorities are almost always bad at every level of government. I like my government divided against itself. I *like* gridlock - it's better than this #$%!.

 

[lbodel]

Well, many of the Republican Presidential candidates went on record supporting the bill as is. Not a smart move. But it goes back to them needing to pander to the very conservative bases in Iowa and South Carolina - aka early primaries.

The problem with that - and one that they seem to not realize again and again - is that Presidential election demographics are not trending in their favor. If a "standard" Democrat is nominated.

Here's the thing. The Republican can win Ohio and Florida. And then other states like Colorado, Iowa, North Carolina, Missouri. The Democrat would need to just win Virginia, which has been trending blue. Michigan and PA are not much of swing states anymore. Obama won Minnesota, Wisconsin and Nevada by around 8%. Obama won Colorado by almost 5%. Obama won New Mexico by 10%. These aren't states where African-Americans are giving him a huge bump either.

Republicans have been doing better in Missouri and West Virginia. But I'm not sure where else they've really improved their standings that was remotely a swing state.

And while it's may not happen in the next Presidential election by any means, the trends are not in Republicans favor in North Carolina. In that situation, even giving Republicans Ohio and Florida, they're 32 electoral votes away from Democrats.

 

[ecouch]

Why did you use scare quotes around Christians?

Are they not true followers of Christ? Are they not Christians?